dexter
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Posts: 233
Nov 28, 2016 15:57:15 GMT
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Post by dexter on Jun 15, 2021 4:10:46 GMT
Exh and I have been split since 2010. He remarried 3 months after our divorce. His new wife has been very active in being a bully when it has come to any payment due to me. He is ordered to pay a portion of the insurance and medical bills. All the accounts are in my name since I am the primary parent. Any time I submitted a bill to him for payment, she found a reason to not accept it. If I scanned or copied the bill she accused me of editing it. It got to be so burdensome. When payments were made she would mail a check to me and include handwritten notes of why “they” were only paying c amount instead of their full portion. I didn’t let them know prior, they felt it was unnecessary, etc. After a particularly nasty email in 2017 I simply stopped submitting bills and paid them myself. It wasn’t worth the toxicity. When my dad had her wisdom teeth removed he paid his portion of the deposit due on the day of the procedure and when the bill arrived after I called him and let him know the amount. Since he felt I insurance should’ve paid more he said they weren’t paying. I paid the bill. DS recently had his wisdom teeth removed. I let him know prior that I would be paying my portion of the deposit. I then put his information on the paperwork and he has gotten the bill and has demanded my portion. I simply said, I paid for the balance of DDs procedure.
Am I wrong? There is so much more information but I tried to keep it brief.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Apr 25, 2024 4:25:04 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2021 4:25:52 GMT
Nope. It’s court ordered. If he wants to make issue, let him take you back to court where he can be ordered to pay the difference in what he still owes you.
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Post by elaine on Jun 15, 2021 4:30:04 GMT
Since the bills are in your name, what is going to happen to your credit when he doesn’t pay and it is turned over to a debt collector?
You should have gotten a lawyer involved years ago, instead of setting the precedent that you would simply pay. Now is the time, unless you want to pay the full bill, to get a lawyer involved. It may be that he/she can help you get back payment for his share of past medical bills too.
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Post by elaine on Jun 15, 2021 4:30:42 GMT
Nope. It’s court ordered. If he wants to make issue, let him take you back to court where he can be ordered to pay the difference in what he still owes you. The bills are in her name. If he doesn’t pay, nor does she, it screws up her credit record.
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dexter
Full Member
Posts: 233
Nov 28, 2016 15:57:15 GMT
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Post by dexter on Jun 15, 2021 4:31:56 GMT
Nope. It’s court ordered. If he wants to make issue, let him take you back to court where he can be ordered to pay the difference in what he still owes you. Im worried that if he does take me to court for contempt they will say I never presented the bills and that’s why they weren’t paid. Which is true, but my reasons for doing so might not be legally valid although they were emotionally required for my sanity. He is also asking for money for reimbursement for a school trip that was cancelled. The trip was over $3k. I paid for almost all of it, and worked concessions, etc to assist. He gave me cash totally get maybe $400. He is now saying he paid every month half of it. I lost $800 when we cancelled. He has zero proof of payment!
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dexter
Full Member
Posts: 233
Nov 28, 2016 15:57:15 GMT
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Post by dexter on Jun 15, 2021 4:33:40 GMT
Since the bills are in your name, what is going to happen to your credit when he doesn’t pay and it is turned over to a debt collector? You should have gotten a lawyer involved years ago, instead of setting the precedent that you would simply pay. Now is the time, unless you want to pay the full bill, to get a lawyer involved. It may be that he/she can help you get back payment for his share of past medical bills too. This bill is in his name. I have paid ALL the bills over the years in my name. I should have gotten a lawyer but for my sanity it was far easier to just pay my copays and I figured in the long run it was cheaper than a lawyer.
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Post by elaine on Jun 15, 2021 4:38:23 GMT
Since the bills are in your name, what is going to happen to your credit when he doesn’t pay and it is turned over to a debt collector? You should have gotten a lawyer involved years ago, instead of setting the precedent that you would simply pay. Now is the time, unless you want to pay the full bill, to get a lawyer involved. It may be that he/she can help you get back payment for his share of past medical bills too. This bill is in his name. I have paid ALL the bills over the years in my name. I should have gotten a lawyer but for my sanity it was far easier to just pay my copays and I figured in the long run it was cheaper than a lawyer. Okay. Since you said all the accounts were in your name in the OP, I assumed this one too. I guess don’t pay it then. Having a lawyer can be great for your peace or mind - you never need to communicate with the ex or his wife about finances again. All communication regarding bills, expenses, etc., goes through the lawyer. It may be a little more expensive- although I’m not convinced of that at this point - but would be much less psychologically toxic.
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dexter
Full Member
Posts: 233
Nov 28, 2016 15:57:15 GMT
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Post by dexter on Jun 15, 2021 4:44:18 GMT
This bill is in his name. I have paid ALL the bills over the years in my name. I should have gotten a lawyer but for my sanity it was far easier to just pay my copays and I figured in the long run it was cheaper than a lawyer. Okay. Since you said all the accounts were in your name in the OP, I assumed this one too. I guess don’t pay it then. Having a lawyer can be great for your peace or mind - you never need to communicate with the ex or his wife about finances again. All communication regarding bills, expenses, etc., goes through the lawyer. It may be a little more expensive- although I’m not convinced of that at this point - but would be much less psychologically toxic. You are probably correct. I can’t imagine taking a $20 copay bill to a lawyer to get reimbursed 58%. Every month? I feel (felt) that taking the high road was just more soothing in my mind lol. When I filled out the paperwork for this procedure I simply put his name and address as the responsible party since my son moved there in the last 3 months before he turned 18. My ex has had no problem filling out paperwork with my information so I figured why not.
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Post by elaine on Jun 15, 2021 4:59:41 GMT
Okay. Since you said all the accounts were in your name in the OP, I assumed this one too. I guess don’t pay it then. Having a lawyer can be great for your peace or mind - you never need to communicate with the ex or his wife about finances again. All communication regarding bills, expenses, etc., goes through the lawyer. It may be a little more expensive- although I’m not convinced of that at this point - but would be much less psychologically toxic. You are probably correct. I can’t imagine taking a $20 copay bill to a lawyer to get reimbursed 58%. Every month? I feel (felt) that taking the high road was just more soothing in my mind lol. When I filled out the paperwork for this procedure I simply put his name and address as the responsible party since my son moved there in the last 3 months before he turned 18. My ex has had no problem filling out paperwork with my information so I figured why not. If the total cost you have been eating is $11.60 per month, then you’re right, it probably isn’t worth getting a lawyer involved. It sounded like it was substantially more than that. 🤷♀️ I misunderstood. If, going forward, you decide to go the legal route - you simply set up the arrangement, and then mail or fax the bills to the lawyer’s office. You don’t need an appointment each time, and one of the paralegals will do most of the work, with the lawyer getting more hands-on if the ex refuses to pay.
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dexter
Full Member
Posts: 233
Nov 28, 2016 15:57:15 GMT
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Post by dexter on Jun 15, 2021 5:03:10 GMT
You are probably correct. I can’t imagine taking a $20 copay bill to a lawyer to get reimbursed 58%. Every month? I feel (felt) that taking the high road was just more soothing in my mind lol. When I filled out the paperwork for this procedure I simply put his name and address as the responsible party since my son moved there in the last 3 months before he turned 18. My ex has had no problem filling out paperwork with my information so I figured why not. If the total cost you have been eating is $11.60 per month, then you’re right, it probably isn’t worth getting a lawyer involved. It sounded like it was substantially more than that. 🤷♀️ I misunderstood. If, going forward, you decide to go the legal route - you simply set up the arrangement, and then mail or fax the bills to the lawyer’s office. You don’t need an appointment each time, and one of the paralegals will do most of the work, with the lawyer getting more hands-on if the ex refuses to pay. Good information. I still have 5 more years of this with my youngest. There are definitely times it is more than that amount, I’m just figuring the known every month. But there have been many drs visits, meds, an occasional X-ray, etc. My son does have an office visit every other month and meds every month. Maybe I will call a lawyer to see how to arrange it. I can’t/won’t use my divorce lawyer!
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Apr 25, 2024 4:25:04 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2021 5:04:12 GMT
Nope. It’s court ordered. If he wants to make issue, let him take you back to court where he can be ordered to pay the difference in what he still owes you. The bills are in her name. If he doesn’t pay, nor does she, it screws up her credit record. She said she put the bill in his name.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Apr 25, 2024 4:25:04 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2021 5:05:59 GMT
Nope. It’s court ordered. If he wants to make issue, let him take you back to court where he can be ordered to pay the difference in what he still owes you. Im worried that if he does take me to court for contempt they will say I never presented the bills and that’s why they weren’t paid. Which is true, but my reasons for doing so might not be legally valid although they were emotionally required for my sanity. He is also asking for money for reimbursement for a school trip that was cancelled. The trip was over $3k. I paid for almost all of it, and worked concessions, etc to assist. He gave me cash totally get maybe $400. He is now saying he paid every month half of it. I lost $800 when we cancelled. He has zero proof of payment! Is there a condition that you give him advanced notice or present the bills or whatever? If he’s that tight with his money, I doubt he’ll spend the money on an attorney. Tell him it’s going to be this way with you putting his names on the bills until he plays fairly.
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Post by elaine on Jun 15, 2021 5:06:45 GMT
If the total cost you have been eating is $11.60 per month, then you’re right, it probably isn’t worth getting a lawyer involved. It sounded like it was substantially more than that. 🤷♀️ I misunderstood. If, going forward, you decide to go the legal route - you simply set up the arrangement, and then mail or fax the bills to the lawyer’s office. You don’t need an appointment each time, and one of the paralegals will do most of the work, with the lawyer getting more hands-on if the ex refuses to pay. Good information. I still have 5 more years of this with my youngest. There are definitely times it is more than that amount, I’m just figuring the known every month. But there have been many drs visits, meds, an occasional X-ray, etc. My son does have an office visit every other month and meds every month. Maybe I will call a lawyer to see how to arrange it. I can’t/won’t use my divorce lawyer! I wish you the best. It sounds so unpleasant for you and unrelenting. You deserve better.
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dexter
Full Member
Posts: 233
Nov 28, 2016 15:57:15 GMT
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Post by dexter on Jun 15, 2021 5:19:30 GMT
Im worried that if he does take me to court for contempt they will say I never presented the bills and that’s why they weren’t paid. Which is true, but my reasons for doing so might not be legally valid although they were emotionally required for my sanity. He is also asking for money for reimbursement for a school trip that was cancelled. The trip was over $3k. I paid for almost all of it, and worked concessions, etc to assist. He gave me cash totally get maybe $400. He is now saying he paid every month half of it. I lost $800 when we cancelled. He has zero proof of payment! Is there a condition that you give him advanced notice or present the bills or whatever? If he’s that tight with his money, I doubt he’ll spend the money on an attorney. Tell him it’s going to be this way with you putting his names on the bills until he plays fairly. There is nothing in the decree that indicates how bills are to be presented. Simply that it is a 58/42% split in medical costs. For now I am simply going to ignore his email! But just getting the email this evening has me upset and sick to my stomach. I hate confrontation and I try to just stick my chin up and take the high road, but I also am tired of the emotional drain.
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Deleted
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Apr 25, 2024 4:25:04 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2021 5:20:06 GMT
Can you give a copy of the court order to the providers and have them just bill you each separately?
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dexter
Full Member
Posts: 233
Nov 28, 2016 15:57:15 GMT
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Post by dexter on Jun 15, 2021 5:21:12 GMT
[/quote]I wish you the best. It sounds so unpleasant for you and unrelenting. You deserve better. [/quote]
Thank you. I really just needed to vent and hear this tonight.
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dexter
Full Member
Posts: 233
Nov 28, 2016 15:57:15 GMT
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Post by dexter on Jun 15, 2021 5:22:38 GMT
Can you give a copy of the court order to the providers and have them just bill you each separately? I tried that. Both my medical doctor and dentist office said they were unable to split the billing in their system. I am slightly worried that’s what he will do- go to the oral surgeons office with the order to have them bill me.
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Post by mikklynn on Jun 15, 2021 11:06:14 GMT
I'm so sorry they are treating you so badly. I can't imagine the level of stress having to deal with this crap is causing you. GIANT hugs.
If the bill is in his name, I'd ignore him.
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peaname
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,389
Aug 16, 2014 23:15:53 GMT
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Post by peaname on Jun 15, 2021 11:20:50 GMT
Her bullying behavior has worked!
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Deleted
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Apr 25, 2024 4:25:04 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2021 11:28:35 GMT
Court ordered is court ordered. I wouldn’t play these games with money.
My ex tried to cheat me out of money…telling me his interpretation of something vs. what was clear in the decree. I told him it was black and white. I told him I didn’t want to get an attorney. He dared me to. So I did. As the language was more than clear, he ended up paying what he tried to cheat me out of in addition to my attorney fees. It was a lot of money but more than that I knew if I started allowing him his loose interpretation, that would’ve been just the beginning.
I think you should get an attorney involved.
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Post by jenb72 on Jun 15, 2021 11:29:50 GMT
For reference sake, I live in GA. I went through this with my ex and his new wife.
First of all, she has nothing to do with it. It's between you and your ex. (I know, easier said than done, but that's the fact of it.) My ex tried to let his wife handle all of it using the excuse that "she pays the bills" and I refused to deal with her because she's also a bully and it doesn't concern her, even if they're married. It's his responsibility. I wouldn't take her calls. I wouldn't respond to her emails (although I saved all of her emails and voicemails as evidence). I simply emailed him so I had my request in writing.
If you don't insist on payment, and on FULL payment, then the bully wins. If she tries to short-pay and sends you some BS letter about why they're only paying X amount, just save it for reference later and request the rest of the payment from your ex.
It didn't stop with my ex until I went to the courthouse and had a contempt order taken out against him for non-payment of court-ordered expenses that he was responsible for. As soon as I got the court involved, all of a sudden he was willing to talk and even willing to make the payments. (Because if he refuses, they could garnish it from his pay. His employer received a notice about it and that's what got him talking to me himself.) He was rude and upset about "being called out" in the court, but it got the job done.
ETA (after reading some of the rest of the thread): no more cash payments for anything. Insist on checks so there's a record. Honestly, I can't understand why he's paying you in cash anyway, since a check actually protects him more. If he has no proof of payment, he's the one that woudl be boned by it.
Jen
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Post by artgirl1 on Jun 15, 2021 11:41:42 GMT
Are you referring to medical bills for your children? If so, there should be a QMCSO (Qualified Medical Child Support Order)included in divorce papers. And are payments ordered to be enforced by a Friend of the Court or other agency? If this is ordered through an agency then they can enforce the order. Pull your records and documentation together and submit to them for enforcement and collection for reimbursement to you.
You indicate there is already a split as to what he pays. If so, then you are able to submit the bills to the agency enforcing, and they will notify him what he owes. If he has child support paid through the agency, they will add the medical bills to what he owes, and if necessary increase his Income Withholding Order to cover reimbursement. I would recommend doing this on a quarterly basis.
Each state had a different set up for enforcement of orders in a Divorce regarding minor children. In Michigan (where I am) enforcement is handled through a Friend of the Court. In NY (where my DD is), she must petition the Court for enforcement, but is can be done pro per (by herself, without an attorney). Verbal agreements cannot be enforced by a Court.
If you have the QMCSO included in your Judgement, then send a copy to the medical provider, with documentation of your portion of the payment, and see if they will bill him directly.
The QMSCO's were implemented in the early 2000, as a federally mandated requirement. I worked on the team for my local FOC in implementing this program across the State of Michigan. But I have been retired for 15 years, so things may have changed, but as this was a federal requirement for any minor child, I cannot see that it has changed too much.
You need to review your Court order, and if necessary, talk to your local agency. And you are essentially advocating for your minor children, and you have to pursue this. Maybe look at their (the ex and current spouse) behavior not so much as bullying you, but neglecting your children. And, as I have said repeatedly in the past to others, SHE has no input, responsibility or say so in this matter. She is nobody when it comes to your minor children. Tell the Ex to man up, and that you will only address him regarding this, and any other matters regarding your minor children.
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Deleted
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Apr 25, 2024 4:25:04 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2021 11:52:23 GMT
Keep in mind each state may (and probably does) do it differently. I was divorced in 2016 in GA and there was no separate medical order. It was included within the document.
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Post by refupea on Jun 15, 2021 12:12:39 GMT
I do not have experience with this, but stop paying now!!!
You have received some wonderful advice. If the decree states a 58/42% split, then that is what it is. Why pay more?
I understand the frustration, but I am sorry and don't intend to upset you, you have set a precedence. Stop now.
jenb72 and artgirl1 gave you some wonderful advice. Please take it.
I wish you my absolute best!!
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Post by jenb72 on Jun 15, 2021 12:34:33 GMT
Keep in mind each state may (and probably does) do it differently. I was divorced in 2016 in GA and there was no separate medical order. It was included within the document. Same for me - our divorce was in 2010. Jen
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Post by SallyPA on Jun 15, 2021 13:35:22 GMT
Just popping on to say my situation has been almost identical. I have found that while it’s fairly easy to WRITE a divorce decree outlining how bills will be shared, it is far more difficult to actually ENFORCE it. And by difficult I mean, lots of time and money and stress.
Providers just want their money; they do not and most will not want to get involved in a split bill arrangement. So I end up paying and then have my attorney write a letter when I get overdue bills from offices.
Anyways, good luck and just wanted to let you know you are not alone.
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lizacreates
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,856
Aug 29, 2015 2:39:19 GMT
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Post by lizacreates on Jun 15, 2021 13:46:21 GMT
Is there a condition that you give him advanced notice or present the bills or whatever? If he’s that tight with his money, I doubt he’ll spend the money on an attorney. Tell him it’s going to be this way with you putting his names on the bills until he plays fairly. There is nothing in the decree that indicates how bills are to be presented. Simply that it is a 58/42% split in medical costs. For now I am simply going to ignore his email! But just getting the email this evening has me upset and sick to my stomach. I hate confrontation and I try to just stick my chin up and take the high road, but I also am tired of the emotional drain. Maybe that’s part of the reason your ex does what he does. I know it’s difficult for people who abhor confrontations to be assertive, but unless you stand your ground and insist he pay up when he should, then he’ll just continue treating you like a pushover. The high road is fine unless you're being mowed down repeatedly. Email him with every bill for which he’s supposed to pay his portion, no matter how small. Don't communicate with his wife. Keep scrupulous records of everything--bills, payments, emails, letters, etc. If he continues to refuse to pay, tell him you’re fed up with the BS and you’ll just take him to court and he can settle it there, either through a motion to enforce the child support order or small claims court. (I don’t understand these non-custodial parents who nickel and dime their own children when it would cost them a hell of a lot more in expenses if they had custody.) I wouldn't say any of these things if it wasn't for the fact that you still have five years to go. So I recommend you assert yourself more forcefully on behalf of your children post haste.
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Post by littlemama on Jun 15, 2021 13:47:49 GMT
Accumulate all of the bills you have paid along with proof of payment and all communications and get thee to a lawyer.
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Post by busy on Jun 15, 2021 13:55:42 GMT
What everyone else has said. Taking the easy way - and paying everything yourself despite the court order - has now made everything the hard way. Get an attorney and stick to the letter of the decree going forward, unless you’re going to give up on him paying his fair share entirely.
Document everything. And quit with being afraid of confrontation. He’s taken advantage of that. Stand up for yourself, or at least for your kids.
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Post by Really Red on Jun 15, 2021 14:00:40 GMT
For reference sake, I live in GA. I went through this with my ex and his new wife. First of all, she has nothing to do with it. It's between you and your ex. (I know, easier said than done, but that's the fact of it.) My ex tried to let his wife handle all of it using the excuse that "she pays the bills" and I refused to deal with her because she's also a bully and it doesn't concern her, even if they're married. It's his responsibility. I wouldn't take her calls. I wouldn't respond to her emails (although I saved all of her emails and voicemails as evidence). I simply emailed him so I had my request in writing. If you don't insist on payment, and on FULL payment, then the bully wins. If she tries to short-pay and sends you some BS letter about why they're only paying X amount, just save it for reference later and request the rest of the payment from your ex. It didn't stop with my ex until I went to the courthouse and had a contempt order taken out against him for non-payment of court-ordered expenses that he was responsible for. As soon as I got the court involved, all of a sudden he was willing to talk and even willing to make the payments. (Because if he refuses, they could garnish it from his pay. His employer received a notice about it and that's what got him talking to me himself.) He was rude and upset about "being called out" in the court, but it got the job done. ETA (after reading some of the rest of the thread): no more cash payments for anything. Insist on checks so there's a record. Honestly, I can't understand why he's paying you in cash anyway, since a check actually protects him more. If he has no proof of payment, he's the one that woudl be boned by it. Jen This is good advice dexterDefinitely do not let the bully win. Do not let him exhaust you. Do all the right things and ONLY deal with your ex, not his wife. It is not her affair. You got this!! We are behind you. Stand up for what is right for you and your kids.
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