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Post by Merge on Dec 28, 2018 2:31:24 GMT
It occurred to me to add, afterward: except for Michael Avenatti. I'm really glad he decided not to run so we didn't have him as a distraction. Any of the current potential candidates I've heard of would be better than Trump. I honestly think Avenatti would have been just as bad as Trump. Problem is you can’t count on voters to come out “just to vote for anybody but trump”. You have to give them someone they want to vote for and to make them get up off their rear ends and actually show up. And another reason you have to give people someone, especially Democrats, they want to vote for is some Republican could primary trump and win. I have had enough of Republicans for awhile. So if someone primaries trump I want to make sure whatever Democrat we nominate can win and will win regardless if it’s trump or another Republican. I agree with you in theory. I think we need a movement candidate - a personality large enough to get people excited even if they don't pay much attention or normally vote. Obama was such a candidate, and people turned out. It's those of us who DO pay close attention who need to be not so picky, IMO. If a movement candidate ends up being someone like Beto, then people need to get over whatever they don't like about his voting record as a congressman from Texas. If it ends up being Biden, people need to get over his age. There's a strong argument to be made that the Bernie bros helped Hillary lose the 2016 election because they sat out in their pique that their guy didn't get the nomination. We can't let that happen again.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 2:32:18 GMT
And I will add, if you think we are at a place where voters will vote for anyone but trump just look at the results of the 2018 midterms.
In a midterm election the best way to vote against a sitting president is to oust members of his party in the House and the Senate.
No question the Democrats did good, but considering it was trump, they should have done better.
CA still re-elected Devin Nunes and the new minority leader in the House, Kevin McCarthy.
And while the Democrats turned two red Senate seats to blue in Nevada and Arizona, we lost a couple of seats as well and the Republicans gain a seat.
So I don’t think the Democrats can count on “anybody is better than trump vote”. No matter how bad he gets in the next 22 months.
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flute4peace
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,757
Jul 3, 2014 14:38:35 GMT
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Post by flute4peace on Dec 28, 2018 4:34:02 GMT
Yes, Beto was a Texas representative and his voting record reflects that. Here's the hill I die on: if we start in-fighting and demand ideological purity from our candidate, Trump will win again. Republicans and their supporters (Russia) are already spreading disinformation about potential candidates to get people to sit out the next election because they just "can't" vote for the Democratic candidate. Whoever we nominate, he /she will not be perfect. We all need to start the process of getting over that shit now. Get on message: Trump must go and that's all that matters. Any of the potential candidates being floated would be a thousand times better than Trump, period. While I agree with you, I think it’s a slippery slope. After all, isn’t this how we ended up with Trump in the first place? “Anybody but Hillary!”
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Post by freecharlie on Dec 28, 2018 4:51:15 GMT
Yes, Beto was a Texas representative and his voting record reflects that. Here's the hill I die on: if we start in-fighting and demand ideological purity from our candidate, Trump will win again. Republicans and their supporters (Russia) are already spreading disinformation about potential candidates to get people to sit out the next election because they just "can't" vote for the Democratic candidate. Whoever we nominate, he /she will not be perfect. We all need to start the process of getting over that shit now. Get on message: Trump must go and that's all that matters. Any of the potential candidates being floated would be a thousand times better than Trump, period. While I agree with you, I think it’s a slippery slope. After all, isn’t this how we ended up with Trump in the first place? “Anybody but Hillary!” on both sides I agree with this. Many Democrats sat out or voted 3rd party because they wouldn't vote for Clinton. Ugh and that gave us trump. The thing about someone like Beto is there isn't the already ingrained hatred that there was for Clinton or is for Sanders, Pelosi, or Warren. Biden doesn't carry that hatred either. I wish he had ran in 2016. I know why he didn't and I respect that, but man...
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Post by katlady on Dec 28, 2018 6:38:43 GMT
So, do you think the photo/video Trump posted on his twitter account is an actual SEAL team? Most think it is, a few say it is normal soldier dressed up for the photo op. But, really, if it is the team, WTH?! Someone needs to take his phone away!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 14:30:37 GMT
trump this morning so far...
”We will be forced to close the Southern Border entirely if the Obstructionist Democrats do not give us the money to finish the Wall & also change the ridiculous immigration laws that our Country is saddled with. Hard to believe there was a Congress & President who would approve!”
”The United States looses soooo much money on Trade with Mexico under NAFTA, over 75 Billion Dollars a year (not including Drug Money which would be many times that amount), that I would consider closing the Southern Border a “profit making operation.” We build a Wall or.....”
”close the Southern Border. Bring our car industry back into the United States where it belongs. Go back to pre-NAFTA, before so many of our companies and jobs were so foolishly sent to Mexico. Either we build (finish) the Wall or we close the Border......”
”Honduras, Guatemala and El Salvador are doing nothing for the United States but taking our money. Word is that a new Caravan is forming in Honduras and they are doing nothing about it. We will be cutting off all aid to these 3 countries - taking advantage of U.S. for years!”
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Post by Merge on Dec 28, 2018 14:39:00 GMT
trump this morning so far... ”We will be forced to close the Southern Border entirely if the Obstructionist Democrats do not give us the money to finish the Wall & also change the ridiculous immigration laws that our Country is saddled with. Hard to believe there was a Congress & President who would approve!” ”The United States looses soooo much money on Trade with Mexico under NAFTA, over 75 Billion Dollars a year (not including Drug Money which would be many times that amount), that I would consider closing the Southern Border a “profit making operation.” We build a Wall or.....” ”close the Southern Border. Bring our car industry back into the United States where it belongs. Go back to pre-NAFTA, before so many of our companies and jobs were so foolishly sent to Mexico. Either we build (finish) the Wall or we close the Border......” ”Honduras, Guatemala and El Salvador are doing nothing for the United States but taking our money. Word is that a new Caravan is forming in Honduras and they are doing nothing about it. We will be cutting off all aid to these 3 countries - taking advantage of U.S. for years!” My God. He is such an idiot. He should be somebody's crazy grandpa sitting in the couch ranting like this, not the most powerful man in the world.
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Post by Merge on Dec 28, 2018 14:40:52 GMT
While I agree with you, I think it’s a slippery slope. After all, isn’t this how we ended up with Trump in the first place? “Anybody but Hillary!” on both sides I agree with this. Many Democrats sat out or voted 3rd party because they wouldn't vote for Clinton. Ugh and that gave us trump. The thing about someone like Beto is there isn't the already ingrained hatred that there was for Clinton or is for Sanders, Pelosi, or Warren. Biden doesn't carry that hatred either. I wish he had ran in 2016. I know why he didn't and I respect that, but man... The thing is that right wing and Russian trolls are already starting to stir the hatred. You watch, they'll knock down the good candidates one at a time. We have to be smarter about this. We can't let Twitter choose our next candidate nor poison us against the best choice, whoever that may be.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 14:56:52 GMT
linkPaul Waldman in the Washington Post... “ The best way to force Trump’s hand? Ignore him.”
As Americans watch the federal government remain (partially) shut down and the president lob angry accusations at the opposition, a common response is, “Why can’t they all just sit down and work this out?” It seems like a reasonable question — if this were a different time and we were dealing with a different president. But since Donald Trump is in the White House, everything is more complicated. So the only answer may be for everyone, Democrats and Republicans alike, to ignore President Trump. Act as though he doesn’t exist and this has nothing to do with him. By which I mean that members of Congress should shut their ears to Trump’s tweets and threats and fulminations, pass something that House Democrats and Senate Republicans can live with, and then dare Trump to veto it. Because I doubt he has the guts.Negotiating with Trump might be impossible, not only because he’s committed to a border wall that Democrats won’t accept, but also because he changes his mind so frequently that his word just can’t be trusted. He could say in the morning that he’ll sign a particular compromise, then decide by the afternoon that he won’t because Sean Hannity doesn’t like it. He’ll have to agree to something eventually, but the only way forward might be to cut him out of the process until the end, then force his hand.Where we stand now is that Paul Ryan and other Republicans have decided to stop trying to arrive at a solution and just leave town, meaning things won’t get resolved until Democrats take over the House next week. Democrats are considering a few options (a very short-term bill, a somewhat short-term bill, a longer-term bill), but they are refusing to offer any more than the $1.3 billion in extra border security funds they’ve already put on the table. So here’s where we are now: Earlier Saturday, Vice President Pence visited Schumer for what has been the last face-to-face bipartisan talks, a brief meeting at which Pence made a new offer that included about half of Trump’s original request for $5 billion in wall funding. Democrats rejected that, still holding firm that no funds go toward a wall, and they also accused Pence of not being capable of guaranteeing the president’s support for his negotiating.“Different people from the same White House are saying different things about what the president would accept or not accept,” Pelosi and Schumer said Wednesday in a joint statement.Trump’s position is a critical roadblock to any negotiating. Democrats do not want to support something presented by Pence, only to have Trump balk at the idea and then move the goal posts farther right because of the apparent Democratic concession.That might sound like gamesmanship on the Democrats' part, but they’re right: Nobody knows what Trump is going to accept, and nobody can speak for him. He changes his mind so often that he himself doesn’t even know what he’ll accept. Even Republicans are getting exasperated:And congressional Republicans are adamant that they will not get caught flat-footed like last week, when the Senate unanimously approved a temporary funding plan to keep the entire government open through Feb. 8, only to learn later that Trump would veto the bill because it did not have funds for a wall.
“It’s clear that we on the Republican side, we do not want to vote for a bill that the president won’t sign,” [Sen. Pat Roberts (R-Kan.)] said.
That’s perfectly understandable, but since it is impossible for anyone to know what the president will sign, the only real option is to cut him and the White House out of the process. House Democrats should sit down with Senate Republicans and work out their own compromise. And we know what it will look like. It will have more money for border security — personnel, equipment, repairs to existing fencing — but not a wall. Republicans will say they worked to secure the border, and Democrats will say they held firm against the wall. It's not complicated. Once the bill is passed by both houses, they’ll send it to Trump’s desk and force him to make a final decision: Sign this or veto it. It’s one thing to threaten vetoes and proclaim that you won’t sign anything if you don’t get what you want; it’s something else entirely to stand against both parties and veto a real compromise that everyone else is behind. This plan of shutting out the White House requires only one person's cooperation: Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell. If he were to decide it's the best way forward, he and Nancy Pelosi could work out the details in an afternoon. Fortunately, McConnell is utterly unemotional and completely cynical. He doesn't particularly care about whether Trump is happy, or whether the president gets a "win." McConnell's only real concern is maintaining his own, and the GOP's, hold on power in the Senate. If he decides that the best way to do that is to end this shutdown and dial back the state of permanent crisis, that's what he'll do.
As I argued on Thursday, in the end, Trump will have to find a way to save face if he’s going to sign a funding bill. Perhaps Democrats and Republicans in Congress could make that more likely by announcing that once the government funding bill is out of the way, they’ll begin work on a comprehensive immigration reform bill, one that might include walls in some places if it’s combined with permanent status for “dreamers.” That would give Trump something to point to, so he can tell his base that the wall is on its way. But there’s just no way that any negotiation in which Trump is involved can succeed. So if it is going to reopen the government, Congress needs to ignore him.”
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Post by SockMonkey on Dec 28, 2018 14:59:41 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 15:21:31 GMT
linkPaul Waldman in the Washington Post... “ The best way to force Trump’s hand? Ignore him.”
As Americans watch the federal government remain (partially) shut down and the president lob angry accusations at the opposition, a common response is, “Why can’t they all just sit down and work this out?” It seems like a reasonable question — if this were a different time and we were dealing with a different president. But since Donald Trump is in the White House, everything is more complicated. So the only answer may be for everyone, Democrats and Republicans alike, to ignore President Trump. Act as though he doesn’t exist and this has nothing to do with him. By which I mean that members of Congress should shut their ears to Trump’s tweets and threats and fulminations, pass something that House Democrats and Senate Republicans can live with, and then dare Trump to veto it. Because I doubt he has the guts.Negotiating with Trump might be impossible, not only because he’s committed to a border wall that Democrats won’t accept, but also because he changes his mind so frequently that his word just can’t be trusted. He could say in the morning that he’ll sign a particular compromise, then decide by the afternoon that he won’t because Sean Hannity doesn’t like it. He’ll have to agree to something eventually, but the only way forward might be to cut him out of the process until the end, then force his hand.Where we stand now is that Paul Ryan and other Republicans have decided to stop trying to arrive at a solution and just leave town, meaning things won’t get resolved until Democrats take over the House next week. Democrats are considering a few options (a very short-term bill, a somewhat short-term bill, a longer-term bill), but they are refusing to offer any more than the $1.3 billion in extra border security funds they’ve already put on the table. So here’s where we are now: Earlier Saturday, Vice President Pence visited Schumer for what has been the last face-to-face bipartisan talks, a brief meeting at which Pence made a new offer that included about half of Trump’s original request for $5 billion in wall funding. Democrats rejected that, still holding firm that no funds go toward a wall, and they also accused Pence of not being capable of guaranteeing the president’s support for his negotiating.“Different people from the same White House are saying different things about what the president would accept or not accept,” Pelosi and Schumer said Wednesday in a joint statement.Trump’s position is a critical roadblock to any negotiating. Democrats do not want to support something presented by Pence, only to have Trump balk at the idea and then move the goal posts farther right because of the apparent Democratic concession.That might sound like gamesmanship on the Democrats' part, but they’re right: Nobody knows what Trump is going to accept, and nobody can speak for him. He changes his mind so often that he himself doesn’t even know what he’ll accept. Even Republicans are getting exasperated:And congressional Republicans are adamant that they will not get caught flat-footed like last week, when the Senate unanimously approved a temporary funding plan to keep the entire government open through Feb. 8, only to learn later that Trump would veto the bill because it did not have funds for a wall.
“It’s clear that we on the Republican side, we do not want to vote for a bill that the president won’t sign,” [Sen. Pat Roberts (R-Kan.)] said.
That’s perfectly understandable, but since it is impossible for anyone to know what the president will sign, the only real option is to cut him and the White House out of the process. House Democrats should sit down with Senate Republicans and work out their own compromise. And we know what it will look like. It will have more money for border security — personnel, equipment, repairs to existing fencing — but not a wall. Republicans will say they worked to secure the border, and Democrats will say they held firm against the wall. It's not complicated. Once the bill is passed by both houses, they’ll send it to Trump’s desk and force him to make a final decision: Sign this or veto it. It’s one thing to threaten vetoes and proclaim that you won’t sign anything if you don’t get what you want; it’s something else entirely to stand against both parties and veto a real compromise that everyone else is behind. This plan of shutting out the White House requires only one person's cooperation: Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell. If he were to decide it's the best way forward, he and Nancy Pelosi could work out the details in an afternoon. Fortunately, McConnell is utterly unemotional and completely cynical. He doesn't particularly care about whether Trump is happy, or whether the president gets a "win." McConnell's only real concern is maintaining his own, and the GOP's, hold on power in the Senate. If he decides that the best way to do that is to end this shutdown and dial back the state of permanent crisis, that's what he'll do.
As I argued on Thursday, in the end, Trump will have to find a way to save face if he’s going to sign a funding bill. Perhaps Democrats and Republicans in Congress could make that more likely by announcing that once the government funding bill is out of the way, they’ll begin work on a comprehensive immigration reform bill, one that might include walls in some places if it’s combined with permanent status for “dreamers.” That would give Trump something to point to, so he can tell his base that the wall is on its way. But there’s just no way that any negotiation in which Trump is involved can succeed. So if it is going to reopen the government, Congress needs to ignore him.” I've been saying this forever. You ignore tantruming children. You don't give in. You don't give attention. That's what they're in it for.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 15:22:15 GMT
Big point of contention in the Steele dossier. Looks like Michael was lying. Shocker, I know.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 15:25:51 GMT
From the article posted by SockMonkey..
”The exact opposite happens in the Republican Party. This fervor over “The One” is not a thing. In fact, when it comes to running for president, the GOP is a “come on in, the water’s fine” party. Remember the Republican debates in 2015-2016? There were so many candidates vying for the presidential nomination that they had to divide them into two groups: the main stage and the “kids’ table.”
Sure, folks have their favorite candidate and talk smack about the others. Their allegiances shift as the field winnows. But once the party faithful settle on a standard-bearer, that person is “The One.” The wagons are circled, and an all-out effort is made to get that person the keys to the White House.
When I asked Michael Steele, former chairman of the Republican National Committee, if my analysis of his party was correct, he basically agreed. “To paraphrase that old saying: Democrats want to fall in love, Republicans just want to win,” said Steele.“
And that type of mentality is how this country ended up with trump as president and we can see how well that is working out. So I’m not sure that is the advice the Democrats should follow.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 15:36:46 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 15:47:55 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 15:51:43 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 16:03:13 GMT
One scenario: "This morning I phoned my friend, the former Republican member of Congress. ME: So, what are you hearing? HE: Trump is in deep sh*t. ME: Tell me more. HE: When it looked like he was backing down on the wall, Rush and the crazies on Fox went ballistic. So he has to do the shutdown to keep the base happy. They’re his insurance policy. They stand between him and impeachment. ME: Impeachment? No chance. Senate Republicans would never go along. HE (laughing): Don’t be so sure. Corporate and Wall Street are up in arms. Trade war was bad enough. Now, you’ve got Mattis resigning in protest. Trump pulling out of Syria, giving Putin a huge win. This dumbass shutdown. The stock market in free-fall. The economy heading for recession. ME: But the base loves him. HE: Yeah, but the base doesn’t pay the bills. ME: You mean … HE: Follow the money, friend. ME: The GOP’s backers have had enough? HE: They wanted Pence all along. ME: So … HE: So they’ll wait until Mueller’s report, which will skewer Trump. Pelosi will wait, too. Then after the Mueller bombshell, she’ll get 20, 30, maybe even 40 Republicans to join in an impeachment resolution. ME: And then? HE: Senate Republicans hope that’ll be enough – that Trump will pull a Nixon. ME: So you think he’ll resign? HE (laughing): No chance. He’s fu*king out of his mind. He’ll rile up his base into a fever. Rallies around the country. Tweet storms. Hannity. Oh, it’s gonna be ugly. He’ll convince himself he’ll survive. ME: And then? HE: That’s when Senate Republicans pull the trigger. ME: Really? Two-thirds of the Senate? HE: Do the math. 47 Dems will be on board, so you need 19 Republicans. I can name almost that many who are already there. Won’t be hard to find the votes. ME: But it will take months. And the country will be put through a wringer. HE: I know. That’s the worst part. ME: I mean, we could have civil war. HE: Hell, no. That’s what he wants, but no chance. His approvals will be in the cellar. America will be glad to get rid of him. ME: I hope you’re right. HE: He’s a dangerous menace. He’ll be gone. And then he’ll be indicted, and Pence will pardon him. But the state investigations may put him in the clinker. Good riddance." www.rawstory.com/2018/12/end-trump-drawing-near/
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Dec 28, 2018 16:18:27 GMT
”close the Southern Border. And cause the closure of all the businesses that depend on legal workers who come across the border and our citizens who travel over the border to Mexico. Not even counting tourists!
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Dec 28, 2018 16:29:55 GMT
Once the bill is passed by both houses, they’ll send it to Trump’s desk and force him to make a final decision: Sign this or veto it. It’s one thing to threaten vetoes and proclaim that you won’t sign anything if you don’t get what you want; it’s something else entirely to stand against both parties and veto a real compromise that everyone else is behind..... But there’s just no way that any negotiation in which Trump is involved can succeed. So if it is going to reopen the government, Congress needs to ignore him.” I've been saying this forever. You ignore tantruming children. You don't give in. You don't give attention. That's what they're in it for. Ignore ignore ignore!!
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Post by crimsoncat05 on Dec 28, 2018 16:32:06 GMT
”close the Southern Border. And cause the closure of all the businesses that depend on legal workers who come across the border and our citizens who travel over the border to Mexico. Not even counting tourists! oh but he doesn't care about THAT- because it doesn't affect HIM directly. Just like all those OTHER things he doesn't care about-- because he's stupid, clueless, and ignorant.
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Post by katlady on Dec 28, 2018 16:43:28 GMT
”close the Southern Border. And cause the closure of all the businesses that depend on legal workers who come across the border and our citizens who travel over the border to Mexico. Not even counting tourists! Yes! Half a million legally go across the Southern border daily. To shut it down will hurt both Americans and Mexicans. At my workplace, there are American citizens who live in Tijuana and come across the border daily to work. The wait time at the border is part of our daily commuter traffic report. There is a shopping center just north of the border that caters to shoppers from Tijuana. Everyone will suffer financial hardship. And not to mention it will separate families who legally cross to visit each other.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 16:55:59 GMT
linkThis coukd turn out to be interesting if true. McClatchy “Cell signal puts Cohen outside Prague around time of purported Russian meeting”From the article.. “WASHINGTON A mobile phone traced to President Donald Trump’s former lawyer and “fixer” Michael Cohen briefly sent signals ricocheting off cell towers in the Prague area in late summer 2016, at the height of the presidential campaign, leaving an electronic record to support claims that Cohen met secretly there with Russian officials, four people with knowledge of the matter say. During the same period of late August or early September, electronic eavesdropping by an Eastern European intelligence agency picked up a conversation among Russians, one of whom remarked that Cohen was in Prague, two people familiar with the incident said. The phone and surveillance data, which have not previously been disclosed, lend new credence to a key part of a former British spy’s dossier of Kremlin intelligence describing purported coordination between Trump’s campaign and Russia’s election meddling operation. The dossier, which Trump has dismissed as “a pile of garbage,” said Cohen and one or more Kremlin officials huddled in or around the Czech capital to plot ways to limit discovery of the close “liaison” between the Trump campaign and Russia.” I didn't read the rest of this thread, but I clearly recall him claiming to have taken a trip with his son to CA, but their passports showed them being in Germany. You can get to Prague via Germany without it showing up on your passport. Wonder why Cohen continues to stick to his lie about this. Maybe this is why SDNY is taking a hard as trance with Him; they know there's much more there.
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Post by crimsoncat05 on Dec 28, 2018 16:57:30 GMT
again, he won't care. Because he can't fathom that things like that actually happen as part of peoples' daily lives. He has led such a sheltered / ignorant existence of how REAL people do things, he has NEVER had any capacity for empathy, and he has NO desire to LEARN about ANYTHING.
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Dec 28, 2018 16:59:44 GMT
You can get to Prague via Germany without it showing up on your passport. He may not have been 'in' Prague, how about near? Then truthfully he was not in Prague?!?!
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Dec 28, 2018 17:01:37 GMT
Yes! Half a million legally go across the Southern border daily. To shut it down will hurt both Americans and Mexicans. At my workplace, there are American citizens who live in Tijuana and come across the border daily to work. The wait time at the border is part of our daily commuter traffic report. There is a shopping center just north of the border that caters to shoppers from Tijuana. Everyone will suffer financial hardship. And not to mention it will separate families who legally cross to visit each other. MAGA sure................... again, he won't care. Because he can't fathom that things like that actually happen as part of peoples' daily lives. He has led such a sheltered / ignorant existence of how REAL people do things, he has NEVER had any capacity for empathy, and he has NO desire to LEARN about ANYTHING. When will I learn.. Like he said you need ID to buy groceries...........
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Dec 28, 2018 17:14:31 GMT
dt has things to learn from this mom! Mollie Tibbetts's mother took in child of Mexican immigrants after murder suspect's arrestBY ARIS FOLLEY - 12/28/18 11:08 AM EST The mother of Mollie Tibbetts, a 20-year-old Iowa college student who was allegedly murdered earlier this year by an immigrant residing the U.S. illegally, adopted the child of Mexican immigrants who fled town after the man accused of killing her daughter was arrested. Laura Calderwood told The Washington Post in an interview published Friday that she had taken in Ulises Felix, 17, after his parents fled town following Cristhian Bahena Rivera's arrest. Felix wanted to remain in Brooklyn, Iowa, to finish high school, according to the paper. Calderwood took in Felix in his parents' absence. He now lives with her son, Tibbetts’s younger brother, Scott. The Post reported that Felix's parents had worked alongside Rivera at the same dairy farm for years. Felix told the paper that his parents "took care of" Rivera "for a while," adding that his mother fed him every day. ** thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/423103-mollie-tibbetts-mother-takes-in-child-of-mexican-immigrants-who
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flute4peace
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,757
Jul 3, 2014 14:38:35 GMT
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Post by flute4peace on Dec 28, 2018 17:18:17 GMT
linkPaul Waldman in the Washington Post... “ The best way to force Trump’s hand? Ignore him.”
As Americans watch the federal government remain (partially) shut down and the president lob angry accusations at the opposition, a common response is, “Why can’t they all just sit down and work this out?” It seems like a reasonable question — if this were a different time and we were dealing with a different president. But since Donald Trump is in the White House, everything is more complicated. So the only answer may be for everyone, Democrats and Republicans alike, to ignore President Trump. Act as though he doesn’t exist and this has nothing to do with him. By which I mean that members of Congress should shut their ears to Trump’s tweets and threats and fulminations, pass something that House Democrats and Senate Republicans can live with, and then dare Trump to veto it. Because I doubt he has the guts.Negotiating with Trump might be impossible, not only because he’s committed to a border wall that Democrats won’t accept, but also because he changes his mind so frequently that his word just can’t be trusted. He could say in the morning that he’ll sign a particular compromise, then decide by the afternoon that he won’t because Sean Hannity doesn’t like it. He’ll have to agree to something eventually, but the only way forward might be to cut him out of the process until the end, then force his hand.Where we stand now is that Paul Ryan and other Republicans have decided to stop trying to arrive at a solution and just leave town, meaning things won’t get resolved until Democrats take over the House next week. Democrats are considering a few options (a very short-term bill, a somewhat short-term bill, a longer-term bill), but they are refusing to offer any more than the $1.3 billion in extra border security funds they’ve already put on the table. So here’s where we are now: Earlier Saturday, Vice President Pence visited Schumer for what has been the last face-to-face bipartisan talks, a brief meeting at which Pence made a new offer that included about half of Trump’s original request for $5 billion in wall funding. Democrats rejected that, still holding firm that no funds go toward a wall, and they also accused Pence of not being capable of guaranteeing the president’s support for his negotiating.“Different people from the same White House are saying different things about what the president would accept or not accept,” Pelosi and Schumer said Wednesday in a joint statement.Trump’s position is a critical roadblock to any negotiating. Democrats do not want to support something presented by Pence, only to have Trump balk at the idea and then move the goal posts farther right because of the apparent Democratic concession.That might sound like gamesmanship on the Democrats' part, but they’re right: Nobody knows what Trump is going to accept, and nobody can speak for him. He changes his mind so often that he himself doesn’t even know what he’ll accept. Even Republicans are getting exasperated:And congressional Republicans are adamant that they will not get caught flat-footed like last week, when the Senate unanimously approved a temporary funding plan to keep the entire government open through Feb. 8, only to learn later that Trump would veto the bill because it did not have funds for a wall.
“It’s clear that we on the Republican side, we do not want to vote for a bill that the president won’t sign,” [Sen. Pat Roberts (R-Kan.)] said.
That’s perfectly understandable, but since it is impossible for anyone to know what the president will sign, the only real option is to cut him and the White House out of the process. House Democrats should sit down with Senate Republicans and work out their own compromise. And we know what it will look like. It will have more money for border security — personnel, equipment, repairs to existing fencing — but not a wall. Republicans will say they worked to secure the border, and Democrats will say they held firm against the wall. It's not complicated. Once the bill is passed by both houses, they’ll send it to Trump’s desk and force him to make a final decision: Sign this or veto it. It’s one thing to threaten vetoes and proclaim that you won’t sign anything if you don’t get what you want; it’s something else entirely to stand against both parties and veto a real compromise that everyone else is behind. This plan of shutting out the White House requires only one person's cooperation: Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell. If he were to decide it's the best way forward, he and Nancy Pelosi could work out the details in an afternoon. Fortunately, McConnell is utterly unemotional and completely cynical. He doesn't particularly care about whether Trump is happy, or whether the president gets a "win." McConnell's only real concern is maintaining his own, and the GOP's, hold on power in the Senate. If he decides that the best way to do that is to end this shutdown and dial back the state of permanent crisis, that's what he'll do.
As I argued on Thursday, in the end, Trump will have to find a way to save face if he’s going to sign a funding bill. Perhaps Democrats and Republicans in Congress could make that more likely by announcing that once the government funding bill is out of the way, they’ll begin work on a comprehensive immigration reform bill, one that might include walls in some places if it’s combined with permanent status for “dreamers.” That would give Trump something to point to, so he can tell his base that the wall is on its way. But there’s just no way that any negotiation in which Trump is involved can succeed. So if it is going to reopen the government, Congress needs to ignore him.” *stands and applauds*
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Post by freecharlie on Dec 28, 2018 17:19:25 GMT
dt has things to learn for this mom! Mollie Tibbetts's mother took in child of Mexican immigrants after murder suspect's arrestBY ARIS FOLLEY - 12/28/18 11:08 AM EST The mother of Mollie Tibbetts, a 20-year-old Iowa college student who was allegedly murdered earlier this year by an immigrant residing the U.S. illegally, adopted the child of Mexican immigrants who fled town after the man accused of killing her daughter was arrested. Laura Calderwood told The Washington Post in an interview published Friday that she had taken in Ulises Felix, 17, after his parents fled town following Cristhian Bahena Rivera's arrest. Felix wanted to remain in Brooklyn, Iowa, to finish high school, according to the paper. Calderwood took in Felix in his parents' absence. He now lives with her son, Tibbetts’s younger brother, Scott. The Post reported that Felix's parents had worked alongside Rivera at the same dairy farm for years. Felix told the paper that his parents "took care of" Rivera "for a while," adding that his mother fed him every day. ** thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/423103-mollie-tibbetts-mother-takes-in-child-of-mexican-immigrants-whowhat a beautiful soul that woman has.
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Post by freecharlie on Dec 28, 2018 17:20:23 GMT
Oh and I say pass a funding bill that the house can override his veto. That should really shut him up.
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flute4peace
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,757
Jul 3, 2014 14:38:35 GMT
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Post by flute4peace on Dec 28, 2018 17:26:16 GMT
dt has things to learn for this mom! Mollie Tibbetts's mother took in child of Mexican immigrants after murder suspect's arrestBY ARIS FOLLEY - 12/28/18 11:08 AM EST The mother of Mollie Tibbetts, a 20-year-old Iowa college student who was allegedly murdered earlier this year by an immigrant residing the U.S. illegally, adopted the child of Mexican immigrants who fled town after the man accused of killing her daughter was arrested. Laura Calderwood told The Washington Post in an interview published Friday that she had taken in Ulises Felix, 17, after his parents fled town following Cristhian Bahena Rivera's arrest. Felix wanted to remain in Brooklyn, Iowa, to finish high school, according to the paper. Calderwood took in Felix in his parents' absence. He now lives with her son, Tibbetts’s younger brother, Scott. The Post reported that Felix's parents had worked alongside Rivera at the same dairy farm for years. Felix told the paper that his parents "took care of" Rivera "for a while," adding that his mother fed him every day. ** thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/423103-mollie-tibbetts-mother-takes-in-child-of-mexican-immigrants-whoNow this is empathy. This is Grace. For all those who think the so-called “Christians” on the right are authentic, THIS is what real Christianity is. THIS is what Jesus would do.
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