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Post by mustlovecats on Jan 19, 2019 22:13:35 GMT
I’m having a really hard time seeing how anyone could think of this as a “vacation”. That word must mean something different to you than it does to me. Please show me who is using the word vacation. I know I absolutely did not and do not think of it like that. When you say things like this myshelly, you instigate problems that do not exist. To be fair your words were “You can take 4 weeks off and still get paid for that? It doesn't seem right to me” and to me it sounded like you were considering this to be akin to other forms of voluntary leave such as vacation time (time you TAKE off), taking 4 weeks off is a luxury and to me your words alluded to that. Here Some TSA agents are calling out sick. They have been working without pay for a month and most of them don’t make all that much. Some of them drive a long way to get to their workplaces. Without pay how can they pay for daycare and gas? So they call out sick.
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marimoose
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,282
Jul 22, 2014 2:10:14 GMT
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Post by marimoose on Jan 19, 2019 22:30:42 GMT
I guess I just don't quite understand why everything doesn't stay open as long as you're going to eventually pay people. it seems like the government is making everything even worse by not allowing people to work and do their jobs. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
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Post by maryland on Jan 19, 2019 22:46:29 GMT
I think they should get paid, it wasn't their choice not to work. I also think the ones who did have to work should get paid with a bonus.
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Post by myshelly on Jan 19, 2019 22:47:53 GMT
I’m having a really hard time seeing how anyone could think of this as a “vacation”. That word must mean something different to you than it does to me. Please show me who is using the word vacation. I know I absolutely did not and do not think of it like that. When you say things like this myshelly, you instigate problems that do not exist. I am trying to understand clearly. I am sick about the shutdown. I am angry about it. I am frustrated at the President's decision not to negotiate. I am sympathetic to people who live paycheck to paycheck and are stuck in a horrible situation that will affect them for a long time to come. What I did not understand completely was it wasn't people calling out "sick." Down here in the south, all we hear is that people are calling out "sick." I know that some places closed down, but I guess I didn't completely understand it all. That's why I came here. To ask questions and to learn. AmeliaBloomer I am learning and I hope growing with considered comments from Peas. When people attack others, those others shut down. I was asking my questions to learn and asking them as best I could. I was NOT blaming anyone at any time except a President who refuses to compromise. I just see that there are a lot of people working without pay and others who are not working. Again, I didn't realize (with the exception of some obvious things, like parks, etc.) that government buildings were actually shut down. seaexplore used the word vacation.
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seaexplore
Prolific Pea
Posts: 8,366
Apr 25, 2015 23:57:30 GMT
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Post by seaexplore on Jan 19, 2019 23:03:39 GMT
Please show me who is using the word vacation. I know I absolutely did not and do not think of it like that. When you say things like this myshelly , you instigate problems that do not exist. I am trying to understand clearly. I am sick about the shutdown. I am angry about it. I am frustrated at the President's decision not to negotiate. I am sympathetic to people who live paycheck to paycheck and are stuck in a horrible situation that will affect them for a long time to come. What I did not understand completely was it wasn't people calling out "sick." Down here in the south, all we hear is that people are calling out "sick." I know that some places closed down, but I guess I didn't completely understand it all. That's why I came here. To ask questions and to learn. AmeliaBloomer I am learning and I hope growing with considered comments from Peas. When people attack others, those others shut down. I was asking my questions to learn and asking them as best I could. I was NOT blaming anyone at any time except a President who refuses to compromise. I just see that there are a lot of people working without pay and others who are not working. Again, I didn't realize (with the exception of some obvious things, like parks, etc.) that government buildings were actually shut down. seaexplore used the word vacation. Yes, I did.... as in "vacation" which isn't REALLY vacation since they're supposed to be and want to be at work. People are not ALLOWED to work. It's a sticky icky area because if they're not at work they're USUALLY considered "sick" or "vacation" but in the case of a shut down- it's really neither.
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Jan 20, 2019 0:18:44 GMT
What I did not understand completely was it wasn't people calling out "sick." Down here in the south, all we hear is that people are calling out "sick." I know that some places closed down, but I guess I didn't completely understand it all. That's why I came here. To ask questions and to learn. Unfortunately some of the TSA and Federal Correction Officers have called off sick. Some have been working double shifts 7 days a week. Air Traffic Controllers? There may be other jobs falling under the same situations. These people are in safety sensitive jobs which require sharpness, which is difficult when sleep deprived. Some of them live far from work, running out of money for gas to commute, daycare, lunches etc. With all the closed Federal Buildings all the small businesses are doing without which trickles down to where they are able to spend their dollars and the list goes on.
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AmeliaBloomer
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,842
Location: USA
Jun 26, 2014 5:01:45 GMT
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Jan 20, 2019 2:35:15 GMT
show me who is using the word vacation. I know I absolutely did not and do not think of it like that. When you say things like this myshelly , you instigate problems that do not exist. I am trying to understand clearly. I am sick about the shutdown. I am angry about it. I am frustrated at the President's decision not to negotiate. I am sympathetic to people who live paycheck to paycheck and are stuck in a horrible situation that will affect them for a long time to come. What I did not understand completely was it wasn't people calling out "sick." Down here in the south, all we hear is that people are calling out "sick." I know that some places closed down, but I guess I didn't completely understand it all. That's why I came here. To ask questions and to learn. AmeliaBloomer I am learning and I hope growing with considered comments from Peas. When people attack others, those others shut down. I was asking my questions to learn and asking them as best I could. I was NOT blaming anyone at any time except a President who refuses to compromise. I just see that there are a lot of people working without pay and others who are not working. Again, I didn't realize (with the exception of some obvious things, like parks, etc.) that government buildings were actually shut down.(Bold mine) Uh, oh. I clearly misunderstood what you wrote, but I’m sorry my response came off as an attack. It really wasn’t my intention. My apologies.
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Post by berty on Jan 20, 2019 3:01:29 GMT
The whole thing, like pretty much every government shut down before this one, is, in my humble not so educated about government opinion, stupid! This particular shut down, for this length of time, is costing us all more money in the end. I do not care whether you are conservative, liberal or apathetic. You have a job that you can do, you work for us, the tax payers... you should be able to go and do that job and get paid for what you do. It's not like this is a shut down because the money isn't there. It's because the POTUS wants something funded that no person with intelligence and foresight wants to fund. (Sorry if I insulted your intelligence if you are pro-wall. It's medieval, will take a good decade or more to build and won't solve the illegal immigration issue because the vast majority simply overstay their welcome. Want to put money into that instead? Go ahead. I'll support that). I think Congress needs to pass a law to prevent this sort of nonsense again no matter who the president is. Perhaps that is a politically naive thought, but it's no where naive as thinking a wall on only one border is going to solve anything. My heart goes out to those who are affected by this insanity. I'm not fully read up on all of this, but I believe Congress could stop this immediately if they wanted to. All they have to do is pass a bill with a 2/3 vote and a presidential veto is overridden. But McConnell stopped them from doing this. He's up for reelection and doesn't want to upset his base. So, while everyone is blaming Trump, they're forgetting that McConnell and the other members in Congress could end this foolishness. (And just for clarity, it's not that I don't blame Trump for this mess. I do. But I also blame McConnell and the other Republicans in congress for going along with Trump.)
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sassyangel
Drama Llama
Posts: 7,456
Jun 26, 2014 23:58:32 GMT
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Post by sassyangel on Jan 20, 2019 3:05:42 GMT
It wasn't time off by their choice though. They were forced into it by virtue of their job being deemed non-essential. I have no problem with them being paid. Seems super harsh to force them to take it with no pay. Just to clarify, I was not suggesting they didn't get back pay, although I see it looks like that's what I said . I just didn't understand why some people had to work and others didn't have to. It didn't seem fair to those who have to work with no pay. I know you weren't. That's why I didn't quote you. It wasn't really directed at you, just adding my general thoughts to the discussion. I think this is basically what you are asking, and I think that is a valid discussion. Furloughing people you're going to have to back pay anyway, and forcing essential workers to cover their jobs in their absence, just seems like a monumentally bad way of doing things during these shut downs, business wise. I guess its complicated by lots of things we don't all understand as to why they do it this way. At least if you're at home, (worrying) you still have more of a chance to cut back some of your spending than if you have to commute to work. I just wish none of them were in this position. It seriously angers me watching them being punished for stuff that is not their fault at all. And those responsible get to wash their hands of it.
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Post by Skellinton on Jan 20, 2019 3:06:18 GMT
The whole thing, like pretty much every government shut down before this one, is, in my humble not so educated about government opinion, stupid! This particular shut down, for this length of time, is costing us all more money in the end. I do not care whether you are conservative, liberal or apathetic. You have a job that you can do, you work for us, the tax payers... you should be able to go and do that job and get paid for what you do. It's not like this is a shut down because the money isn't there. It's because the POTUS wants something funded that no person with intelligence and foresight wants to fund. (Sorry if I insulted your intelligence if you are pro-wall. It's medieval, will take a good decade or more to build and won't solve the illegal immigration issue because the vast majority simply overstay their welcome. Want to put money into that instead? Go ahead. I'll support that). I think Congress needs to pass a law to prevent this sort of nonsense again no matter who the president is. Perhaps that is a politically naive thought, but it's no where naive as thinking a wall on only one border is going to solve anything. My heart goes out to those who are affected by this insanity. I'm not fully read up on all of this, but I believe Congress could stop this immediately if they wanted to. All they have to do is pass a bill with a 2/3 vote and a presidential veto is overridden. But McConnell stopped them from doing this. He's up for reelection and doesn't want to upset his base. So, while everyone is blaming Trump, they're forgetting that McConnell and the other members in Congress could end this foolishness. (And just for clarity, it's not that I don't blame Trump for this mess. I do. But I also blame McConnell and the other Republicans in congress for going along with Trump.) McConnell is every bit as disgusting, despicable and responsible as Trump.
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Post by gritzi on Jan 20, 2019 3:08:53 GMT
Furloughed workers aren't taking time off for vacation. No comparison!
Many ARE working without zero pay. My bills don't halt because our last paystub was zero. We are facing another paycheck with NO money. Employees should not be played as pawns in this political tantrum. Both parties are to blame!
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Post by chances on Jan 20, 2019 4:54:48 GMT
Just to clarify, I was not suggesting they didn't get back pay, although I see it looks like that's what I said . I just didn't understand why some people had to work and others didn't have to. It didn't seem fair to those who have to work with no pay. I know you weren't. That's why I didn't quote you. It wasn't really directed at you, just adding my general thoughts to the discussion. I think this is basically what you are asking, and I think that is a valid discussion. Furloughing people you're going to have to back pay anyway, and forcing essential workers to cover their jobs in their absence, just seems like a monumentally bad way of doing things during these shut downs, business wise. I guess its complicated by lots of things we don't all understand as to why they do it this way. At least if you're at home, (worrying) you still have more of a chance to cut back some of your spending than if you have to commute to work. I just wish none of them were in this position. It seriously angers me watching them being punished for stuff that is not their fault at all. And those responsible get to wash their hands of it. There are laws preventing the government from paying for things that haven't had money allocated to them except “emergencies involving the safety of human life or the protection of property.” I CAN NOT understand how the definition of essential keeps getting expanded. How the hell is getting tax returns processed about safety or protection of property? It's unfair to put the burden only on the workers and their families. The rest of us should really be feeling this harder. I should not be able to fly, file taxes, and a host of other things. It makes it easier to complain about "bloated government." If everyone had to feel the effects of going without government services I think things would change quickly.
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Post by dewryce on Jan 20, 2019 4:59:13 GMT
I know you weren't. That's why I didn't quote you. It wasn't really directed at you, just adding my general thoughts to the discussion. I think this is basically what you are asking, and I think that is a valid discussion. Furloughing people you're going to have to back pay anyway, and forcing essential workers to cover their jobs in their absence, just seems like a monumentally bad way of doing things during these shut downs, business wise. I guess its complicated by lots of things we don't all understand as to why they do it this way. At least if you're at home, (worrying) you still have more of a chance to cut back some of your spending than if you have to commute to work. I just wish none of them were in this position. It seriously angers me watching them being punished for stuff that is not their fault at all. And those responsible get to wash their hands of it. There are laws preventing the government from paying for things that haven't had money allocated to them except “emergencies involving the safety of human life or the protection of property.” I CAN NOT understand how the definition of essential keeps getting expanded. How the hell is getting tax returns processed about safety or protection of property? It's unfair to put the burden only on the workers and their families. The rest of us should really be feeling this harder. I should not be able to fly, file taxes, and a host of other things. It makes it easier to complain about "bloated government." If everyone had to feel the effects of going without government services I think things would change quickly. That’s exactly it. He’d lose support from a lot more people if they were personally impacted.
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PLurker
Prolific Pea
Posts: 9,730
Location: Behind the Cheddar Curtain
Jun 28, 2014 3:48:49 GMT
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Post by PLurker on Jan 20, 2019 5:15:39 GMT
it was not a choice to take time off.
it was forced on them.
I've heard of terrible snow days getting paid when workers couldn't get in.
this is a bigger (sh!t) storm than that.
Pay them
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Post by lucyg on Jan 20, 2019 6:16:54 GMT
show me who is using the word vacation. I know I absolutely did not and do not think of it like that. When you say things like this myshelly , you instigate problems that do not exist. I am trying to understand clearly. I am sick about the shutdown. I am angry about it. I am frustrated at the President's decision not to negotiate. I am sympathetic to people who live paycheck to paycheck and are stuck in a horrible situation that will affect them for a long time to come. What I did not understand completely was it wasn't people calling out "sick." Down here in the south, all we hear is that people are calling out "sick." I know that some places closed down, but I guess I didn't completely understand it all. That's why I came here. To ask questions and to learn. AmeliaBloomer I am learning and I hope growing with considered comments from Peas. When people attack others, those others shut down. I was asking my questions to learn and asking them as best I could. I was NOT blaming anyone at any time except a President who refuses to compromise. I just see that there are a lot of people working without pay and others who are not working. Again, I didn't realize (with the exception of some obvious things, like parks, etc.) that government buildings were actually shut down.(Bold mine) Uh, oh. I clearly misunderstood what you wrote, but I’m sorry my response came off as an attack. It really wasn’t my intention. My apologies. For whatever it’s worth, I Liked your post and was surprised to be the first one who did. It didn’t read as an attack in any way to me. I was surprised by the OP’s feelings, but now, having read the whole thread, I realize she thought workers were staying home by choice. I believe all workers should receive their full pay. I do not understand how “essential” workers can be required to work for no pay (for now). I think this shutdown is an abomination, and purely the result of a Trump temper tantrum. To hell with “both parties are to blame.” Using the shutdown as ammunition to get his own way without resorting to negotiation, i.e., compromise, is reprehensible leadership.
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sassyangel
Drama Llama
Posts: 7,456
Jun 26, 2014 23:58:32 GMT
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Post by sassyangel on Jan 20, 2019 6:46:16 GMT
I know you weren't. That's why I didn't quote you. It wasn't really directed at you, just adding my general thoughts to the discussion. I think this is basically what you are asking, and I think that is a valid discussion. Furloughing people you're going to have to back pay anyway, and forcing essential workers to cover their jobs in their absence, just seems like a monumentally bad way of doing things during these shut downs, business wise. I guess its complicated by lots of things we don't all understand as to why they do it this way. At least if you're at home, (worrying) you still have more of a chance to cut back some of your spending than if you have to commute to work. I just wish none of them were in this position. It seriously angers me watching them being punished for stuff that is not their fault at all. And those responsible get to wash their hands of it. There are laws preventing the government from paying for things that haven't had money allocated to them except “emergencies involving the safety of human life or the protection of property.” I CAN NOT understand how the definition of essential keeps getting expanded. How the hell is getting tax returns processed about safety or protection of property? It's unfair to put the burden only on the workers and their families. The rest of us should really be feeling this harder. I should not be able to fly, file taxes, and a host of other things. It makes it easier to complain about "bloated government." If everyone had to feel the effects of going without government services I think things would change quickly. Well personally, I don't need to have all those things happen to be angered about this. :/ But you are correct, that it seems most general people do need that, to be moved beyond apathy. I think if it continues any longer people will most certainly feel it. The only reason people haven't is because of the essential workers. That WILL inevitably start to break down in critical agencies, if they are pushed to their absolute limits (without pay) for much longer. It seems to me like the only reason that things haven't been a bigger impact yet, is a lot of these agencies have small reserves knowing this can happen, but that can't last. I have a friend on FB who has been updating her Chicago/Illinois friends on some of the benefits programs and changes that have been made to ensure people are still getting them (like changing pay dates and stuff) and each one she posts ends with they can't guarantee next months benefits. When those run out, people WILL feel it. Maybe it's not doing us any favours in trying to keep things as normal as possible to date, and we should be feeling it with them more? Someone told me a lot of the IRS tax filing/return stuff isn't actually done by the IRS level, but contracted out and those are still funded, and that's why its not going to be as affected, is that true? I don't get a tax return really any more, I pay in a bit most years, but personally I'd be quite okay with anything mine being held as long as federal workers weren't being paid. There would be far more outrage if they were going to be delayed, though.
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Post by Really Red on Jan 20, 2019 13:03:29 GMT
(Bold mine) Uh, oh. I clearly misunderstood what you wrote, but I’m sorry my response came off as an attack. It really wasn’t my intention. My apologies. For whatever it’s worth, I Liked your post and was surprised to be the first one who did. It didn’t read as an attack in any way to me. I was surprised by the OP’s feelings, but now, having read the whole thread, I realize she thought workers were staying home by choice. I believe all workers should receive their full pay. I do not understand how “essential” workers can be required to work for no pay (for now). I think this shutdown is an abomination, and purely the result of a Trump temper tantrum. To hell with “both parties are to blame.” Using the shutdown as ammunition to get his own way without resorting to negotiation, i.e., compromise, is reprehensible leadership. AmeliaBloomer I did not read your post in any way as an attack. I apologize that you thought that. My comment was not at all directed towards you, nor to the majority of posters here.
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AmeliaBloomer
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,842
Location: USA
Jun 26, 2014 5:01:45 GMT
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Jan 20, 2019 16:24:49 GMT
For whatever it’s worth, I Liked your post and was surprised to be the first one who did. It didn’t read as an attack in any way to me. I was surprised by the OP’s feelings, but now, having read the whole thread, I realize she thought workers were staying home by choice. I believe all workers should receive their full pay. I do not understand how “essential” workers can be required to work for no pay (for now). I think this shutdown is an abomination, and purely the result of a Trump temper tantrum. To hell with “both parties are to blame.” Using the shutdown as ammunition to get his own way without resorting to negotiation, i.e., compromise, is reprehensible leadership. AmeliaBloomer I did not read your post in any way as an attack. I apologize that you thought that. My comment was not at all directed towards you, nor to the majority of posters here. Okay, thanks. My mistake. I admit I’m now totally confused by this thread and, after swinging the bat through empty air twice, should stop before I strike out. LOL/Namaste/Carry on/and Thanks, lucyg.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Jan 20, 2019 16:41:57 GMT
Nobody asked for this. Every furloughed person I know wants to go to work but can’t. It’s morally wrong to expect people who have jobs to do and want to do them to lose out on their income because the government can’t get its shit together. This is not a vacation. The ones who are working... actually I do think they should get special compensation for working without pay all this time. They made an even bigger sacrifice paying for gas and childcare to go to work while not having an income. Which is also morally wrong. I agree with this.
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Post by FuzzyMutt on Jan 20, 2019 18:32:08 GMT
1. Some of them can NOT have a 2nd job without prior approval due to conflict of interest laws- there’s no one around to approve your interim job isn’t a conflict so you could be disciplined for taking a job if you could find one. 2. Most are ineligible to apply for unemployment. 3. Non of this is thier choice So yes I think they should be paid wtf else are they supposed to do? Loose a months sakary becausecpokiticians are tempertantruming? I do agree this working without pay do deserve something in thanks but I also know they’ll never get it. My response is certainly colored because 95% of the federal workers I know are GS-10 and above and they got those cush jobs after retiring from military service and took those jobs because they can make 70-80k for doing nothing, non essential so they get snow dusting days off with pay or early releases. Half days at the holidays etc. The majority of them have a tax free retirement in the states they live in, as well as the liberal “executive” vacation plan (don’t actually account for days off and just accrue accrue accrue until they come within a year or so of second retirement and then take Monday and Friday off for the last 5 years. Do I hate on them for it? No! They knew how it worked and planned on it for years and years! But do I feel bad they are sitting at home while low key (certainly not on social media!) give me shit for having to work? Yes!! Before everyone gets their panties in a bunch.. I realize there are a ton of lower level federal employees and their situation likely sucks. But just like the folks I came up with, we knew the perks and chose to take the bath water with the baby. I agree that they are being held “hostage” and they truly have no real control over it. That said, their bleeding hearts whining about losing homes one paycheck in is bull. They weren’t paying their bills before. Credit report dings. There is actually a credit report code for government furlough that is forgiveness. Y’all want to feel bad for someone? Feel bad for the servers losing money while these belts “may be” tightened. They won’t get back pay. Feel bad for the child care providers that provide reasonable in home care and won’t get paid. Feel bad for the folks that make a living running restaurants and dry cleaners with reduced volume who won’t get back pay. Those are the real folks taking the hit. Just like when the local coffee shop had to close early for the storm and didn’t open today- that’s a real hit. Federal workers know that furlough is part of their job. It sucks and it is inconvenient, but it’s as much “part of the job” as whether that McDonalds employee gets no paid vaca vs the McDonalds manager. I don’t feel a bit bad for them- and I DO believe furloughed employees should not get paid if they weren’t reporting to work.
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Post by FuzzyMutt on Jan 20, 2019 18:38:12 GMT
I know you weren't. That's why I didn't quote you. It wasn't really directed at you, just adding my general thoughts to the discussion. I think this is basically what you are asking, and I think that is a valid discussion. Furloughing people you're going to have to back pay anyway, and forcing essential workers to cover their jobs in their absence, just seems like a monumentally bad way of doing things during these shut downs, business wise. I guess its complicated by lots of things we don't all understand as to why they do it this way. At least if you're at home, (worrying) you still have more of a chance to cut back some of your spending than if you have to commute to work. I just wish none of them were in this position. It seriously angers me watching them being punished for stuff that is not their fault at all. And those responsible get to wash their hands of it. There are laws preventing the government from paying for things that haven't had money allocated to them except “emergencies involving the safety of human life or the protection of property.” I CAN NOT understand how the definition of essential keeps getting expanded. How the hell is getting tax returns processed about safety or protection of property? It's unfair to put the burden only on the workers and their families. The rest of us should really be feeling this harder. I should not be able to fly, file taxes, and a host of other things. It makes it easier to complain about "bloated government." If everyone had to feel the effects of going without government services I think things would change quickly. Why on earth would you believe the rest of us should be feeling this harder??? I’ve paid my taxes! I have voted and I have done my civic duty to be informed. The damn government (no matter which hat you put on-) should be feeling this. Not moreso the people! Insanity. And while everyone’s heart is breaking for employed people who chose to be federal (or state) knowing this could happen, and laugh their happy asses off when nonessentials leave work early for a snowstorm or don’t have to come in for one. I have absolute not an ounce of feeling the American people should be held even greater pawns.
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Post by chances on Jan 20, 2019 20:27:57 GMT
There are laws preventing the government from paying for things that haven't had money allocated to them except “emergencies involving the safety of human life or the protection of property.” I CAN NOT understand how the definition of essential keeps getting expanded. How the hell is getting tax returns processed about safety or protection of property? It's unfair to put the burden only on the workers and their families. The rest of us should really be feeling this harder. I should not be able to fly, file taxes, and a host of other things. It makes it easier to complain about "bloated government." If everyone had to feel the effects of going without government services I think things would change quickly. Why on earth would you believe the rest of us should be feeling this harder??? I’ve paid my taxes! I have voted and I have done my civic duty to be informed. The damn government (no matter which hat you put on-) should be feeling this. Not moreso the people! Insanity. And while everyone’s heart is breaking for employed people who chose to be federal (or state) knowing this could happen, and laugh their happy asses off when nonessentials leave work early for a snowstorm or don’t have to come in for one. I have absolute not an ounce of feeling the American people should be held even greater pawns. The "government" does not feel things, people do. My point is that many people are shielded from the consequences of this thing unfairly. If we the people (via our elected officials) dont want to pay for shit we shouldn't get shit.
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sassyangel
Drama Llama
Posts: 7,456
Jun 26, 2014 23:58:32 GMT
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Post by sassyangel on Jan 20, 2019 21:14:25 GMT
1. Some of them can NOT have a 2nd job without prior approval due to conflict of interest laws- there’s no one around to approve your interim job isn’t a conflict so you could be disciplined for taking a job if you could find one. 2. Most are ineligible to apply for unemployment. 3. Non of this is thier choice So yes I think they should be paid wtf else are they supposed to do? Loose a months sakary becausecpokiticians are tempertantruming? I do agree this working without pay do deserve something in thanks but I also know they’ll never get it. My response is certainly colored because 95% of the federal workers I know are GS-10 and above and they got those cush jobs after retiring from military service and took those jobs because they can make 70-80k for doing nothing, non essential so they get snow dusting days off with pay or early releases. Half days at the holidays etc. The majority of them have a tax free retirement in the states they live in, as well as the liberal “executive” vacation plan (don’t actually account for days off and just accrue accrue accrue until they come within a year or so of second retirement and then take Monday and Friday off for the last 5 years. Do I hate on them for it? No! They knew how it worked and planned on it for years and years! But do I feel bad they are sitting at home while low key (certainly not on social media!) give me shit for having to work? Yes!! Before everyone gets their panties in a bunch.. I realize there are a ton of lower level federal employees and their situation likely sucks. But just like the folks I came up with, we knew the perks and chose to take the bath water with the baby. I agree that they are being held “hostage” and they truly have no real control over it. That said, their bleeding hearts whining about losing homes one paycheck in is bull. They weren’t paying their bills before. Credit report dings. There is actually a credit report code for government furlough that is forgiveness. Y’all want to feel bad for someone? Feel bad for the servers losing money while these belts “may be” tightened. They won’t get back pay. Feel bad for the child care providers that provide reasonable in home care and won’t get paid. Feel bad for the folks that make a living running restaurants and dry cleaners with reduced volume who won’t get back pay. Those are the real folks taking the hit. Just like when the local coffee shop had to close early for the storm and didn’t open today- that’s a real hit. Federal workers know that furlough is part of their job. It sucks and it is inconvenient, but it’s as much “part of the job” as whether that McDonalds employee gets no paid vaca vs the McDonalds manager. I don’t feel a bit bad for them- and I DO believe furloughed employees should not get paid if they weren’t reporting to work. Wow. Okay then. I agreed with the point that if the majority feels it, then maybe things are more likely to change and congress might think long and hard about doing this in future. At this point we are pretty much insulated from it. I'm not sure what more there is be said other than that, we clearly are not going to agree on this.
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Jan 20, 2019 23:24:55 GMT
All they have to do is pass a bill with a 2/3 vote and a presidential veto is overridden. But McConnell stopped them from doing this. He's up for reelection and doesn't want to upset his base. He's from Kentucky. Some HS kids may have made it a bit more difficult for him! How the hell is getting tax returns processed about safety or protection of property? Agreed, but he is doing it for HIS base, so they stick with him. Someone told me a lot of the IRS tax filing/return stuff isn't actually done by the IRS level, but contracted out and those are still funded, and that's why its not going to be as affected, is that true? I don't get a tax return really any more, I pay in a bit most years, but personally I'd be quite okay with anything mine being held as long as federal workers weren't being paid. There would be far more outrage if they were going to be delayed, though. Many contractors are not funded. Or if funded, when their monies run out they will shut down and those people would not get back pay.
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sassyangel
Drama Llama
Posts: 7,456
Jun 26, 2014 23:58:32 GMT
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Post by sassyangel on Jan 21, 2019 0:31:04 GMT
All they have to do is pass a bill with a 2/3 vote and a presidential veto is overridden. But McConnell stopped them from doing this. He's up for reelection and doesn't want to upset his base. He's from Kentucky. Some HS kids may have made it a bit more difficult for him! How the hell is getting tax returns processed about safety or protection of property? Agreed, but he is doing it for HIS base, so they stick with him. Someone told me a lot of the IRS tax filing/return stuff isn't actually done by the IRS level, but contracted out and those are still funded, and that's why its not going to be as affected, is that true? I don't get a tax return really any more, I pay in a bit most years, but personally I'd be quite okay with anything mine being held as long as federal workers weren't being paid. There would be far more outrage if they were going to be delayed, though. Many contractors are not funded. Or if funded, when their monies run out they will shut down and those people would not get back pay. Ahh ok. I meant it from the perspective of return checks going out, to those that get them. If refund checks are delayed, there will be some serious outrage from a lot of people.
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Post by roberta on Jan 21, 2019 0:37:42 GMT
It is not by choice!!!!
We should not be punished! How would you feel if you were forced into unpaid leave just so someone else could play their games.
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Post by hop2 on Jan 21, 2019 0:39:25 GMT
1. Some of them can NOT have a 2nd job without prior approval due to conflict of interest laws- there’s no one around to approve your interim job isn’t a conflict so you could be disciplined for taking a job if you could find one. 2. Most are ineligible to apply for unemployment. 3. Non of this is thier choice So yes I think they should be paid wtf else are they supposed to do? Loose a months sakary becausecpokiticians are tempertantruming? I do agree this working without pay do deserve something in thanks but I also know they’ll never get it. My response is certainly colored because 95% of the federal workers I know are GS-10 and above and they got those cush jobs after retiring from military service and took those jobs because they can make 70-80k for doing nothing, non essential so they get snow dusting days off with pay or early releases. Half days at the holidays etc. The majority of them have a tax free retirement in the states they live in, as well as the liberal “executive” vacation plan (don’t actually account for days off and just accrue accrue accrue until they come within a year or so of second retirement and then take Monday and Friday off for the last 5 years. Do I hate on them for it? No! They knew how it worked and planned on it for years and years! But do I feel bad they are sitting at home while low key (certainly not on social media!) give me shit for having to work? Yes!! Before everyone gets their panties in a bunch.. I realize there are a ton of lower level federal employees and their situation likely sucks. But just like the folks I came up with, we knew the perks and chose to take the bath water with the baby. I agree that they are being held “hostage” and they truly have no real control over it. That said, their bleeding hearts whining about losing homes one paycheck in is bull. They weren’t paying their bills before. Credit report dings. There is actually a credit report code for government furlough that is forgiveness. Y’all want to feel bad for someone? Feel bad for the servers losing money while these belts “may be” tightened. They won’t get back pay. Feel bad for the child care providers that provide reasonable in home care and won’t get paid. Feel bad for the folks that make a living running restaurants and dry cleaners with reduced volume who won’t get back pay. Those are the real folks taking the hit. Just like when the local coffee shop had to close early for the storm and didn’t open today- that’s a real hit. Federal workers know that furlough is part of their job. It sucks and it is inconvenient, but it’s as much “part of the job” as whether that McDonalds employee gets no paid vaca vs the McDonalds manager. I don’t feel a bit bad for them- and I DO believe furloughed employees should not get paid if they weren’t reporting to work. I don’t know what your talking about obviously. But my nephew works hard at his job but due to security clearance is not allowed to have an unapproved 2nd job. He can’t go work elsewhere. While yes, he was previously a marine, he is now a hard working father of 2 trying to put food in his table. It’s funny to me because I thought his job was pretty essential security job but no- he’s furloughed. Most of the furloughed workers I know are at the end of thier safety net because they just don’t make big salaries for the areas they live in. ( btw have you tried to live in a DC suburb for 60k?? It’s NOT going to be easy and certainly not cushy ) So it really makes me wonder if there is some underlying reason for this shut down for Trump, you know since cyber security and things like that are barely staffed? Is he giving his Russian hackers free reign?
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Post by gritzi on Jan 21, 2019 1:00:31 GMT
Refunds won't be delayed because employees are working without pay.
If planes were delayed/canceled and taxes not processed a larger portion of the general public would be affected & outraged. Many aren't outraged or sympathetic because they are earning pay for hours worked...life as usual.
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Post by roberta on Jan 21, 2019 1:00:49 GMT
My dh is not allowed to go to work through no fault of his own. He will be working extra hours (unpaid!) after this is over. It is very difficult to plan anything for the family time wise or financially with all this going on. We are making a lot of sacrifices through all this. He is trapped at home because we don’t know when things will change. And as he said and I agree, we’ll believe he is being paid when the money is in his hands. This admin is just TOO unprofessional and unpredictable!
The “essential” rule is supposed to be about safety but tRump is expanding it to help himself.
In terms of taxes, the parks, the clock tower at tRump Hotel being open - those are all things tRump is doing to try to benefit himself. The parks should be closed so there would be much less damage. He doesn’t care about future problems only himself and now. He cares more about staying in power than what is good for the country.
For anyone saying we should not be paid - well, I can’t say it here. My blood boils and I want to explode at that selfish and pretentious attitude. The vast majority of employees effected are not double dipping and not relaxing and having a great time.
ETA: oops 😬 that should be affected not effected, this shutdown is affecting my brain
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Post by FuzzyMutt on Jan 21, 2019 2:00:45 GMT
My dh is not allowed to go to work through no fault of his own. He will be working extra hours (unpaid!) after this is over. It is very difficult to plan anything for the family time wise or financially with all this going on. We are making a lot of sacrifices through all this. He is trapped at home because we don’t know when things will change. And as he said and I agree, we’ll believe he is being paid when the money is in his hands. This admin is just TOO unprofessional and unpredictable! The “essential” rule is supposed to be about safety but tRump is expanding it to help himself. In terms of taxes, the parks, the clock tower at tRump Hotel being open - those are all things tRump is doing to try to benefit himself. The parks should be closed so there would be much less damage. He doesn’t care about future problems only himself and now. He cares more about staying in power than what is good for the country. For anyone saying we should not be paid - well, I can’t say it here. My blood boils and I want to explode at that selfish and pretentious attitude. The vast majority of employees effected are not double dipping and not relaxing and having a great time. ETA: oops 😬 that should be affected not effected, this shutdown is affecting my brain Guessing that is directed at me because I said folks not at work and not spending vacation time shouldn’t get paid. Ok 😊 That said, just like I can’t wave a magic wand and reopen the government, my opinion won’t “effect” your bank account balance. Maybe your husband should consider private sector employment. I work in healthcare where the difference between essential and non essential is if you are expected to go to work even if the weather and life in general is adverse. If not, you burn vacation or take unpaid time off. This is why grown ups weigh the benefits package, pay and responsibility. Unless your husband has only been working two years, he knew this could happen.
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