Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2016 18:15:20 GMT
link
The link is for "Benghazi is Over. But the search for proof of Clinton's perfidy continues." By Paul Waldman. I though it was interesting piece with some good points. Some highlights: On Bill's visit with Loretta Lynch at the airport. " Sure they say they were just talking about grandchildren and golf. And they say it just happened because they happened to cross paths at the airport. But the truth is far more sinister. We know that because the truth with the Clintons is always more sinister. Isn't it obvious? Despite the fact that there were other people standing around, Clinton probably ordered Lynch to quash the investigation into his wife's emails, and she agreed to comply. Maybe it was a Jedi mind trick. You are going to hear this story on Fox, and Russ Limbaugh's show, and probably from Donald Trump before long." And "The fact is that even mainstream Republicans indulge the wackiest notions and the wackiest people on their side, and have for decades, and it renders them all unable to distinguish between what's actually worth going after their opponents about and what isn't." And " And that's a real danger for them, that 7 or 8 Benghazi investigations is never enough. The hatred that ferments inside the conservatives information bubble for major Democratic Party figures is so pure that no collision with the facts will diminish it. That leaves Republicans unable to distinguish between a legitimate critique and a laughable one, particularly when it comes to what voters will find persuasive." The article makes several other good points IMO. It's hard to argue with what Waldman is saying in his article. Sometimes I think the Republicans are looking to find a Democratic version of Watergate and Iran-Contra even if one isn't there. No question it was a dumb move by Clinton to meet with Lynch. However until someone says otherwise I will believe Lynch's account they just talked about grandchildren and golf. Especially since there were other people present during the conversation.
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MizIndependent
Drama Llama
Quit your bullpoop.
Posts: 5,836
Jun 25, 2014 19:43:16 GMT
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Post by MizIndependent on Jun 30, 2016 18:34:51 GMT
krazyscrapper , from your article: Ya...right. Was there also sniper fire? ABC15-Phoenix: "US Attorney General Loretta Lynch, Bill Clinton meet privately in Phoenix before Benghazi report" Show me ANY previous example of an Attorney General having 30 minute meetings on a private plane with the spouse of a suspect in an FBI/DoJ criminal investigation. The reality is that this is massively, shockingly inappropriate for an Attorney General. The more this gets traction, the more I think it's supposed to. Seems that the Clintons want the appearance of bias so they can get a special prosecutor and stall this out. They definitely know their way around special prosecutors. And it is far more likely the Clinton modus operandi: turn a scandal into a relatively narrow legal issue (versus one of ethics and public accountability), drag the whole thing out for as long as possible thereby exhausting public interest and attention, give the appearance that the whole thing is a partisan witch-hunt, and then when there are eventually no, or minimal, legal findings (merely because thresholds for prosecution are sky high), parade the "fact" that you are irreproachable. Special prosecutors can perform this function very well.
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Post by anxiousmom on Jun 30, 2016 18:41:39 GMT
It might surprise people, but on the meeting with Former President Clinton and Attorney General Lynch, I agree that it was not appropriate regardless of what the topic of discussion. They both should have said politely "I think at this point, we need to put off any meetings."
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Post by BeckyTech on Jun 30, 2016 18:45:34 GMT
Gotta love the Clinton dictionary. Potential conflict of interest and gross impropriety = Jedi mind trick. (Imagine if Rudy Giuliani had met with John Gotti while the Mafia was under investigation (that Rudy would later prosecute.) You know, just to chat grandchildren.)
Trying to dig out the truth that is regularly blocked and hidden by Clinton, her aides, and Obama = hatred.
Okey dokey.
Paul Waldman is putting on a happy face, but that meeting is giving top Democrats heartburn: Democrats made clear that while the meeting was likely as innocent as Lynch described, it did not give the Justice Department the appearance of independence.
“I do agree with you that it doesn’t send the right signal,” Sen. Chris Coons (D-Del.) said Thursday in response to a question about the meeting from CNN “New Day” host Alisyn Camerota. “She has generally shown excellent judgment and strong leadership of the department, and I’m convinced that she’s an independent attorney general. But I do think that this meeting sends the wrong signal and I don’t think it sends the right signal. I think she should have steered clear, even of a brief, casual social meeting with the former president.”
www.politico.com/story/2016/06/bill-clinton-loretta-lynch-224972
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Deleted
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Jun 10, 2024 4:03:53 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2016 18:51:17 GMT
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flute4peace
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,757
Jul 3, 2014 14:38:35 GMT
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Post by flute4peace on Jun 30, 2016 19:15:24 GMT
It might surprise people, but on the meeting with Former President Clinton and Attorney General Lynch, I agree that it was not appropriate regardless of what the topic of discussion. They both should have said politely "I think at this point, we need to put off any meetings." Haven't read all the replies so apologies if this is duplicating another response.
Initially I felt the same way, and then started thinking about it. I'm not up on political propriety, but could she have been giving him a private heads-up about what the report contained? I could see that being done out of professional courtesy - you know, like when Jack McCoy meets Danielle Melenik at the bar the night before trial . Of course, it could also be totally illegal, in which case I plead ignorance of the rules. Would a meeting like that have to be supervised/recorded?
If they had stopped at the baggage claim area & said "Hi, how was your trip? How are those grandkids doing?" sure. But on the other hand, with all the security that surrounds them, that's not likely, either.
Certainly raises eyebrows.
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Jun 30, 2016 19:23:41 GMT
krazyscrapper , from your article: Ya...right. Was there also sniper fire? ABC15-Phoenix: "US Attorney General Loretta Lynch, Bill Clinton meet privately in Phoenix before Benghazi report" Show me ANY previous example of an Attorney General having 30 minute meetings on a private plane with the spouse of a suspect in an FBI/DoJ criminal investigation. The reality is that this is massively, shockingly inappropriate for an Attorney General. The more this gets traction, the more I think it's supposed to. Seems that the Clintons want the appearance of bias so they can get a special prosecutor and stall this out. They definitely know their way around special prosecutors. And it is far more likely the Clinton modus operandi: turn a scandal into a relatively narrow legal issue (versus one of ethics and public accountability), drag the whole thing out for as long as possible thereby exhausting public interest and attention, give the appearance that the whole thing is a partisan witch-hunt, and then when there are eventually no, or minimal, legal findings (merely because thresholds for prosecution are sky high), parade the "fact" that you are irreproachable. Special prosecutors can perform this function very well. And..........you've just proved krazyscrappers point.
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MizIndependent
Drama Llama
Quit your bullpoop.
Posts: 5,836
Jun 25, 2014 19:43:16 GMT
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Post by MizIndependent on Jun 30, 2016 19:29:25 GMT
And..........you've just proved krazyscrappers point. How do you figure? The whole thing is shady af either way.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2016 19:34:38 GMT
when it comes to what voters will find persuasive." BOTH parties are woefully out of touch with what voters find persuasive ETA: The more that the party insists Clinton is just an innocent who has done nothing wrong, the less I trust anything they have to say.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2016 19:57:32 GMT
No one forced Bill Clinton to board that airplane. No one forced Loretta Lynch to privately talk to the husband of someone her department is investigating. But it's all a right-wing conspiracy, or as the article so adorably put it, a Jedi mind trick.
How about this? If you don't want to be perceived as dishonest and shady, stop doing things that make you look dishonest and shady.
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Post by jenis40 on Jun 30, 2016 20:09:13 GMT
I will be voting for Hillary in November and she has been my first choice in this incredibly sucky field of candidates. I think she is an intelligent, ambitious woman who has the experience to lead this country as compared to Trump or Sanders. However, she and her campaign need to stop doing stupid shit like this. Seriously with as many years of political experience she has as well as having a target on her back for the last 20 plus years, quit giving them ammunition.
Private email server - dumbass move. Lying about sniper fire - dumbass move. Badmouthing Bill's mistresses - dumbass move but nothing no other red-blooded American woman wouldn't do. Bill meeting with the Attorney General - dumbass move.
Still like her better than Trump.
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Jun 30, 2016 20:30:21 GMT
And..........you've just proved krazyscrappers point. How do you figure? The whole thing is shady af either way. (My answer is based on the facts known at this moment) The creation of something out of nothing. While I'll concede to it being a dumbass idea to meet, the people--the only people who were present stated what it was about, and to my knowledge, nothing has been given to the Clintons as some sort of free pass or favor on their part. Making a mountain out of a molehill.
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Deleted
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Jun 10, 2024 4:03:53 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2016 20:36:48 GMT
I will be voting for Hillary in November and she has been my first choice in this incredibly sucky field of candidates. I think she is an intelligent, ambitious woman who has the experience to lead this country as compared to Trump or Sanders. However, she and her campaign need to stop doing stupid shit like this. Seriously with as many years of political experience she has as well as having a target on her back for the last 20 plus years, quit giving them ammunition. Private email server - dumbass move. Lying about sniper fire - dumbass move. Badmouthing Bill's mistresses - dumbass move but nothing no other red-blooded American woman wouldn't do. Bill meeting with the Attorney General - dumbass move. Still like her better than Trump. Yep.....I liked the story I heard that she smacked the shit out of him.....normally I wouldn't condone physical violence, but personally, I think Bill deserved it. She's flawed, but so am I....and so are most of us and the alternative is worse than flawed. #ImWithHer
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MizIndependent
Drama Llama
Quit your bullpoop.
Posts: 5,836
Jun 25, 2014 19:43:16 GMT
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Post by MizIndependent on Jun 30, 2016 21:16:14 GMT
How do you figure? The whole thing is shady af either way. (My answer is based on the facts known at this moment) The creation of something out of nothing. While I'll concede to it being a dumbass idea to meet, the people--the only people who were present stated what it was about, and to my knowledge, nothing has been given to the Clintons as some sort of free pass or favor on their part. Making a mountain out of a molehill. But that is exactly the point. This isn't nothing. By doing this, even if it is completely innocent (which it probably is), they confuscate this issue, purposefully. I'd be willing to bet it's all just a horse and pony show rigged specifically so a special prosecutor will be appointed to the FBI case, which would fit if they're just trying to stall until the DNC convention. They only need to make it as far as the convention and then the American people are out of options.
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~Lauren~
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,876
Jun 26, 2014 3:33:18 GMT
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Post by ~Lauren~ on Jun 30, 2016 21:24:59 GMT
I will be voting for Hillary in November and she has been my first choice in this incredibly sucky field of candidates. I think she is an intelligent, ambitious woman who has the experience to lead this country as compared to Trump or Sanders. However, she and her campaign need to stop doing stupid shit like this. Seriously with as many years of political experience she has as well as having a target on her back for the last 20 plus years, quit giving them ammunition. Private email server - dumbass move. Lying about sniper fire - dumbass move. Badmouthing Bill's mistresses - dumbass move but nothing no other red-blooded American woman wouldn't do. Bill meeting with the Attorney General - dumbass move. Still like her better than Trump. All I can say in response to a post like this is:
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~Lauren~
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,876
Jun 26, 2014 3:33:18 GMT
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Post by ~Lauren~ on Jun 30, 2016 21:26:18 GMT
As attorneys, both Bill and the Lynch are well aware that the appearance of impropriety is every bit as bad as actual impropriety. It's hammered into lawyers from the time their students and then throughout their careers.
They just don't care because in spite of everything, the Clinton supports give them a pass.
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Jun 30, 2016 21:41:14 GMT
I will be voting for Hillary in November and she has been my first choice in this incredibly sucky field of candidates. I think she is an intelligent, ambitious woman who has the experience to lead this country as compared to Trump or Sanders. However, she and her campaign need to stop doing stupid shit like this. Seriously with as many years of political experience she has as well as having a target on her back for the last 20 plus years, quit giving them ammunition. Private email server - dumbass move. Lying about sniper fire - dumbass move. Badmouthing Bill's mistresses - dumbass move but nothing no other red-blooded American woman wouldn't do. Bill meeting with the Attorney General - dumbass move. Still like her better than Trump. All I can say in response to a post like this is: Posts the person who not 2 days ago hammered people for posting photos to shut down or impede the conversation, labeling them as immature, calling them bullies....
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Post by refugeepea on Jun 30, 2016 21:42:47 GMT
I will be voting for Hillary in November and she has been my first choice in this incredibly sucky field of candidates. I think she is an intelligent, ambitious woman who has the experience to lead this country as compared to Trump or Sanders. However, she and her campaign need to stop doing stupid shit like this. Seriously with as many years of political experience she has as well as having a target on her back for the last 20 plus years, quit giving them ammunition. Private email server - dumbass move. Lying about sniper fire - dumbass move. Badmouthing Bill's mistresses - dumbass move but nothing no other red-blooded American woman wouldn't do. Bill meeting with the Attorney General - dumbass move. Still like her better than Trump. I your response. I find it refreshing when someone from either side can admit their candidate of choice has faults. I feel it really makes it worse for Hillary when supporters won't admit that she has lied. They say she "misspoke" or "embellished". Or Trump, "that's not really what he meant". I do agree with you, better than Trump.
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Deleted
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Jun 10, 2024 4:03:53 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2016 21:43:00 GMT
As attorneys, both Bill and the Lynch are well aware that the appearance of impropriety is every bit as bad as actual impropriety. It's hammered into lawyers from the time their students and then throughout their careers. They just don't care because in spite of everything, the Clinton supports give them a pass. I'm guessing this means Hillary? What's the meaning behind it? Nevermind. I figured out you were talking about the AG. Complete DUH moment.
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Jun 30, 2016 21:43:48 GMT
So then, what's the big secret? What was uncovered as dishonest, favor on their part towards them? What nefarious hanky panky has been uncovered?
If the AG, a respected person has said nothing shady was going on, then what?
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~Lauren~
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,876
Jun 26, 2014 3:33:18 GMT
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Post by ~Lauren~ on Jun 30, 2016 21:44:02 GMT
No, I meant Lynch, not HIllary. Typo
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Deleted
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Jun 10, 2024 4:03:53 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2016 21:45:47 GMT
No, I meant Lynch, not HIllary. Typo Thanks. I edited my post when I figured it out. I was having a duh moment.
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Deleted
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Jun 10, 2024 4:03:53 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2016 21:47:08 GMT
I find it refreshing when someone from either side can admit their candidate of choice has faults. I feel it really makes it worse for Hillary when supporters won't admit that she has lied. They say she "misspoke" or "embellished". Or Trump, "that's not really what he meant". Couldn't agree more! The apologists and excuse-makers just make their candidate look worse.
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MizIndependent
Drama Llama
Quit your bullpoop.
Posts: 5,836
Jun 25, 2014 19:43:16 GMT
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Post by MizIndependent on Jun 30, 2016 21:48:18 GMT
As attorneys, both Bill and the Lynch are well aware that the appearance of impropriety is every bit as bad as actual impropriety. It's hammered into lawyers from the time their students and then throughout their careers. They just don't care because in spite of everything, the Clinton supports give them a pass. It's worse than that. Knowing how shifty the Clintons are, I have no doubt believing this little "coincidental" meeting was engineered to undermine the people's confidence in Lynch so that a special prosecutor would have to be brought in. They're trying to drag this out for as long as they can.
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Jun 30, 2016 21:55:21 GMT
As attorneys, both Bill and the Lynch are well aware that the appearance of impropriety is every bit as bad as actual impropriety. It's hammered into lawyers from the time their students and then throughout their careers. They just don't care because in spite of everything, the Clinton supports give them a pass. Let's see, I think the same goes for those who support Trump. He lies daily. He is not fit to be president. He spews hate pretty much every day. He rips people off in business and brags about it. He wears his shady ass business acumen like a badge of honor. But... "they don't care because in spite of everything, the Trump/Republican supports give him a free pass."
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flute4peace
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,757
Jul 3, 2014 14:38:35 GMT
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Post by flute4peace on Jun 30, 2016 22:09:08 GMT
As attorneys, both Bill and the Lynch are well aware that the appearance of impropriety is every bit as bad as actual impropriety. It's hammered into lawyers from the time their students and then throughout their careers. They just don't care because in spite of everything, the Clinton supports give them a pass. Let's see, I think the same goes for those who support Trump. He lies daily. He is not fit to be president. He spews hate pretty much every day. He rips people off in business and brags about it. He wears his shady ass business acumen like a badge of honor. But... "they don't care because in spite of everything, the Trump/Republican supports give him a free pass." I think it's fair to say it happens on both sides. Is this typical of a presidential campaign, or is it more significant this time due to the candidates? I would sort of expect it on a small scale, just because nobody is going to agree with everything a specific candidate stands for.
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Deleted
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Jun 10, 2024 4:03:53 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2016 22:09:48 GMT
So then, what's the big secret? What was uncovered as dishonest, favor on their part towards them? What nefarious hanky panky has been uncovered? If the AG, a respected person has said nothing shady was going on, then what?If there was something shady going on, do you honestly expect she'd admit to it? "Hey, Bill Clinton boarded my private plane and tried to talk me into dropping the investigation into his wife..." Really? It's the part about them knowing how this would appear, even if their conversation was entirely innocent (and it probably was), that leaves me flabbergasted. That and the accusations of a right-wing conspiracy when they're questioned. What if Donald Trump's wife met privately with the judge presiding over the civil suits against Trump for coffee. What if they claimed they just talked about family stuff? Would it be so innocuous then? Again, if you don't want people to question your integrity and honesty, don't hold private, unnecessary discussions with the spouse of someone you're supposed to be investigating in an impartial manner. Don't seek out the person who is investigating your spouse to chitchat. Save
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Post by mollycoddle on Jun 30, 2016 22:13:21 GMT
I will admit that the meeting was foolish. The optics are bad, even if the meeting was innocent-and I believe that it was.
Having said that, the alternative isTrump, so I'm voting for her. Her positives to me outweigh her negatives. I realize that many of you don't agree, and that's the way that elections generally go.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Jun 30, 2016 22:27:05 GMT
link
The link is for "Benghazi is Over. But the search for proof of Clinton's perfidy continues." By Paul Waldman. I though it was interesting piece with some good points. Some highlights: On Bill's visit with Loretta Lynch at the airport. " Sure they say they were just talking about grandchildren and golf. And they say it just happened because they happened to cross paths at the airport. But the truth is far more sinister. We know that because the truth with the Clintons is always more sinister. Isn't it obvious? Despite the fact that there were other people standing around, Clinton probably ordered Lynch to quash the investigation into his wife's emails, and she agreed to comply. Maybe it was a Jedi mind trick. You are going to hear this story on Fox, and Russ Limbaugh's show, and probably from Donald Trump before long." And "The fact is that even mainstream Republicans indulge the wackiest notions and the wackiest people on their side, and have for decades, and it renders them all unable to distinguish between what's actually worth going after their opponents about and what isn't." And " And that's a real danger for them, that 7 or 8 Benghazi investigations is never enough. The hatred that ferments inside the conservatives information bubble for major Democratic Party figures is so pure that no collision with the facts will diminish it. That leaves Republicans unable to distinguish between a legitimate critique and a laughable one, particularly when it comes to what voters will find persuasive." The article makes several other good points IMO. It's hard to argue with what Waldman is saying in his article. Sometimes I think the Republicans are looking to find a Democratic version of Watergate and Iran-Contra even if one isn't there. No question it was a dumb move by Clinton to meet with Lynch. However until someone says otherwise I will believe Lynch's account they just talked about grandchildren and golf. Especially since there were other people present during the conversation. Happened to cross paths at the airport - well that pretty much discredits anything else in the article. Waiting around for someone to land and then boarding their private plane for a meeting isn't just happened to cross paths. But then the entire article is rubbish and articles like these do nothing but play to people want to believe anyone who doesn't like Hillary Clinton is an imbecile - not a way to win over any new supporters.
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Deleted
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Jun 10, 2024 4:03:53 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2016 23:09:14 GMT
Happened to cross paths at the airport - well that pretty much discredits anything else in the article. Waiting around for someone to land and then boarding their private plane for a meeting isn't just happened to cross paths. But then the entire article is rubbish and articles like these do nothing but play to people want to believe anyone who doesn't like Hillary Clinton is an imbecile - not a way to win over any new supporters. I find when folks dismiss articles like this one the way you just did it's because it hits a little bit to close to home. But hey if that is the way you see the article then that's the way you see it. So let me see if I have this right. Bill Clinton wanted to have a conversation with Loretta Lynch so he plotted where she would be at a given time. Flew there and waited until her plane arrived. Then he went on to her plane, where there were other people besides Lynch and her husband, to talked to Lynch about his wife's investigation. In front of potential witnesses. Well ok. There is no question this was a dumb ass move by Bill and Hillary is going to pay a price for it. Bill has done other stupid things and this is by far the worst, no question about that. However if it was Bill's intent to have a conversation with Lynch and not just him wanting to say hi on a whim I have no doubt he would have found a way to have the conversation that was not in a public place with reporters around and not in front of potential witnesses. Politicians are good at planning secret meetings. In fact they excel at it. No this was a dumb ass move by Bill because he wasn't thinking.
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