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Post by quinlove on Jan 7, 2016 3:39:18 GMT
Most importantly, where can I sign a petition ?
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Post by jovifan on Jan 7, 2016 4:12:48 GMT
So I am on Wisconsin Circuit Court's website, and looked up Brendan Dassey. Here is part of what is listed: Exhibit 48, photo of handcuffs taken from Barb Tadych's bedroom. Exhibit 49, photo of Barb Tadych's bedroom showing handcuffs and leg irons. Exhibit 50, photo of leg irons taken from Barb Tadych's residence. Exhibit 51, photo of golf cart. Exhibit 52, photo of jacket found in Dassey residence. Exhibit 53, photo of tennis shoes found in Dassey residence. Exhibit 54, photo of blue jeans found in Dassey residence Exhibit 62, pink fur-lined leg irons Exhibit 82, photo of headboard area of Avery's bedroom. Exhibit 83, photo of gun rack above Avery's bed. Exhibit 84, photo of handcuffs found in Avery's bedroom. Exhibit 85, photo of leg irons found in Avery's bedroom. Exhibit 86, photo of gun located on gun rack in Avery's bedroom. Exhibit 87, photo of muzzle loader located on gun rack in Avery's bedroom. Exhibit 88, photo of bleach bottle. Exhibit 89, phot of cut on Avery's finger. Exhibit 90, photo of hood latch from RAV4. Exhibit 91, handcuffs seized from Avery's bedroom. Exhibit 92, leg irons seized from Avery's bedroom. Exhibit 93, bleach bottle seized from the Avery residence. Exhibit 94, swab taken of hood latch of RAV4. Exhibit 95, photo of burn barrel located in the front yard of Steven Avery's residence. Exhibit 96, photo of the interior of the burn barrel. Exhibit 97, photo of burned pieces of three electronic devices recovered from the burn barrel. Exhibit 98, photo of burned cover plate for a Motorola cell phone. Exhibit 99, photo comparing burned cover plate and new cover plate. Exhibit 100, photo comparing burned cell phone and new cell phone. Exhibit 101, photo comparing burned key pad and new key pad. Exhibit 102, photo of burned portion of a Canon Powershot camera. Exhibit 103, photo of the processing of evidence at the Wisconsin State Crime Lab. Exhibit 104, photo of jean rivet with "Daisy Fuentes" stamped on it. Exhibit 105, photo of interior of Steven Avery's garage. Exhibit 106, photo of paint thinner container found in Avery garage. Exhibit 107, photo of a roller creeper found in Avery garage. Exhibit 108, photo of marker #9 indicating bullet fragment found in Avery garage.
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Post by jovifan on Jan 7, 2016 4:15:13 GMT
those were things brought as exhibit during the trial for him
also saw this... On 08-15-06, the court received a notice from the State Public Defender's office indicating that Attorney Kachinsky has been decertified. Attorney Kachinsky has now filed a motion to withdraw as counsel in this matter. Attorney Kachinsky states that he spoke with the defendant and his mother and they both wish to have him continue on the case. However, as of yesterday, the defendant has changed his mind and no longer wants him to continue to represent him. The court has a short colloquy with the defendant and asks him what his wish is today. The defendant states he wants Attorney Kachinsky off the case. He feels that he in not helping him very much. They still get along and he always listens to him and the letter from the public defender's office was not the cause of this. He feels that Attorney Kachinsky is not on his side and he doesn't do what he wants him to do. The Court finds that Attorney Kachinsky should have been present with his client during the interview in May. Having an investigator there and being availiable by phone was not enough. There was deficient performance on Attorney Kachinsky's part and the reasons he gave as to why he couldn't be present were not sufficient. The Court grants the motion to withdraw as counsel. The Court will draft the order. The defendant, on the record, agrees to have Attorney Kachinsky turn over his file to successor counsel once appointed. A scheduling conference will be set once new counsel is appointed.
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Post by beanbuddymom on Jan 7, 2016 4:45:37 GMT
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Deleted
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Mar 28, 2024 11:04:32 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2016 7:45:04 GMT
I'm quite sure based on knowledge of other trials, that if evidence wasn't presented during the trial (such as Brendan saying they got in his head) it's because the Judge didn't permit it. There are always all sorts of things that as a juror I would feel like I would want to know, but the reality is that they, in one way or another, are ruled to be prejudicial or nonadmissable. To be honest, I thought that the Judge wasn't particularly fair in his rulings that we did see, but from a legal standpoint, I can't say if that is true or not. I agree 1000%!!!!!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2016 7:53:15 GMT
Jovifan, were any of the clothes proven to be what Teresa was last wearing? I still find it beyond improbable that if Teresa were shackled as claimed, WHERE is at least ONE piece of trace evidence? ? And the fact that the only evidence was "found" by the same cop AFTER many searches who wasn't even supposed to be there!
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stittsygirl
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Post by stittsygirl on Jan 7, 2016 8:20:09 GMT
Jovifan, were any of the clothes proven to be what Teresa was last wearing? I still find it beyond improbable that if Teresa were shackled as claimed, WHERE is at least ONE piece of trace evidence? ? And the fact that the only evidence was "found" by the same cop AFTER many searches who wasn't even supposed to be there! I believe the only evidence of Theresa's clothes they found was the "Daisy Fuentes" rivet they recovered in the fire pit. Theresa's sister testified that was a brand of jeans Theresa wore. The other clothing items they took photos of likely belonged to Brendan, particularly the jeans. There was a long, convoluted part of his confession that included bleach and bleach spots on the jeans and gasoline and paint thinner and cleaning the garage floor. None of it proved anything though, and I'm too tired to go into in tonight. I can tell you I learned that chlorine bleach can make blood stains disappear, but not the hemoglobin in the blood, so blood evidence will still show up under Luminol even if it's been cleaned up with chlorine bleach. Oxygenated bleach (Oxy Clean) will destroy the hemoglobin though (thank Reddit people for the link to that info). You're correct, there was never any biological evidence found from Theresa Halbach on the shackles or handcuffs, which were of the sex toy variety. Why Avery and his sister had matching bondage gear, I don't even want to know, but apparently the items taken into evidence were the same or similar to each other.
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Nanner
Drama Llama
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Jun 25, 2014 23:13:23 GMT
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Post by Nanner on Jan 7, 2016 13:14:44 GMT
After hearing about it from a few people, DH and I started watching it last night. We've only watched the first 2 episodes, but we're hooked.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2016 13:56:02 GMT
Other SuspectsThis is an interesting article that gives a bit more info as to who also had access to the property.
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blue tulip
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Post by blue tulip on Jan 7, 2016 14:51:53 GMT
The mom/daughter team were related to the Halbachs - cousins I believe. The mom was also a private investigator herself. Why the car location appears hinky to some is because it was located in an area where it was found relatively easily, once the searchers had permission to go on the lot. It also looked like someone had tried to disguise it with a few branches and an old car hood on it, but that just made it stand out more from the cars around it. It's plausible, if you believe in the framing theory, that someone may have found the car a couple of days earlier in another location (like when Colburn called those plates in the first day Theresa was reported missing), then planted the car on the Avery property sometime in the night in a way that made it pretty easy to pick out. The Avery blood evidence inside the car could have also been planted in that time period. The vial of Avery's blood that was kept at the county offices wasn't secured well, and no log or security camera video was kept to determine who had broken the evidence seals and accessed it. It really could go either way - Avery (or whomever murdered Theresa) did a horrible job hiding the car before he could render it unrecognizeable, or it was purposely moved there by someone else to put the focus on Avery. There was also a statement by someone, can't remember who, that the woman who found it had commented that she heard from a police officer that that the car was in the junkyard. That was stated during the trial when she testified and Avery's lawyer asked her why she was given a camera that day but others who were also searching weren't. ok, I must've missed that in the show then. I remember her saying she didn't know how she found it so quickly, that she believed God led her to it. her being a relative of Theresa's doesn't change my opinion, because of course relatives are going to be involved in a search for their loved one. but if she said a cop told her it WAS there, then that's significant.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Jan 7, 2016 14:58:37 GMT
There was also a statement by someone, can't remember who, that the woman who found it had commented that she heard from a police officer that that the car was in the junkyard. That was stated during the trial when she testified and Avery's lawyer asked her why she was given a camera that day but others who were also searching weren't. ok, I must've missed that in the show then. I remember her saying she didn't know how she found it so quickly, that she believed God led her to it. her being a relative of Theresa's doesn't change my opinion, because of course relatives are going to be involved in a search for their loved one. but if she said a cop told her it WAS there, then that's significant. Avery's lawyers said they didn't trust her but I thought she was actually the most believable person so far. They didn't mention the context of the police officer telling her the car was in the salvage yard (did he mention that it "could be" there and was highly suggesting that they look there? Or was it more of a direct statement?) but it sounded like there was a reason she went there that day, besides God telling her where to go.
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blue tulip
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Post by blue tulip on Jan 7, 2016 16:24:19 GMT
I think people find the ease with which they found that car the hinky part. If Avery was attempting to hide it, wouldn't he have hidden it deeper in the junkyard, not at the edge of the first rows? If he was really attempting to hide it, wouldn't he have used the car crusher he had easy access to? Avery might not be the brightest bulb on the tree, but he was familiar with how a police investigation would play out. It doesn't sit right that the car was so easily accessed. i was speaking more to just the "I can't believe they found the car so quickly" thinking.
but you're right, and I agree- if he had done it, why not crush the car immediately and bury it somewhere (literally, or within a pile of crushed cars) because he definitely had the equipment and capability. and if he'd done it, why leave it there for days? what could possibly be more important than getting rid of that car asap? he's smart enough to clean all blood evidence but leaves the car there under some branches? and while we're at it, why would he burn bones in a bonfire when he had a smelter?
yesterday was the first I read about the different hood. if it was laid on top, not installed (I don't know which, people have said different things and I haven't read the transcripts or real documentation about the hood) then I see how his sweat DNA was on it. it could've been any hood he removed and had laying around the yard, that someone picked up and put on the car when they were stashing it.
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Post by bostonmama on Jan 7, 2016 16:35:59 GMT
Just a thought, but if someone wanted to frame him, then obviously they wouldn't bring the car deep into the lot where they could risk being seen; they'd drop it near the front and get the heck out of there. I don't really have any thoughts on the sweat DNA being present. No other sweat DNA elsewhere but there (am I remembering that correctly)? I can't make sense of it, but I've seen enough tv to know you can get DNA from anywhere, lt seems. There was SO LITTLE evidence all the way around that it makes far more sense that it was planted than it occurred naturally during the course of a crime.
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stittsygirl
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Post by stittsygirl on Jan 7, 2016 17:20:33 GMT
From my reading, sweat itself doesn't have DNA, the shed epithelial cells in sweat would carry the DNA. I believe the prosecutor liked to use the word "sweat" a lot because it had more of a negative connotation than "epithelial cells". Epithelial cells are shed by all of us every day, usually on what we touch, but also on what we wear and what we put in our mouths. Obtaining a clothing item (like a dirty sock or t-shirt - Steven Avery didn't look like the most hygienic guy) or toothbrush that are carrying Avery's DNA in shed cells, while having pretty much free reign over the property while the family is gone, is a plausible way that DNA could have been planted on the hood latch of the car, and even the key fob (which only had Avery's DNA on it), if you believe in the framing theory.
The prosecutor Ken Kratz has since made a big deal of the fact that the "sweat on the hood latch" information wasn't shown in the documentary, but apparently it just wasn't made such a big deal in the trial. The blood evidence in the car was the bigger "gotcha".
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gina
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Post by gina on Jan 7, 2016 18:58:00 GMT
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stittsygirl
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Location: In the leaves and rain.
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Post by stittsygirl on Jan 7, 2016 19:20:01 GMT
The president can only pardon convicted felons at the federal level, so I don't know if there is anything he can do here. I think it's good that people who are frustrated with what they've seen have an outlet for that frustration, like signing a petition, but they'd probably do more good advocating for getting the possibility for corruption in the system fixed, more checks and balances. Manitowoc county definitely isn't the only place that corruption happens.
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Post by uksue on Jan 7, 2016 22:51:23 GMT
It annoys me so much that someone like Kachinsky not only retained his qualifications but has been promoted upwards to Judge. He clearly didn't understand the most basic premise of protecting his client (Brendan) or plain ignored and just wanted to hand him to the prosecution .wherever he presides- there should be a petition to remove him from office !
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Jan 8, 2016 4:52:52 GMT
Just watched the episode with the end of Steven Avery's trial... What happened to reasonable doubt? Does anyone else have a problem with the prosecutors statement to the jury that if they didn't find Avery guilty, they were then saying that the police did it? I feel like that shifted their focus and asked a different question than what should have been asked--Is Steven Avery guilty beyond reasonable doubt?
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Jan 8, 2016 4:54:56 GMT
It annoys me so much that someone like Kachinsky not only retained his qualifications but has been promoted upwards to Judge. He clearly didn't understand the most basic premise of protecting his client (Brendan) or plain ignored and just wanted to hand him to the prosecution .wherever he presides- there should be a petition to remove him from office ! I'm sure he knew that losing the case would be better for his career than winning it, given how the case was going. I would't be surprised if he got special favors because of his actions in this case.
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Jili
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Post by Jili on Jan 8, 2016 5:45:05 GMT
It annoys me so much that someone like Kachinsky not only retained his qualifications but has been promoted upwards to Judge. He clearly didn't understand the most basic premise of protecting his client (Brendan) or plain ignored and just wanted to hand him to the prosecution .wherever he presides- there should be a petition to remove him from office ! I'm sure he knew that losing the case would be better for his career than winning it, given how the case was going. I would't be surprised if he got special favors because of his actions in this case. I'm behind on the series-- I am watching episode 4 right now. I already can't believe this guy. He's creepy and reminds me of Guilderoy Lockhart in the Harry Potter movies. In just a few minutes he's mentioned making a plea bargain several times.
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stittsygirl
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Post by stittsygirl on Jan 8, 2016 5:50:47 GMT
It annoys me so much that someone like Kachinsky not only retained his qualifications but has been promoted upwards to Judge. He clearly didn't understand the most basic premise of protecting his client (Brendan) or plain ignored and just wanted to hand him to the prosecution .wherever he presides- there should be a petition to remove him from office ! It appears Kachinsky is battling cancer - leukemia from my brief search. I absolutely wouldn't wish that on anyone, but his health might remove him from the bench quicker than a petition would. But yeah, he ranks high on the very long WTF! list this case has produced.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2016 6:11:07 GMT
I just finished it. Crazy stuff. I'm not at all for pardoning them - I think it's entirely possible Stephen did it - but they both should get new trials. There are way too many problems with and questions about the investigation and original trials.
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Post by Drew on Jan 8, 2016 8:38:40 GMT
I watched the documentary. I've also read documents about the case.
I think steven forced Teresa drive off site where he then shot her and put her in the back of her Toyota.
I think he drove the Toyota back to the yard and put her in a fire in a barrel then dumped the barrel into a bigger fire behind his garage.
I don't think brendan had anything to do with it other than going around the property in the golf cart with steven, looking for garbage and tires to add to the fire that was already in progress.
I think Lenk obtained the Toyota key when he was inappropriately at the car the day it was found. I think he planted the key in Steven's bedroom to ensure a compelling case.
If steven had an accomplice, he'll never tell because he's hanging his hat on the idea that he's wrongfully incarcerated. Again.
I think Colburn called in the Toyota plate based upon missing persons info he was given, just to verify.
I think the bullet was placed in the garage after it was discovered in the burn pile to, once again, seal the deal.
I don't think Teresa was raped and murdered in Steven's trailer. I don't think brendan was in the trailer that day/night.
I think that Steven's blood in the Toyota was not from the vial but from Steven's cut.
One of the crucial moments for me was when steven was talking to his parents from jail. He was aggressive and demanding, and his parents weren't shocked or upset, they were just trying to do what he told them to do.
Lastly, it's interesting that some of the peas proclaiming that the Avery family is "off" are the same peas who many other peas consider "off".
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Deleted
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Mar 28, 2024 11:04:32 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2016 9:04:40 GMT
Drew, if you think the blood in the car is Steven's, then where are the fingerprints? No fingerprints, he had to be wearing gloves. If there was blood, no gloves, but where are the fingerprints?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2016 9:06:58 GMT
Lastly, it's interesting that some of the peas proclaiming that the Avery family is "off" are the same peas who many other peas consider "off". This thread has been quite civil. That was really unnecessary.
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Post by Drew on Jan 8, 2016 9:27:16 GMT
Drew, if you think the blood in the car is Steven's, then where are the fingerprints? No fingerprints, he had to be wearing gloves. If there was blood, no gloves, but where are the fingerprints? I think his blood got on his gloves before he drove the car to the edge of the yard to hide it.
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Post by Drew on Jan 8, 2016 9:30:41 GMT
Lastly, it's interesting that some of the peas proclaiming that the Avery family is "off" are the same peas who many other peas consider "off". This thread has been quite civil. That was really unnecessary. Just an observation. I'm bothered that this family is considered strange or "off" because of their economic status, accents, and 'rural' demeanor.
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Post by jovifan on Jan 8, 2016 12:42:22 GMT
I know a few people who know the Averys indirectly, (they are customers of their store) and they are 'off'. 2 brothers of Stevens are arrested for choking their wives in domestic incidents? Steven and what he did. Brendan and what he did. Yeah they have to be 'off' to some degree. I get so frustrated and am becoming tired of the continued debate, that people who watch 10 hours of info are ready to sign petitions. The trial for Steven was 6 weeks long. Let's say 8 hours a day X 5 days a week for 6 weeks is a lot of time. And that's the trial alone.
A good friend of mine's DH works for the state patrol and was on scene looking for evidence. He found body parts. According to her there are thousands of pages of evidence that have not been introduced. She said he has read Brendan's 4 page written explanation of what happened. It's very detailed. I'd be curious to read that vs the book Brendan referenced. Also my ex deals with Kachinsky and says he's an idiot. There is no 'call' for him to be outed. Colburn, nothing with him either. I heard he was told not to come in as he was receiving death threats, but no outrage to oust him. I hope this story starts to die. I just get so frustrated when ppl are calling for him to be released and they have no idea. I have no idea but am going off of what I hear from those close to the situation.
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Post by scraphappyinjax on Jan 8, 2016 13:23:31 GMT
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blue tulip
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Post by blue tulip on Jan 8, 2016 13:31:43 GMT
Drew, in your theory particularly about the burning, what is the explanation for burned remains being found at the quarry? Just politely asking, i think it's possible there is credibility with some points you made.
Regarding the placement of the Rav4 in the yard, I thought aerial showed there was a little-used two-track type road that went behind that ridge. I remember them saying there were multiple ways of getting in and out of the yard, including back ways. so it could've been easier to sneak it in that way than to drive it up front past the houses to the main entrance.
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