Olan
Pearl Clutcher
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Posts: 4,053
Jul 13, 2014 21:23:27 GMT
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Post by Olan on Jun 2, 2020 19:50:45 GMT
I understand. I have felt like that. I keep this book at hand, TBH, because it helps me reflect. White Fragility, chapter 8, "Why it's so hard for White People to Take Feedback" This part resonates with me ALL the time. Literally have it highlighted. The quote is: Racism is the norm rather than an aberration. Feedback is key to our ability to recognize and repair our inevitable and often unaware collusion. In recognition of this, I try to follow these guidelines: 1. How, where, and when you give me feedback is irrelevant - it is the feedback I want and need. Understanding that it is hard to give, I will take it in any way I can get it. From my position of social, cultural, and institutional white power and privilege, I am perfectly safe and I can handle it. If I cannot handle it, it's on me [emphasis author's] to build my racial stamina.2. Thank you.ETA: I'm sharing this more about showing up outside of this place than here, so it's not necessarily a commentary on this particular thread or any thread here. More about what has been helpful to me as I think about ways to be more anti-racist in my life. Any explanation that I give about how I am feeling will he met with negativity so there really isn’t a point. I’ve already been told several times that my feedback is not important. And no, that is not me being a victim. It is a fact of how people have been acting. People try to share their POV and they are torn apart and told they are wrong. People ask questions or say they want to learn and are treated like they are idiots for not knowing in the first place. People are constantly posting things (whether their own opinion or an article or the title of a post) that are said in an aggressive tone, whether that is coming from a black person or a white person that thinks he or she is so much more enlightened than everyone else. It is true that looking at our own biases and history is uncomfortable. That is hard enough as it is, why would anyone do it if they are met with aggression and resistance along the way?a little kindness goes a long way. I think the reason why they would be inclined to change even if they were met with resistance is because 1. It’s important to them. 2. It’s time. 3. It’s the right thing to do. And dangling the “right thing to do” over my head and demanding I perform a certain way to get your help or response doesn’t make me feel comfortable. I don’t think I’m lacking kindness when my response is “that’s okay then”.
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Post by catmom on Jun 2, 2020 19:52:33 GMT
I understand. I have felt like that. I keep this book at hand, TBH, because it helps me reflect. White Fragility, chapter 8, "Why it's so hard for White People to Take Feedback" This part resonates with me ALL the time. Literally have it highlighted. The quote is: Racism is the norm rather than an aberration. Feedback is key to our ability to recognize and repair our inevitable and often unaware collusion. In recognition of this, I try to follow these guidelines: 1. How, where, and when you give me feedback is irrelevant - it is the feedback I want and need. Understanding that it is hard to give, I will take it in any way I can get it. From my position of social, cultural, and institutional white power and privilege, I am perfectly safe and I can handle it. If I cannot handle it, it's on me [emphasis author's] to build my racial stamina.2. Thank you.ETA: I'm sharing this more about showing up outside of this place than here, so it's not necessarily a commentary on this particular thread or any thread here. More about what has been helpful to me as I think about ways to be more anti-racist in my life. Any explanation that I give about how I am feeling will he met with negativity so there really isn’t a point. I’ve already been told several times that my feedback is not important. And no, that is not me being a victim. It is a fact of how people have been acting. People try to share their POV and they are torn apart and told they are wrong. People ask questions or say they want to learn and are treated like they are idiots for not knowing in the first place. People are constantly posting things (whether their own opinion or an article or the title of a post) that are said in an aggressive tone, whether that is coming from a black person or a white person that thinks he or she is so much more enlightened than everyone else. It is true that looking at our own biases and history is uncomfortable. That is hard enough as it is, why would anyone do it if they are met with aggression and resistance along the way?a little kindness goes a long way. From the thread on the black square, you were answered in the most passive way someone can, with question marks after the answer. You perceived that as aggressive and mocking. Could it be worthwhile to consider if you are misinterpreting answers as more aggressive than they are meant? Or asking why it makes you feel defensive? As to why anyone should bother - we should bother because black people deserve to be safe, even if the process is painful for me. And because as a white person, the literal least I owe is to listen and try to understand and learn, even if what I hear hurts my feelings.
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Olan
Pearl Clutcher
Enter your message here...
Posts: 4,053
Jul 13, 2014 21:23:27 GMT
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Post by Olan on Jun 2, 2020 19:54:29 GMT
Any explanation that I give about how I am feeling will he met with negativity so there really isn’t a point. I’ve already been told several times that my feedback is not important. And no, that is not me being a victim. It is a fact of how people have been acting. People try to share their POV and they are torn apart and told they are wrong. People ask questions or say they want to learn and are treated like they are idiots for not knowing in the first place. People are constantly posting things (whether their own opinion or an article or the title of a post) that are said in an aggressive tone, whether that is coming from a black person or a white person that thinks he or she is so much more enlightened than everyone else. It is true that looking at our own biases and history is uncomfortable. That is hard enough as it is, why would anyone do it if they are met with aggression and resistance along the way?a little kindness goes a long way. From the thread on the black square, you were answered in the most passive way someone can, with question marks after the answer. You perceived that as aggressive and mocking. Could it be worthwhile to consider if you are misinterpreting answers as more aggressive than they are meant? Or asking why it makes you feel defensive? As to why anyone should bother - we should bother because black people deserve to be safe, even if the process is painful for me. And because as a white person, the literal least I owe is to listen and try to understand and learn, even if what I hear hurts my feelings. Thank you. Really.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Jun 2, 2020 19:56:51 GMT
Can I ask if you're talking about here or in person in your life? I'm sorry that you feel like your point of view isn't important, and I'm sorry if I, personally, have made you feel that way. I would say both. Look, if I ask *what can I do* it is met with someone saying that it isn't their job to tell white people what to do. I'm asking because I want to know. I want to know what you (global) consider relevant, important and right. I am asking because I value your opinion. Hearing that it isn't your job to educate me or tell me what to do makes me not want to do anything. Not because I don't care enough to do it but because you don't care enough to help me help you when I am asking to help. I have heard some good analogies/explanations for this recently that really helped me. These came from the Chalene Show podcast that I asked if anyone has listened to yesterday. Chalene and her African American friend had a candid conversation about racism and the topic of white people asking black people what they should do came up. Chalene said that the husband of one of her friends recently died and the friend said that she often was taken aback when people would come up to her and unload their grief on her. That they had good intentions and were trying to relate and grieve with her, but she felt that it was too much for her at the time and it wasn’t her job at that time to help them cope when she was trying to do so herself. They related that to this situation. It makes sense to me, but I also then had the question of what is the best way for white people to cope with their own feelings right now? How to show support in a way that isn’t going to be offensive? Her friend also said that for some black people, they see white people as being the perpetrator and lash out. I have seen that here. I can understand it but I also don’t think it is productive and does hurt to be on the receiving end. And I would say that we have a Pea that comes across this way all the time, not just this week, and many people avoid her. So her approach is not really that effective. It was a really good episode and I would encourage people to listen to it.
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Post by scrapcat on Jun 2, 2020 19:56:52 GMT
I think your questions regarding the hashtag was answered.
As far as the symbolic gesture.... I read a few opinions before posting my black square with just the #blackouttuesday. I originally was not going to post because I felt like, why be another white voice in the way of black voices. But I did it for the white people who follow me. I am extremely introverted and any of what I do as far as social justice, etc. is very private to me. But I wanted a way to signal to other white people who may follow me to see that I am standing with Black Lives Matter. Honestly, there are probably white people who follow me who would never listen to a black person, but they may listen (or learn thru example) by looking at me. Basically using my white privilege in a way.
I took the blackout as a moment for businesses and influencers to stop peddling their goods and allow other voices to rise up. I am taking note of what businesses/influencers I follow are doing and will unfollow accordingly.
I didn't feel right just letting the square sit there with no support, so I chose to link stories to black women, mainly in the papercrafting/arts community, who are contributing to the dialogue, in my stories and add some info there. The idea is to elevate voices that are not always heard, so by continuing to post to those accounts. I don't have a ton of followers and honestly I am not that involved in social media to really get into it, but I figure if I can help in any little way, even if it makes 1 other person stop and think, or question, then it is something.
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Post by *KAS* on Jun 2, 2020 20:01:05 GMT
Any explanation that I give about how I am feeling will he met with negativity so there really isn’t a point. I’ve already been told several times that my feedback is not important. And no, that is not me being a victim. It is a fact of how people have been acting. People try to share their POV and they are torn apart and told they are wrong. People ask questions or say they want to learn and are treated like they are idiots for not knowing in the first place. People are constantly posting things (whether their own opinion or an article or the title of a post) that are said in an aggressive tone, whether that is coming from a black person or a white person that thinks he or she is so much more enlightened than everyone else. It is true that looking at our own biases and history is uncomfortable. That is hard enough as it is, why would anyone do it if they are met with aggression and resistance along the way? Can I ask if you're talking about here or in person in your life? I'm sorry that you feel like your point of view isn't important, and I'm sorry if I, personally, have made you feel that way. I know you aren't asking me, but I had it happen (on Facebook, with a high school classmate that is Black) this past weekend. I was 100% trying to be supportive to her after she said that she was so hurt that more people weren't speaking up. So I mentioned what I had done, although that didn't include posting about it on FB (which I've never used for any sort of social justice or political message. It's not like I was ignoring just this. I keep my FB light and fluffy always). She told me what I was doing wasn't enough and really lashed out. Sent me multiple MLK Jr quotes and said something along the lines of 'but thanks for your donations to wherever you gave them' in a passive aggressive way. So I explained where i gave, and why I chose those places to donate to b/c they were places that I thought would have a better impact than me posting on FB, and she said I shouldn't have ever commented to her and just went off and told me to mind my business. I recognize she was hurt but my intent was positive and I apologized for the miscommunication. I've used the time since then to do research and have downloaded some books to read (one of which you quoted), and viewed some online anti-racism resources to try and educate myself using a ton of info I've seen shared socially. But sometimes it just feels like you can't win, so it's better to be silent. You'll be judged either way. Which sucks.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Jun 2, 2020 20:01:39 GMT
Any explanation that I give about how I am feeling will he met with negativity so there really isn’t a point. I’ve already been told several times that my feedback is not important. And no, that is not me being a victim. It is a fact of how people have been acting. People try to share their POV and they are torn apart and told they are wrong. People ask questions or say they want to learn and are treated like they are idiots for not knowing in the first place. People are constantly posting things (whether their own opinion or an article or the title of a post) that are said in an aggressive tone, whether that is coming from a black person or a white person that thinks he or she is so much more enlightened than everyone else. It is true that looking at our own biases and history is uncomfortable. That is hard enough as it is, why would anyone do it if they are met with aggression and resistance along the way?a little kindness goes a long way. From the thread on the black square, you were answered in the most passive way someone can, with question marks after the answer. You perceived that as aggressive and mocking. Could it be worthwhile to consider if you are misinterpreting answers as more aggressive than they are meant? Or asking why it makes you feel defensive? As to why anyone should bother - we should bother because black people deserve to be safe, even if the process is painful for me. And because as a white person, the literal least I owe is to listen and try to understand and learn, even if what I hear hurts my feelings. To me, using question marks in that way comes across as “duh. Why didn’t you already know that.” I don’t see it as passive at all. If she had said, “I’m not sure. It could be x? It could be y?” I might have taken it differently. However, I am also very raw after some interactions here this weekend and some irl as well so it is possible that I took it differently than intended. I also didn’t say that I personally would not continue to learn things, I was Saying in general, coming at people with an aggressive tone is not going to help matters. You and I will move forward in becoming more aware. But others may not. That being said, I am more receptive to people posting things that come across as positive and purposeful rather than “you are probably just a racist” types of sentiments.
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Post by sleepingbooty on Jun 2, 2020 20:02:02 GMT
I didn't feel right just letting the square sit there with no support, so I chose to link stories to black women, mainly in the papercrafting/arts community, who are contributing to the dialogue, in my stories and add some info there. The idea is to elevate voices that are not always heard, so by continuing to post to those accounts. I agree with this method and it's what I'll be looking for when it comes to the accounts I follow. The square and hashtag for a day (or a week for those quietening until Sunday) is a symbolic, short-term gesture. It's nice to draw attention in big numbers to the issue. But change can only come from picking up activism after that short-term goal has been met. It'll be interesting to see who continues to regularly use their platform to let minorities, including the Black community, be heard and amplified. I'll make my decisions on who to follow and who to unfollow on how they act after the "hot topic-ness" of the #blackouttuesday has passed.
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Post by SockMonkey on Jun 2, 2020 20:07:30 GMT
Can I ask if you're talking about here or in person in your life? I'm sorry that you feel like your point of view isn't important, and I'm sorry if I, personally, have made you feel that way. I would say both. Look, if I ask *what can I do* it is met with someone saying that it isn't their job to tell white people what to do. I'm asking because I want to know. I want to know what you (global) consider relevant, important and right. I am asking because I value your opinion. Hearing that it isn't your job to educate me or tell me what to do makes me not want to do anything. Not because I don't care enough to do it but because you don't care enough to help me help you when I am asking to help. I think I understand what you’re saying, and what I’m reading is that you want to do something and your intentions are good. I think for me it’s important to consider that asking a person of color to tell me what to do can feel like labor, and there are LOTS of resources out there already. Books upon books, links, many of which have been shared here. Google, Twitter. Tons of resources. So if we can start there, it may alleviate the burden on someone we know. If that person of color is a friend or relative, maybe shifting to “what can I do FOR YOU” is a more helpful question? I don’t have all the answers, but that’s what I’ve come to in my reading.
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Post by snugglebutter on Jun 2, 2020 20:11:11 GMT
Thank you to those who explained why including #blacklivesmatter on the IG posts is harmful.
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Deleted
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Nov 23, 2024 16:12:16 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2020 20:11:48 GMT
I would say both. Look, if I ask *what can I do* it is met with someone saying that it isn't their job to tell white people what to do. I'm asking because I want to know. I want to know what you (global) consider relevant, important and right. I am asking because I value your opinion. Hearing that it isn't your job to educate me or tell me what to do makes me not want to do anything. Not because I don't care enough to do it but because you don't care enough to help me help you when I am asking to help. I have heard some good analogies/explanations for this recently that really helped me. These came from the Chalene Show podcast that I asked if anyone has listened to yesterday. Chalene and her African American friend had a candid conversation about racism and the topic of white people asking black people what they should do came up. Chalene said that the husband of one of her friends recently died and the friend said that she often was taken aback when people would come up to her and unload their grief on her. That they had good intentions and were trying to relate and grieve with her, but she felt that it was too much for her at the time and it wasn’t her job at that time to help them cope when she was trying to do so herself. They related that to this situation. It makes sense to me, but I also then had the question of what is the best way for white people to cope with their own feelings right now? How to show support in a way that isn’t going to be offensive? Her friend also said that for some black people, they see white people as being the perpetrator and lash out. I have seen that here. I can understand it but I also don’t think it is productive and does hurt to be on the receiving end. And I would say that we have a Pea that comes across this way all the time, not just this week, and many people avoid her. So her approach is not really that effective. It was a really good episode and I would encourage people to listen to it. I understand what she is saying, but it isn't dumping grief. It is trying to navigate in a place that I have never been to before. It is asking for directions. It is like asking where the good restaurant is and which one to avoid. I am asking someone who is familiar with something that I am not. I am not burdening them with why I want to do something or how I feel somehow discriminated against. I am literally standing there with support in my hand and asking what is the best place to put this to work.
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Post by SockMonkey on Jun 2, 2020 20:12:26 GMT
Can I ask if you're talking about here or in person in your life? I'm sorry that you feel like your point of view isn't important, and I'm sorry if I, personally, have made you feel that way. I know you aren't asking me, but I had it happen (on Facebook, with a high school classmate that is Black) this past weekend. I was 100% trying to be supportive to her after she said that she was so hurt that more people weren't speaking up. So I mentioned what I had done, although that didn't include posting about it on FB (which I've never used for any sort of social justice or political message. It's not like I was ignoring just this. I keep my FB light and fluffy always). She told me what I was doing wasn't enough and really lashed out. Sent me multiple MLK Jr quotes and said something along the lines of 'but thanks for your donations to wherever you gave them' in a passive aggressive way. So I explained where i gave, and why I chose those places to donate to b/c they were places that I thought would have a better impact than me posting on FB, and she said I shouldn't have ever commented to her and just went off and told me to mind my business. I recognize she was hurt but my intent was positive and I apologized for the miscommunication. I've used the time since then to do research and have downloaded some books to read (one of which you quoted), and viewed some online anti-racism resources to try and educate myself using a ton of info I've seen shared socially. But sometimes it just feels like you can't win, so it's better to be silent. You'll be judged either way. Which sucks. Can I ask you a question? Do you think she could have felt hurt that in the semi-public space you share with her, Facebook, you didn’t post anything? What does “keeping it light and fluffy” protect and prioritize? Maybe she felt hurt that you don’t speak out in a way that calls others you know in? She would have to answer that, and now is probably not the time to ask, but I guess it’s about where and how you bring your full self. If she feels like you only private message support and never speak “publicly” on it, that could feel frustrating and unsupportive of her, regardless of your intentions. And, it does suck to be judged, but this is where what DiAngelo calls “building our racial stamina” comes in. The amount of judgement we face for these behaviors pales in comparison to the experiences of people of color in this country, and I try to keep that centered in my mind. Thank you for sharing your example from your life.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Jun 2, 2020 20:13:46 GMT
Can I ask if you're talking about here or in person in your life? I'm sorry that you feel like your point of view isn't important, and I'm sorry if I, personally, have made you feel that way. I know you aren't asking me, but I had it happen (on Facebook, with a high school classmate that is Black) this past weekend. I was 100% trying to be supportive to her after she said that she was so hurt that more people weren't speaking up. So I mentioned what I had done, although that didn't include posting about it on FB (which I've never used for any sort of social justice or political message. It's not like I was ignoring just this. I keep my FB light and fluffy always). She told me what I was doing wasn't enough and really lashed out. Sent me multiple MLK Jr quotes and said something along the lines of 'but thanks for your donations to wherever you gave them' in a passive aggressive way. So I explained where i gave, and why I chose those places to donate to b/c they were places that I thought would have a better impact than me posting on FB, and she said I shouldn't have ever commented to her and just went off and told me to mind my business. I recognize she was hurt but my intent was positive and I apologized for the miscommunication. I've used the time since then to do research and have downloaded some books to read (one of which you quoted), and viewed some online anti-racism resources to try and educate myself using a ton of info I've seen shared socially. But sometimes it just feels like you can't win, so it's better to be silent. You'll be judged either way. Which sucks. I’ve seen similar posts and interactions and have similar feelings. From this point of view I can also see why someone might ask a black person what they can do, because there are also posts saying what NOT to do (similar to the black squares and BLM hashtags) and people don’t want to do something that is seen as “wrong”.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Jun 2, 2020 20:15:15 GMT
I have heard some good analogies/explanations for this recently that really helped me. These came from the Chalene Show podcast that I asked if anyone has listened to yesterday. Chalene and her African American friend had a candid conversation about racism and the topic of white people asking black people what they should do came up. Chalene said that the husband of one of her friends recently died and the friend said that she often was taken aback when people would come up to her and unload their grief on her. That they had good intentions and were trying to relate and grieve with her, but she felt that it was too much for her at the time and it wasn’t her job at that time to help them cope when she was trying to do so herself. They related that to this situation. It makes sense to me, but I also then had the question of what is the best way for white people to cope with their own feelings right now? How to show support in a way that isn’t going to be offensive? Her friend also said that for some black people, they see white people as being the perpetrator and lash out. I have seen that here. I can understand it but I also don’t think it is productive and does hurt to be on the receiving end. And I would say that we have a Pea that comes across this way all the time, not just this week, and many people avoid her. So her approach is not really that effective. It was a really good episode and I would encourage people to listen to it. I understand what she is saying, but it isn't dumping grief. It is trying to navigate in a place that I have never been to before. It is asking for directions. It is like asking where the good restaurant is and which one to avoid. I am asking someone who is familiar with something that I am not. I am not burdening them with why I want to do something or how I feel somehow discriminated against. I am literally standing there with support in my hand and asking what is the best place to put this to work. I understand the intent behind asking, but I also understand that the people who are being asked are taking it a different way. I’m not sure what the answer is.
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Post by SockMonkey on Jun 2, 2020 20:16:41 GMT
From the thread on the black square, you were answered in the most passive way someone can, with question marks after the answer. You perceived that as aggressive and mocking. Could it be worthwhile to consider if you are misinterpreting answers as more aggressive than they are meant? Or asking why it makes you feel defensive? As to why anyone should bother - we should bother because black people deserve to be safe, even if the process is painful for me. And because as a white person, the literal least I owe is to listen and try to understand and learn, even if what I hear hurts my feelings. To me, using question marks in that way comes across as “duh. Why didn’t you already know that.” I don’t see it as passive at all. If she had said, “I’m not sure. It could be x? It could be y?” I might have taken it differently. However, I am also very raw after some interactions here this weekend and some irl as well so it is possible that I took it differently than intended. I also didn’t say that I personally would not continue to learn things, I was Saying in general, coming at people with an aggressive tone is not going to help matters. You and I will move forward in becoming more aware. But others may not. That being said, I am more receptive to people posting things that come across as positive and purposeful rather than “you are probably just a racist” types of sentiments. It’s also REALLY REALLY difficult to have productive discussion around race online with people you don’t know and without the benefit of tone, body language, and context. It’s HARD to do it face to face, and even more difficult online. I’m guilty of letting my passion for things get the better of my keyboard fingers, that’s for sure.
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Post by claudia123 on Jun 2, 2020 21:04:51 GMT
I think it's really important to try not to take criticism too personally. The point is not that you as an individual are a bad person, or actively racist, but the foundations of society are entrenched in racism and so if you are not actively anti-racist you are, whether it's nice to hear or not, racist.
I think it's tragically analogous to the murder of George Floyd. You may not be the one kneeling on peoples necks but if you're not actively educating yourself and listening to black people's lived experiences, you are also guilty.
This isn't targeted at anyone and I, as a white woman am still learning and getting things wrong because systematic racism is in every facet of our society and is taught from birth . Black people are traumatised and exhausted enough, they don't need to educate us on why Black Lives Matter, it's plain to see when you being to research. We (white people) have benefited from the institutionally racist system, so it's up to us to do our part in dismantling it.
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Nov 23, 2024 16:12:16 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2020 21:31:50 GMT
I appreciate everyone answering my questions.
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Post by hopemax on Jun 2, 2020 21:32:39 GMT
I know today is black out Tuesday. I have a few questions as I get conflicting information: 1. Why are you now not supposed to use BLM and blacklivesmatter as a hashtag? I thought BLM organization is the one who started the black square? Now people are saying BLM is not helping the cause for systemic change within the black community. So is BLM no longer a positive changing group? I am a bit confused because I have friends who are now anti BLM. ? 2. Does anyone feel this is just another symbolic gesture of social media? Like the "post what color bra you have on to support breast cancer awareness." (And NO I am not liking to two). Posting your bra color did not in fact help bring awareness to breast cancer. I know you are supposed to black out and listen and educate yourself. But if everyone blacks out and no one is posting information, how are we to learn? I hate to say this but I feel like many are doing it because its what you are supposed to do. A 'Hey I am with you even though I am not doing anything in my home, my community to make positive changes.' I am honestly trying to understand how a black square is going to help. Any insight is greatly appreciated. I am here to learn so share!!! #1 is about data organization. Instead, of BLM think of this board. Let's say every time a Pea says something, a bot makes a 1000 posts. Now imagine those posts are black squares. You come here to look for Pea content not black squares. How much harder do those bot posts make it to find Pea content? So if everyone with a black square is using BLM hashtags, then all the BLM hashtags that are black voices talking about justice and equality are harder to find. That's a lot of scrolling. The request is to use BLM hashtags for BLM content, not BlackOutTuesday content. #2 For most people, perhaps. From my late night reading, as the hashtag started trending, it seems like it originated from the Music Industry. Asking the question, with all of this going on, is it really appropriate for our business, which features many black artists, to be engaging in PR content. Instead, perhaps we should refrain from the typical promotion for this one day, so that people can fill their day with hopefully learning about the history of systemic racism and social inequality, advocacy and elevating voices supporting change. So for corporations who are used to posting about their new product, or entertainers promoting their movies, musicians promoting their albums, and I'd even include the most high-profile influencers promoting themselves, the square represents what normally is here. For one day, just shut up. For normal people, it's more, don't post selfies of yourself at the protest, or really selfies in general. Today we don't need to see you. I think in that case it is a bit silly to post the square. Just don't post.
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Post by pierkiss on Jun 2, 2020 21:34:29 GMT
I can tell you why I changed all of my profile pics on social media to black squares. I have quite a few racist extended family members and old family friends on my social media. I want to make very clear to them that I do not agree with Trump and his shenanigans yesterday with the protesters. . I don’t agree with the way black people are Treated in this country as a whole. And I sure as hell don’t agree with the way that the police and judicial system treat black people in this country. I am in favor of long overdue societal change. I want that line drawn in the sand with these people. I realize that this is an incredibly tiny action that doesn’t amount to a whole lot compared with the actions of people who are out there working for change. But it does send a message that I’m not ok with what’s happening in our country right now. If nothing else they’ll think for even a second “huh. She doesn’t think like us” And I think that’s important.
I don’t have anything to say or share right now that’s more important than what’s being said and done by black people in this country. So all my stuff is dark, and I’m not taking up space with pictures of baby birds in my yard this week. (I have most of these people hidden. But I know that my stuff shows up in their regularly because they always like and comment on it. They will see this.).
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Post by myboysnme on Jun 2, 2020 21:46:22 GMT
My son told me about the black square and I changed my profile photo to a black square. I have posted/shared one story after another and my black square goes right along with my other posts. Sadly, some people on facebook have been increasing their Trump support posts in contrast to the black squares. I have been hiding those posts to keep my feed clear of that.
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Post by *KAS* on Jun 2, 2020 22:04:59 GMT
I know you aren't asking me, but I had it happen (on Facebook, with a high school classmate that is Black) this past weekend. I was 100% trying to be supportive to her after she said that she was so hurt that more people weren't speaking up. So I mentioned what I had done, although that didn't include posting about it on FB (which I've never used for any sort of social justice or political message. It's not like I was ignoring just this. I keep my FB light and fluffy always). She told me what I was doing wasn't enough and really lashed out. Sent me multiple MLK Jr quotes and said something along the lines of 'but thanks for your donations to wherever you gave them' in a passive aggressive way. So I explained where i gave, and why I chose those places to donate to b/c they were places that I thought would have a better impact than me posting on FB, and she said I shouldn't have ever commented to her and just went off and told me to mind my business. I recognize she was hurt but my intent was positive and I apologized for the miscommunication. I've used the time since then to do research and have downloaded some books to read (one of which you quoted), and viewed some online anti-racism resources to try and educate myself using a ton of info I've seen shared socially. But sometimes it just feels like you can't win, so it's better to be silent. You'll be judged either way. Which sucks. Can I ask you a question? Do you think she could have felt hurt that in the semi-public space you share with her, Facebook, you didn’t post anything? What does “keeping it light and fluffy” protect and prioritize? Maybe she felt hurt that you don’t speak out in a way that calls others you know in? She would have to answer that, and now is probably not the time to ask, but I guess it’s about where and how you bring your full self. If she feels like you only private message support and never speak “publicly” on it, that could feel frustrating and unsupportive of her, regardless of your intentions. And, it does suck to be judged, but this is where what DiAngelo calls “building our racial stamina” comes in. The amount of judgement we face for these behaviors pales in comparison to the experiences of people of color in this country, and I try to keep that centered in my mind. Thank you for sharing your example from your life. Keeping it light and fluffy means that I've never posted about social justice, politics or anything like that on FB. I have a lot of work clients on my page. I have FB to keep up with old friends, local news, post in groups I'm in or so that my family can keep up with what I'm doing. It's nice too look back at history and see where I was. I rarely post a 'status' in general. Just not my thing. I already spend enough time online every day, and prefer Instagram. I'm not oblivious - I talk to friends in real life, just haven't ever used social media in that way. She was hurt that more people had not posted publicly. Not me personally, as I haven't seen her in 20+ years. But when she said that, I responded and said that I had donated to important organizations even though I had not spoken out publicly, with a heart. In my head, I felt bad that she perceived that people didn't care, and I didn't want her to feel like that. She replied with 4 quotes from Dr Martin Luther King about being silent. And then a follow-up post that said "but thanks to your donation to whomever" and thanked the other person for SPEAKING OUT LOUD AND NOT MAKING ANONYMOUS DONATIONS. (in all caps) So I explained the places I donated to and why. I didn't want her to think I just threw some money out to check a box. That would be a gross thing to do. This was her response: Let's be clear, the fact that you came on THIS post to speak directly to me and make it known that you gave your money to <redacted> further fuels the flame of "privilege" ; using your money just to tout and feel good about yourself. But if it means so much and you care so much, why be ANONYMOUS? Why weren't you loud and proud before I posted how I felt!! As loud as your silence was and as loud as the blatant disregard for BLACK LIVES!! As you said, you were "trying " to be supportive. Please, don't do US any favors!! I'm BLACK EVERYDAY!! I HAVE A BLACK SON, HUSBAND, FATHER, BROTHER, NEPHEWS, COUSINS, AND FRIENDS WHOM I FEAR FOR AND PRAY FOR EVERY MINUTE OF EVERDAY!! There was more after that, but that's when I checked out of the conversation. There was nothing I was going to say that was going to be right in that situation. I've lost a big chunk of my income this year due to COVID, and it would have been easier to just post on Facebook if I was trying to 'check a box.' I thought it was important to give to people that can help more than I can by posting on my semi-private social media pages. And a lot of the resources under "what can a white person do" has 'donate' being one of the things to do. Like I said, sometimes it feels like everything is wrong. At any rate, I'll do my best to learn and do better.
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Post by oliquig on Jun 2, 2020 22:43:33 GMT
I decided to post a link to @victoriamariescraps instagram and check out her social justice story. Lots of great information on being agents of change beyond social media.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Nov 23, 2024 16:12:16 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2020 22:54:33 GMT
I think some have misinterpreted what the black square meant today. It morphed from a campaign started by two black music-industry veterans, Jamila Thomas, senior director of marketing at Atlantic Records, and Brianna Agyemang, senior artist campaign manager at Apple-owned music talent development firm Platoon. (Agyemang also used to work at Atlantic Records.) “Your black executives, artists, managers, staff, colleagues are drained, traumatized, hurt, scared, and angry,” Thomas wrote on Instagram. “I don’t want to sit on your Zoom calls talking about the black artists who are making you so much money, if you fail to address what’s happening to black people right now.” Together, they started a campaign called #THESHOWMUSTBEPAUSED, asking their colleagues in the music and entertainment space to “pause” work on Tuesday, June 2, in solidarity with the Black community.
Instead of using this movement to reflect on how Black artists fuel culture and sharing resources support ongoing solidarity protests around the country, #THESHOWMUSTBEPAUSED has been co-opted by well-intentioned Instagrammers clogging up the #BlackLivesMatter feed. If you search the hashtag on the app, you’ll find almost nothing but black square posts. A number of black artists, including Kehlani and Little Nas X, have pointed out how this is ultimately an ineffective way to help, given that Instagram is a vital tool for organizing. A great example is the @justiceforgeorgenyc account, a centralized hub for information on daily protests in New York City. A flood of black squares wastes useful digital space that could be devoted to the real cause. LINK
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Post by elaine on Jun 2, 2020 22:58:36 GMT
Any explanation that I give about how I am feeling will he met with negativity so there really isn’t a point. I’ve already been told several times that my feedback is not important. And no, that is not me being a victim. It is a fact of how people have been acting. People try to share their POV and they are torn apart and told they are wrong. People ask questions or say they want to learn and are treated like they are idiots for not knowing in the first place. People are constantly posting things (whether their own opinion or an article or the title of a post) that are said in an aggressive tone, whether that is coming from a black person or a white person that thinks he or she is so much more enlightened than everyone else. It is true that looking at our own biases and history is uncomfortable. That is hard enough as it is, why would anyone do it if they are met with aggression and resistance along the way?a little kindness goes a long way. From the thread on the black square, you were answered in the most passive way someone can, with question marks after the answer. You perceived that as aggressive and mocking. Could it be worthwhile to consider if you are misinterpreting answers as more aggressive than they are meant? Or asking why it makes you feel defensive? As to why anyone should bother - we should bother because black people deserve to be safe, even if the process is painful for me. And because as a white person, the literal least I owe is to listen and try to understand and learn, even if what I hear hurts my feelings. As a woman married to a black man and as the mother of four black young men, I think that Kristin probably understands better than you do why black people deserve to be safe. The assumptions and condescension on this thread towards Kristin makes me wonder why she even bothers. Maybe you should step back and consider why you throw accusations at someone whose life story you know nothing about?
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Post by pattyraindrops on Jun 3, 2020 0:50:22 GMT
Also, if it feels performative for you to do it, you should not do it. If you never show any support ever and then post a black square, you're disingenuous. Do your reading instead. Because you don't want to wind up like this: I mean, come on. It does feel performative for ME to do it. Not because I don't ever show support, but because I never share support for anyone in this way - frames, colors, challenges etc. All those social media things that many people do for a day or week. Not saying they are bad to do - it's just never been something I do. I did have a huge debate with myself about what I would or would not be posting on social media. I finally decided to support in a way that was genuine for me.
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milocat
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,615
Location: 55 degrees north in Alberta, Canada
Mar 18, 2015 4:10:31 GMT
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Post by milocat on Jun 3, 2020 2:41:43 GMT
I think some have misinterpreted what the black square meant today. It morphed from a campaign started by two black music-industry veterans, Jamila Thomas, senior director of marketing at Atlantic Records, and Brianna Agyemang, senior artist campaign manager at Apple-owned music talent development firm Platoon. (Agyemang also used to work at Atlantic Records.) “Your black executives, artists, managers, staff, colleagues are drained, traumatized, hurt, scared, and angry,” Thomas wrote on Instagram. “I don’t want to sit on your Zoom calls talking about the black artists who are making you so much money, if you fail to address what’s happening to black people right now.” Together, they started a campaign called #THESHOWMUSTBEPAUSED, asking their colleagues in the music and entertainment space to “pause” work on Tuesday, June 2, in solidarity with the Black community.
Instead of using this movement to reflect on how Black artists fuel culture and sharing resources support ongoing solidarity protests around the country, #THESHOWMUSTBEPAUSED has been co-opted by well-intentioned Instagrammers clogging up the #BlackLivesMatter feed. If you search the hashtag on the app, you’ll find almost nothing but black square posts. A number of black artists, including Kehlani and Little Nas X, have pointed out how this is ultimately an ineffective way to help, given that Instagram is a vital tool for organizing. A great example is the @justiceforgeorgenyc account, a centralized hub for information on daily protests in New York City. A flood of black squares wastes useful digital space that could be devoted to the real cause. LINK I've seen many references to the show must be paused with blackout Tuesday and also criticisms of both. Criticisms from the black community saying now is not the time for pause or silence, share, show awareness. My feed today has been all muted, taking a break for the week, or blackout Tuesday, which will continue to show all week+ because of Instagram's algorithm. Most of the blackout Tuesday posts just have that hashtag or nothing, why not link an advocate's post or a quote or something. I don't see the point of a sea of silence when you're trying to raise awareness.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Nov 23, 2024 16:12:16 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2020 8:17:30 GMT
I think some have misinterpreted what the black square meant today. It morphed from a campaign started by two black music-industry veterans, Jamila Thomas, senior director of marketing at Atlantic Records, and Brianna Agyemang, senior artist campaign manager at Apple-owned music talent development firm Platoon. (Agyemang also used to work at Atlantic Records.) “Your black executives, artists, managers, staff, colleagues are drained, traumatized, hurt, scared, and angry,” Thomas wrote on Instagram. “I don’t want to sit on your Zoom calls talking about the black artists who are making you so much money, if you fail to address what’s happening to black people right now.” Together, they started a campaign called #THESHOWMUSTBEPAUSED, asking their colleagues in the music and entertainment space to “pause” work on Tuesday, June 2, in solidarity with the Black community.
Instead of using this movement to reflect on how Black artists fuel culture and sharing resources support ongoing solidarity protests around the country, #THESHOWMUSTBEPAUSED has been co-opted by well-intentioned Instagrammers clogging up the #BlackLivesMatter feed. If you search the hashtag on the app, you’ll find almost nothing but black square posts. A number of black artists, including Kehlani and Little Nas X, have pointed out how this is ultimately an ineffective way to help, given that Instagram is a vital tool for organizing. A great example is the @justiceforgeorgenyc account, a centralized hub for information on daily protests in New York City. A flood of black squares wastes useful digital space that could be devoted to the real cause. LINK I've seen many references to the show must be paused with blackout Tuesday and also criticisms of both. Criticisms from the black community saying now is not the time for pause or silence, share, show awareness. My feed today has been all muted, taking a break for the week, or blackout Tuesday, which will continue to show all week+ because of Instagram's algorithm. Most of the blackout Tuesday posts just have that hashtag or nothing, why not link an advocate's post or a quote or something. I don't see the point of a sea of silence when you're trying to raise awareness. I think it does show awareness though, in particular how much we all benefit/enjoy what the black community and other ethnic minorities is contributing to our lives, through music and theatre/entertainment which is the reason for calling it #theshowmustbepaused". Most of the black images I've seen personally that have been shared here are from the music industry and places like performing arts colleges and theatres. They don't have the hashtag of blacklivesmatter but the #the show must be stopped. Our lives are so more enriched with the contribution they make and yet we're reluctant to speak out, when everyday we see the injustice they face. ( we is used in general terms). So having a global blackout for one day bring it to our attention of how much we are missing. I was never meant to "educate" us and that is why it's wrong to #blacklivesmatter It's a separate message. One is to bring it to our attention of how much they contribute, a contribution we take for granted and would miss if that contribution wasn't available and the other is to educate and show your support for the injustice. We shouldn't enjoy one and ignore the other.
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schizo319
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,030
Jun 28, 2014 0:26:58 GMT
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Post by schizo319 on Jun 3, 2020 11:59:58 GMT
You're going to listen to what Black voices are saying - shut up and let THEM have their voice without spouting your own opinions - for a DAY. If we all are all only posting black boxes, it's not like blogs, websites, podcasts, op-eds, books, etc. are going to magically disappear.
I haven't posted about any of this on social media because that isn't typically how I use my page, there are no words to accurately describe how devastating it is, and in this fight nobody needs to hear what my privileged white ass has to say about it. I changed my profile picture to a black box with the hashtag #shutupandlisten (before I even knew about "black out Tuesday") because I want to show I am listening and I care - it will stay that way until the other 3 officers who stood by and did nothing while they watched George Floyd die are arrested.
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