River
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,590
Location: Alabama
Jun 26, 2014 15:26:04 GMT
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Post by River on Oct 16, 2024 17:33:38 GMT
This is a S/O of sorts of Workingclassdog's post asking if that was bad of her and ballots coming in the mail.
I've been feeling like common curtesy has started going out the window lately and her post just added to that feeling. I kept seeing over and over that he's a grown man and he is responsible for his mail. Yes, that's true, but what about having ones back? What about helping your partner out when you know their mind is on serval things at the moment, making it easy to overlook something? What about common curtesy?
I'm seeing more and more that people are only concerned with themselves and the thought that everyone should do the same. While I understand this to a point because women today don't want to have to babysit their spouse. With more women working and having kids, they don't want the added pressure of making sure everyone is doing what they are supposed to. I totally get that! That's not my issue, BTDT. What I don't want to see is people, especially with spouses, not looking out for each other when it's important.
I'm sadden that the majority on the thread saying he's a grown man, don't care that something very important got missed during a time that a lot was likely on his mind. It's just "oh well, he's a grown man".
Are you seeing common curtesy slipping away like I have been?
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Post by chaosisapony on Oct 16, 2024 17:46:28 GMT
I agree that a lot of common courtesy seems to be gone these days. To me, common courtesy is holding doors open for others, returning phone calls in a timely manner, offering to grab something for someone while you are out.
Reminding your spouse multiple times to deal with his mail is not common courtesy. I'd expect my partner to look after his own affairs so that he's not adding to my mental load. There can be a very fine line in relationships where one spouse can take on an almost parental role. That's not good for the relationship and has nothing to do with common courtesy the way I see it.
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Post by Zee on Oct 16, 2024 18:00:12 GMT
I'm not going to help someone knowingly take away what should be mine, my daughter's, our granddaughters', and every other woman's bodily rights, courtesy be damned.
And she didn't hide the ballot so let's stop shaming her about it.
Do you hold your husband's hand to accomplish every goal he has that you don't share? Or do you let him figure it out? Maybe you don't have goals that you don't share, and that's great for you.
If my DH was going to vote for Trump, I certainly wouldn't be reminding him to do so. I'd actually be contemplating divorce because it would mean we no longer have the same principles that we used to save he would have changed into someone I don't know and can't support, but that's another thread.
As for "common courtesy", meaning the kindness you extend to others, no it's not dead. Probably dead on the Internet, but in person, I still meet really great people all the time. There have always been jerks but we hear and see them online now.
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Post by workingclassdog on Oct 16, 2024 18:03:32 GMT
I agree that a lot of common courtesy seems to be gone these days. To me, common courtesy is holding doors open for others, returning phone calls in a timely manner, offering to grab something for someone while you are out. Reminding your spouse multiple times to deal with his mail is not common courtesy. I'd expect my partner to look after his own affairs so that he's not adding to my mental load. There can be a very fine line in relationships where one spouse can take on an almost parental role. That's not good for the relationship and has nothing to do with common courtesy the way I see it. WCD here responding... I totally agree with this.. opening doors, giving your seat to the elderly, is common courtesy. I am usually overboard on courtesy when it comes to things like that. We grew up that way and taught our kids the same. I am also kind to my husband (apparently I'm not) and maybe sometimes I can get irritated by him. But along the lines of everyday things, I can't stand behind him to remind him of everything. He is a grown man who needs to take care of his business, like myself, I need to take care of my own business. It wouldn't bother me in the least if he got the ballots and did the same thing.. the normal practice in our house. I take my own responsibility. Now if the man was disabled, sick, can't take care of himself in some way, then yes all bets are off and I would help. That isn't the case. Again, I am not his mother and he would for sure let me be if I allowed it. |
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Post by coaliesquirrel on Oct 16, 2024 18:09:01 GMT
I agree that a lot of common courtesy seems to be gone these days. To me, common courtesy is holding doors open for others, returning phone calls in a timely manner, offering to grab something for someone while you are out. Reminding your spouse multiple times to deal with his mail is not common courtesy. I'd expect my partner to look after his own affairs so that he's not adding to my mental load. There can be a very fine line in relationships where one spouse can take on an almost parental role. That's not good for the relationship and has nothing to do with common courtesy the way I see it. Agreed - I think we also have to realize that "common courtesy" changes with society, so that the normal/expected thing years ago or in a different culture simply isn't considered common courtesy anymore. Like now, at my work we're specifically forbidden from holding doors open for people due to security reasons. 50 years ago, most people in the US would have been shocked by adults removing their shoes in the homes of others, but now it's common for lots of folks to have that unspoken rule. Courtesy isn't gone - in many situations, its definition is just changing. Now, is selfishness increasing? Absolutely. When you have loud personalities constantly screaming "screw those OTHER people - ME FIRST!" it unfortunately takes hold. |
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dawnnikol
Prolific Pea
'A life without books is a life not lived.' Jay Kristoff
Posts: 8,556
Sept 21, 2015 18:39:25 GMT
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Post by dawnnikol on Oct 16, 2024 18:16:18 GMT
I'm sadden that the majority on the thread saying he's a grown man, don't care that something very important got missed during a time that a lot was likely on his mind. It's just "oh well, he's a grown man". It was not important to him. Voting is such a priority for me that I've made sure to keep up with the deadlines, checked my status online multiple times, and marked my calendar for the dates when I should receive my ballot. I also have a plan to make sure it's back in the mail in plenty of time to be counted. This is not lifesaving medication, this is not a sick person being at home and unable to fend for themself, this is certainly not something like letting a door slam in someone's face. This is a consequence of him not being responsible for his own crap. Do I think some people have thrown common courtesy out the window? I certainly do, at times, but overall? Nah. I think we tend to look at the past with rose-colored glasses and forget how smelly it really was when we were there living it. |
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breetheflea
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,588 
Location: PNW
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Post by breetheflea on Oct 16, 2024 18:25:50 GMT
The door holding comments made me think of the time I was volunteering at the elementary school. I was carrying a box of something and pushing DS in a stroller, and walking next to another volunteer. The school principal walked over, took the very small item co-volunteer was carrying and took it down the steps and set it on the table for her. I guess looked like she needed help and I didn't  |
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Post by bc2ca on Oct 16, 2024 18:27:10 GMT
For the most part I would say common courtesy is alive and strong. IME, most people live by the golden rule and treat others the way they want to be treated.
When you have a system in your household for mail or anything else, it isn't common courtesy to micromanage what others do. IMHO, leaving your mail pile untouched or dealt with is the opposite of common courtesy. You are leaving it for someone else to clean up, recycle, pay, file, etc.
That being said, I do think there is an element of divisiveness right now that has allows people to feel entitled to take their anger/frustration out on someone who has no control of the situation. I'm thinking of the person berating a phlebologist at the lab because she has been waiting an hour for her draw. For context, the lab was very busy, front desk person absent so phlebologists doing check-ins and draws, and those of us coming in with appointments bump anyone in the stand-by line. Much to her dismay, the berater couldn't get anyone to join in on the berating even though there was a room of very frustrated people. Most made a point to let the staff know we knew they were doing their best.
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SweetieBsMom
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,785
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Post by SweetieBsMom on Oct 16, 2024 18:29:20 GMT
I agree that a lot of common courtesy seems to be gone these days. To me, common courtesy is holding doors open for others, returning phone calls in a timely manner, offering to grab something for someone while you are out. Reminding your spouse multiple times to deal with his mail is not common courtesy. I'd expect my partner to look after his own affairs so that he's not adding to my mental load. There can be a very fine line in relationships where one spouse can take on an almost parental role. That's not good for the relationship and has nothing to do with common courtesy the way I see it. This. 10000 times THIS! |
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Post by lainey on Oct 16, 2024 18:36:19 GMT
Infantilising your spouse and common courtesy are very different things. I for one didn't get married to baby someone.
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Post by compeateropeator on Oct 16, 2024 18:53:13 GMT
I think there is still a lot of common courtesy out there. I see it often. There are also a lot of people out there who travel through public only focused on what they are trying to do or where they are trying to get to and pay no attention to those around them. So definitely a mixed bag on any given day. 😉
There is also a fine line between common courtesy and personal responsibility.
Common courtesy =. Placing a spouses mail in the same place all the time.
Personal responsibility = spouse taking responsibility to look at said pile of mail when he is there.
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Post by padresfan619 on Oct 16, 2024 19:09:57 GMT
I think common courtesy is bringing the mail in and leaving it in a well known and visible spot.
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pinklady
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,066
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Post by pinklady on Oct 16, 2024 19:22:26 GMT
This is a S/O of sorts of Workingclassdog's post asking if that was bad of her and ballots coming in the mail. I've been feeling like common curtesy has started going out the window lately and her post just added to that feeling. I kept seeing over and over that he's a grown man and he is responsible for his mail. Yes, that's true, but what about having ones back? What about helping your partner out when you know their mind is on serval things at the moment, making it easy to overlook something? What about common curtesy? I'm seeing more and more that people are only concerned with themselves and the thought that everyone should do the same. While I understand this to a point because women today don't want to have to babysit their spouse. With more women working and having kids, they don't want the added pressure of making sure everyone is doing what they are supposed to. I totally get that! That's not my issue, BTDT. What I don't want to see is people, especially with spouses, not looking out for each other when it's important. I'm sadden that the majority on the thread saying he's a grown man, don't care that something very important got missed during a time that a lot was likely on his mind. It's just "oh well, he's a grown man". Are you seeing common curtesy slipping away like I have been? Seriously.  You are equating a woman reminding another person to vote to take their rights away as common courtesy? WTF! Bad example of common "courtesy". |
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Post by katlady on Oct 16, 2024 19:38:53 GMT
I think of common courtesy as opening doors for others, giving up your seat, allowing someone to go ahead of you. As for the mail ballot issues, I put all the incoming mail in one spot. If there is something important, I’ll put it on the top and tell SO it is there. I might remind him if I still see that envelope sitting there a couple of days later, but that is it. I am not going to put it in his hands.
I still see common courtesy when I am out and about. I don’t think it is truly dying. Now, there is one gal at work I will not hold the door open for. I’ve held it for her a couple of times, and she walks through like a Queen. No acknowledgment at all from her. I would even take a glance or a nod, but nope, I am completely ignored. So, I no longer hold the door for her when I see her. She works on my floor so I see her often.
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Post by melanell on Oct 16, 2024 19:39:18 GMT
I agree that a lot of common courtesy seems to be gone these days. To me, common courtesy is holding doors open for others, returning phone calls in a timely manner, offering to grab something for someone while you are out. Reminding your spouse multiple times to deal with his mail is not common courtesy. I'd expect my partner to look after his own affairs so that he's not adding to my mental load. There can be a very fine line in relationships where one spouse can take on an almost parental role. That's not good for the relationship and has nothing to do with common courtesy the way I see it. I agree completely. I am raising children with my spouse. I am trying to teach them to be independent human beings, responsible for their own day to day tasks. I'm not going to then turn around and hold their father's hand with the same responsibilities we're trying to teach them. And the same goes in the opposite direction. We each have things that are "ours" to do in the house. I don't remind DH to do his things. I don't ask him if they've been done. They are his things. I trust him to do them on his own without my input, unless asked. And he 's the same. He assumes all is fine with my things unless I say there's an issue. Now, to me, common courtesy is when DH is sick, and I remind the kids that we need to take over Dad's responsibilities until he feels better. Common courtesy is still thanking DH for making dinner each night, despite it being "his thing". |
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Post by Merge on Oct 16, 2024 19:45:04 GMT
Public manners aside, to me, basic courtesy between spouses requires us to be supportive of each other with things that we actually want to do. It didn't strike me that WCD's husband was particularly interested in voting, so why would she waste mental bandwidth making sure he could/did?
A better example to me would be - for DH and I, who share a car - for me to share that I plan to vote on X day and DH's making the effort not to schedule something for work that requires the car at that day/time. He will do that even though he may not agree with who I'm voting for. That's basic courtesy.
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Post by workingclassdog on Oct 16, 2024 19:55:38 GMT
Public manners aside, to me, basic courtesy between spouses requires us to be supportive of each other with things that we actually want to do. It didn't strike me that WCD's husband was particularly interested in voting, so why would she waste mental bandwidth making sure he could/did? A better example to me would be - for DH and I, who share a car - for me to share that I plan to vote on X day and DH's making the effort not to schedule something for work that requires the car at that day/time. He will do that even though he may not agree with who I'm voting for. That's basic courtesy. Now on the car thing... I MIGHT let him ride with me if we were going to the poll. I don't know. Tuck and Roll baby... I'll slow down to 55. HAHA.. I am JUST KIDDING. I wouldn't stand in anyone's way even if it killed me.. again.. this is a joke. |
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Post by epeanymous on Oct 16, 2024 20:04:06 GMT
Part of common courtesy is not acting like an incompetent overgrown child and attending to one's own affairs instead of expecting someone else to do the emotional labor of constantly keeping track of your business and reminding you to complete basic adult tasks.
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River
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,590
Location: Alabama
Jun 26, 2014 15:26:04 GMT
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Post by River on Oct 16, 2024 20:21:17 GMT
I was apparently way off base with the common curtesy wording. I apologize. What I was meaning as common curtesy is mutual respect maybe between partners. I have memory issues and can forget even the most important things when my mind is occupied on something else. Actually, my memory issues expand way beyond that. I am eternally grateful to have someone that will give me a nudge or remind me of important things. My SO does not have memory issues but is still grateful when I help him in the same way. I apologize workingclassdog I wasn't trying to say anything negative about you, which is why I didn't comment. I started a thread to discuss why people seem to no longer have each other's back. To me, the example workingclassdog shared and the responses of he's a grown man, just threw me for a loop. I'm seeing it more and more and I just don't understand it. Giving a reminder on something important shouldn't be a fend for yourself attitude in my world. |
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Post by ScrapbookMyLife on Oct 16, 2024 20:33:28 GMT
I think the "not giving Husband his mail" situation does not fall under the common courtesy category.
To me common courtesy is >> being polite and kind, holding a door for someone, next in line goes (not the person running from the back of the line, to be next), giving up one's seat for an elderly person or pregnant woman, extending grace to a Parent whose child is having melting down in public, turning OFF (or using earphones) one's device volume in public, etc...
I think common courtesy has....some but not all of the time....been replaced with entitlement and complete disregard for others.
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Post by bossymom on Oct 16, 2024 20:51:48 GMT
Infantilising your spouse and common courtesy are very different things. I for one didn't get married to baby someone. Thank you. Question for the general peas : Would you husband have made sure YOU voted? Made sure you saw your mail in ballot wherever the mail gets deposited in your home? |
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Post by mom on Oct 16, 2024 20:58:21 GMT
For my home and marriage, it would be considered a common curtesy / nice thing if I saw it and knew it was sitting there and I also knew DH was trying to get out of town for work, so me reminding him of it would be nice. DH would not expect me to remind him to automatically do it nor would I remind him about every little thing in life. But I know DH would want to vote+ if he's occupied with getting ready to leave, then it would not be that big of a deal for me remind him about it.
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dawnnikol
Prolific Pea
'A life without books is a life not lived.' Jay Kristoff
Posts: 8,556
Sept 21, 2015 18:39:25 GMT
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Post by dawnnikol on Oct 16, 2024 21:04:18 GMT
I was apparently way off base with the common curtesy wording. I apologize. What I was meaning as common curtesy is mutual respect maybe between partners. I have memory issues and can forget even the most important things when my mind is occupied on something else. Actually, my memory issues expand way beyond that. I am eternally grateful to have someone that will give me a nudge or remind me of important things. My SO does not have memory issues but is still grateful when I help him in the same way. I apologize workingclassdog I wasn't trying to say anything negative about you, which is why I didn't comment. I started a thread to discuss why people seem to no longer have each other's back. To me, the example workingclassdog shared and the responses of he's a grown man, just threw me for a loop. I'm seeing it more and more and I just don't understand it. Giving a reminder on something important shouldn't be a fend for yourself attitude in my world. Having memory issues would change the situation for anyone, as you mentioned. That was not the issue in that situation, otherwise, I am 100% sure OP would've reminded her husband, on top of his text. I did ask my DH his thoughts on this whole thing, going back to the original thread and this one. He felt like "more people need to be spoon fed things", of course he related it to his job. XYZ is not enough communication, it has to be XYZ and ABC, oh and then DEF. Then when people still fail to understand the changes coming, we should also do "GHI". He might be a little miffed about work atm.  He said he definitely would not want me to go out of the way to remind him about mail if that was our normal procedure. |
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Post by melanell on Oct 16, 2024 21:07:30 GMT
I started a thread to discuss why people seem to no longer have each other's back. To me, the example workingclassdog shared and the responses of he's a grown man, just threw me for a loop. I'm seeing it more and more and I just don't understand it. Giving a reminder on something important shouldn't be a fend for yourself attitude in my world. If we need help remembering things, then we do remind one another. It's all part of each of us doing our "things". Some of our "things" have been the same for our entire marriage, but others change as our needs change. DH, for example, misplaces things all of the time. Even when things have specific places to live. So I know one of my things is to notice something where it shouldn't be and either put it away, or more often, just make a mental note for when DH eventually says "Have you seen my...." But, on the flip side, paying bills is my thing, and at this point in my life I don't require any assistance with that, so there's just no reason for DH to point out every time a bill arrives, or to repeatedly ask or remind me about paying bills. We all have enough to do without giving out reminders that are typically not needed. We save that effort for instances where we know the other person needs the help.  |
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dawnnikol
Prolific Pea
'A life without books is a life not lived.' Jay Kristoff
Posts: 8,556
Sept 21, 2015 18:39:25 GMT
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Post by dawnnikol on Oct 16, 2024 21:08:26 GMT
Question for the general peas : Would you husband have made sure YOU voted? Made sure you saw your mail in ballot wherever the mail gets deposited in your home? DH only gets the mail at our house about 5% of the time, so he would tell me my ballot has arrived because he tells me about every single piece of mail we receive. However, if the situation was exactly the original thread's OP, no, he wouldn't. |
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Post by bc2ca on Oct 16, 2024 21:10:07 GMT
Question for the general peas : Would you husband have made sure YOU voted? Made sure you saw your mail in ballot wherever the mail gets deposited in your home? DH asked "when are we filling out our ballots?" the day they came in the mail. We have always filled them out together. Once the kids turned 18, they joined us by choice. Monday night was ballot night at our house this year. The common courtesy part was me offering to drop off all the completed ballots at the library, which everyone happily accepted. |
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Post by melanell on Oct 16, 2024 21:11:29 GMT
Infantilising your spouse and common courtesy are very different things. I for one didn't get married to baby someone. Thank you. Question for the general peas : Would you husband have made sure YOU voted? Made sure you saw your mail in ballot wherever the mail gets deposited in your home? In our house all of my mail goes on my desk. And as I mentioned in the other thread, except for Postcrossing postcards, which DH enjoys reading, no one ever says a word to me about mail that gets deposited on my desk again. So when my ballot arrives, it will land on my desk, and I'll take care of it. DH is going to vote in person and our polling place is 2 blocks away. So DH's normal routine, since he is the last person home each day, is on voting day to come home and say "I'm walking down to vote. Anyone else want to come along?" If anyone else still needs to vote, they'll walk down with him. That would be the extent of anyone asking anyone about voting here. |
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Post by epeanymous on Oct 16, 2024 23:24:01 GMT
I was apparently way off base with the common curtesy wording. I apologize. What I was meaning as common curtesy is mutual respect maybe between partners. I have memory issues and can forget even the most important things when my mind is occupied on something else. Actually, my memory issues expand way beyond that. I am eternally grateful to have someone that will give me a nudge or remind me of important things. My SO does not have memory issues but is still grateful when I help him in the same way. I apologize workingclassdog I wasn't trying to say anything negative about you, which is why I didn't comment. I started a thread to discuss why people seem to no longer have each other's back. To me, the example workingclassdog shared and the responses of he's a grown man, just threw me for a loop. I'm seeing it more and more and I just don't understand it. Giving a reminder on something important shouldn't be a fend for yourself attitude in my world. Honestly I think what you are seeing is responses from a lot of women who either have their own experience, grew up in a household with the experience, or have many friends who have had the experience that many men expect their wives to keep track of their lives for them and to remind them and make lists and otherwise take on a managerial role in something that should be a partnership. It doesn't mean that people don't want to help one another out or engage in kindness. |
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Post by cmpeter on Oct 17, 2024 0:21:48 GMT
It’s still here in my experience. Most still do things like hold doors open, say please and thank you, let you merge when you put your blinker on, etc.
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Post by workingclassdog on Oct 17, 2024 1:09:01 GMT
I was apparently way off base with the common curtesy wording. I apologize. What I was meaning as common curtesy is mutual respect maybe between partners. I have memory issues and can forget even the most important things when my mind is occupied on something else. Actually, my memory issues expand way beyond that. I am eternally grateful to have someone that will give me a nudge or remind me of important things. My SO does not have memory issues but is still grateful when I help him in the same way. I apologize workingclassdog I wasn't trying to say anything negative about you, which is why I didn't comment. I started a thread to discuss why people seem to no longer have each other's back. To me, the example workingclassdog shared and the responses of he's a grown man, just threw me for a loop. I'm seeing it more and more and I just don't understand it. Giving a reminder on something important shouldn't be a fend for yourself attitude in my world. No worries! We all have different kinds of households. Of course if there were issues like memory or whatever, that's a different story. Although, he can't ever ever remember my work at home days vs office days no matter how many times I told him. OYE. |
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You are equating a woman reminding another person to vote to take their rights away as common courtesy? WTF! Bad example of common "courtesy".
He said he definitely would not want me to go out of the way to remind him about mail if that was our normal procedure. 
