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Post by hollymolly on Aug 31, 2015 21:26:10 GMT
I would not have chosen to become involved in PTO at my workplace is because for me, it was important to have some involvement and connection with events and people at my own children's school. This is a very good point. If teachers are attending your PTO meetings, that is less time they have for their own children's after school activities.
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mmll32
Junior Member
Posts: 80
Jun 29, 2014 19:22:38 GMT
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Post by mmll32 on Aug 31, 2015 21:26:53 GMT
I think that the original post is meaning if the goal of the PTA is to help the teachers help the students (which is the common goal between both the parents and the teachers) that in her opinion it would be nice to see that the teachers wanted to see the PTA succeed.
I can see how it may be frustrating to the original poster to feel as though she is doing all of this work to help the teachers help the students with not even as much as a verbal thank you for all the work you are putting in from the teachers. (I am not saying that the teachers need to send the PTA a thank you note for everything the PTA does, however, if someone came in and fed a group of people a verbal thank you would be nice and polite.)
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PaperAngel
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Jun 27, 2014 23:04:06 GMT
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Post by PaperAngel on Aug 31, 2015 21:28:22 GMT
Exactly. Name another profession that expects YOU to volunteer without pay to meet its needs. Many professionals work with children year-round without the benefit of a volunteer organization to meet its needs/wants. Um. Pretty much every non-profit organization out there has an unpaid Board of Directors and usually other volunteers as well. Fundraising is usually a core component of the volunteer functions. Of course. However, in my experience, the professionals who are supported by such organizations routinely attend those meetings & are active in those volunteer groups on their own time. myshelly's argument is that no "other job expects you to volunteer unpaid like that."
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Post by myshelly on Aug 31, 2015 21:33:50 GMT
Um. Pretty much every non-profit organization out there has an unpaid Board of Directors and usually other volunteers as well. Fundraising is usually a core component of the volunteer functions. Of course. However, in my experience, the professionals who are supported by such organizations routinely attend those meetings & are active in those volunteer groups on their own time. myshelly's argument is that no "other job expects you to volunteer unpaid like that." But that is part of those professional's jobs and they are paid for it. I do not see this as part of a teacher's job. Fundraising, dealing with parents on that scale, etc. is an administrator's job. Which is why so many peas have said the principal attends the meeting, but not the teachers. Teachers don't attend bc they are not required to as part of their job.
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PaperAngel
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Jun 27, 2014 23:04:06 GMT
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Post by PaperAngel on Aug 31, 2015 21:36:36 GMT
The school is also where the teacher works, usually long after the students of the parents active in the PTA/PTO attend. In my experience, the PTA/PTO funds large ticket items, such as SmartBoards, at the request of teachers who will use them beyond that one year. So what? These are items that teachers need to DO THEIR JOBS. The school SHOULD provide them, but we have such a mess of a public school system that many don't/can't. It's not like PTAs are buying teachers personal cars or fancy clothes. It's just an f'ed up attitude that the teachers should be ever so grateful to have work materials. You must be projecting, since I wouldn't volunteer my time at a school that my own child does not attend if I had such a poor opinion of teachers.
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AnotherPea
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Posts: 2,968
Jan 4, 2015 1:47:52 GMT
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Post by AnotherPea on Aug 31, 2015 21:37:00 GMT
I've been a member of two different organizations whose focus was to support the hospital. There was never a doctor or nurse present at our meetings.
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Post by hollymolly on Aug 31, 2015 21:41:04 GMT
Not having to work over while the teacher was such a rare event that they were very very happy and memorable. it was normal to stay 2 to 4 hours after the end of the day and still take homework. I gave myself Saturdays off but Sunday was always a teacher workday for me. And then there are the extra things that we did, like attending football game so there's a teacher presennce, chaperoning dances, volunteering for clubs, committees, the request for teacher time goes on and on and on . And don't forget that continued education as a requirement of teachers. So many teachers are balancing all these demands with classwork that they themselves have to do in order to continue their certification. of course, since I was a high school teacher, I never benefited from the PTO. There were no PTOs for high school. And I would have to say that giving me $50-$100 would've made a very small dent into what I personally put out for my classroom. This is definitely what I have seen from my sister who is an elementary school teacher.
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PaperAngel
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Jun 27, 2014 23:04:06 GMT
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Post by PaperAngel on Aug 31, 2015 21:41:39 GMT
Of course. However, in my experience, the professionals who are supported by such organizations routinely attend those meetings & are active in those volunteer groups on their own time. myshelly's argument is that no "other job expects you to volunteer unpaid like that." But that is part of those professional's jobs and they are paid for it. I do not see this as part of a teacher's job. Fundraising, dealing with parents on that scale, etc. is an administrator's job. Which is why so many peas have said the principal attends the meeting, but not the teachers. Teachers don't attend bc they are not required to as part of their job. False. As I stated, the professionals donate their own time year round to attend/participate in the volunteer meetings/activities; it is not in their job description. I'm grateful for the teachers who go above & beyond their contract for their students, & the parents & concerned citizens who volunteer their time outside of their own demanding professions to support the teachers' efforts to educate our children!
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Post by Merge on Aug 31, 2015 21:41:40 GMT
Do you want me to attend the PTO meeting or work on lesson plans, concert preparation, arranging, transposing, etc. that directly benefits your child in choir? There are only so many hours in the day.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Apr 27, 2024 15:50:08 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2015 21:43:15 GMT
So what? These are items that teachers need to DO THEIR JOBS. The school SHOULD provide them, but we have such a mess of a public school system that many don't/can't. It's not like PTAs are buying teachers personal cars or fancy clothes. It's just an f'ed up attitude that the teachers should be ever so grateful to have work materials. You must be projecting, since I wouldn't volunteer my time at a school that my own child does not attend if I had such a poor opinion of teachers. I'm not projecting anything. You are the one who made it sound like SmartBoards are personal gifts to teachers since they get to use them for multiple years.
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Post by myshelly on Aug 31, 2015 21:44:25 GMT
But that is part of those professional's jobs and they are paid for it. I do not see this as part of a teacher's job. Fundraising, dealing with parents on that scale, etc. is an administrator's job. Which is why so many peas have said the principal attends the meeting, but not the teachers. Teachers don't attend bc they are not required to as part of their job. False. As I stated, the professionals donate their own time year round to attend/participate in the volunteer meetings/activities; it is not in their job description. I'm grateful for the millions of teachers who go above & beyond their contract for their students, & the parents & concerned citizens who volunteer their time to support the teachers' efforts! I'm having a hard time understanding your posts. What exactly do you think is false? Yes. Lots of professionals choose to volunteer. There is a difference between choosing to volunteer and being required to volunteer. You just seem very combative and unsupportive. It comes across as rude and judgmental toward teachers as several posters are telling you.
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Dani-Mani
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,706
Jun 28, 2014 17:36:35 GMT
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Post by Dani-Mani on Aug 31, 2015 21:46:59 GMT
Yes, we have a teacher rep.
I can't imagine asking every teacher to attend but I do think having a rep is wise, as we've had some decisions made by the PTO that made zero sense and definitely needed teacher input...
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PaperAngel
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Jun 27, 2014 23:04:06 GMT
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Post by PaperAngel on Aug 31, 2015 21:47:51 GMT
You must be projecting, since I wouldn't volunteer my time at a school that my own child does not attend if I had such a poor opinion of teachers. I'm not projecting anything. You are the one who made it sound like SmartBoards are personal gifts to teachers since they get to use them for multiple years. Given message boards are words, I didn't state or "make it sound like" anything was a personal gift to the teacher. Obviously, anything funded by the PTA/PTO benefits the school, teachers, & students who attend.
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Post by myshelly on Aug 31, 2015 21:54:14 GMT
I'm not projecting anything. You are the one who made it sound like SmartBoards are personal gifts to teachers since they get to use them for multiple years. Given message boards are words, I didn't state or "make it sound like" anything was a personal gift to the teacher. Obviously, anything funded by the PTA/PTO benefits the school, teachers, & students who attend. I agree with busypea. That is exactly how you sounded.
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Post by 950nancy on Aug 31, 2015 21:54:37 GMT
When I was on the PTO board, our principal always attended. Unofficially, he asked a teacher from each grade level to attend a meeting. That way, a teacher had to only attend 2 or at most 3 meetings a year. Basically, they were allowed to flex out the time on another day. If the teachers lived in our district, they would usually attend our festivals or movie night (free admission) and they brought their own kids. I think the principal pointed out to them that they receive PTO funds so they can at least work over for two hours twice a year. The PTO gives each teacher a $50 to $100 stipend to use for classroom materials each year. I am a big supporter of teachers, but honestly I am getting sick and tired of hearing about how hard they have it. And gasp, might have to work over? ?!!!!!! Such horror!!!! I work in child welfare and do you know how many times I have fed kids or bought groceries for families out of my own pocket? How many times I gave hand me downs to families and foster families. How many times my "off time" is interrupted as I am on call once every four weeks? I average 4 hours a week of on-call time that is not extra pay. How many times, I treat kids for head lice? How much time I've spent handing out levy information, again not paid time. How many times I work over when we have an emergency removal (no overtime). How many times I have had to pay to kennel my dogs and make arrangements for my mom to stay at our house to babysit our son (when he was younger and my husband was on duty at the firehouse for 24 hours) because I had to accompany a runaway back home OR place children out of state? How many times I volunteer at the booth for various community events, decorate floats for our local parade, each year, all on our own time? How many times I have to vacuum and spray my car due to bed bugs, etc. etc. Sorry, vent over. I think teachers in different areas probably do different amounts of work. I can speak just from my situation. Our PTO meetings were at 6:30 or 7:00. If I stayed for a PTO meeting, I didn't go home and spent an extra four hours at work. This was every month. We were expected to attend a meeting once a year and if we ever requested support, we needed to ask in person. There were also daycare issues when my kids were little and that was a problem too. Teachers at my school arrived up to two hours early each day and others stayed until six or later to get the paperwork done. The ones that left on time to pick up their own kids just did all of that grading and planning at home. It was an average of 10-15 hours a week extra that I spent that was not paid for. We also attended unpaid classes and meetings and stayed late for that parent who worked until five and couldn't meet you before then. One lady I worked with had four boys and she got to work on time and left on time. She also came in every single Saturday to get her paperwork finished. I didn't work in an affluent area and easily spent $100-$150 every month on school supplies for myself and the kids. Paying off lunch balances for a kid that didn't have enough food to eat because a parent refused to fill out a free and reduced form happened more than it should have. Schools are non profit and I didn't expect to get paid for these things, but I also thought it would be nice to be appreciated for the many things I did that were over and above expectations. We all dealt with lice, community parades, passing out levy information, and things that many people also do. Personally, I think people should walk a mile or two in other people's shoes (myself included) before getting upset. Our PTO was awesome, but much of the money was spent on technology just to keep the school up-to-date for the state testing. We didn't get $ for our classrooms. Most of our teachers went online to set up accounts for their families and friends to support them. I know I wrote ten plus grants to get important items into my classroom. Having been in the profession for 28 years, I know how very hard teachers work and how much they get criticized. Sure, there are bad apples, but I know the vast majority of teachers are just flat out amazing, loving people who would do almost anything for your kid.
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MerryMom
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,534
Jul 24, 2014 19:51:57 GMT
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Post by MerryMom on Aug 31, 2015 21:55:04 GMT
When I was on the PTO board, our principal always attended. Unofficially, he asked a teacher from each grade level to attend a meeting. That way, a teacher had to only attend 2 or at most 3 meetings a year. Basically, they were allowed to flex out the time on another day. If the teachers lived in our district, they would usually attend our festivals or movie night (free admission) and they brought their own kids. I think the principal pointed out to them that they receive PTO funds so they can at least work over for two hours twice a year. The PTO gives each teacher a $50 to $100 stipend to use for classroom materials each year. I am a big supporter of teachers, but honestly I am getting sick and tired of hearing about how hard they have it. And gasp, might have to work over? ?!!!!!! Such horror!!!! I work in child welfare and do you know how many times I have fed kids or bought groceries for families out of my own pocket? r. [ Not having to work over while the teacher was such a rare event that they were very very happy and memorable. it was normal to stay 2 to 4 hours after the end of the day and still take homework. I gave myself Saturdays off but Sunday was always a teacher workday for me. And then there are the extra things that we did, like attending football game so there's a teacher presennce, chaperoning dances, volunteering for clubs, committees, the request for teacher time goes on and on and on . And don't forget that continued education as a requirement of teachers. So many teachers are balancing all these demands with classwork that they themselves have to do in order to continue their certification. of course, since I was a high school teacher, I never benefited from the PTO. There were no PTOs for high school. And I would have to say that giving me $50-$100 would've made a very small dent into what I personally put out for my classroom. I don't want to say the teachers have it worse than anyone, but the demand on our time is very real. I often thought that I had more time for other people's children than I had for my own. And the thanks that A teacher receives is minimal. We receive more gripes then compliments by far. A teacher's job is the one job that too many people seem to think they know the job better than the teacher does. But it was a good job for me and I enjoyed it. Ok.... Vent over.... I love how we can disagree and both be right! I worked full time AND was on the PTO and I rarely saw teachers consistently work over 2-4 hours a day as you outline. Work in child welfare if you want to be under-appreciated. Oh and thanks? Well would the kids in hysteria as we remove them from their sh)) hole house and abusive/neglectful parents thank us? Umm, no. Well how about the perp who molests kids: is he thanking me for the fabulous forensic interview I just did? Dang, another lack of thanks. How about the foster parent who found 1 nit after I spent two hours with the Robi-comb killing the Luce and combing out the nits. Hmmm another no thank you. And yes, I have to complete 56 hours of annual training which I pay for. And use vacation time for. No teacher COTA days for me. Wheeeeeeeeee, no thanks for that either. And so on... Some of the items listed for teachers ARE part of their job description and/or their supplemental contract. i think the OP is frustrated when they don't get thanks for what they do directly for the teachers. Gosh, no one ever provided me food like they do for conference nights. Oooooooo and a classroom materials stipend?
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Post by deekaye on Aug 31, 2015 21:55:34 GMT
For eight years I was involved in our high school's Music Boosters group, four of those years as either President or Vice President. We loved it when the music teachers attended our monthly evening meetings but certainly didn't get bent when they didn't. Usually they didn't attend because they were in the auditorium with the students practicing for a concert... or on a field trip with students to a competition... or visiting the grades schools to promote music... or on the football field practicing with the marching band...
We earned a lot of money and handed the teachers a lot of money to spend ON OUR STUDENTS! You know, our sons and daughter who were benefiting from the concerts, field trips, competitions, marching band.
Sorry OP but your pissy attitude is one of the reasons that after just a couple of meetings, I chose not to involve myself in our elementary school's PTO. 'Worked out best for me though because I discovered the Music Boosters!
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PaperAngel
Drama Llama
Posts: 7,294
Jun 27, 2014 23:04:06 GMT
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Post by PaperAngel on Aug 31, 2015 22:05:06 GMT
False. As I stated, the professionals donate their own time year round to attend/participate in the volunteer meetings/activities; it is not in their job description. I'm grateful for the millions of teachers who go above & beyond their contract for their students, & the parents & concerned citizens who volunteer their time to support the teachers' efforts! I'm having a hard time understanding your posts. What exactly do you think is false? Yes. Lots of professionals choose to volunteer. There is a difference between choosing to volunteer and being required to volunteer. You just seem very combative and unsupportive. It comes across as rude and judgmental toward teachers as several posters are telling you.. Your statement & belief that professionals in other fields/industries are not required to participate in volunteer meetings/activities related to their job on their own time, outside of their job description, & without pay is false. Many professionals are expected to attend such meetings & serve on related committees year round as a representative of their field/employer &/or to serve their communities.
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kate
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Jun 26, 2014 3:30:05 GMT
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Post by kate on Aug 31, 2015 22:07:42 GMT
At my school and my kids' schools, it's called the Parents' Association or the Family Association, not Parent-Teacher Association.
The teachers appreciate all that the parents do for us, and the parents appreciate all that we do for the kids.
Teachers don't attend the PA meetings (though usually an administrator does attend), and the parents don't attend the faculty meetings. Happy happy.
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peabay
Prolific Pea
Posts: 9,592
Jun 25, 2014 19:50:41 GMT
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Post by peabay on Aug 31, 2015 22:08:42 GMT
At my DD's school last year (her first year) the principal attended the meetings & one teacher rep (always the same one) -- a few times a counselor came too. I was kind of surprised. I expected more teacher involvement given the name of the organization. LOL I do wonder why they don't just rename it to something that reflects the fact that it is just a parent group. Same at ours: principal and teacher rep to the board. At the elementary and middle school levels, we have pretty much 100% participation from the teachers. Not so much at the high school.
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Post by alexa11 on Aug 31, 2015 22:09:12 GMT
I taught middle school for 25 years and honestly it depended on our principal. Some let us decide if we wanted to attend and others basically made it mandatory.
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Post by beaglemom on Aug 31, 2015 22:19:47 GMT
The last school that I taught at the meetings were either during school hours, so teachers couldn't attend. Or in the evening 30+ minutes away from the school site. The minutes were not something that was easily accessible to us. However we did attend the school site council meetings. Those the teachers were required to attend.
The school site council had more control on how the money the PTA raised was spent. So it was felt that it was better to have us at that meeting.
I always attended the pta events and was very appreciative. Even though we were always responsible for paying for our $50+ ticket and for our spouse. And we usually spent at least a couple hundred at the auction, well dh and I did, I don't think the rest of the teachers (there were only 4 of us teachers) did.
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Post by Dixie Lou on Aug 31, 2015 22:47:37 GMT
At my school we have PTA board meetings 6-7 p.m. and the general PTA meeting 7-8 p.m.
The teachers attend the general PTA meeting if it is their students (grade level) who are performing that month.
We' ve had a rough time getting parents to volunteer to be on the PTA board. Every position this year is filled by a teacher. I am the secretary. My good friend in second grade is the president. Fundraising? A Title One teacher. I am amazed that it's all parents at your schools. Hospitality? A fifth grade teacher.
Principal expects 100% participation from teachers to join the PTA every year.
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AmeliaBloomer
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Posts: 6,842
Location: USA
Jun 26, 2014 5:01:45 GMT
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Aug 31, 2015 23:01:14 GMT
This is a very good point. If teachers are attending your PTO meetings, that is less time they have for their own children's after school activities. I remember once telling a parent that I missed my own kids' parent-teacher conferences because they were the same nights as conferences at my school. It was like an epiphany for her. She was a smart woman, but she actually didn't fully grasp it for several seconds. You know how little kids can think their teacher sleeps in the classroom or lives in the house next door? Sometimes I think some (some!) parents have a view of teachers as living in the attendance area...instead of possibly 10-40 (or more) miles away. Just like parents who travel to their jobs, we need to race back to daycare for pick-up, take our turn in carpools, get a car home to a teen who needs it for work, attend our kids' schools events, care for aging parents, take classes, etc. The teacher who has to go home and then back to work for a PTO meeting is very often not just driving the few blocks the parents are. I love PTOs. I've joined, paid my money, talked it up to the parents. I've gone to one meeting a year, when it worked for me. I've volunteered at weekend fundraisers. I thank them for the breakfast. (I've chosen to have the students write thank you notes for gifts and supplies, though.) But I consider it chiefly a parent organization.
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Post by ferblover on Aug 31, 2015 23:04:08 GMT
We have two teachers on our Board. Both have students at our school as well, but the one teacher has a very specific title, Staff Member at Large. Horrible name but we haven't come up with a better one. She(well now both) are great to have as they are the best way to get things done in the school. We wanted to change how we did our Fall Festival, they came up with a great idea and put it in front of all the teachers. They are able to give us immediate feedback if something will or not work in the school. It is great. Based on this thread I think I am going to have to give them huge props tomorrow above and beyond what we already tell them. Also each meeting, all teachers in a grade are there to present how they are using Artful Learning(we are a niche school that is using this learning style). They rotate through each month and even the Special Ed and Specials teachers come to say how they are using it in their classroom. It is a wonderful thing. We always offer that they can be dismissed after they present. Some stay, some don't.
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Post by 950nancy on Aug 31, 2015 23:12:53 GMT
This is a very good point. If teachers are attending your PTO meetings, that is less time they have for their own children's after school activities. I remember once telling a parent that I missed my own kids' parent-teacher conferences because they were the same nights as conferences at my school. It was like an epiphany for her. She was a smart woman, but she actually didn't fully grasp it for several seconds. You know how little kids can think their teacher sleeps in the classroom or lives in the house next door? Sometimes I think some (some!) parents have a view of teachers as living in the attendance area...instead of possibly 10-40 (or more) miles away. Just like parents who travel to their jobs, we need to race back to daycare for pick-up, take our turn in carpools, get a car home to a teen who needs it for work, attend our kids' schools events, care for aging parents, take classes, etc. The teacher who has to go home and then back to work for a PTO meeting is very often not just driving the few blocks the parents are. I love PTOs. I've joined, paid my money, talked it up to the parents. I've gone to one meeting a year, when it worked for me. I've volunteered at weekend fundraisers. I thank them for the breakfast. (I've chosen to have the students write thank you notes for gifts and supplies, though.) But I consider it chiefly a parent organization. My principal scheduled Parent Teacher Conferences on Halloween one year. He couldn't believe the teachers were angry. The conferences were scheduled 8 am to 8 pm. He said that the other parent could take the kid trick or treating. It did get changed when parents said they wouldn't come at that time.
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Post by freecharlie on Aug 31, 2015 23:19:04 GMT
Only the teacher reprrsentitive shows up to meetings at this pto.
At the last one a good number of teachers showed up, but that was a good school. We did start making them request funds from the pto in person, so if they wanted money they need to come
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AmeliaBloomer
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Jun 26, 2014 5:01:45 GMT
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Aug 31, 2015 23:31:02 GMT
I worked full time AND was on the PTO and I rarely saw teachers consistently work over 2-4 hours a day as you outline. Frankly, I sometimes get embarrassed by some of the teacher kvetching - and I can see that clearly you're angry about several issues here - but how can you possibly KNOW how much time teachers are putting in after their work day? Ever since I had kids, I started doing the majority of my extra work at home...evenings, early mornings, weekends. Fifteen hours yesterday. True story. Will I do that every Sunday? No way. But not a single person outside of this house knows whether I spent my Sunday binge watching TV or doing schoolwork.
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twinsmomfla99
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Jun 26, 2014 13:42:47 GMT
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Post by twinsmomfla99 on Aug 31, 2015 23:37:05 GMT
When I was teaching, my colleagues and I supported the PTA in many other ways besides going to meetings (we had two teacher reps who took turns going).
1. We joined. Our principal was quite insistent that we have 100%participation. 2. We attended events. We were expected to attend at least three, but those of us who lived close attended far more. 3. We promoted the PTA in our classroom newsletters and with membership reminders about a month after school started. 4. We promoted events for students with classroom tokens/extra credit for students who participated. 5. We helped with the spring carnival. Each grade level had an event that teachers were expected to help staff. 6. We sponsored a "volunteer breakfast" in conjunction with field day to show our appreciation to our volunteers who helped in our classrooms and with so many school events.
I don't think our PTA minded that most of us never went to a meeting.
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Post by darkchami on Aug 31, 2015 23:38:46 GMT
Our principal attends all meetings along with a teacher representative.
Please remember that those teachers who seem uninvolved are likely busy with other activities that benefit the students. Last year a typical week for me included 7-9 before or after school meetings. While one extra meeting a month may seem insignificant to you, it can be nearly impossible for someone else. I had a meeting scheduled during every single PTA meeting last year. I think people have no idea how booked up we are outside of the school day.
We are very thankful for our PTA. They provide opportunities for students that are invaluable.
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