Just T
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,527 
|
Post by Just T on Jul 9, 2020 17:09:09 GMT
I have never started a poll, so I hope I did it correctly!
I have thought about this so many times over the past few years, but I think it should be required for any presidential candidate to release their financial records/tax returns before they can even be considered a candidate. I think it is important to know if they have any bad debts or shady dealings as IMO, a president should be a top-notch person with no skeletons in their closet.
I have also wondered why Trump is so adamantly opposed to releasing his. It makes me feel like he is hiding something that may change people's opinion of him, and he doesn't want that to happen. So, I would love to have a discussion about this. I would love to hear from people who think he, or any other president/candidate should not have to disclose their financial records (no matter what your political leaning is). I realize I do not know everything, and maybe I am missing something.
|
|
|
|
Post by Darcy Collins on Jul 9, 2020 19:04:32 GMT
So I think we have to start with the understanding that all candidates ARE required to disclose a lot of their financial information. Sources of income, assets, debts etc. This is a link to the disclosures that are required (this is the 88 pages that Trump disclosed last year): oge.app.box.com/s/e32qrrfvyxk9cgrvteo7diicwd11pac4 As an aside he's stalling on the latest. Now these disclosures will tell you a lot about debts and dealings. Probably more than an actual tax return as you're getting a real snap shot on who they actually owe money to and where their income is coming from. One issue that was very, very clear with Mitt Romney's tax release is that there are a LOT of people who haven't the faintest clue about taxes and way too many of them felt compelled to issue an opinion or write an article full of utter and complete bullshit. I have absolutely no doubt that there are some things buried in Trump's taxes that are probably legal but would look bad. I also think that there would be a ton of articles that would skew something completely legitimate, but misunderstood. I am an information hound, so more disclosure is good for me - but I understand the trepidation of those who know that by the very nature of the complexity of finance and taxes coupled with an extremely high level of ignorance in both the general population and frankly journalists or pseudo journalists - as well as the tendency to reduce everything to a soundbite or tweet - it may actually cause more confusion than illumination. |
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
Apr 19, 2024 4:54:10 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2020 19:42:18 GMT
"What this financial disclosure doesn't show us -- in any sort of detail -- is a) how much, specifically, Trump made (and from where) and b) how much his businesses owe -- and to whom. The range on the financial disclosure report makes that sort of specificity laughable. Trump is only required to report income in broad categories like $1 million to $5 million or over $5 million. That broadness makes any sort of attempted forensic analysis pointless. Which brings me to Trump's regular contention that financial disclosure forms are far more insightful into his financial standing than his tax returns would be. (Trump is the only post-Watergate president to refuse to release any of his past tax returns.) Here's how Trump put it in a press conference he held the day after the 2018 midterm elections: "People don't understand tax returns. Now, I did do a (financial disclosure) filing of over a hundred pages, I believe, which is in the offices. And when people went and saw that filing and they saw the magnitude of it, they were very disappointed. And they saw the — you know, the detail. You get far more from that. And I guess we filed that, now, three times. But you get far more from that than you could ever get from a tax return." You don't. Period. No tax professional or financial expert would say that. According to Forbes' Chase Peterson-Withorn -- citing federal ethics laws: " Trump must disclose the companies he owns, but not how much they're truly worth or exactly how much money he's making from these businesses. He doesn't have to say who any of his business partners are or disclose any of the debts held by his businesses."With a normal president, that might not be all that big a deal. After all, most presidents prior to Trump have not had the sort of massive global company that he sat atop prior to being elected. Past presidents also revealed at least some of their past tax returns. And generally speaking, they put their businesses in a blind trust -- meaning that their investments, gains and losses were managed by a neutral third party -- with zero input of influence from the president." www.cnn.com/2019/05/16/politics/donald-trump-financial-disclosure-tax-returns/index.html |
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
Apr 19, 2024 4:54:10 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2020 19:43:54 GMT
"3. A full picture of Trump’s debt. Federal disclosure rules require Trump to list debt he personally owes—but not debt his companies owe. Trump, however, has elected to disclose some of his corporate liabilities, providing a partial picture of his debts. The president disclosed at least $311 million in debt across 16 loans from 9 creditors, including Merrill Lynch and Germany-based Deutsche Bank—but there’s more to it than that. 5. What Trump and his companies pay (or don’t pay) in taxes. The document, which is intended to outline potential conflicts of interest, does not touch on the subject of taxes at all. Trump is not required to disclose what he or his companies pay in local, state or federal taxes. For that, we’d need to see the president’s tax returns, which he has refused to disclose." www.forbes.com/sites/chasewithorn/2018/05/16/heres-what-trumps-financial-disclosure-doesnt-tell-you/ |
|
|
|
Post by revirdsuba99 on Jul 9, 2020 19:52:15 GMT
When he wants to borrow money from a bank he inflates the value of said building.
When he has to pay taxes on the same building he devalues the worth of said building, which can amount to millions!
|
|
keithurbanlovinpea
Pearl Clutcher
Flowing with the go...
Posts: 4,253
|
Post by keithurbanlovinpea on Jul 9, 2020 20:08:50 GMT
I do think disclosure is good; however, no matter how legal someone's tax returns are, they will be picked apart to no end with regard to "advantages" that were taken.
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
Apr 19, 2024 4:54:10 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2020 5:35:15 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by lisae on Jul 10, 2020 11:21:09 GMT
Of course he is hiding something, probably a lot. He probably isn't worth nearly as much as he claims - shocking, I know. He's disputed Forbes estimate of his net worth for at least a couple of decades now. Tax returns won't tell net worth but you can work backward from investment and other income to get an idea.
He may be receiving income from connections he has made in office. He's claimed to do no business in Russia but if he has income from business there, he would be caught in yet another lie. He's probably walking so close to the line on various deductions that most people would feel like it was criminal.
He might not even be paying any taxes if he can find enough ways around it. I'm not saying he is doing things that are strictly illegal. He does get audited but his base would not be pleased to learn that they pay an effective tax rate of say 20% or so and he pays next to nothing.
|
|
|
|
Post by Really Red on Jul 10, 2020 13:11:42 GMT
Let's face it. There is no good, decent, ethical, moral or happy way to spin why he doesn't want to release the financial records- that he said he would. So that leaves us with only bad reasons. I have my theory, but if course it is only a theory for now. I'd love to hear your theory. I think all candidates should absolutely have to show their returns. I want to know (in particular) about his debts. If we have a president who is indebted to someone, wouldn't that influence what he does? I'd want to know if he had monetary dealings that might be considered - ahem - sneaky. I think that would influence what he does. We see that we have a president who cozies up to dictators and has outright praised Putin, Xi and Kim. This same leader has not denounced Russia paying Afghani rebels to kill Americans. Why? What does Putin have on Trump? Would those returns help us figure it out? We need to make sure our leaders are as ethical and as moral as possible. I really want to understand why someone thinks they should not show their returns. Don't you worry that a leader may be unethical in his dealings then? Clearly, you can't immediately stop them from being unethical, but you could see the reasoning behind it and then hopefully they would be stopped. |
|
