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Post by crimsoncat05 on Mar 18, 2015 21:15:52 GMT
I am not mis-understanding anything, and I am not trying to make anyone feel uncomfortable. I'm just trying to clarify whether abstaining from ALL alcohol actually means ALL alcohol, or just some... I totally get that certain people have reasons for not drinking.
But to me, there is ALSO the perception on this thread that anyone who DOES choose to drink or use alcohol of any kind is boozing it up, trying to turn little kids into alcoholics, and that the only thing that ALL alcohol is 'good for' is getting plastered.
^^^ ALL of these things are not true, not just the ONE viewpoint.
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Post by genny on Mar 18, 2015 21:17:14 GMT
I probably wouldn't send them to school because you never know how some people would react and it could possibly send the wrong message, but I would let my kids eat them, and now that I know they exist will probably make them some time soon. I wouldn't be pissed if my kids at them elsewhere either. Just way to many other things to get bent out of shape about and that's not one of them. Now…don't offer my kid a beer or a shot though, that you'll find a monster in your face. But I don't think this is anywhere near that level...
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Post by Darcy Collins on Mar 18, 2015 21:23:31 GMT
I wouldn't send them. I'm not too fond of the name, Irish Car Bomb cupcakes either. Kinda tasteless, IMO. Ugh you're right that's awful. I went through so many variations - all pretty much the same that I didn't even notice what she named them when I pulled it up. |
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Deleted
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Apr 20, 2024 4:11:41 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2015 21:38:15 GMT
And Irish Car Bomb is the name of an alcoholic drink so that to me adds another level than just "being a cupcake". They are specifically meant to mimic the alcoholic version. "Irish Car Bomb is one of the most popular drinks worldwide. The ingredients are simple and widely available, and beer lovers will almost certainly enjoy it. If you ask for one of these in an Irish pub you'll be greeted with either a smile, or a black eye. Enjoy! 3/4 pint Guinness® stout 1/2 shot Bailey's® Irish cream 1/2 shot Jameson® Irish whiskey Add the Bailey's and Jameson to a shot glass, layering the Bailey's on the bottom. Pour the Guinness into a pint glass or beer mug 3/4 of the way full and let settle. Drop the shot glass into the Guinness and chug. If you don't drink it fast enough it will curdle and increasingly taste worse. Read more: Irish Car Bomb recipe www.drinksmixer.com/drink7774.html#ixzz3Um8nUSx2" I'm not so sure I would want my kids googling Irish Car bomb either.... To me, it is more than just about a "small bit of alcohol" than knowing and following the school's policies and not truly wanting to introduce alcohol as fun/tasty in treats. Yes, I cook spaghetti with wine, chili with beer, beer can chicken etc. But those aren't treats. But then again we have a history of alcoholism in our family tree (both sides on mine) and I just try to keep the use to mostly cooking vs baking/drinking. That said my 12 yr old nephew had a pack of cards where each playing card was the picture of an alcoholic drink and the recipe was on the other side. Personally at 12, I thought it was very inappropriate. And all the adults (other than his mom) thought it wasn't the right thing for a 12 year old to have. But we aren't the parents and could do nothing about it. |
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AmeliaBloomer
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,842
Location: USA
Jun 26, 2014 5:01:45 GMT
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Mar 18, 2015 21:44:15 GMT
...but given that my dds middle school and high school find the sight of her bare shoulders so shocking she can't wear a tank top to school...they for sure aren't ready for Guinness cupcakes. BIG TANGENT: In my experience, people don't write dress codes rules because they are "Tut, tut"ers who are too easily shocked. Truly. Tank tops: Hold up a tank top made 15 years ago and one made today. Today's is often cut completely differently - and of much thinner fabric. A buxom girl in a tank top and push-up bra can end up looking like the serving wench at the Renaissance Faire. And that's BEFORE she leans over to light the Bunsen burner.  Yes, a smaller breasted girl can look fine. But mentioning a girl's cleavage is really fraught these days, and there's an increasing chance Rennaissance Girl and her parents will go to the mat - TO THE MAT, I tell you - parsing dress code rules and pointing out "unfairness" in enforcement. So, rules become increasingly narrow - and then look goofy. |
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Post by lucyg on Mar 18, 2015 21:48:56 GMT
I understand it. Vanilla extract and cough syrup have other purposes. They're for cooking or medical use, and aren't intended just for for "taking the edge off," getting drunk, whatever ... purely social/relaxation purposes. What is the purpose of Mormons abstaining from alcohol? I am under the impression it's because of the "mind altering" qualities of alcohol, but truthfully, I don't know for sure. I'm not Mormon and I am a drinker (a light drinker ... I don't want the peas to start talking about me now).  Maybe one of our LDS peas can answer your question better. |
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Post by luanne on Mar 18, 2015 21:57:01 GMT
Meh - I would feed it to my kid. And I would not be pissed if someone gave it to my kid. But probably I would not feed it to kids at school. I don't think I want to be the one explaining why you can eat a Guinness cupcake but not drink a Guinness. |
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Post by lucyg on Mar 18, 2015 22:00:02 GMT
In a public school it is and should be. Public school is the LAST place where things should be black & white. We have a responsibility to teach kids to think critically. Tania, I am not a fan of zero-tolerance policies, either, but you have clearly never dealt with a U.S. public school system if you think you'd be taking this one up the chain of command. You can raise all the ruckus you like, but your child would be serving that suspension and no one's going to bend the rules for you. I wouldn't have a problem with my child eating that cupcake, but there's no way I'd be sending them to school, even just one for my own kid, precisely because I know the likelihood that my kid would end up suspended for bringing alcohol to school. I just read this horror story the other day: VA school suspends 11yo for a year for bringing dried herb that was NOT marijuana to school
You think I would risk my child's education over a Bailey's cupcake in this kind of environment? I think you would be homeschooling after your first run-in with the school district. |
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AmeliaBloomer
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Mar 18, 2015 22:04:39 GMT
Well them make sure that the cough syrup doesn't have any alcohol in it. Some of the script versions do have a form of alcohol in them.
I am out of this thread.
To live a life where absolutely no coffee and absolutely no alcohol in this day & age seems rather far out to me.
But then, I don't know any LDS people. Not a huge religion where I live.
So much for the lemoncello in my lemon pie and no kaluha in my coffee cake.
Each to their own.
And remember to NOT accept the yummy home-made vanilla extract that someone made for you as a Christmas gift. Wha...huh?  The topic is whether cupcakes that contain (brand name) alcohol are verboten in a school of minors. I don't drink, but I use vanilla extract and would happily accept a gift of it from you. I also accept gifted wine with a smile (and then give it away!). I think many non-drinkers are like me. Who ya' so mad at? (And you might be surprised how many people don't accept "No, thank you" when I'm offered a drink. They can be very persistent. So, it cuts both ways. Everybody can live as they want - with their personal choices.) |
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Post by crimsoncat05 on Mar 18, 2015 22:05:02 GMT
I am so glad we don't have kids... if we did, I'd probably be home-schooling them, with asinine policies like that.
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cycworker
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by cycworker on Mar 18, 2015 22:05:07 GMT
Public school is the LAST place where things should be black & white. We have a responsibility to teach kids to think critically. Tania, I am not a fan of zero-tolerance policies, either, but you have clearly never dealt with a U.S. public school system if you think you'd be taking this one up the chain of command. You can raise all the ruckus you like, but your child would be serving that suspension and no one's going to bend the rules for you. I wouldn't have a problem with my child eating that cupcake, but there's no way I'd be sending them to school, even just one for my own kid, precisely because I know the likelihood that my kid would end up suspended for bringing alcohol to school. I just read this horror story the other day: VA school suspends 11yo for a year for bringing dried herb that was NOT marijuana to school
You think I would risk my child's education over a Bailey's cupcake in this kind of environment? I think you would be homeschooling after your first run-in with the school district. thanks Lucy. I admit, while I have some knowledge of US public schools, I didn`t quite get how strict they are. Here, the district would not want the media attention and they`d turn a blind eye to Bailey`s cupcake in an individual child`s lunch. Bake sale would be a different kettle of fish, but we wouldn`t the parent`s rights debate that would ensue. We`ve lost too many times. |
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Deleted
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Apr 20, 2024 4:11:41 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2015 22:05:38 GMT
Public school is the LAST place where things should be black & white. We have a responsibility to teach kids to think critically. Tania, I am not a fan of zero-tolerance policies, either, but you have clearly never dealt with a U.S. public school system if you think you'd be taking this one up the chain of command. You can raise all the ruckus you like, but your child would be serving that suspension and no one's going to bend the rules for you. I wouldn't have a problem with my child eating that cupcake, but there's no way I'd be sending them to school, even just one for my own kid, precisely because I know the likelihood that my kid would end up suspended for bringing alcohol to school. I just read this horror story the other day: VA school suspends 11yo for a year for bringing dried herb that was NOT marijuana to school
You think I would risk my child's education over a Bailey's cupcake in this kind of environment? I think you would be homeschooling after your first run-in with the school district. See and even I agree that case is ridiculous. But I understand schools not wanting drugs, alcohol or weapons. That school went way too far. |
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Post by elaine on Mar 18, 2015 22:08:33 GMT
I want to know whose public schools here have anything BUT a zero tolerance policy for students bringing alcohol on campus? For me, it isn't about whether my child shared them or not, or what other parents think or not, it is about knowingly sending my child in with a contraband subtance. Would you encourage parents who live where pot is legal to bring in to school goodies made with marijuana in them? Even if they didn't share? If you wouldn't, why is that any different than thinking it is okay to send in goodies baked with alcohol? Zero tolerance is zero tolerance. Kids get sent home for having aspirin or butter knives in their backpacks. Why would you send something in that could get your kid kicked out? Again, I have no problem with my kids eating Guinness cupcakes outside of school. Do you think the school's zero tolerance for alcohol would also ban the vanilla extract in the cupcakes? Why would a teaspoon of 90 proof alcohol be okay, but a teaspoon of 20 proof alcohol be a problem? If you can't see the difference between a batch of Guinness cupcakes made with a cup of beer and a batch of cupcakes that has 1 teaspoon of vanilla extract - I use vanilla paste because I prefer the taste - I can't help you. I can also say that I wouldn't be surprised if a parent made a to-do about someone bringing in cupcakes with vanilla extract in them due to the alcohol in the extract that those treats would also be banned. Around here, they WILL err on the side of caution/ zero tolerance. ETA: I am in VA, btw. See Lucy's horror story. If it is a battle you want to fight, go ahead. It isn't one that I'd subject my kids to when they could simply eat said cupcakes at home. It is literally one of the last issues I'd fall on my sword about. Would you be okay with baked goods with pot in them coming in to school in states where it is legal? |
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Post by lucyg on Mar 18, 2015 22:13:36 GMT
Oh, I agree it's ridiculous. And maybe someone younger than me would have the energy to fight this battle. But they still are unlikely to win. ETA above is addressed to @scrappower and cycworker |
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Dani-Mani
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by Dani-Mani on Mar 18, 2015 22:13:43 GMT
I keep hearing the `zero tolerance`remark and I`ll say it again, as I`ve said before when I hear that phrase: Zero tolerance is zero thinking. Life`s not black and white. In a public school it is and should be. No it should not be. I know a child who took his backpack hunting with his dad. He realized on the bus there was still a knife in the inside pocket. He got to school and went straight to the office and turned it in. He was still expelled. Straight A honors kid who never once had a discipline problem. Zero tolerance my ass. |
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Deleted
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Apr 20, 2024 4:11:41 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2015 22:15:13 GMT
In a public school it is and should be. No it should not be. I know a child who took his backpack hunting with his dad. He realized on the bus there was still a knife in the inside pocket. He got to school and went straight to the office and turned it in. He was still expelled. Straight A honors kid who never once had a discipline problem. Zero tolerance my ass. And I disagree. Shrug |
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AmeliaBloomer
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Mar 18, 2015 22:23:22 GMT
Public school is the LAST place where things should be black & white. We have a responsibility to teach kids to think critically. If you're the middle school principal who has to answer 17 (37? 77?) emails from parents whose kids came home with some fabulous, embellished, social media-fueled story of Guiness-Bailey's-eating-drunken-girls at lunch today, this would definitely NOT be the critical thinking hill you would choose to die on... I suspect you would be astonished at the diversity of opinions/reactions of parents and community members, the constituents of the public school. In response, or just to stem the tide, black and white become the colors of the season. Battles are chosen carefully (after consulting attorneys...). (And yes, there have been some (not many) major missteps by schools over zero tolerance of "weapons." Stupid people are everywhere. Sometimes they run schools.) |
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loco coco
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Post by loco coco on Mar 18, 2015 22:31:51 GMT
In a public school it is and should be. Public school is the LAST place where things should be black & white. We have a responsibility to teach kids to think critically. I agree with you and think zero tolerance has gotten out of hand. Every issue is different and should be looked at that way by the administrators. Im a person who believes "better safe than sorry, so on this issue there is no way I would send them to the school. However, if another parent did and my kid had one I wouldn't care |
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Post by CarolT on Mar 18, 2015 22:35:51 GMT
I would have let my kids have those cupcakes, at home, when they were in middle school without batting an eye. If someone sent them in to school, and I found out about it, I would have thought it was a poor choice on the part of the parent. Not school appropriate. And, for the record, I love Guiness, but don't like Bailey's, lol  |
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Post by myboysnme on Mar 18, 2015 22:42:31 GMT
The alcohol cooking out thing isn't as cut and dry as once was believed. There is usually zero tolerance for that kind of things in school. I say no way. Just not worth it. I am allergic to alcohol. If I had a dollar for every time I heard it cooks out I could pay cash for the times I went to the hospital because it is was in food and I was told it wasn't. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2015 22:43:09 GMT
The alcohol cooking out thing isn't as cut and dry as once was believed. There is usually zero tolerance for that kind of things in school. I say no way. Just not worth it. I am allergic to alcohol. If I had a dollar for every time I heard it cooks out I could pay cash for the times I went to the hospital because it is was in food and I was told it wasn't. Yup that is my Dh's issue too. Along with a history of alcoholism. |
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Post by myboysnme on Mar 18, 2015 22:48:37 GMT
I am allergic to alcohol. If I had a dollar for every time I heard it cooks out I could pay cash for the times I went to the hospital because it is was in food and I was told it wasn't. Yup that is my Dh's issue too. Along with a history of alcoholism. My family has so much alcoholism that I really think my alcoholism gene was altered somehow causing severe intolerance instead of increased tolerance. |
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cycworker
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by cycworker on Mar 18, 2015 22:53:39 GMT
In a public school it is and should be. No it should not be. I know a child who took his backpack hunting with his dad. He realized on the bus there was still a knife in the inside pocket. He got to school and went straight to the office and turned it in. He was still expelled. Straight A honors kid who never once had a discipline problem. Zero tolerance my ass. Exactly. And I guess the point I`m trying to make is that I can`t even see the school finding out about it. No harm, no foul. As I said in another thread, no teacher in our district is going to question what kind of cupcake a student brings in their lunch from home. But that said, even though we`ve changed our vending machines to remove `junk food,`(Grr. Don`t get me started on THAT stupid provincial decision) we do NOT police what parents send from home, beyond rules we have re: nuts. You want to send your kid with the small bags of Cheetos or chips, or cookies or chocolate bars or cupcakes, it falls into your child, your choice. |
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cycworker
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,375
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Post by cycworker on Mar 18, 2015 22:55:57 GMT
Public school is the LAST place where things should be black & white. We have a responsibility to teach kids to think critically. If you're the middle school principal who has to answer 17 (37? 77?) emails from parents whose kids came home with some fabulous, embellished, social media-fueled story of Guiness-Bailey's-eating-drunken-girls at lunch today, this would definitely NOT be the critical thinking hill you would choose to die on... I suspect you would be astonished at the diversity of opinions/reactions of parents and community members, the constituents of the public school. In response, or just to stem the tide, black and white become the colors of the season. Battles are chosen carefully (after consulting attorneys...). (And yes, there have been some (not many) major missteps by schools over zero tolerance of "weapons." Stupid people are everywhere. Sometimes they run schools.) Again, around here I can`t even imagine the principal finding out. They weren`t cupcakes for the whole class. They were a treat for 1 student and a few friends. The kids around here wouldn`t even think to mention it. |
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AmeliaBloomer
Drama Llama
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Jun 26, 2014 5:01:45 GMT
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Mar 18, 2015 23:07:48 GMT
Again, around here I can`t even imagine the principal finding out. They weren`t cupcakes for the whole class. They were a treat for 1 student and a few friends. The kids around here wouldn`t even think to mention it. Y'all must have a surfeit of admirably mature critical thinker kids up there. It could start with an innocent comment: "Oh, I had the best cupcake today. Suzie brought them. They were made from..." Then it takes on a life if its own. Or it doesn't. You never know. If I had a nickel for every ridiculously exaggerated rumor I have seen simmer, cook and explode among middle (and high) school students (even pre-internet) in thirty years, I could...I could...hell, I could buy the Guiness brewery. btw: In addition to school and parent rules, the potential for misunderstanding or exaggeration is a big reason *I* wouldn't send the cupcakes. I don't think I ever said that in my posts. But those might be uniquely American reasons. |
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Post by elaine on Mar 18, 2015 23:35:01 GMT
If you're the middle school principal who has to answer 17 (37? 77?) emails from parents whose kids came home with some fabulous, embellished, social media-fueled story of Guiness-Bailey's-eating-drunken-girls at lunch today, this would definitely NOT be the critical thinking hill you would choose to die on... I suspect you would be astonished at the diversity of opinions/reactions of parents and community members, the constituents of the public school. In response, or just to stem the tide, black and white become the colors of the season. Battles are chosen carefully (after consulting attorneys...). (And yes, there have been some (not many) major missteps by schools over zero tolerance of "weapons." Stupid people are everywhere. Sometimes they run schools.) Again, around here I can`t even imagine the principal finding out. They weren`t cupcakes for the whole class. They were a treat for 1 student and a few friends. The kids around here wouldn`t even think to mention it. Around here, kids talk. Kids exaggerate. Kids gossip. Kids would think it really coooool that there were Guinness cupcakes at their table. Even if they weren't eating them. Because kids know that alcohol is contraband here, it would be the worst kept secret since Selena Gomez dumped Justin Beiber. I actually have a harder time imagining that at least a handful of teachers wouldn't find out by the end of the day. Given that I think we are talking middle school, it would be a large handful. |
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ginacivey
Pearl Clutcher
refupea #2 in southeast missouri
Posts: 4,685
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Post by ginacivey on Mar 19, 2015 0:01:16 GMT
you'd end up with kids figuring out there was alcohol used...and then they'd end up 'drunk'
consider that catastrophe
gina
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Post by crimsoncat05 on Mar 19, 2015 0:03:16 GMT
^^^ I thought that said 'consider that apostrophe' and I couldn't, for the life of me, figure out where grammar came into this whole thing!! lol!!
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Post by Belia on Mar 19, 2015 0:20:46 GMT
I would feed them to my own kids at home but NO WAY would I send them to school, and I would be pretty shocked and appalled if another parent sent them to school for kids' consumption. It's just not proper. Alcohol treats aren't appropriate for school.
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Post by anonrefugee on Mar 19, 2015 0:29:33 GMT
you'd end up with kids figuring out there was alcohol used...and then they'd end up 'drunk' consider that catastrophe gina You're right! There would be the one advanced kid who knows about Bailey's and Guinness. He'd be (impossibly) drunk and have the whole cupcake contingent convinced they are too. In our town, who cares what the school board said? News crews would be on scene within the hour! There have been some strange cases, but I'm not sure anyone would keep a straight face if anyone championed the Guinness = Vanilla argument in school. Unless Guinness is now owned by one of the district's "sponsors". In that case, you might gain some traction... |
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