Sarah*H
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Jun 25, 2014 20:07:06 GMT
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Post by Sarah*H on May 1, 2016 15:28:50 GMT
Then I'm genuinely confused about why you think it's okay to be offended and insulted by someone else's choice about their own body hair. I DON'T remember a time when that would have been okay but maybe we grew up with different expectation of politeness and good manners.
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Post by freecharlie on May 1, 2016 15:29:22 GMT
It may be possible that the bride didn't know of the armpit thing until recently. I have no idea whether my sil shaves her pits of not.
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GiantsFan
Prolific Pea
Posts: 8,257
Site Supporter
Jun 27, 2014 14:44:56 GMT
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Post by GiantsFan on May 1, 2016 15:30:27 GMT
I'm trying to remember a time when it would have been polite or acceptable to tell someone else to change something about themselves because you think it looks like "ass" and I'm coming up blank. Fine, you don't like armpit hair. Shave it. Telling someone else that they should conform to your personal standards of attractiveness is shallow and rude. What I don't understand is when people became so eager to be so offended and insulted by every little thing. I remember a time that most people wouldn't have a brain aneurism over the idea of a bride asking a bridesmaid to shave her pits for the wedding pictures that she was paying a fortune for. I miss that world. I totally agree. So then why is the bride offended and insulted by her attendants arm pit hair? I don't get it.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Mar 28, 2024 21:54:34 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2016 15:31:52 GMT
What I don't understand is when people became so eager to be so offended and insulted by every little thing. I remember a time that most people wouldn't have a brain aneurism over the idea of a bride asking a bridesmaid to shave her pits for the wedding pictures that she was paying a fortune for. I miss that world. I agree that it does seem such a tiny ask that I can't imagine people feeling insulted about it. I had no idea armpit hair was such a big thing or that people were growing it out to challenge the notions of beauty in society. We learn something new everyday! I'm not offended by armpit hair and really don't notice what other people do with their pits, however for one day, for the sake of family, I'd just shave.
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Post by crazy4scraps on May 1, 2016 15:32:51 GMT
I disagree. You don't *have* to include your future in-law (or your own family, or anyone really) in your wedding party. I could have, but I didn't. I had one attendant, and I chose one of my sisters. We gave DH's sister and my other sister other roles in the wedding and they were both totally fine with that. And FWIW, neither my DH (her brother) or I were in her wedding party either when she got married several years later. When my BFF got married, I was her MOH. Not her own sister and none of her future SILs. That's one of the perks of being the bride, you get to choose who stands up with you. I don't know, in some families it is expected. Having just one attendant makes it easy to exclude siblings, more than that it becomes harder. Or, it was important to me to have my brother up there with me. Dh didn't pick him, I did. Perhaps this is that situation I stood up with my brother at his wedding as his "best man" LOL. I have three other living brothers he could have chosen, and his wife has a brother too. If her DH wanted his sister in the wedding party, she could stand with him and wear a jacket, and her armpit hair would be a non-issue.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Mar 28, 2024 21:54:34 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2016 15:36:01 GMT
I'm wondering whether the bride even knew about underarm hair. The mom said this change started a year ago so she truly may not have known. Either way, if the hair stays or goes, someone's feelings are going to be hurt. I think if I was the bridesmaid, I would rather be asked to shave vs having my future SIL resent me without even knowing why.
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craftykitten
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,304
Jun 26, 2014 7:39:32 GMT
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Post by craftykitten on May 1, 2016 15:37:32 GMT
It is SUCH an emotive topic because there are many women who fight very hard for us to be accepted as we are, regardless of age or weight or hair/lack of it. Women are generally expected to conform to all kinds of beauty standards, and removing body hair is one of those. For those women who decide not to follow those rules, it is a massive personal decision and they've probably received a lot of abuse for it. So to ask her to 'just shave' because it 'looks better' is offensive because you are asking them to go against their strongly held personal beliefs.
Maybe people used not to get offended because it was more acceptable to expect a woman to look a certain way. Today we are able to challenge those views and I am grateful for that.
I think the bride has to either let it go, or choose a different dress. I can't believe people would notice a bridesmaids armpithair instead of focussing on the happy couple, but maybe her friends are different.
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Dalai Mama
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Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on May 1, 2016 15:40:31 GMT
It is SUCH an emotive topic because there are many women who fight very hard for us to be accepted as we are, regardless of age or weight or hair/lack of it. Women are generally expected to conform to all kinds of beauty standards, and removing body hair is one of those. For those women who decide not to follow those rules, it is a massive personal decision and they've probably received a lot of abuse for it. So to ask her to 'just shave' because it 'looks better' is offensive because you are asking them to go against their strongly held personal beliefs. Maybe people used not to get offended because it was more acceptable to expect a woman to look a certain way. Today we are able to challenge those views and I am grateful for that. I think the bride has to either let it go, or choose a different dress. I can't believe people would notice a bridesmaids armpithair instead of focussing on the happy couple, but maybe her friends are different. All this. I would imagine this conversation would go differently if the bride had asked the mother if she would ask the SIL if she would change her weight.
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Post by melanell on May 1, 2016 15:43:49 GMT
WHY for all that is holy do you care about another person's armpits?! WTF?! I'm not even going to say the "general you." If you are so offended by an armpit, well then I'm talking about you. What does the hairy armpit have to do with you? What does it say about you? Why does it offend you? Seriously...why? brides have a vision of their day and its pictures For my Sil she wanted everyone's hair down. Whatever, ok. She wanted everyone to wear these ugly earrings she picked out. I wore the ugly earrings. Of your entire self is wrapped up in your armpit hair, then say no to shaving. I guess my question in this situation would be how would she handle it if one of the wedding party had extremely short hair. To me asking someone to wear hair that they already have down for the day would be much different from asking them to grow their hair before the wedding. If she allowed the person with super-short hair to just rock the short hair for the day, then asking the others to skip an up-do wouldn't bother me. They weren't doing anything for the wedding that couldn't be immediately changed back to their own preference the moment the wedding was over.
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Post by freecharlie on May 1, 2016 15:48:24 GMT
It is SUCH an emotive topic because there are many women who fight very hard for us to be accepted as we are, regardless of age or weight or hair/lack of it. Women are generally expected to conform to all kinds of beauty standards, and removing body hair is one of those. For those women who decide not to follow those rules, it is a massive personal decision and they've probably received a lot of abuse for it. So to ask her to 'just shave' because it 'looks better' is offensive because you are asking them to go against their strongly held personal beliefs. Maybe people used not to get offended because it was more acceptable to expect a woman to look a certain way. Today we are able to challenge those views and I am grateful for that. I think the bride has to either let it go, or choose a different dress. I can't believe people would notice a bridesmaids armpithair instead of focussing on the happy couple, but maybe her friends are different. I was at a wedding g last night.weddings are all about people watching. And yea, I may be a judgemental ass, but I totally notice things about many of the guess. So did the people I sat with and I am sure other tables noticed things about us.
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Post by hop2 on May 1, 2016 15:48:40 GMT
Eh, I'll admit that I'm taking this personally. ( no not the armpit hair I shave that ) but the fact that so many people feel so entitled to control those around them. I'm so done with controlling people.
And honestly if the person writing in to 'Dear Abby' is the bridesmaids mother I'd probably suggest she work on her relationship with her DD if she doesn't already know if armpit hair is a key personal factor for her DD or not. I'm pretty sure I know what I can ask of my DD without asking Abby. Although they don't mention the age of the bridesmaid either.
I know my DD well enough that, I'm pretty sure right now, I could ask my DD if her ideas about grooming have changed or she's low on cash and out of razors, without causing irreparable harm to our relationship. In a few more years that type of question will be out of bounds because her financial situation will be none of my business.
So perhaps I'm reading more into this mothers issue because of my own bias, I'll admit that. I think she needs to stop talking about her DD behind her back with the bride, ( and with Dear Abby ) and try to get to know her DD for who she is. Because she ought to know wether or not she can bring that subject up with her own DD.
And really if armpit hair is their biggest problem .... First world problems for sure,
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seaexplore
Prolific Pea
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Apr 25, 2015 23:57:30 GMT
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Post by seaexplore on May 1, 2016 15:50:20 GMT
Didn't read all the responses....
If the bride has an issue, she needs to politely ask. She needs to be prepared for a "no" answer. Can't hurt to ask if it's done in a kind manner.
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Post by justkat on May 1, 2016 15:52:40 GMT
Normally I'd say tell bridezilla to back off. However this isn't a woman telling her attendants to remove a tattoo or loose weight or hold off on getting pregnant. She wants her soon-to-be sister in law to shave her underarms. Yeah, seriously join polite civilized society and shave.
I'd simply ask her nicely myself. Explain to her why it's important to the bride and the groom. I'd also order a shrug that she'd be wearing if she wanted to walk sporting an armpit bush.
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Post by freecharlie on May 1, 2016 15:54:29 GMT
Eh, I'll admit that I'm taking this personally. ( no not the armpit hair I shave that ) but the fact that so many people feel so entitled to control those around them. I'm so done with controlling people. And honestly if the person writing in to 'Dear Abby' is the bridesmaids mother I'd probably suggest she work on her relationship with her DD if she doesn't already know if armpit hair is a key personal factor for her DD or not. I'm pretty sure I know what I can ask of my DD without asking Abby. Although they don't mention the age of the bridesmaid either. I know my DD well enough that, I'm pretty sure right now, I could ask my DD if her ideas about grooming have changed or she's low on cash and out of razors, without causing irreparable harm to our relationship. In a few more years that type of question will be out of bounds because her financial situation will be none of my business. So perhaps I'm reading more into this mothers issue because of my own bias, I'll admit that. I think she needs to stop talking about her DD behind her back with the bride, ( and with Dear Abby ) and try to get to know her DD for who she is. Because she ought to know wether or not she can bring that subject up with her own DD. And really if armpit hair is their biggest problem .... First world problems for sure, from the tone of the letter, it sounds like the mom does not agree with the daughters choices. However, this topic, like almost all of them is going to depend on your upbringing and the way you see the world. My mom would totally tell me her thoughts and opinions and I am 40. I don't mind. I see my mother as a friend and that works for us.
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Post by littlemama on May 1, 2016 15:57:47 GMT
I don't see why the girl's mother couldn't just ask her if she plans to shave her pits since it is a sleeveless dress and a formal event. If she says no, then that's the end of it.
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Post by freecharlie on May 1, 2016 16:01:29 GMT
I don't see why the girl's mother couldn't just ask her if she plans to shave her pits since it is a sleeveless dress and a formal event. If she says no, then that's the end of it. I agree with this...or the brother.
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Dalai Mama
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Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on May 1, 2016 16:04:45 GMT
Normally I'd say tell bridezilla to back off. However this isn't a woman telling her attendants to remove a tattoo or loose weight or hold off on getting pregnant. She wants her soon-to-be sister in law to shave her underarms. Yeah, seriously join polite civilized society and shave. I'd simply ask her nicely myself. Explain to her why it's important to the bride and the groom. I'd also order a shrug that she'd be wearing if she wanted to walk sporting an armpit bush. Polite and civilized? Yeah, no. This is exactly why women grow their body hair.
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Post by Chips on May 1, 2016 16:04:46 GMT
Weddings can definitely bring out the crazy in people! I got married in 1997 and my best friend was my maid of honor and she had a baby about 4 months before the wedding. I never gave it a thought, she came to me worried about her weight and the dress but I assured her not to worry about that! I loved her for her not anything else. But what surprised me was my Aunt who probably married in the sixties thanked me for having my bf as my moh. Back in her day she would never of asked someone to be in her wedding who recently had a baby I was totally shocked at the thought of excluding someone from such an important life event based on their looks. I can tell that most people have come a long way from this kind of thinking and it truly makes for a much for a much better and real relationship for everyone!
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Post by Chips on May 1, 2016 16:07:40 GMT
Weddings can definitely bring out the crazy in people! I got married in 1997 and my best friend was my maid of honor and she had a baby about 4 months before the wedding. I never gave it a thought, she came to me worried about her weight and the dress but I assured her not to worry about that! I loved her for her not anything else. But what surprised me was my Aunt who probably married in the sixties thanked me for having my bf as my moh. Back in her day she would never of asked someone to be in her wedding who recently had a baby I was totally shocked at the thought of excluding someone from such an important life event based on their looks. I can tell that most people have come a long way from this kind of thinking and it truly makes for a much for a much better and real relationship for everyone! So forgot to add - armpit hair would not even be on my radar! I be thankful for all the fellowship, joy, love, and celebrating of the wedding.
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grinningcat
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Posts: 4,663
Jun 26, 2014 13:06:35 GMT
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Post by grinningcat on May 1, 2016 16:09:34 GMT
If, as a bride, your definition of 'perfect day' includes dictating others' personal grooming habits, you suck. A hairy-pitted bridesmaid will not ruin your wedding day. Seriously? As expected, I disagree with all the responses so far, but especially this one. And I feel like such an old fart, even though I realized after we recently did a "How old are you" poll and it seemed that the majority of the Peas are around my age. Is this really so much for the bride to ask? This makes her a terrible person? She isn't asking Hairy to have a nose job or liposuction (or stuff her bra with socks). It takes two seconds to shave under your arms. It is not painful or dangerous. Armpit hair grows back. Almost immediately, in my case. I believe the bridesmaid who would refuse to make such a simple gesture for the bride - who she presumably cares about - is the one who sucks. In the Dear Abby column, the mother was too much of a weenie to even ASK her special snowflake about this. The bridesmaid might have been like, sure what's the big deal? If you have that much of a problem with them that you would demand that someone physically alter their body for something as stupid as a wedding, you suck as a friend or a family member.
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grinningcat
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Jun 26, 2014 13:06:35 GMT
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Post by grinningcat on May 1, 2016 16:12:19 GMT
Contrary to popular opinion, I have to agree with Cranky Pea on this one. The bride was stuck and had to include the hippy SIL. So she should ask all of her attendants to wear a style of dress that they may not like/want because of one bridesmaid's "hippy lifestyle?" Not a religious belief, but a lifestyle choice. Would it be traumatic/insulting to request that the SIL trim the hair so it did not show if the girls' arms were not clamped to their sides? I guess it depends on how long and how dark/obvious the pit hair is. I would be tempted to have each girl pick a different style dress in the same color so SIL could cover the pit hair, but then she may want to flaunt her lifestyle and would end up strapless or. sleeveless anyway. Everyone is defending the hippy girl and not wanting to offend her, but I can't see how shaving her pits once would be that horrifying for her, and would be a sacrifice she could make for her future sister in law. If everyone is too scared to say anything, then she would not have the opportunity to accommodate the bride. She may be happy to do so, depending on their relationship. No one is forced to have anyone in a wedding party. Did the bride have a gun to her head when she had to choose the wedding party? I highly doubt it. And really, if she's so shallow that she bowed to outside pressure to pick her bridesmaids, no wonder she has this problem. Is she really uncomfortable with it, or is she just bowing to pressure. Sorry, but I see no redeeming quality here for the bride or the mother. I think you suck if you demand someone to physically change for something as temporary as a wedding. Falling for the "perfection" that the WIC insists on is a bad idea. If she didn't want the hippy sister then she shouldn't have asked her. Now she has, so suck it up.
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Post by Amelia Bedelia on May 1, 2016 16:13:31 GMT
I also think it's offensive to ask someone to change their appearance/grooming habits to conform to your "wedding vision." It's no different from asking someone to cut their hair/let it grow, lose weight, wear a padded bra (as mentioned earlier)... Personally, if I were the bridesmaid, I'd keep my pit hair and dye it to match the wedding colors.
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grinningcat
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,663
Jun 26, 2014 13:06:35 GMT
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Post by grinningcat on May 1, 2016 16:15:04 GMT
I'm tired of the idea that a wedding day must achieve some manufactured picture-perfect ideal that the bride and/or groom have dreamed up. Your wedding party and guests are real people--people who are likely important to you. They are not models for a wedding magazine photo shoot. Exactly. WIC perfection is an illusion and a dangerous thing to desire for a wedding.
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chaosisapony
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Jun 26, 2014 3:27:53 GMT
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Post by chaosisapony on May 1, 2016 16:17:36 GMT
It may be possible that the bride didn't know of the armpit thing until recently. I have no idea whether my sil shaves her pits of not. This sounds like the most plausible scenario to me. Most of the time, in the weddings I've been involved with, when future in laws are included in the wedding party it's just a polite gesture. The bride/groom doesn't really know the new in law. And if this is a recent change in the SIL's lifestyle it's possible that the bride had all the dresses picked out and stuff before this change in lifestyle. People can have ridiculously long engagements and things can change during those engagements. Personally this wouldn't even be a blip on my radar. You want to shave? Shave. You don't? Don't. It's that simple. It's your appearance, not mine.
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Post by anxiousmom on May 1, 2016 16:18:09 GMT
Normally I'd say tell bridezilla to back off. However this isn't a woman telling her attendants to remove a tattoo or loose weight or hold off on getting pregnant. She wants her soon-to-be sister in law to shave her underarms. Yeah, seriously join polite civilized society and shave. I'd simply ask her nicely myself. Explain to her why it's important to the bride and the groom. I'd also order a shrug that she'd be wearing if she wanted to walk sporting an armpit bush. Polite and civilized? Yeah, no. This is exactly why women grow their body hair. I agree. The women who hold this as a deeply held belief are saying that polite and civilized society are narrow and unrealistic-that all women are beautiful as they are. To them, a civilized society says you are beautiful-without any kind of artificial help.
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craftykitten
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Jun 26, 2014 7:39:32 GMT
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Post by craftykitten on May 1, 2016 16:20:38 GMT
Ok, so I just read this to DH to get his view (he has a beard, so I asked him what he would do if someone asked him to shave it off).
And he pointed out that if the bride-to-be can't ask the bridesmaid directly by herself, then she knows it's a rude question to ask.
Also, he said he wouldn't shave his beard.
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oldcrow
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Jun 26, 2014 12:25:29 GMT
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Post by oldcrow on May 1, 2016 16:24:09 GMT
So what are the reasons people stop shaving their armpit hair? In no way whatsoever is having hairy underarms the same as not eating meat or doing something for religious reasons As for the validity of other peoples feelings, aren't the brides feelings also valid? Whose validity wins? The bride has had more than ample time and opportunity to deal with this. The bridesmaid has been under the assumption all this time that things were fine and now she should have to change what she is to valid someone who has been too spineless to mention a problem. The bride should have said in the very beginning that she would only choose that bridesmaid if she changed her ways. Or she could have made different choices along the way. To leave it to the last minute in hopes of guilting the bridesmaid into doing what the bride wants is controlling to the maximum. I hope all the other bridesmaids grow armpit hair so that they will all look the same.
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grinningcat
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Jun 26, 2014 13:06:35 GMT
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Post by grinningcat on May 1, 2016 16:24:28 GMT
I'm trying to remember a time when it would have been polite or acceptable to tell someone else to change something about themselves because you think it looks like "ass" and I'm coming up blank. Fine, you don't like armpit hair. Shave it. Telling someone else that they should conform to your personal standards of attractiveness is shallow and rude. What I don't understand is when people became so eager to be so offended and insulted by every little thing. I remember a time that most people wouldn't have a brain aneurism over the idea of a bride asking a bridesmaid to shave her pits for the wedding pictures that she was paying a fortune for. I miss that world. There was once a time when people WOULD NOT be offended by a bridezilla making out of control demands to their bridesmaids? Every.Single.Person. I have ever talked to has at least one story of an out of control, unrealistic bride who wanted stupid, disrespectful shit like what this mother and alledgedly the bride want. Bridezillas aren't a new phenomenon. And this one is definitely a bridezilla. You don't think that she doesn't have a list a mile long of things that others have to do so she can have her stereotypical WIC approved wedding? Guaranteed she does.
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grinningcat
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Jun 26, 2014 13:06:35 GMT
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Post by grinningcat on May 1, 2016 16:29:50 GMT
Normally I'd say tell bridezilla to back off. However this isn't a woman telling her attendants to remove a tattoo or loose weight or hold off on getting pregnant. She wants her soon-to-be sister in law to shave her underarms. Yeah, seriously join polite civilized society and shave. I'd simply ask her nicely myself. Explain to her why it's important to the bride and the groom. I'd also order a shrug that she'd be wearing if she wanted to walk sporting an armpit bush. Polite and civilized? Yeah, no. This is exactly why women grow their body hair. All of this. Asking to shave anything let alone pit hair is no different that asking to hide tattoos or lose weight or whatever. It's like these people read The Knot and think that their snobby requirements are acceptable. They aren't.
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Post by peano on May 1, 2016 16:30:47 GMT
Personally, if I were the bridesmaid, I'd keep my pit hair and dye it to match the wedding colors.
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