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Post by aj2hall on Nov 2, 2021 1:04:25 GMT
It's infuriating to me that 1 or 2 Senators can completely derail and drag out a bill. The progressives compromised for 6 trillion to 1.75 trillion. Manchin won't settle for anything over 1.5 trillion? He successfully removed family leave and free community college because he doesn't like entitlement. He looked out for his own financial interests and those of the oil & gas industry the measure to reward the utility companies that transition to clean energy. Sinema successfully negotiated to have the medicare negotiations with the pharmaceutical companies removed. What more could they possibly want? I also blame the 50 Republican senators for voting no. www.npr.org/2021/11/01/1051152135/sen-manchin-says-hes-not-ready-to-back-bidens-1-75-trillion-budget-package |
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Post by Skellinton on Nov 2, 2021 1:14:12 GMT
Tyranny of the minority. It completely pisses me off.
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Post by ntsf on Nov 2, 2021 1:33:30 GMT
it is horrible.. and it is because of the strength of the republicans to be the party of no and we don't give a f about regular people
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Post by Deleted on Nov 2, 2021 2:18:47 GMT
He’s a f$)$&(ing f($(;56(;er!
And we deserve him because that’s how America votes (and doesn’t)
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Post by elaine on Nov 2, 2021 2:20:19 GMT
I hate Manchin. Not as much as I hate McConnell mind you, but I hate him all the same.
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Post by aj2hall on Nov 2, 2021 4:29:22 GMT
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Nov 2, 2021 5:35:36 GMT
His constituents want the bills passed! Enough said?
He is serving the presidency on a silver platter to former. Let him prove me wrong!!
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Post by onelasttime on Nov 2, 2021 5:50:46 GMT
The victim speaks. He’s right about one thing but wrong who was demanding it. With Manchin it was his way or the highway and nothing was ever going to be good enough.
Election have consequences and the American People are going to pay a heavy price for their apathy and poor choices at the ballot box,
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Post by mollycoddle on Nov 2, 2021 10:10:45 GMT
I hate Manchin. Not as much as I hate McConnell mind you, but I hate him all the same. Agree. |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Nov 2, 2021 11:53:35 GMT
When did he ever work for his constituents?
His warnings come from his oil & gas/energy connections.
He is only concerned with what his family earns.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Nov 2, 2021 12:26:03 GMT
His constituents want the bills passed! Enough said? He is serving the presidency on a silver platter to former. Let him prove me wrong!! I’m having a hard time understanding why two Democrats and all of the republicans blocking legislation that people want would lead to democrats losing in 2022. I keep hearing that on the news but the logic really doesn’t make sense to me. But I guess maybe that is the point. People don’t always think logically when voting? |
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Post by elaine on Nov 2, 2021 12:35:01 GMT
His constituents want the bills passed! Enough said? He is serving the presidency on a silver platter to former. Let him prove me wrong!! I’m having a hard time understanding why two Democrats and all of the republicans blocking legislation that people want would lead to democrats losing in 2022. I keep hearing that on the news but the logic really doesn’t make sense to me. But I guess maybe that is the point. People don’t always think logically when voting? Yes, you are right - people don’t think logically. What they will see is that they and the government are worse off - ignoring that the reason the budget bill didn’t pass was due to Republicans. Ultimately, in the minds of the voters, the blame almost always falls on the President, even when it is Congress that is screwing things up by stonewalling. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 2, 2021 13:14:48 GMT
Yes, you are right - people don’t think logically. What they will see is that they and the government are worse off - ignoring that the reason the budget bill didn’t pass was due to Republicans. Ultimately, in the minds of the voters, the blame almost always falls on the President, even when it is Congress that is screwing things up by stonewalling. Do you ever wonder if people are just too idiotic for democracy to work? I do. A lot lately. Not sure there's a better alternative than democracy, but not sure democracy is possible when 30, 40% or more of the people have little reasoning and information processing skills. |
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Post by mollycoddle on Nov 2, 2021 13:32:38 GMT
I was just arguing with people on Twitter who think that calling Manchin names and saying that he doesn’t get to dictate this bill are productive. I cannot stand that SOB. But yes, they have to deal with him or no bill. It alarms me that so many people don’t seem to understand this. It’s math.
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Post by mom2jnk on Nov 2, 2021 13:48:20 GMT
Yes, you are right - people don’t think logically. What they will see is that they and the government are worse off - ignoring that the reason the budget bill didn’t pass was due to Republicans. Ultimately, in the minds of the voters, the blame almost always falls on the President, even when it is Congress that is screwing things up by stonewalling. Do you ever wonder if people are just too idiotic for democracy to work? I do. A lot lately. Not sure there's a better alternative than democracy, but not sure democracy is possible when 30, 40% or more of the people have little reasoning and information processing skills. I think that a large swath of our population lack critical thinking skills and it is now perfectly okay for media sources to promote outright lies, inflammatory disinformation, and misinformation. This, combined with an obscene amount of dark money flowing into the messaging from media and politics, will keep us from regaining democracy. I honestly don't know what can be done anymore. I fear that the current administration will not be able to turn this around and we will be back in the dark ages of aristocracy in the next few years. |
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Post by mollycoddle on Nov 2, 2021 14:03:14 GMT
Do you ever wonder if people are just too idiotic for democracy to work? I do. A lot lately. Not sure there's a better alternative than democracy, but not sure democracy is possible when 30, 40% or more of the people have little reasoning and information processing skills. I think that a large swath of our population lack critical thinking skills and it is now perfectly okay for media sources to promote outright lies, inflammatory disinformation, and misinformation. This, combined with an obscene amount of dark money flowing into the messaging from media and politics, will keep us from regaining democracy. I honestly don't know what can be done anymore. I fear that the current administration will not be able to turn this around and we will be back in the dark ages of aristocracy in the next few years. 💯%. |
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Post by thundergal on Nov 2, 2021 14:07:59 GMT
Do you ever wonder if people are just too idiotic for democracy to work? I do. A lot lately. Not sure there's a better alternative than democracy, but not sure democracy is possible when 30, 40% or more of the people have little reasoning and information processing skills. I think that a large swath of our population lack critical thinking skills and it is now perfectly okay for media sources to promote outright lies, inflammatory disinformation, and misinformation. This, combined with an obscene amount of dark money flowing into the messaging from media and politics, will keep us from regaining democracy. I honestly don't know what can be done anymore. I fear that the current administration will not be able to turn this around and we will be back in the dark ages of aristocracy in the next few years. I agree with you. My Mom and I regularly check in with each other re: the state of the country and our mental/emotional health as we try to find the balance between being tuned in and being overwhelmed by terrifying and maddening information. I told her the other day that I was starting to prepare myself for the end of our democracy. She was alarmed, but with some explanation, did understand why that's where I'm at right now. In contemplating this kind of future, I'm left feeling sick about the relief I feel, as I have since the Muslim ban in January 2017, that my skin is not brown or black, that I'm not living in poverty, that I'm not in my reproductive years anymore... I'm scared of what the future holds for me personally to some degree, but it's NOTHING compared to what so many groups of people have every right to feel. Also, fuck Manchin and the GOP. (Felt like I should address the OP, and that's all I've got right now.) |
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Nov 2, 2021 14:38:31 GMT
Critical thinking, lack of, falls right in the hands of teaching for the test, not learning the information for life.
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Post by Merge on Nov 2, 2021 15:32:09 GMT
I'm convinced that Manchin and Sinema are GOP moles, paid by the GOP to pretend to be Democrats in the election and then vote with Republican interests.
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Post by Merge on Nov 2, 2021 15:32:49 GMT
Critical thinking, lack of, falls right in the hands of teaching for the test, not learning the information for life. Many of the people lacking critical thinking were in school long before high stakes standardized testing came about. |
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Post by librarylady on Nov 2, 2021 15:42:55 GMT
I think a large part of it is that he is from a small state that is often considered unimportant.
He has lived with that in Congress for years.....and NOW, he can be IMPORTANT! His name is in
most newscasts. He is MAKING NEWS! Others are running to him for his vote. I think he is clinging
to that at any cost, because "ego."
He does not give a damn about others, his party or the nation. Right now it is all about him.
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Post by onelasttime on Nov 2, 2021 16:00:50 GMT
When you talk about some people may lack critical thinking skills you may be on to something.
On Twitter this am..,
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Post by papersilly on Nov 2, 2021 17:38:07 GMT
i'll say this for the Republicans---when they band together, they really band together. they will put their shit aside for to stonewall against something.
right now, there are too many factions in the Democratic party wanting their way and they are not afraid to hold up the process to get it. the GOP must be laughing their asses off that the Dems control the House and Senate but can't get anything done because of 1 or 2 hold outs. the Dems seriously need to get it together.
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Post by lisae on Nov 2, 2021 19:43:38 GMT
i'll say this for the Republicans---when they band together, they really band together. they will put their shit aside for to stonewall against something. right now, there are too many factions in the Democratic party wanting their way and they are not afraid to hold up the process to get it. the GOP must be laughing their asses off that the Dems control the House and Senate but can't get anything done because of 1 or 2 hold outs. the Dems seriously need to get it together. They can band together when all they have to do is ...nothing. When the Republicans had control, they accomplished even less of their agenda. The only major legislation Trump passed pre-pandemic was his tax bill which he struggled to pass until the very end of his 1st year in office. He had a bigger majority in both houses. And he passed a bill that did not pay for itself. So imo, the Democrats have some time to get things together. There are currently 2 major bills with the high possibility that at least the infrastructure bill can pass. What happens in Virginia today will matter, if the Democrat wins, the civil war will drag on. If the Republican wins, Biden has more argument that they need to get something done and change the direction of public sentiment before the mid-terms. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 2, 2021 20:22:57 GMT
They can band together when all they have to do is ...nothing. Gangs of people DESTROYING things can always stick together. Destruction is dead easy. Creation, innovation, improvement - THOSE are hard. |
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twinsmomfla99
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by twinsmomfla99 on Nov 2, 2021 20:45:31 GMT
I was just arguing with people on Twitter who think that calling Manchin names and saying that he doesn’t get to dictate this bill are productive. I cannot stand that SOB. But yes, they have to deal with him or no bill. It alarms me that so many people don’t seem to understand this. It’s math. I have no love for Manchin as a representative of my state. But I can guarantee you, he is better than any alternative that might come out of WV.
WV voted Democrat for many years, but it was NEVER a blue state culturally. Ever. Democrats ruled in this state because of the unions. The Republicans were the party of union-busters and the Democrats were pro-union. That was enough to elect a pretty solid Democrat majority in the state government, with a few Republican governors here and there. We had two Democrats in the U.S. Senate for many years. Shelly Moore Capito was the first Republican senator elected in WV since 1958.
But do not doubt that WV residents align more with Republicans than Democrats when it comes to values. Fundamentalist/evangelical churches are strong across a large part of the state, and as many of our younger people have left the state for better economic opportunities, those values are even more prevalent among our aging population.
For now, you do see some polls suggesting that West Virginians support BBB. But I can guarantee you that supporting it will be used against Manchin in 2024. The hatred for "the Squad," Nancy Pelosi, and Joe Biden is ridiculous. I was at our game against Iowa State this weekend, and the number of anti-Biden shirts, flags, bumper stickers, etc. was excessive. "Biden sucks, but Kamala swallows" shirts with "F*** Biden" on the back seemed to be especially popular. Morgantown is one of the bluest areas of the state, and there is still a lot of Biden hate in this area. There are rumors that Manchin will switch parties before 2024, and that would not surprise me at all.
Manchin is getting good press on social media for "standing up to progressives." People support the ideas behind the bill, but they also dislike a lot of what they hear about it (much of it fake news). He is scoring political points by slowing things down because there are people who think he is showing that he is being "thoughtful" about it. I believe he will eventually vote for the bill, but he will score political points by forcing compromise and reduction of the cost. "Trillion" is a hard word for people to digest, and even if they want the benefits of the bill, they worry about the cost.
In the long run, he will be praised for voting for a watered-down bill. Standing up to progressives while still bringing some benefits to the state will be his best bet for re-election.
It sucks, but it is reality.
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Post by questioning on Nov 2, 2021 21:23:34 GMT
Many of the people lacking critical thinking were in school long before high stakes standardized testing came about. Made me laugh! There's not a problem in the country that won't be blamed on standardized testing or lack of Christian prayer in schools. |
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Post by mollycoddle on Nov 2, 2021 21:58:15 GMT
I was just arguing with people on Twitter who think that calling Manchin names and saying that he doesn’t get to dictate this bill are productive. I cannot stand that SOB. But yes, they have to deal with him or no bill. It alarms me that so many people don’t seem to understand this. It’s math. I have no love for Manchin as a representative of my state. But I can guarantee you, he is better than any alternative that might come out of WV. WV voted Democrat for many years, but it was NEVER a blue state culturally. Ever. Democrats ruled in this state because of the unions. The Republicans were the party of union-busters and the Democrats were pro-union. That was enough to elect a pretty solid Democrat majority in the state government, with a few Republican governors here and there. We had two Democrats in the U.S. Senate for many years. Shelly Moore Capito was the first Republican senator elected in WV since 1958. But do not doubt that WV residents align more with Republicans than Democrats when it comes to values. Fundamentalist/evangelical churches are strong across a large part of the state, and as many of our younger people have left the state for better economic opportunities, those values are even more prevalent among our aging population. For now, you do see some polls suggesting that West Virginians support BBB. But I can guarantee you that supporting it will be used against Manchin in 2024. The hatred for "the Squad," Nancy Pelosi, and Joe Biden is ridiculous. I was at our game against Iowa State this weekend, and the number of anti-Biden shirts, flags, bumper stickers, etc. was excessive. "Biden sucks, but Kamala swallows" shirts with "F*** Biden" on the back seemed to be especially popular. Morgantown is one of the bluest areas of the state, and there is still a lot of Biden hate in this area. There are rumors that Manchin will switch parties before 2024, and that would not surprise me at all.
Manchin is getting good press on social media for "standing up to progressives." People support the ideas behind the bill, but they also dislike a lot of what they hear about it (much of it fake news). He is scoring political points by slowing things down because there are people who think he is showing that he is being "thoughtful" about it. I believe he will eventually vote for the bill, but he will score political points by forcing compromise and reduction of the cost. "Trillion" is a hard word for people to digest, and even if they want the benefits of the bill, they worry about the cost. In the long run, he will be praised for voting for a watered-down bill. Standing up to progressives while still bringing some benefits to the state will be his best bet for re-election. It sucks, but it is reality.
Oh, I know. I grew up close to W Va. And in a very blue collar town, which used to be full of Democrats, but now has turned to Trump. Much like W. Va. I am just very nervous that nothing will get done, and Republicans will take back Congress. |
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Post by epeanymous on Nov 2, 2021 22:03:52 GMT
They can band together when all they have to do is ...nothing. Gangs of people DESTROYING things can always stick together. Destruction is dead easy. Creation, innovation, improvement - THOSE are hard. This is exactly right. It is much easier to blow things up than to create good things. |
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Nov 23, 2024 23:42:27 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 2, 2021 22:07:36 GMT
Gangs of people DESTROYING things can always stick together. Destruction is dead easy. Creation, innovation, improvement - THOSE are hard. This is exactly right. It is much easier to blow things up than to create good things. You'd think even the ignorant could understand that, but I guess not.
Destroyers get credit for "standing strong!" Creators get sidelined for doing the hard work of making life better for millions.
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