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Post by gar on Oct 9, 2019 22:08:00 GMT
But Trump kept emphasizing that this was an accident and we all have accidents! Nothing’s going to happen, is it. Sadly I doubt it 😔 I believe the parents are preparing to travel to the US.
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inkedup
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,837
Jun 26, 2014 5:00:26 GMT
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Post by inkedup on Oct 9, 2019 22:10:27 GMT
What a terrible tragedy and a disgusting embarrassment to the United States.
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Post by gar on Oct 9, 2019 22:22:44 GMT
What a terrible tragedy and a disgusting embarrassment to the United States. It’s just so sad and I can’t help but think that she’s only made things much worse for herself in the long run, apart from anything else.
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Deleted
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Mar 28, 2024 10:58:49 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2019 23:25:47 GMT
Listening to Trump speaking to the press about it doesn't give me any hope that anything will be done about it. He couldn't even bring himself to offer any condolences but just made excuses and defended her.
“The woman was driving on the wrong side of the road. That can happen” “Those are the opposite side of the road. I won’t say it ever happened to me, but it did. When you get used to driving on our system and then you’re all of a sudden on the other system where you’re driving it happens. It happens. You have to be careful.” ........Yes, Trump you do have to be careful that is why it wasn't an accident it was pure carelessness.
"We're going to speak to her and see what we can come up with so there's some healing"......... come up with what? The only thing that he could possibly come up with is to send her back and let her face the consequences of her actions. Nothing he comes up with will go anywhere near healing for what the family of Harry Dunn have lost.
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Oct 9, 2019 23:54:25 GMT
I will tell you that as an ex-pat living here in Morocco, I was told very early on that if an ex-pat hit someone with their car that caused a death, that they should drive directly to the airport and leave the country. Not joking. This has been told to me several times by many different ex-pats. A couple of years ago, I knew someone, not a close friend, that worked at the American Embassy here. He got into some type of physical altercation with a Moroccan. It was my understanding that HE was the aggressor and really beat this guy up. The Embassy employee was gone the next day. No one knew exactly what happened, they just knew that he was no longer at the Embassy and no longer in the country. Not sure what would happen now as we currently have no Ambassador or even Deputy here. Since Trump fired many of those people at the beginning of his Presidency, we have not had a replacement here. This is the situation in NYC, MVAs, bar fights, et al.. They constantly have people leaving quickly. So many with the UN in NYC. Last I knew diplomatic pouches were not searched. Not sure how that is now with the TSA. Vehicles with Diplomatic plates rack up thousands of dollars in parking fines, never to be paid.
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Deleted
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Mar 28, 2024 10:58:49 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2019 0:28:13 GMT
I will tell you that as an ex-pat living here in Morocco, I was told very early on that if an ex-pat hit someone with their car that caused a death, that they should drive directly to the airport and leave the country. Not joking. This has been told to me several times by many different ex-pats. A couple of years ago, I knew someone, not a close friend, that worked at the American Embassy here. He got into some type of physical altercation with a Moroccan. It was my understanding that HE was the aggressor and really beat this guy up. The Embassy employee was gone the next day. No one knew exactly what happened, they just knew that he was no longer at the Embassy and no longer in the country. Not sure what would happen now as we currently have no Ambassador or even Deputy here. Since Trump fired many of those people at the beginning of his Presidency, we have not had a replacement here. This is the situation in NYC, MVAs, bar fights, et al.. They constantly have people leaving quickly. So many with the UN in NYC. Last I knew diplomatic pouches were not searched. Not sure how that is now with the TSA. Vehicles with Diplomatic plates rack up thousands of dollars in parking fines, never to be paid. They owe millions in London alone.Diplomats from the United States are the biggest offenders, racking up fines worth £11,929,685. The vast majority of the charges (£11,925,920) arise from for London’s Congestion Charge but the embassy’s vehicles have also accrued £3,765 in unpaid parking fines. Donald Trump's recent visit saw the US President's Beast limousine rack up £750 in Congestion Charge fees alone. Japan, Nigeria, Russia and India are also major fine dodgers, each having built up debts of over £5m. between them. It angers me when I have to pay a congestion charge in London if I drive there but they are all allowed to get away with not paying it.
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Oct 10, 2019 3:15:07 GMT
They owe millions in London alone.Diplomats from the United States are the biggest offenders, racking up fines worth £11,929,685. Psst: maybe not as much, but I bet all countries owe in all the others. I DO think criminal issues should be handled differently. Although MVAs are not criminal, however causing a death adds another level of responsibility. I'm wondering how often a fatal MVA happens, involving a 'diplomat', that we never hear about and IF the offending country accepts responsibility for the 'diplomat's' action and quietly offers a settlement? (I have no clue what the answer is.) In our world here, in the USA, today there is no responsibility in the WH for anything.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Mar 28, 2024 10:58:49 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2019 3:16:48 GMT
I will tell you that as an ex-pat living here in Morocco, I was told very early on that if an ex-pat hit someone with their car that caused a death, that they should drive directly to the airport and leave the country. Not joking. This has been told to me several times by many different ex-pats. A couple of years ago, I knew someone, not a close friend, that worked at the American Embassy here. He got into some type of physical altercation with a Moroccan. It was my understanding that HE was the aggressor and really beat this guy up. The Embassy employee was gone the next day. No one knew exactly what happened, they just knew that he was no longer at the Embassy and no longer in the country. Not sure what would happen now as we currently have no Ambassador or even Deputy here. Since Trump fired many of those people at the beginning of his Presidency, we have not had a replacement here. This is the situation in NYC, MVAs, bar fights, et al.. They constantly have people leaving quickly. So many with the UN in NYC. Last I knew diplomatic pouches were not searched. Not sure how that is now with the TSA. Vehicles with Diplomatic plates rack up thousands of dollars in parking fines, never to be paid. I have a close friend here who is a diplomat with diplomatic plates on her car...she has told me they NEVER stop her for speeding here, even when the radar catches her. You are 100 percent correct!
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Jili
Pearl Clutcher
SLPea
Posts: 4,363
Jun 26, 2014 1:26:48 GMT
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Post by Jili on Oct 10, 2019 5:16:32 GMT
I've been following this story and I think it's terrible. I would hope that discussions are happening behind the scenes so that Anne Sacoolas will face appropriate justice for what she's done. Honestly, though, my cynical guess is that she's lying low and hoping that attention will die down and that before long she can go about her life.
If I were in her shoes, I doubt that I personally could do that. In addition, how can her friends and family carry on as usual with her, knowing that she refuses to take responsibility for her actions that have resulted in the death of a young man? If I were a family member or friend, I don't think I could continue my relationship with her in the same way knowing that she's done this. I'd never view her in the same light again.
She needs to do the right thing. She doesn't need to be locked away for life. It was clearly an accident. She does need, however, to accept responsibility and consequences, whatever they may be.
Again, the cynic in me believes that nothing will happen and that this will all die down. She'll eventually go about a normal life at some point, but I hope that Anne Sacoolas struggles with her actions for the rest of her days.
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Post by gar on Oct 10, 2019 6:32:44 GMT
Trump doesn't seem to have any intention of waiving her DI. I hope he proves me wrong. She may be able to go on with her life but Harry's parents will never be able to move on if there's no closure for them.
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Post by pierkiss on Oct 10, 2019 10:32:50 GMT
So if you’re a diplomat, and something like this happens, and you flee back home, do you lose your job? Or do they just find a different posting for you after a period of time?
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Post by gar on Oct 10, 2019 10:55:38 GMT
Would you lose your job if you haven’t been convicted of anything?
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Post by uksue on Oct 10, 2019 11:22:10 GMT
It’s clear from the photo of the notes he was holding she isn’t coming back.
If someone isn’t a careful driver how many times are they allowed to kill someone ‘accidentally ’ ? It’s not like she has an exemplary driving record . Plus her spouse has DI- why is it extended to spouses? That makes no sense to me.
I’m not surprised at Trump . If the situation were reversed I guarantee he would be demanding the culprit return to face justice but then he’s made sure we are all fully aware it’s the US first, second - always.
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Post by uksue on Oct 10, 2019 11:35:15 GMT
Also if he’s so sure it was an accident, why is she too chicken to come back and face the investigation? You only run if you are aware you’ve done something wrong . She didn’t just run - she clearly got legal advice and they were taken home to the states on a private plane .
I hope she is hounded by the US press so she gets a real sense of what she’s done, as clearly there is gong to be no real justice . The family here don’t even want her jailed - they just want to talk to her .
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anniebygaslight
Drama Llama
I'd love a cup of tea. #1966
Posts: 7,389
Location: Third Rock from the sun.
Jun 28, 2014 14:08:19 GMT
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Post by anniebygaslight on Oct 10, 2019 12:29:41 GMT
There is a gofundme page here Justice4HarryI don't usually donate to gofundme pages, but I am making an exception in this case.
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Post by pierkiss on Oct 10, 2019 16:13:04 GMT
Would you lose your job if you haven’t been convicted of anything? Maybe. Take for example men who are falsely accused of sexual crimes against children and women. As soon as there is a whisper that it happened they’re fired. Or, asked to resign so they can avoid being fired. Also, look at all the people who have been fired for content on their social media pages. They haven’t been convicted in a court of anything at all. They just dared to have a social life and put it on their own personal page. 🤷♀️
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Mar 28, 2024 10:58:49 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2019 21:36:12 GMT
Interesting info just been confirmed by our Foreign office and confirmed by the US. She’s not covered by diplomatic immunity any longer. It ceased the minute she flew out of British air space. I still don’t have much confidence that she will be extradited though. It could prove a problem for her if she wants to travel with her husband to other countries when she is wanted as part of a UK police investigation though.
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Post by rainangel on Oct 12, 2019 22:46:09 GMT
There is this case that reminds me of this, it must be 10 years old by now. Young Norwegian woman studying in London is horribly murdered and found in a closet in her apt building. She haf been out with friends, and was last seen on surveillance footage with young man from (I think) Jordan. Before her body is even found, young man has abruptly left his studies in London and taken a private plane back to Jordan. He has not left Jordan since, and because neither England or Norway has an extradition agreement with Jordan he can't be interviewed by police or taken into custody. He has not been proven guilty or anything remotely close, because he was out of England before the body was even found and has never spoken to any officials about his side of the story.
The young womans family has been trying to make a deal with Jordan to get the young man to England to be interviewed, but his father is rich and powerful so it hasn't happened yet. For 10-12 years this has gone on for. Young man is not so young anymore, and has since married and has several children.
I sincerely hope there is a way to get this diplomat's wife back to England to be interviewed and held accountable. Fleeing the country makes you seem VERY guilty. But there are cases of justice never happening because the suspects just stay in their homecountry. I hope this doesn't happen here.
If Trump decides in his infinite wisdom it was an accident, and she should be protected, she'll never be held accountable.
It's just sickening......
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Mar 28, 2024 10:58:49 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2019 23:40:08 GMT
There is this case that reminds me of this, it must be 10 years old by now. Young Norwegian woman studying in London is horribly murdered and found in a closet in her apt building. She haf been out with friends, and was last seen on surveillance footage with young man from (I think) Jordan. Before her body is even found, young man has abruptly left his studies in London and taken a private plane back to Jordan. He has not left Jordan since, and because neither England or Norway has an extradition agreement with Jordan he can't be interviewed by police or taken into custody. He has not been proven guilty or anything remotely close, because he was out of England before the body was even found and has never spoken to any officials about his side of the story. The young womans family has been trying to make a deal with Jordan to get the young man to England to be interviewed, but his father is rich and powerful so it hasn't happened yet. For 10-12 years this has gone on for. Young man is not so young anymore, and has since married and has several children. I sincerely hope there is a way to get this diplomat's wife back to England to be interviewed and held accountable. Fleeing the country makes you seem VERY guilty. But there are cases of justice never happening because the suspects just stay in their homecountry. I hope this doesn't happen here. If Trump decides in his infinite wisdom it was an accident, and she should be protected, she'll never be held accountable. It's just sickening...... It was Yemen not Jordan. Her father visited London last year on the 10th anniversary of her death. Police still have the case open but as you say, very little can be done about it while he is still in Yemen. A dreadful injustice for her and her family. link
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Oct 13, 2019 1:29:45 GMT
Oct. 12, 2019, 8:08 PM EDT By Dennis Romero The spokesman for the parents of a British teenager killed in a collision with a vehicle driven by a U.S. diplomat's wife said he will meet her lawyer in the United States, NBC News has learned.Radd Seiger, spokesman for the family of Harry Dunn, 19, said, "I have had a brief conversation with the legal representatives appointed on behalf of Anne Sacoolas and we have agreed to meet at the earliest opportunity." Sacoolas is the spouse of a United States diplomat assigned to the United Kingdom, according to the U.S. State Department. The session could be a prelude to a direct meeting between Sacoolas and the parents. The Volvo SUV she was driving was headed the wrong way when it collided with Dunn as he rode a motorcycle in the village of Croughton, England, in late August, according to British authorities. Prosecutors have not said whether they would seek any possible charges. The woman returned to the United States following the crash. Authorities in the U.K. said they would go through "diplomatic channels" as part of their investigation. President Donald Trump said this week that he spoke to British Prime Minister Boris Johnson about the case and that the woman is the subject of diplomatic immunity. "We’re going to speak to her very shortly and see if we can do something," Trump said. However, the U.K. government disputes whether she has diplomatic immunity. Dunn's parents said in a statement Saturday that they would be coming to the United States "to fight to achieve justice" for their son. The parents said they would visit New York and Washington to drum up political support for the return of Sacoolas to England to "face the consequences of her actions." "As if losing Harry was not enough, they now find themselves having to expend enormous time and energy, which they can ill afford, generating sufficient publicity to garner public support to persuade the US government to help them achieve closure," they said in the statement sent under the heading "Justice4Harry." Seiger also asked any witnesses or anyone with information about the collision to come forward. He said Sacoolas' lawyer first contacted him and that he hopes a meeting will take place soon. www.nbcnews.com/news/world/representatives-diplomat-s-wife-family-teen-killed-u-k-crash-n1065466@dottyscrapper gar anniebygaslight uksue
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Deleted
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Mar 28, 2024 10:58:49 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 13, 2019 9:22:19 GMT
Unfortunately, revirdsuba99 unless she comes back voluntarily there's not a lot they can do unless the police and the Director of Public Prosecution in this country to go down the extradition route. I have little faith that the US authorities will agree to that. According to reports here Anne Sacoolas has issued a statement through her legal representative from the law firm Arnold and Porter saying she "Fully cooperated with the police and the investigation.She spoke with authorities at the scene of the accident and met with the Northampton police at her home the following day. She will continue to cooperate with the investigation.
Anne would like to meet with Mr. Dunn’s parents so that she can express her deepest sympathies and apologies for this tragic accident.
We have been in contact with the family’s attorneys and look forward to hearing from them."Radd Seiger is a spokesperson of the family and a former lawyer. He has no legal authority to make her return.Fully cooperating would be for her to return voluntarily to face the consequences of her actions. For her lawyer to say she cooperated fully while she was here is untrue. She didn't, she fled back to the US assisted by whoever pulled the diplomatic immunity card when the police went to interview her fully after it happened.
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Post by gar on Oct 13, 2019 9:31:17 GMT
They are currently appealing for witnesses and information about her departure from the UK. - in a transport plane apparently!
I believe Harry's parents are traveling to the US today so I expect you'll all be seeing them on your news stations etc. I hope she comes through with her expressed wish to meet them - I'm sure they will very much want to do that.
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Deleted
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Mar 28, 2024 10:58:49 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 13, 2019 10:48:02 GMT
They are currently appealing for witnesses and information about her departure from the UK. - in a transport plane apparently! I believe Harry's parents are traveling to the US today so I expect you'll all be seeing them on your news stations etc. I hope she comes through with her expressed wish to meet them - I'm sure they will very much want to do that. There's more reports coming out on the diplomatic immunity from various sources. Apparently he didn't have it to start with. He's not on the official Foreign office list of named diplomats and the US National Security Agency has confirmed that he is not one of their employees. It makes it even more serious because whoever advised her, or assisted her, in leaving the country is also guilty of breaking the law in assisting someone to flee who was under police investigation. It doesn't sound as if Northamptonshire Police is going to let it go either. Speaking on Friday morning, Chief Constable Nick Adderley said: "We will go through the process that we would with anybody who’s not subject to diplomatic immunity.
"We would look to circulate that person as 'wanted' on the police national computer, we would look to consider the options we have in starting extradition proceedings.
"What we’ve got to do is be ready so that if anything changes we’re in a position to go.
"We will not row back or slow down from doing this exactly as we would if this was any other case where somebody was not available or making themselves availed for part of that investigation enquiry."Mr Adderley also said they will be passing on all the information they have to the Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) in the next few days.
He added: "We are moving at pace in terms of putting that file of evidence together.
"The fact that the driver of that vehicle is not in the country will not slow us down in terms of putting that evidence to the CPS.
"Once the CPS have come back with a decision on what to charge - if anything - and hopefully that will be early next week, we will then start the process of deciding what we do next."
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Mar 28, 2024 10:58:49 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 13, 2019 11:09:58 GMT
Empty words by Trump as usual. Someone photographed his notes at the press conference
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wellway
Prolific Pea
Posts: 8,759
Jun 25, 2014 20:50:09 GMT
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Post by wellway on Oct 13, 2019 11:20:45 GMT
If the person who advised them has immunity then I guess they will not have to answer for anything either.
Beginning to wonder what the husband's job really was? They had been here three weeks and yet not on an approved list.
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Oct 16, 2019 16:20:34 GMT
Harry Dunn's family rejects Trump's 'bombshell' offer to meet Anne Sacoolas"The bombshell was dropped not soon after we walked in the room: Anne Sacoolas was in the building and was willing to meet with us," Dunn's mother said. Oct. 16, 2019, 8:19 AM EDT / Updated Oct. 16, 2019, 10:43 AM EDT By Alexander Smith The family of a British teenager killed in a wrong-way crash involving the wife of an American diplomat said President Donald Trump dropped a "bombshell" during a meeting at the White House, revealing that the woman was waiting to meet them in the room next door. ** But during a meeting with Trump at the White House on Tuesday, they said the president made what they considered a shocking and inappropriate offer. "The bombshell was dropped not soon after we walked in the room: Anne Sacoolas was in the building and was willing to meet with us," Dunn's mother, Charlotte Charles, told reporters in Washington afterward. "We made it very clear that as we've said all along … we would still love to meet with her but it has to be on our terms and on U.K. soil." Mark Stephens, a lawyer for the Dunn family, told Sky News on Wednesday the plan of the Trump team was to set up the meeting and then "bring in the press corp to show it was all happy families." "Unfortunately, that was a gargantuan miscalculation," he said, describing the way the meeting was proposed as "so wrong." Stephens also described Sacoolas as a "fugitive from justice." Dunn's father, Tim Dunn, had said earlier that Trump was "very gracious and respectful" throughout the meeting, holding Charles' hand at one point and promising her he would seek a solution. "He was understanding and I think he genuinely will look to try and resolve this," he said. But Charles, the teenager's mother, said the meeting ultimately went "round in circles" as Trump and his team tried to get the family to "accept the invitation to meet her [Sacoolas] on their terms which we weren't willing to do." She said that any meeting would need to involve "therapists and mediators in the room and not just her and us. I wouldn't imagine that's even advisable for her, let alone us." Tim Dunn said they felt "a bit rushed" and that they "don't think it would have gone too well" if they had gone through with the president's plan. Sacoolas has admitted that she was driving on the wrong side of the road when she hit Harry Dunn on his motorcycle near RAF Croughton in Northamptonshire, England. ** Trump initially ruled out Sacoolas returning to the U.K., but later in the meeting Tuesday he mentioned trying to "push this from a different angle," Dunn's mother said. ** www.nbcnews.com/news/world/harry-dunn-s-family-reject-trump-s-bombshell-offer-meet-n1067246No doubt dt was looking for a photo op!!
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craftykitten
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,304
Jun 26, 2014 7:39:32 GMT
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Post by craftykitten on Oct 16, 2019 16:22:22 GMT
I am disgusted that they were set up in this way, and really proud of them for refusing to meet her and make it a press opportunity.
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Post by bc2ca on Oct 16, 2019 16:50:15 GMT
FWIW, I do believe Sacoolas's lawyer that she was set up as well: It was the buffoons in the White House who thought this was a good idea and I'm glad Harry's parents were able to withstand the pressure on them. CBS interview
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Post by femalebusiness on Oct 16, 2019 16:53:56 GMT
Laura Bush killed a kid when she was speeding and ran a stop sign. I don't think she even got a slap on the wrist. If you are well connected you skate.
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wellway
Prolific Pea
Posts: 8,759
Jun 25, 2014 20:50:09 GMT
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Post by wellway on Oct 16, 2019 16:59:38 GMT
FWIW, I do believe Sacoolas's lawyer that she was set up as well: It was the buffoons in the White House who thought this was a good idea and I'm glad Harry's parents were able to withstand the pressure on them. CBS interviewInteresting, the BBC reported differently. A statement issued by Mrs Sacoolas' lawyer Amy Jeffress said: "We are trying to handle the matter privately and look forward to hearing from the family or their representatives. "Anne accepted the invitation to the White House with the hope that the family would meet and was disappointed." www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-northamptonshire-50070481My guess, she was looking for a quick forgiveness to enable her to move on. Guess she has to live with her conscious a bit longer
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