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Post by scrapperal on Jul 31, 2014 5:15:47 GMT
I try to buy tools or adhesive or embellishments for whatever I'm working on. My LSS closed, but reopened with a new owner. Gotta help keep the lights on!
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mallie
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,253 
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Post by mallie on Jul 31, 2014 12:19:24 GMT
I usually found that my croppers were not my shoppers and I came to the conclusion that the croppers, really, just wanted a night out away from kids and family. I think the above is the norm and the reality of being a LSS owner. A crop needs to be seen largely as a loss leader for the purposes of building long-term store loyalty. It's a mistake, generally, to expect a crop to be a means to sell product. As someone who's owned a business and knows lots of small business owners, the reality is that part of having a loss leader is being able to afford it as part of the cost of doing business; if a store cannot afford a loss leader, then they should not have it. As an example, I know two women who own a jewelry-making store. They offer a once a month wine and pendant party. For $5, you can come in and make two glass pendants and sip wine they provide for 2 hours or so. They make no money on the party and don't expect to do so. In fact, they itemize the costs for it under their advertising budget line. When you do come in, they always ask if you've attended the party -- it's a way track if it's working and to advertise it. As they said to me, when the party stops working as an advertising device, they'll find another way of advertising. Another reality is that small business owners cannot expect to survive long term on customer loyalty. It's a business, not a charity. You have to provide the products they want at the price point they want to pay. If the customers don't want to pay the price point that enables a livable profit and/or if the store does not have the product the customers want, the store will not stay in business. |
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Post by triplettkarla on Jul 31, 2014 13:56:46 GMT
I want to crop at your store!! The LSS I go to 15.00 in product and snacks to buy. Wish there was wifi there would go more if there was. but, it is a nice place and the people are really great, and it's really fun to be with friends and it is really comfy I really try to buy i want her to stay she is moving to smaller store and really trying so want to support her. It's hard joann's is close and hobby lobby, and it seems they are always having sales, so we dont talk or show it's just a good time there.
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Post by guzismom on Jul 31, 2014 14:10:43 GMT
My thought is that if you like having a local place to get away for scrapping, you should support the store and buy what you can there even if it's just cardstock, adhesives, cutting machine mats, whatever. Odds are that the amount she is charging barely covers the costs to keep the lights and heat/air on for those additional hours the store is open, so just going there and paying the fee to scrap isn't really helping her to be profitable enough to stay in business for the long haul. If she has a lot of older inventory, that in and of itself is a good sign that she's not turning things over quickly enough. Oftentimes crops and classes are loss leaders that are merely a vehicle to get shoppers in the door in the hopes that they will buy something the store owner can actually make a little money on. Every dollar you spend in the store will help that retailer buy new inventory. The old has to go before anything new can come in. I agree. I would find SOMETHING, even if it was just cardstock and adhesive, to buy. |
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Post by LavenderLayoutLady on Jul 31, 2014 14:58:31 GMT
For those of you who wouldn't feel obligated to purchase something if you have to "pay for admittance" to a crop I have a few questions for you. And I'm trying not to sound snarky, but I have this problem at the store where I have a hard time getting people to come to a $10 crop, much less buy anything while they're there. We charge $10 for a 6 hour Friday night crop and $20 for a 13 hour Saturday crop. We do not provide any meals, however we have water, sodas, coffee, tea, hot chocolate, chips, cookies, popcorn and other snacks available. They can use our Cricut machine along with 200+ cartridges, idea books, punches, free wi-fi, they share an 8 foot table with a drink/garbage holder and a Making Memories self-healing mat at their spot. So, for that, we will have to pay an employee for 6 or 12 hours to be there. Depending on where you are (and we're in the middle of nowhere Iowa) her wage could be anywhere from $8-12 an hour. So, that store owner is paying $50-75 for the employee to be there during the 6 hour crop (that doesn't count the 1/2 hour or so of clean up afterward). So that means, the first 5-8 people at the crop are just paying for the employee to be there. The other 9-? people at the crop are paying for the utilities, snacks, pop, meals if provided, Cricut cartridge purchases, tool purchases, etc. 1 - While I get you are paying for the time to be there, would you buy something if they gave you a $10 credit in purchasing that night? So, then basically, she's getting $5 to pay her employees and bills for the night, IF you buy everything at regular price. If you buy clearance items or sale items, she's getting less than the $5. 2 - If the crop were free and didn't offer any tools, snacks, water, etc would you then feel you had at least $10 to spend in product, and would you do it, or would you say, "hey, it's awesome that I get a free crop!" and not spend money? I offer two free Saturday crops a year (World Cardmaking Day and NSD) and still have people not buy a thing at the store that day. They bring in their 5 full Creative Memories totes full of stuff and sit for 13 hours not buying a thing. Honestly, I think $10 is pretty cheap entertainment for 6 hours. My mom, sister and I used to go to Archivers crops when I lived in Minneapolis and would always complain about the $35 crop fee (including pizza or pasta for dinner), saying we wish we didn't have to pay the fee either, because then we could turn around and use that $35 to buy supplies instead and feel like we had something to show for it. Now, as an owner, I totally get it. For some reason, it feels like our customers think/feel like store owners are gouging them on cost of products, fees for classes, fees for crops, etc. OK, off my soapbox now.  Just thought it would be interesting for some to hear from a store owner's perspective. If the admittance fee was $10, and $5 of it could go towards a credit to buy supplies with, I'd be all over it. And of course you know I wouldn't be able to stop at $5 worth of stuff. So i would purchase things. But I also wouldn't expect all the snackage and perks that you offer for only $10. I would think that you'd have to charge a lot more of an admittance fee to cover all of that and still be profitable. |
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Post by crazy4scraps on Jul 31, 2014 18:34:41 GMT
As an example, I know two women who own a jewelry-making store. They offer a once a month wine and pendant party. For $5, you can come in and make two glass pendants and sip wine they provide for 2 hours or so. They make no money on the party and don't expect to do so. In fact, they itemize the costs for it under their advertising budget line. When you do come in, they always ask if you've attended the party -- it's a way track if it's working and to advertise it. As they said to me, when the party stops working as an advertising device, they'll find another way of advertising. This is exactly my point. If hosting crops isn't doing *something* for the LSS other than to provide a warm fuzzy for the community, it would be time, money and effort better spent doing something else with those hours of the day and that space in the store. Retail space is very expensive and ANY use of it has to be bringing dollars into the store, period. |
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Post by chlerbie on Jul 31, 2014 19:12:59 GMT
One of my best friends ran an LSS and she really did rely on people to buy during crops--when they stopped, that really hurt her business tremendously. On her 12 hour crops, she charged 18 dollars and that included, snacks, beverages AND dinner. So, she wasn't making a tremendous amount on that, plus was putting in a more than 12 hour day--with the crop being 12 hours and then people arriving early and the cleanup after. I always tried to buy SOMETHING. Of course, it DID help that she always had new product in, but it used to irk me to see people come in with all kinds of new stuff and then not buy anything from her at the crop and her prices were just fine. If you want your LSS to stay open, you NEED to support it. She closed last year.
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Post by irisheyes on Aug 1, 2014 3:57:57 GMT
I was so sad when our local LSS closed. I miss their crop night so much. Sometimes I bought when I cropped and sometimes I didn't. If I didn't feel like packing for the crop, I would grab my pictures, cutter, and adhesive and buy everything for each layout. It was fun but took me a long time to pick everything out, so I didn't get as much done as when I pre-planned pages at home, but I loved having the lastest and greatest on those pages. Almost everything in my stash came from their store, so I didn't feel horrible on the nights I didn't spend much. They charged 10 dollars, but gave you a five dollar credit to shop with - no dinner or snacks, but they had drawings and giveaways. I miss them.
There is another LSS not too far from me, but I haven't tried out their crops. They have a swamp cooler and it warps the paper and supplies making things appear water damaged. They have a great selection though, so I may try them out after they turn the furnace on for winter.
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Post by 950nancy on Aug 1, 2014 4:05:38 GMT
I don't ever have a problem spending $10 for a crop or spending $50 while I am there. We only have one good LSS in town and I want her to stay.
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Post by 950nancy on Aug 1, 2014 4:08:56 GMT
I will also travel two hours north to Loveland and spend $50 on a 12 hour crop. They give us breakfast lunch and dinner. I hate the four hours of travel, but love the crops. Most of their food is donated because the crop is for charity.
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Post by totravel on Aug 1, 2014 6:57:56 GMT
No matter how organized I am for a crop, I always forget something, need to replenish something, or change my mind about the cardstock/pp that I brought. So I usually end up buying paper, adhesive, or embellishment.
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Post by rumplesnat on Aug 1, 2014 13:22:05 GMT
I don't necessarily feel obligated, but my LSS offers 20% off your total purchase on crop days to attendees, so that is certainly incentive!
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Post by Prenticekid on Aug 1, 2014 14:21:18 GMT
My store charges $2 an hour to use the crop area when nothing is going on, and a Friday night or Sunday afternoon crop (about 5 hours) is $10 and includes pizza. There are also "event" crops that range in price according to duration, and they also include classes, make and takes and lunches. I usually budget in an amount to shop - it is part of my fun time. I have had times where I did not shop as much, and I don't feel guilty about it all, but probably because I know my yearly totals more than cover the crop where I don't spend as much.
I do think that LSS owners need to understand that they might not get the $$ that night, but that what they provide and how they treat customers will be what adds to their bottom line. My store is an hour away, so it really does need to be someplace I want to travel to to spend my money. The staff is wonderful whether I buy a couple of sheets of cardstock during a midnighter crop or I have a larger budget to stock my stash. In the case of the OP, if she feels welcome even when there is nothing she wants to buy, she'll be there when something comes in that she does want to spend her $$ on, right?
On the other hand, I will say that over the years I've been dismayed at some of the attitudes some have had about spending $10 or $15 for a great place to come and scrap for a few hours. They remind me of the same sort of consumers who won't spend $4 for a dozen organic eggs, but will spend $4 for a latte. $10 to scrap in a space I don't have to clean up in a scrapbooking atmosphere completely surrounded by others who are creating, is just worth it, I think.
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Post by scrapperal on Aug 5, 2014 3:16:17 GMT
I just went to a crop that was 10 to 4 and cost $10, but you got a $5 credit. I wasn't planning on spending too much, but they had some dies and embellishments I that I couldn't resist, lol. This is the first time I went to a crop with that kind of fee. Even if you take out the dies, I spent more that I planned because I had the credit that I had to spend that day. So that put me in more of a spending mood than a 20% discount gives me.
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PLurker
Prolific Pea
Posts: 9,840
Location: Behind the Cheddar Curtain
Jun 28, 2014 3:48:49 GMT
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Post by PLurker on Aug 5, 2014 4:08:30 GMT
I usually buy a little something. Sometimes more. But not as much as I used to since, like many of you, I have supply overload. So why do I always feel the need for PAPER?! (I couldn't possibly use it all it this life, or the one after for that matter!)
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scrappington
Pearl Clutcher
in Canada
Posts: 3,139
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Post by scrappington on Aug 5, 2014 10:19:28 GMT
I never brought cardstock to a crop. I always just bought it there. I found that to be a lot easier. Normally I would get some embellishments too.
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scrapnnana
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,449
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Post by scrapnnana on Aug 5, 2014 13:23:40 GMT
For those of you who wouldn't feel obligated to purchase something if you have to "pay for admittance" to a crop I have a few questions for you. And I'm trying not to sound snarky, but I have this problem at the store where I have a hard time getting people to come to a $10 crop, much less buy anything while they're there. ...If the crop were free and didn't offer any tools, snacks, water, etc would you then feel you had at least $10 to spend in product, and would you do it, or would you say, "hey, it's awesome that I get a free crop!" and not spend money?...Honestly, I think $10 is pretty cheap entertainment for 6 hours. I chimed in earlier, but I want to add some clarification. First, I agree that $10 is a reasonable fee for having to keep the store open extra hours, pay the employee, and provide snacks. However, paying $10 or more for a crop meant I had less money to spend on products. What I did instead was go to the LSS during the day when the crop room was available. You either paid $3 for use of the crop room during the normal store hours, or the fee was waived if you purchased at least $5 in products. She already had her staff there during normal store hours anyway, so it was no added expense to the owner, while encouraging customers to come in and shop. I liked that option because what I would have spent on a crop fee went for scrapbook supplies, and I always bought a lot more than the required $5 minimum. Cropping during the day was also quieter. I don't get much done if the environment is too noisy and distracting. I don't want prize bags. I don't need food provided. I just want a place to gather with my friends. When cropping at the LSS, I always, always shopped and found stuff to buy. I spent LESS money in the store when I went only for a quickie shopping trip than when I went to crop. However, one gal came in every week, used the Cricut machine all day and never bought anything at all, so she took advantage of all the tools without supporting the LSS. That really bothered me. Those tools cost money to provide. The $3 crop fee was minimal. She couldn't spend $5 to support the store that provided the Cricut and tools? I always spent considerably more than the $5. The LSS provided a way for scrappers like me to come and crop, but also gave us an incentive to spend a few bucks. Win-win. I never understood those who figured their $3 fee meant they didn't need to buy anything. The LSS canceled the paid crops that didn't have enough people sign up, because the they couldn't afford an unnecessary loss. They offered both crops with food, etc., and other crops that were "no frills" where the fee just paid for the employee to be there. Towards the end, the crops got fewer and fewer. Most people seemed to prefer to go and crop during the day for the $3 fee or $5 purchase. |
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scrapperdee
Junior Member
Refupea 1827
Posts: 76
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Post by scrapperdee on Aug 5, 2014 15:37:10 GMT
I've never been to a LSS for an LSS organized crop (always full by the time I realize they are having one) BUT I do go with some friends to crop and use their crop area - they charge $5 (and we are there from open until close)...but if you buy >$5 of product (& we always spend >$30 each...since we only meet up once a year), they wave the $5 fee. I also arrive with just my tools and photos...which forces me to purchase something (well...lots). I normally am doing my scrapbooking at home with the supplies I have there...so to actually get OUT to a LSS to crop...allows me to get/use new things rather than just what's in my stash (and to replenish my stash  ) |
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Post by crazy4scraps on Aug 5, 2014 15:50:24 GMT
One of the main problems with dedicating any amount of square footage in a scrap store to crop space is that it generally doesn't generate anything even close to the amount of dollars per square foot that it could generate if it was filled with product for sale. Getting people to come in and crop (and ideally, to spend money while doing so) when the space isn't being used for classes or organized crops (which also should be designed to be an income generator for the store) is a good idea as long as they are buying something while they are occupying that space, and the space is utilized every day the store is open. But $3-5 for the day to use the space isn't actually even covering the base cost of that square footage for most retailers, especially if the chairs are empty most of the time. One 8' table alone eats up about 20 square feet of floor space, and when you add two chairs to that you can tack on another 16-24 square feet of floor space used, minimum. Even at a very modest cost of $2 per square foot, having one table plus two chairs would cost that store at least $72-96 per month. Just a little more food for thought. Having those square feet filled with inventory could potentially generate income every day. Using it for crop space, not so much.
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anniebeth24
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,778
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Post by anniebeth24 on Aug 5, 2014 15:50:33 GMT
If you want to support the LSS but don't like her inventory, ask the owner if you can special order items through her. I've done that through my LSS several times. When I see items online, I ask ours to add it to her next weekly order and she's always been able to help. Done this for collection packs, page protectors, and albums. I save on shipping and help the store at the same time.
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Just thought it would be interesting for some to hear from a store owner's perspective.
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