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Post by hopemax on Feb 8, 2025 6:02:19 GMT
Sorry, this one is too important to be buried in another thread. Some of you may work at a university or have received care via the medical center at your local university. Especially, for more serious conditions that a more local hospital may not be able to provide.
Today's illegal action was for the new head of NIH to issue a directive capping "Indirect Costs" to a flat 15%. It is illegal because one of the actions Congress did take in 2024 was to specifically say that cutting these Indirect Costs *has* to be done with Congressional approval. Indirect costs are money the university receives in addition to the grant, acknowledging that in order to do things like research cancer treatments, you need a place to *do* the research. So these pay for facilities and labs. They range based on cost of living of the area and other factors. The rates each university receives has been calculated by teams within HHS, military or relevant agency. This isn't something a university sets. As you might imagine, universities located in expensive metro areas are reimbursed at higher rates. The example in the Bluesky thread below says the rate for the University of Washington is 55%. So going from 55% down to 15% will have a large, unanticipated, and immediate effect on the University of Washington Medical Center's ability to operate.
The "justification" for doing this is because private grants have caps*, and that some universities have large endowments Trump's people think should be paying instead. The info they posted specifically lists places like Harvard (69%), Yale (67.5%) along with the size of the endowments. Doing this will save an estimated $4 Billion per year. What they didn't put in their info graphic is that also are places like the Children's Hospital of Pennsylvania's rate is 70%.
Small discussion on how rates have been calculated
Universities will not be able to absorb the costs. Even if programs are eliminated, tuition is raised, some medical centers will simply not be able to function. This will not only affect the ability to provide care, it will shutdown a massive amount of medical research, it will cost jobs (on top of other job losses we could expect via other cuts) and people will die. I expect the Administration will use this as a weapon they can wield to get places to eliminate things they don't like such as gender affirming care, women's health, diversity, equity and inclusion research and programs, etc.
For Washington it's not only UW, but Fred Hutchinson Cancer Institute, Seattle Children's Hospital. Here in Colorado, UC Health dominates.
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samantha25
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Post by samantha25 on Feb 8, 2025 6:17:21 GMT
Yes, this is true.. the rate at University of Colorado overhead is 56% for our NIH SBIR grant. We have 1 million sitting in PMS to use for the last studies into animals for our cancer drug for TNBC, melanoma, ovarian cancer. It's so hopeful, that it's effective in a pill form, no IV treatment. We also had a grant from Colorado state, OEDIT, which ended this month, which had an overhead to university for 8%. It's just devastating this absolute stupidity of the effects of "getting rid" of the excess spending, especially people have no knowledge of how budgets work and will affect others.
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Post by epeanymous on Feb 8, 2025 7:09:10 GMT
Alabama’s top employer is its university system’s medical research, just as an example. These illegal cuts would have the effect of decimating critical research, creating severe economic disruption to areas with universities, and potentially shuttering many universities.
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samantha25
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Post by samantha25 on Feb 8, 2025 7:11:59 GMT
Alabama’s top employer is its university system’s medical research, just as an example. These illegal cuts would have the effect of decimating critical research, creating severe economic disruption to areas with universities, and potentially shuttering many universities. What about any hospital connection? As University of Colorado Anschutz is associated with uchealth hospital. Just wondering. |
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Post by epeanymous on Feb 8, 2025 7:25:53 GMT
Alabama’s top employer is its university system’s medical research, just as an example. These illegal cuts would have the effect of decimating critical research, creating severe economic disruption to areas with universities, and potentially shuttering many universities. What about any hospital connection? As University of Colorado Anschutz is associated with uchealth hospital. Just wondering. Yeah, those too. I mean I get that this administration hates higher education and that their voting base isn’t college-educated but come on. |
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Post by Embri on Feb 8, 2025 7:30:55 GMT
This is what happens when you treat a government as a for-profit business. No morals, no humanity.
Sick people are a liability, why waste capital on them. /heavy sarcasm just in case that isn't 100% obvious
Muskrat and friends don't care about who dies in the process, only on how many resources they can hoard for themselves and the "right" people. This is straight out of the Nazi playbook.
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Post by hop2 on Feb 8, 2025 10:49:31 GMT
This is what happens when you treat a government as a for-profit business. No morals, no humanity. Sick people are a liability, why waste capital on them. /heavy sarcasm just in case that isn't 100% obvious Muskrat and friends don't care about who dies in the process, only on how many resources they can hoard for themselves and the "right" people. This is straight out of the Nazi playbook. that’s highly insulting to muskrats and not insulting enough to Elon. ( sorry gotta find humor before I cry ) But otherwise the sentiment is exactly on point Nazis don’t care for the masses they think there are unlimited of us peons to work where they need us to. I really never thought about sending an immigrant back where they came from as much as I would love to deport Elon. He is a moral less asshole |
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Feb 8, 2025 11:52:07 GMT
hop2 actually pres Musk could be sent back IF elected officials as well as Justice were honoring their oath of office..
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compeateropeator
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Post by compeateropeator on Feb 8, 2025 12:30:46 GMT
Yes this is a big one. This information was from March of 2024 for my state but shows some of the importance.
Sorry so long. I also didn’t want to paste the chart in but our grant recipients also included a Veteran’s organization, although most all of our grants are for UVM and UVMMC (our medical center). We are a teaching hospital.
Economic Analysis Finds Every $1 of NIH Research Funding Generates $2.46 in Economic Activity
Vermont Business Magazine Research funding from the National Institutes of Health (NIH) generated $92.89 billion in new economic activity nationwide last year — or $2.46 of economic activity for every $1 of research funding, according to a report from United for Medical Research (UMR). Vermont received 108 grants valued at $58,638,753. The University of Vermont received 99 grants worth over $52 million.
NIH’s Role in Sustaining the U.S. Economy, published annually by UMR, also found that the $37.81 billion awarded to researchers in the 50 U.S. states and the District of Columbia in Fiscal Year 2023 supported 412,041 jobs.
See tables below.
“Every research dollar that leaves NIH does double duty by supporting life-changing research and by generating jobs and economic activity that support local economies across the United States,” said Caitlin Leach, UMR President.
“Increases to the NIH budget over the past eight years have been instrumental in making progress against our most vexing diseases and maintaining America’s leadership in biomedical research. Failure to continue to invest robustly in medical research through the NIH will immediately reduce funding for research and its benefit to local economies. However, the longer-term consequences of a shrinking NIH budget will be far greater, with a significant negative impact on biomedical innovation, public health and the U.S. economy,” Leach added.
More than 80 percent of the NIH budget is awarded in grants each year to researchers at academic institutions, non-profits and businesses. That funding supports employment and the purchase of research-related goods, services and materials. The income generated from these jobs and purchases cycles through the economy to produce new economic activity.
Since Fiscal Year 2015, the NIH budget has grown by more than $17 billion thanks to bipartisan congressional support and a commitment to making medical research a critical national priority. The annual increases to the NIH budget in fiscal years 2016-2023 have enabled the NIH to fund a greater number of grants each year. This momentum was essential and helped the NIH catch up from a long period of flat funding and begin to restore lost purchasing power. Continued robust funding for the NIH is essential to continuing this progress.
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Post by Embri on Feb 8, 2025 14:45:09 GMT
Just like giving your population regular medical care stops many of them from getting sick and needing expensive treatments later. Or banning/heavily taxing cigarettes reduces the number of related illnesses. Or how seatbelt regulations reduce accident fatalities.
Every dollar of prevention saves you many more in the future.
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Post by Merge on Feb 8, 2025 14:54:53 GMT
I'll say it again - the idea of any entity being classed as a public good rather than a profit center is completely lost on these Republicans.
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Post by agengr2004 on Feb 8, 2025 15:07:09 GMT
The indirect costs also supplement departments, like Safety departments, that typically do not have budgets that allow them to maintain the staff and programs necessary to function without those dollars.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Feb 8, 2025 15:21:45 GMT
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Post by Embri on Feb 8, 2025 15:28:04 GMT
I'll say it again - the idea of any entity being classed as a public good rather than a profit center is completely lost on these Republicans. I'd hesitate to call them Republicans anymore.
While I don't pretend to be privy to the nuances of how exactly y'all choose to identify, I'm reasonably sure that USAinian politicians are supposed to be in favour of the USA, you know, continuing to exist as a sovereign nation. Kinda hard to put "America First!" if there's no America remaining.
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Post by peano on Feb 8, 2025 15:28:42 GMT
For purely selfish reasons, DS just got his master's and is looking for a job in the biological sciences. I can't help but think that employers may have hiring on hold indefinitely until hopefully the courts sort this mess out. He specifically wants to do research.
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Post by agengr2004 on Feb 8, 2025 15:35:19 GMT
For purely selfish reasons, DS just got his master's and is looking for a job in the biological sciences. I can't help but think that employers may have hiring on hold indefinitely until hopefully the courts sort this mess out. He specifically wants to do research. Has he been looking at in the private sector? I don’t know if they will feel the effects of all this to the degree that universities and other public entities will. I will finish my Masters of Public Health in May and I just hope they don’t decimate these programs before I can finish. I’m not relying on any non-profits or grants to finish my practicum, but I have classmates that are and I’m concerned about what happens to them if they can’t finish through no fault of their own. |
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Post by peano on Feb 8, 2025 15:59:07 GMT
I'm sure he's been looking at the private sector. He was originally thinking about working in gov't, but, oh well...
Good luck to you in your job hunt after graduation.
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Sarah*H
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Post by Sarah*H on Feb 8, 2025 16:12:23 GMT
I'm sick to my stomach and awake in the middle of the night about a lot of things but this one is personal. My daughter is a biochemistry major at an R1 public research university.
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Post by mom2jnk on Feb 8, 2025 21:42:15 GMT
I'm sick to my stomach and awake in the middle of the night about a lot of things but this one is personal. My daughter is a biochemistry major at an R1 public research university. I'll come sit with you. My daughter is a second year PhD student in Chemistry at a major public university researching small molecule therapeutics for cancer treatment. She has worked her a$$ off since she was a sophomore in high school to achieve her dream of contributing to finding new treatments for cancer and now this! Her lab *thinks* they will be able to fully support all their current graduate students through their program of study, but it's going to be rough. And there is talk of no new graduate student admissions at all. We will lose an entire generation of scientists and scientific research from the effects of this administration. Heavens only knows how many more people will suffer and die from this wholesale war on science and education. I just can't any more... |
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Post by epeanymous on Feb 8, 2025 22:50:14 GMT
I'm sick to my stomach and awake in the middle of the night about a lot of things but this one is personal. My daughter is a biochemistry major at an R1 public research university. I am really sorry. I will say the order is unlawful and I would expect an injunction next week, although who knows what happens in the long term. |
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Post by Embri on Feb 9, 2025 11:35:27 GMT
I'm sick to my stomach and awake in the middle of the night about a lot of things but this one is personal. My daughter is a biochemistry major at an R1 public research university. I am really sorry. I will say the order is unlawful and I would expect an injunction next week, although who knows what happens in the long term. The general consensus is the legality of FF's actions are a slamdunk for Very Very Illegal, it's the enforcement that's in serious question. Courts only determine legality, they're not equipped to take the necessary actions when their orders are defied. Most (all?) of those are under the President's control. |
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samantha25
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Post by samantha25 on Mar 14, 2025 23:45:28 GMT
Check out this new requirement "field" for the PMS system, where you request payment/reimbursement for grants. I'm sure this is a mechanism to flag grants using the restricted buzz words. I will not be inputting anything specific like "breast cancer" research for my requests to PMS.
Dear Payment Management System User,
This is an official email from the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services Payment Management System (PMS).
In order to implement Executive Order 14222 — Implementing the President's "Department of Government Efficiency" Cost Efficiency — PMS is introducing a new mandatory field in the payment request screen at the subaccount level on March 17, 2025. This field, limited to 1,000 characters, will capture a justification from the Grant Recipient explaining the purpose of the payment. Justifications can be brief or more detailed, such as:
• "Purchase of anti-retroviral drugs for HIV/AIDS clinics in Uganda."
• "Reimbursement of payroll and supply expenses for a Head Start preschool program."
Medicaid payment requests are exempt from this requirement.
Below is an example of what the PMS screen will look like:
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samantha25
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Post by samantha25 on Mar 17, 2025 23:05:41 GMT
CTSI funding, which is grant funding for doctoral and post-doctoral students tuition/stipends etc. at universities has been canceled at University of Utah. I don't have a link yet as this is from a colleague who is very active of this type of grant. She says that University of Colorado will probably get funding provoked, too. I'm sure many universities will be affected.
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Mar 18, 2025 0:33:19 GMT
Each state has an NIH Cancer research facility with in house doctors/faculty. (That's not the right name for them)
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samantha25
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by samantha25 on Mar 18, 2025 0:59:54 GMT
Each state has an NIH Cancer research facility with in house doctors/faculty. (That's not the right name for them) Have no idea what you are trying to say. |
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Post by busy on Mar 18, 2025 1:12:25 GMT
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samantha25
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Post by samantha25 on Mar 18, 2025 1:40:08 GMT
The NIH (National Institutes of Health) funds Clinical and Translational Science Institutes (CTSIs) through various grant programs, including the CTSA network, which aims to improve research and translate findings into practice.
CTSI Activities:
CTSIs utilize the funding to:
Support Research: Conduct research projects in various areas of clinical and translational science.
Train Researchers: Provide training opportunities for researchers in clinical and translational research.
Disseminate Knowledge: Share research findings and best practices with the broader scientific community and the public.
Improve Research Infrastructure: Enhance research infrastructure and capabilities within their institutions.
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samantha25
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Post by samantha25 on Mar 18, 2025 4:28:30 GMT
For purely selfish reasons, DS just got his master's and is looking for a job in the biological sciences. I can't help but think that employers may have hiring on hold indefinitely until hopefully the courts sort this mess out. He specifically wants to do research. Has he been looking at in the private sector? I don’t know if they will feel the effects of all this to the degree that universities and other public entities will. I will finish my Masters of Public Health in May and I just hope they don’t decimate these programs before I can finish. I’m not relying on any non-profits or grants to finish my practicum, but I have classmates that are and I’m concerned about what happens to them if they can’t finish through no fault of their own. Oh yeah, Danaher corporation feeling the heat and lay offs. |
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samantha25
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,320
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Post by samantha25 on Mar 18, 2025 4:35:21 GMT
I'm sick to my stomach and awake in the middle of the night about a lot of things but this one is personal. My daughter is a biochemistry major at an R1 public research university. I'll come sit with you. My daughter is a second year PhD student in Chemistry at a major public university researching small molecule therapeutics for cancer treatment. She has worked her a$$ off since she was a sophomore in high school to achieve her dream of contributing to finding new treatments for cancer and now this! Her lab *thinks* they will be able to fully support all their current graduate students through their program of study, but it's going to be rough. And there is talk of no new graduate student admissions at all. We will lose an entire generation of scientists and scientific research from the effects of this administration. Heavens only knows how many more people will suffer and die from this wholesale war on science and education. I just can't any more... Absolutely, getting rid of CTSI funding for students that goes to the university funding is devastating. I can't say what our small molecule for cancer is, because then you will know my identity. We will loose these students. I don't encourage my DD and DS, who is a sophomore in highschool to pursue a science degree. Although, DD wants to pursue law/journalism/policy... damn.. that seems destroyed, too. I'm not sure what to do to guide the future for students. |
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Post by Merge on Mar 18, 2025 7:10:05 GMT
I read, though I can’t find the link just now, that the Trump admin has been disappointed to realize that their funding cuts don’t affect the arts and humanities, which generally don’t receive any federal funds. Those are the departments where all the “woke” is happening, you see.
I suspect what we’ll see next is a refusal to allow federal student loans for people majoring in arts, humanities, or education. And won’t that be fun. Business and science only.
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