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Post by iamkristinl16 on Dec 13, 2016 20:03:12 GMT
I admit that I do not know all of the details about what is going on in Aleppo and the political dealings of the US and other countries who are/aren't involved. But the videos and news coming out of Aleppo is heartbreaking. I just watched an interview with a woman whose family is there and she was pleading to President Obama to do something to help. But I'm wondering what exactly can be done? It seems so complicated with so many different groups being involved.
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Post by gar on Dec 13, 2016 20:06:50 GMT
It's utterly heartbreaking isn't it...and shameful that the west hasn't really done anything effective although I don't know what the answer is. I saw a clip earlier of a man saying"I hope you can do something...I hope you will save my child" "crying"
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Dec 13, 2016 20:12:31 GMT
It's utterly heartbreaking isn't it...and shameful that the west hasn't really done anything effective although I don't know what the answer is. I saw a clip earlier of a man saying"I hope you can do something...I hope you will save my child" "crying" I know. I'm here complaining about the size of my kitchen and that we have too much stuff to fit In the cupboards while I'm watching video of people giving their last goodbyes or children carrying their siblings, trying to get to safety as there are gunshots all around. It is horrible. I think that news agencies need to spend more time on this and make sure that people really know what is going on. I did some reading to get myself up to speed (but definitely need more info). What proportion of people are on each side?
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Dec 13, 2016 20:14:51 GMT
The woman on CNN was saying that Pres Obama should create a no fly zone. But I'm not sure how that would help. She seemed to be against Assad but I'm not sure if that is the consensus.
Makes me wonder what would happen if we had a similar situation here. I hope that we have enough safeguards in our government to protect against the government acting as Assad's regime did/does. But who really knows?
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perumbula
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,439
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Jun 26, 2014 18:51:17 GMT
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Post by perumbula on Dec 13, 2016 20:18:20 GMT
The most heartbreaking part of this for me is that I feel like we should do something but so often when the US has stepped into a country in the last fifty years it has led to worse conditions over the long term. Sending troops doesn't seem to help. Why, why, why can't people just get along?  ?? Why? It's just horrible. 
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Post by annabella on Dec 13, 2016 20:24:07 GMT
I think Obama has been treading too lightly afraid to make a bold move. First Assad needs to be removed from power. A no fly zone would stop Russia from air bombing and killing thousands of people. As long as the Russians are bombing Assad stays in Power.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Dec 13, 2016 20:28:33 GMT
I think Obama has been treading too lightly afraid to make a bold move. First Assad needs to be removed from power. A no fly zone would stop Russia from air bombing and killing thousands of people. As long as the Russians are bombing Assad stays in Power. So Russia is helping Assad? I assume having a no fly zone also means that someone needs to enforce it. I agree with Perumbula--situations in the Middle East are so complicated and it seems that helping one group leads to more problems, since none or the groups are really "good".
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pudgygroundhog
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,652
Location: The Grand Canyon
Jun 25, 2014 20:18:39 GMT
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Post by pudgygroundhog on Dec 13, 2016 20:32:31 GMT
I think Obama has been treading too lightly afraid to make a bold move. First Assad needs to be removed from power. A no fly zone would stop Russia from air bombing and killing thousands of people. As long as the Russians are bombing Assad stays in Power. This is why Putin wanted Trump. Trump won't do anything and Putin will do what he wants there, including keeping a government in power that kills women and children fleeing for safety.
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Post by annabella on Dec 13, 2016 20:33:42 GMT
Syria and Russia have been allies for a long time. Syria buys 75% of their weapons from Russia and Russia has a base in the Middle East. Although technically it's called a "naval facility" to not sound so threatening. Iran got in on that as well.
Either way Russia is enjoying being a major player in the world right now, like look at me, America is not top dog, I'm an equal contender/threat that you better take notice of:
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Post by anxiousmom on Dec 13, 2016 20:41:56 GMT
I think Obama has been treading too lightly afraid to make a bold move. First Assad needs to be removed from power. A no fly zone would stop Russia from air bombing and killing thousands of people. As long as the Russians are bombing Assad stays in Power. So Russia is helping Assad? I assume having a no fly zone also means that someone needs to enforce it. I agree with Perumbula--situations in the Middle East are so complicated and it seems that helping one group leads to more problems, since none or the groups are really "good". Yes. Russia is firmly behind keeping Assad in power. After that, it gets incredibly complicated as to who is backing who. Here is an infographic map that will make you wonder how anyone can keep it straight. click if you want your brain to explode...
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Post by myshelly on Dec 13, 2016 20:45:57 GMT
One very real, tangible thing that we could have and should have done was to welcome Syrian refugees.
But it seems a lot of Americans were against that. How anyone can see that utter hell on earth and doubt the motive of those trying to save themselves and their children is beyond me.
I'm really not sure what we can do.
To help in Syria would be to go to war with Russia and no one wants to do that. Even if an effort were made now, the next administration would not sustain it.
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Peal
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,524
Jun 25, 2014 22:45:40 GMT
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Post by Peal on Dec 13, 2016 20:56:35 GMT
I think Obama has been treading too lightly afraid to make a bold move. First Assad needs to be removed from power. A no fly zone would stop Russia from air bombing and killing thousands of people. As long as the Russians are bombing Assad stays in Power. So Russia is helping Assad? I assume having a no fly zone also means that someone needs to enforce it. I agree with Perumbula--situations in the Middle East are so complicated and it seems that helping one group leads to more problems, since none or the groups are really "good". Russia is helping Russia. I don't believe Putin cares one whit about Syria or it's people. For our country to institute and enforce a no fly zone over Syria would mean we would have to go to war with Syria. We have no authorization over their sovereign country or their air space. The Obama administration doesn't want to declare war with another middle east country. And our country doesn't want it either. There is no good answer. The west as a whole sat back and watched this country dissolve into civil war years ago. Save
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scorpeao
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Posts: 4,524
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Jun 25, 2014 21:04:54 GMT
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Post by scorpeao on Dec 13, 2016 21:00:02 GMT
I think Obama has been treading too lightly afraid to make a bold move. First Assad needs to be removed from power. A no fly zone would stop Russia from air bombing and killing thousands of people. As long as the Russians are bombing Assad stays in Power. This is why older military members were in favor of Trump. They feel the last 8 years we've been pussyfooting around issues like this; they feel we need to be bold, go in and get shit done. I don't quite know how I feel about it because there's likely to be a lot of collateral damage, but it's not like innocents aren't dying as it is now.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Aug 18, 2025 19:40:27 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2016 21:06:08 GMT
This is my opinion on Syria from a previous thread:
First off, the conflict in Syria is so multi-faceted and murky, the question of what to do and how to help Syria is akin to how do you scale Mt. Everest! Most importantly, Russia needs to get out. PERIOD! They need to have ZERO involvement in Syria. IMO as well as many others, believe that Russia is involved for geographical/strategic purposes. Syria would be Russia's only "base" or access to the Mediterranean. Not only that, there is a large natural gas deposit in the Mediterranean. Putin is no friend to the Muslims, so you must ask yourself what business do they have in that region. Also, I firmly believe Russia is behind trying to destabilize Turkey as well.
Next off, Assad needs to go. He is a brutal dictator and has slaughtered his own people. You also have Kurds that are fighting to take over this region as well and claim it as their own. Throw in the bat shit crazy ISIS that needs to be wiped off the map and you have a real cesspool of bad guys. There is opposition forces that are made up of the Syrian people, but it is very hard to know who is who. I think that a "no fly zone" needs to be established as well. The opposition forces need to be supported, but again, that is very tricky to make sure that whatever support is provided does not end up in the wrong hands.
Having said all that, I do think that America's involvement should be very limited and definitely no boots on the ground. I think where the US needs to get involved is putting on the pressure to Putin to stay the hell out of there. But that seems highly unlikely as Trump is quite favorable to Putin. It is my fear that he will let Putin do as he pleases.
Many may think that it is not of a big concern to the States, but I think this is a very critical conflict. Do we really want Russia to have strategic access to the Mediterranean? I do not think for ONE second Russia will stop there once they have taken over Syria. I also do not trust for ONE second that Putin will stay so nice with the US. I firmly believe Putin is playing a very careful chess game and is in it for the long haul. Out of all the world leaders, he is who I distrust the most.
It is going to take a very skilled and diplomatic hand to navigate the Syrian conflict. I honestly do not have confidence in Trump's present offerings for Secretary of State. I can only hope that will change.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Dec 13, 2016 21:07:56 GMT
I think Obama has been treading too lightly afraid to make a bold move. First Assad needs to be removed from power. A no fly zone would stop Russia from air bombing and killing thousands of people. As long as the Russians are bombing Assad stays in Power. This is why older military members were in favor of Trump. They feel the last 8 years we've been pussyfooting around issues like this; they feel we need to be bold, go in and get shit done. I don't quite know how I feel about it because there's likely to be a lot of collateral damage, but it's not like innocents aren't dying as it is now. I think those older people don't really understand the issues that are going on. They see it as a straight shot--go in and defeat the enemy and be done--but it's not so simple. I personally have appreciated that about president Obama and feel that he "gets it". I have no faith that Trump Will think before acting. What exactly does Russia have to gain by helping Assad besides having a base there?
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Aug 18, 2025 19:40:27 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2016 21:08:49 GMT
The most heartbreaking part of this for me is that I feel like we should do something but so often when the US has stepped into a country in the last fifty years it has led to worse conditions over the long term. Sending troops doesn't seem to help. Why, why, why can't people just get along? ?? Why? It's just horrible. Scarce resources. That is the underlying source of every conflict. Whether that resource is land, water, love, shelter, power. Never enough to go around. And I am a part of the problem. So are you. We all want lives of comfort, hot water at the tap, warmth, safety. But we haven't figured out a way for all to get the basics - let alone more than that. Instead we seem hell-bent on making the disparities worse and further funneling more and more of the world's wealth to smaller and smaller percentages of the population under the mistaken assumption that to do otherwise is evil "wealth redistribution" or "social engineering." Thank you for raising this issue @iamkristini16. It has been on my mind for days that as I fret over holiday events, food, etc, 4 mo. old children are dying of cold. I don't know what we do. Other than something other than we've done. More donations to Doctors w/o Borders, more agitation for peace and health and safety and less for hatred, war and fear. But, other than that, I've got few ideas.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Aug 18, 2025 19:40:27 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2016 21:10:40 GMT
And let me just say, we see a lot more vivid reporting out of Syria as Aljazeera does not hold a lot back. It is utterly horrifying. We get a lot of refugees even here in Morocco.
For sure, whomever gets involved will be fighting a proxy war with Russia.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Dec 13, 2016 21:11:32 GMT
It seems that we are damned if we do and damned if we don't. Civilians are pleading for us to do something and will think negatively if we don't do enough. But then helping means getting involved in a war that would cause others in the region to be pissed off.
I also agree that we should be taking more refugees. I'm not sure where we are in that process now. It was a big thing on facebook awhile ago and I see things now once in awhile as well against it. Particular things like a supposed report from Germans saying how horrible the refugees are and used as "proof" that we should not take any in.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Dec 13, 2016 21:15:40 GMT
The most heartbreaking part of this for me is that I feel like we should do something but so often when the US has stepped into a country in the last fifty years it has led to worse conditions over the long term. Sending troops doesn't seem to help. Why, why, why can't people just get along? ?? Why? It's just horrible. Scarce resources. That is the underlying source of every conflict. Whether that resource is land, water, love, shelter, power. Never enough to go around. And I am a part of the problem. So are you. We all want lives of comfort, hot water at the tap, warmth, safety. But we haven't figured out a way for all to get the basics - let alone more than that. Instead we seem hell-bent on making the disparities worse and further funneling more and more of the world's wealth to smaller and smaller percentages of the population under the mistaken assumption that to do otherwise is evil "wealth redistribution" or "social engineering." Thank you for raising this issue @iamkristini16. It has been on my mind for days that as I fret over holiday events, food, etc, 4 mo. old children are dying of cold. I don't know what we do. Other than something other than we've done. More donations to Doctors w/o Borders, more agitation for peace and health and safety and less for hatred, war and fear. But, other than that, I've got few ideas. I do think that resources are important, but my understanding about how this got started after reading this article is that it started because people weren't happy with the government. I actually saw a lot of similarities in what started it there to what is happening here and how easy it could be to slip into a violent situation. I think resources are an issue now but not sure what role they played in starting the war. www.bbc.co.uk/newsround/16979186
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casii
Drama Llama

Posts: 5,588
Jun 29, 2014 14:40:44 GMT
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Post by casii on Dec 13, 2016 21:28:57 GMT
This breaks my heart. Is there a way for us to sponsor refugees even if they aren't welcomed into the US? What kind of aid can we offer that will actually help?
I sponsor children through Compassion International. Syria is not an option for them. One of my children is in a country where the government has been hijacking the funds & aid sent, so that the program there is about to close. Each time I think about it, I break down crying that this girl I've written and supported since she was 9 will possibly be left without aid at 15 in a country where girls are not valued at all.
It's the children's faces who haunt me.
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Post by myshelly on Dec 13, 2016 21:31:56 GMT
This breaks my heart. Is there a way for us to sponsor refugees even if they aren't welcomed into the US? What kind of aid can we offer that will actually help? I sponsor children through Compassion International. Syria is not an option for them. One of my children is in a country where the government has been hijacking the funds & aid sent, so that the program there is about to close. Each time I think about it, I break down crying that this girl I've written and supported since she was 9 will possibly be left without aid at 15 in a country where girls are not valued at all. It's the children's faces who haunt me. So far this is the only aid organization I have found on the ground in Syria. www.preemptivelove.org/see_beyond_despair_aleppo_syriaThey are trying to provide safe camps with food and sleeping bags for people attempting to flee. It's the best they can so as there is no infrastructure for an actual refugee camp or evacuation.
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Post by gmcwife1 on Dec 13, 2016 21:37:32 GMT
The most heartbreaking part of this for me is that I feel like we should do something but so often when the US has stepped into a country in the last fifty years it has led to worse conditions over the long term. Sending troops doesn't seem to help. Why, why, why can't people just get along?  ?? Why? It's just horrible. I agree, people say the US should get involved, but that usually leads to more problems. Either we aren't doing it right, we are causing more issues or they resent our interference. We are in a no win situation when it comes to wars and civil unrest in other countries.
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pudgygroundhog
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,652
Location: The Grand Canyon
Jun 25, 2014 20:18:39 GMT
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Post by pudgygroundhog on Dec 13, 2016 21:42:24 GMT
I agree the US is in a tough position as far as military intervention in Syria and I think we have been right to stay out of it so far. But I think we should be taking more refugees or at least doing more to aid the refugee camps in other countries. Not only because I believe it is the right thing to do as humans, but it is also self serving. Listening/reading some of the stories from the camps, I fear they could become breeding grounds for self-radicalization and recruitment.
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casii
Drama Llama

Posts: 5,588
Jun 29, 2014 14:40:44 GMT
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Post by casii on Dec 13, 2016 21:54:08 GMT
This breaks my heart. Is there a way for us to sponsor refugees even if they aren't welcomed into the US? What kind of aid can we offer that will actually help? I sponsor children through Compassion International. Syria is not an option for them. One of my children is in a country where the government has been hijacking the funds & aid sent, so that the program there is about to close. Each time I think about it, I break down crying that this girl I've written and supported since she was 9 will possibly be left without aid at 15 in a country where girls are not valued at all. It's the children's faces who haunt me. So far this is the only aid organization I have found on the ground in Syria. www.preemptivelove.org/see_beyond_despair_aleppo_syriaThey are trying to provide safe camps with food and sleeping bags for people attempting to flee. It's the best they can so as there is no infrastructure for an actual refugee camp or evacuation. Thank you! I know what I'm going to ask for if someone wants a wish list. And I'll send a donation. If others have more ways to help, let us know.
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Post by ntsf on Dec 13, 2016 21:57:10 GMT
we could take a couple of 100 thousand refugees.. there are plenty of families, women and children that could be helped in a modest way to start a life here.. and our economy is big enough to absorb it. they often can create businesses.. and would be a good thing for us.. and this would help europe out too.
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J u l e e
Drama Llama

Posts: 6,531
Location: Cincinnati
Jun 28, 2014 2:50:47 GMT
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Post by J u l e e on Dec 13, 2016 21:58:58 GMT
This breaks my heart. Is there a way for us to sponsor refugees even if they aren't welcomed into the US? What kind of aid can we offer that will actually help? I sponsor children through Compassion International. Syria is not an option for them. One of my children is in a country where the government has been hijacking the funds & aid sent, so that the program there is about to close. Each time I think about it, I break down crying that this girl I've written and supported since she was 9 will possibly be left without aid at 15 in a country where girls are not valued at all. It's the children's faces who haunt me. So far this is the only aid organization I have found on the ground in Syria. www.preemptivelove.org/see_beyond_despair_aleppo_syriaThey are trying to provide safe camps with food and sleeping bags for people attempting to flee. It's the best they can so as there is no infrastructure for an actual refugee camp or evacuation. And those sleeping bags are being made by other Syrian refugees. Please consider donating to this organization if you are able.
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casii
Drama Llama

Posts: 5,588
Jun 29, 2014 14:40:44 GMT
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Post by casii on Dec 13, 2016 22:13:46 GMT
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Aug 18, 2025 19:40:27 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2016 13:44:19 GMT
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Post by gar on Dec 14, 2016 14:13:02 GMT
I see that the ceasefire that was brokered has broken down already. Buses there to evacuate rebels and their families have left empty
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Post by Merge on Dec 14, 2016 14:49:54 GMT
I've set up a monthly donation to the American Refugee Committee. They're on the ground in Syria and Charity Navigator gives them their top rating.
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