~Lauren~
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Jun 26, 2014 3:33:18 GMT
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Post by ~Lauren~ on Jul 12, 2014 13:32:06 GMT
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Post by fkawitchypea on Jul 12, 2014 13:41:14 GMT
I'm with the school district. Unless the school is already providing the child with a one on one aide, what are they supposed to do? Provide a full time employee to walk next to the child with the dog? The dog provides the child with a better quality of life, yes, but apparently the child could continue to take seizure medication and go to school without the dog. If the parents want to make this choice for their child, good for them, but the school shouldn't have to pay the expense.
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gsquaredmom
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Jun 26, 2014 17:43:22 GMT
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Post by gsquaredmom on Jul 12, 2014 13:44:11 GMT
My district would pay, just as we pay for a nurse for medical needs if needed. If the child also needs a one- one for academics, they get that, as well.
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katybee
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Jun 25, 2014 23:25:39 GMT
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Post by katybee on Jul 12, 2014 13:46:47 GMT
I had a little girl with a full time nurse (she had a tracheotomy) and the district didn't pay. In her case the state did (Medicaid). But if a child is unable to attend school for medical reasons, I believe the district is required to send a teacher to his home... (i'm talking about my state. I am not familiar with the story that you are referring to...)
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TankTop
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Post by TankTop on Jul 12, 2014 13:48:29 GMT
I feel for the family, I do.
As a teacher I would not want to be responsible for this animal. I have a primary job to do...service all children. If I had to command/watch this dog I do not see how I could do my primary job. I had a student last year who had to hold my hand or he would not walk in the halls or outside the classroom. This was very difficult. Much more so than I imagined before actually being put in the situation. For instance, I once saw one of my students slipping. I tried to get to this student to prevent the fall. I could not get there in time because of the hand holding.
I also feel this opens up a huge can of worms. What about the student that needs a wheelchair? Could they argue the school must provide it for their child to attend school? The fact is we do not find schools for these sort of expenses. We barely fund them enough to keep the doors open as it is.
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TankTop
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Post by TankTop on Jul 12, 2014 13:50:58 GMT
I wanted to add, I would have no problem with an aide being in my room to handle the dog.
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Post by CarolinaGirl71 on Jul 12, 2014 14:00:09 GMT
I'm torn on this one, too- but if the dog doesn't come with him and the boy has a seizure at school, I'll bet his teacher would be glad to help with the dog after that. However, this has the potential to take away time from other students who may have separate but equal needs so I can see the need for a handler, similar to assistants who are assigned to a special needs student and go with them for the entire day. But in those cases the school pays for it.
I do think the dog/handler are necessary for him to safely attend school, I disagree with the school official who said that the boy doesn't have to have the dog.
I wish the article stated who would give the seizure preventive meds- does the teacher have it to give immediately, or do they have to call or go to the nurse? This gets complicated when the student changes classes and has more than one teacher/classroom.
ETA- Tank Top, I posted before I read your response. I really don't see how a teacher could handle the dog and teach at the same time. I just know it's very upsetting in a classroom when a child has a seizure.
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Post by ihaveonly1l on Jul 12, 2014 14:10:03 GMT
I would assume that the expectation isn't that the teacher would handle the dog, but that the school would provide a paraprofessional to handle the dog. Perhaps this child already has a one on one para to assist him and the parents feel as though the para could handle the dog. I think providing a nurse at school covers the school since there seems to be precedence that other children have successfully attended with a nurse on the premises.
Also, any medication that the student needs wouldn't be kept right on him unless he did have a one on one aide. It would be unsafe to have medications around in case another child ingested them. I wouldn't be responsible to administer the medications as a classroom teacher. Those things are kept to a nurse.
Another issue that may be encountered is allergies. I've had students in the past and my own son who is allergic to dogs. Is this dog a hypoallergenic breed? If my son was in a classroom with a dog, he would have sneezed and wheezed all day.
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Post by freecharlie on Jul 12, 2014 14:14:45 GMT
Schools are required to provide FAPE, but they do not have to provide the world. In this case, the child is too young to be the handler, so the parents need to decide between paying for a handler (not too expensive) and returning the boy to medication. If the parents would rather, they could also choose homebound until the boy is old enough to be the dog's handler.
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TankTop
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Post by TankTop on Jul 12, 2014 14:36:08 GMT
I wish the article stated who would give the seizure preventive meds- does the teacher have it to give immediately, or do they have to call or go to the nurse? This gets complicated when the student changes classes and has more than one teacher/classroom. With medication or the dog, an aide would not be needed for a seizure student unless their seizures are frequent, as in multiple per day. In that case I doubt the student would be mainstreamed. As a teacher I am not permitted to dispense or hold any medications. I can't even keep cough drops in the room when a child brings them in. Last time I had a student who had seizures I assigned four students as runners. 1 called the office from our classroom phone, 1 went to the classroom to the left to alert the teacher, 1 to the classroom to the right to alert the teacher, and one to the office. I never wanted to be in a situation where I could not contact the office due to a busy signal. All other students immediately got up and quietly walked to the classroom across the hall.
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Post by Lexica on Jul 12, 2014 14:44:09 GMT
I would think that a handler could be provided for less than $125 per week. Couldn't the family have a family member accompany the child to provide the signals to the dog until the boy is old enough to do it himself? This is provided there is someone in the family that would be available to do so. I wouldn't think the school is responsible for providing someone since there are other alternatives to educating this child. The parents chose this method and they should be able to provide a handler as well. Even if that handler came from a pool of eligible college students that were able to share the responsibility based on their availability.
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Post by Skellinton on Jul 12, 2014 14:47:58 GMT
"Thurman pointed out that, according to the ADA guidelines, "Staff are not required to provide care or food for a service animal."
The family claims that such a statement is misleading -- and does not make clear the school isn't required to provide a handler. Michelle Sorrells described "handling" Majesty as, "simply holding her leash and using one-word commands." "
To me the family is using the word handle vs care to get their way, and the ADA needs to clarify what they meant by that statement as it is way to vague! I can't believe the family is really obtuse enough to expect the teacher to take on the dog solo. A classroom teacher is not with her students full time, there is recess, music, Pe, sometimes art classes, and lunch where the student is with other teachers. Are they all going to be trained? I am also surprised this child doesn't already have a para educator in place. We had a student at our school who had seizures and there was a trained para educator with her at all times. Besides the logistical problems (child moving from teacher to teacher and having to have all staff trained and passing of the medicine) it just seems unreasonable to add this burden to a classroom teacher. I do feel the school district should provide a para educator for the student and his service animal though.
Regarding the allergy question, it is a golden retriever, so no not a hypo allergenic dog, I imagine a student with allergies would not be placed in this child's class, but that should be handled before the start of the school year when the class lists are made.
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Post by Basket1lady on Jul 12, 2014 14:53:00 GMT
I feel for the little boy and his parents. But the classroom teacher should not be responsible for the dog in any way. Surely the organization that trained the dog discussed this? How can a teacher be responsible for bathroom breaks and controlling the dog? It's not just one dog. It's the dog, the ADD kids, the diabetic kid, the peanut allergy kid... And 25 young children in a classroom. It's too much responsibility for one human.
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Post by Basket1lady on Jul 12, 2014 15:00:11 GMT
Jul 12, 2014 9:44:09 GMT -5 Lexica said: I would think that a handler could be provided for less than $125 per week. ---------------------------------
$125 a week is $25 a day. Our elementary school is in session for 7 hours each day. That's just over $3 an hour. I don't see how it could be any cheaper. I would volunteer my time before I took the commitment of a $3 an hour job.
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Post by Merge on Jul 12, 2014 15:04:49 GMT
We're required to provide appropriate public education, not exactly-as-you'd-like-it public education. There are other options for this boy as others have pointed out. I feel for him and his family, but cannot fathom the disruption a dog and handler would cause. Never mind kids who are allergic.
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Post by shanni on Jul 12, 2014 15:08:04 GMT
The parent are saying that the teacher wouldn't have to feed or walk the dog; they would just have to give one word commands. I don't know anything about service animals, but I have a hard time believing that any dog could go 7 hours without food, water, or a potty break!
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Post by BeckyTech on Jul 12, 2014 15:14:17 GMT
One thing I haven't seen mentioned yet, but my first thought was that if the school provided a handler that would also make them liable for any problems with the dog, for instance if the dog nipped or bit someone. I can't blame them for not wanting to take that on.
ETA: Shanni, they would certainly need water. A full-grown dog of that size would have no problem going without a potty break for 7 hours (although I'm sure they would like one.)
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RosieKat
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Post by RosieKat on Jul 12, 2014 15:19:37 GMT
I don't think school districts should be required to provide anything above the minimum a child needs to obtain an education safely. (And for the record, I say this as a parent of at least one child with medical and behavioral accommodations.) It sounds like the boy can safely take the medication and attend school. While I fully, fully appreciate preferring not to medicate him 24/7, the fact remains that using the service dog is a more expensive route and isn't the only option for him. I think the school district should be required to ALLOW the dog (which doesn't sound like it's a problem), but any extra costs need to be absorbed by the family. FAPE is free, appropriate - not free no matter what you choose.
As an aside, as a parent, I would be nervous about sending my son out there in the busy school environment where the dog would alert someone to a seizure. Schools are busy places - could the dog really get a teacher/adult's attention soon enough to get the medication to the boy? My response time as a parent is one thing, but my response time as a teacher would be another. (Not by choice, just by the fact of having more people around, etc.) I am sure the parents have considered all of this, I'm just wondering.
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Post by Pahina722 on Jul 12, 2014 15:26:03 GMT
In a perfect world, the school district would hire another para-professional whose sole duty is to deal with that dog 7 hours a day, 5 days a week. But this isn't a perfect world. Public schools don't have the funding (or the mandate) to provide that kind of service. Since the child COULD be on medication which would prevent the seizures but the family has chosen to use the service dog instead, it is the family's responsibility to provide and pay for the handler to deal with the dog until the child is old enough to do so himself.
I feel for the family. I understand that they are trying to provide the best quality of life for their son, but when their choices are going to impact the quality of education for other children (how much good could another para do for a whole class, as opposed to one child?), they get to pony up.
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Deleted
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Apr 24, 2024 11:46:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2014 15:26:57 GMT
I'm with the school district. Unless the school is already providing the child with a one on one aide, what are they supposed to do? Provide a full time employee to walk next to the child with the dog? The dog provides the child with a better quality of life, yes, but apparently the child could continue to take seizure medication and go to school without the dog. If the parents want to make this choice for their child, good for them, but the school shouldn't have to pay the expense. ITA
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Post by momofkandn on Jul 12, 2014 15:29:34 GMT
I don't believe the school should have to pay for the handler. We wouldn't expect them to pay for wheelchairs for students that can't walk? It is up to the parents (or insurance, public assistance, private donation) to pay for any equipment the child may need to handle their disability. I see both the service dog and the handler in a similar way to other equipment. Under ADA, it is the school's responsibility to provide reasonable accommodations for that equipment such as ramps and even letting a handler be present in the classroom. But paying for a handler for the dog goes beyond reasonable in my mind.
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Post by stampinbetsy on Jul 12, 2014 15:49:14 GMT
I used to be a teacher, and I think having the dog in the classroom could not be something the teacher needs to be in charge of. If the child can't handle the dog (and I think the issue here may be more the child's disabilities rather than age, even though that's what it said in the article), then someone besides the teacher needs to do whatever handling is necessary. What kind of commands do you need to give to a seizure dog? I'm thinking that the handler is really on the family - it would be nice if the school would provide someone, but I don't think they have to. Someone else already brought up whether or not this child already has an aide. And what kind of classroom environment is this child in - mainstream or self-contained special ed? Or a mixture of the two?
I think there's a lot more to this story than the article states - and that there are alternatives that maybe the family is refusing to discuss.
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Post by gmcwife1 on Jul 12, 2014 16:28:20 GMT
Family's choice on how to manage child's needs, family needs to pay/provide not the school.
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Post by karen on Jul 12, 2014 16:50:58 GMT
The family needs to pay. It is nice that the child has the dog and doesn't have to have medication, but the school district should not have to be burdened because of this.
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Deleted
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Apr 24, 2024 11:46:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2014 17:05:32 GMT
There are other options for learning if the public school does not accommodate to your liking.
However, the article did not state whether there was a 1-to-1 relation between the child and the instructor. If there is this type of relationship it would seem that providing an additional stipend to the teacher to "handle" the dog would appease everyone in this situation. The parents would pay the additional stipend. Caring for the dog during school hours would not amount to $125 a week, IMHO. Then again, I am all about alternative therapy versus pill-popping to fix a problem.
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moodyblue
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Jun 26, 2014 21:07:23 GMT
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Post by moodyblue on Jul 12, 2014 17:14:54 GMT
Like Stampinbetsy, I wonder about some things that aren't really made clear in that article.
Other children this age have service dogs and are fine handling the dogs by themselves at school, so I wonder if the child's disabilities are a factor, rather than his age? Also, what kind of classroom is he in and are there aides in that room?
As far as the parental decision to use the service dog rather than have him on meds all the time, it might be that the meds he would need to take have side effects that are undesirable. I think it's easy to say they have the option to have him on meds if they want him to attend school, but maybe those meds cause problems they want to avoid.
Cases like these aren't easy, because how do you weigh the rights of one child against the rights of others (kids who are allergic to dogs, for example)? And who pays when a student needs special help? In my district, a full-time nurse was paid for, rather than the part-time we had at the junior high, for one student who had a life-threatening condition. School board didn't even question it; they knew he could die if the nurse wasn't there to administer the meds if needed (student needed a heart transplant).
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2014 17:20:57 GMT
There is a lot the article doesn't cover. Like why the decision to take him off of full time medication? It seems the family has arbitrarily picked a life choice that the patient is too young to deal with on his own. So they are going to need to adjust other choices that go along with it like paying someone to go as a handler, choosing a different educational setting (homebound schooling or a private school that is willing to accommodate the presence of a dog) OR wait to use a service dog at school until he is old/mature enough to be the handler himself. He can use the dog after school, week ends, holidays but make another control choice during the school week.
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sweetpeasmom
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Post by sweetpeasmom on Jul 12, 2014 17:30:23 GMT
When my son was in 2nd grade, there was a child in his class that was a severe diabetic. He had a paraprofessional assigned to him and she went wherever he went. With that said, she also was a big help in general to the teacher. I don't see this as any different. Hire someone that is responsible for the dog but that is also able to help the teacher out. It's a win/win, IMO.
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jodis
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Jun 25, 2014 19:21:25 GMT
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Post by jodis on Jul 12, 2014 17:32:11 GMT
As a Mom whose child used to have seizures, have medication easily accessible to him while at school (an EA with specialized training allowed to give medication) and have an EA with him at all times for the first two years of school, I'm for having the dog in the classroom, but I would have paid the handler myself. I wouldn't have expected the school to do more as they were already doing a lot for my son.
Also having the dog in the classroom would be a lot less disruptive than my son having a seizure and scaring the other kids. During the time my son was at this school, the custodian was deaf and had a service dog with him at all times. He wore the vest and the school children all knew not to pat him or distract him when he was wearing the service vest. They never had a problem.
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TankTop
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Post by TankTop on Jul 12, 2014 17:35:56 GMT
As a teacher I am not permitted to administer medication.
Wonder if the handler is allowed to administer medication when the dog alerts?
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