trollie
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Post by trollie on Sept 5, 2018 13:34:13 GMT
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trollie
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,580
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Post by trollie on Sept 5, 2018 13:35:13 GMT
And I see nothing wrong with Tebow kneeling. I knew nothing of this controversy. If he wants to kneel, he can kneel. Not sure who was upset about that. I wish I had managed to know nothing of this controversy. How do you escape such omnipresent news? IDK.... Guessing it was going on when my children were small and my focus was elsewhere? Who the heck knows? |
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trollie
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by trollie on Sept 5, 2018 13:38:38 GMT
And I see nothing wrong with Tebow kneeling. I knew nothing of this controversy. If he wants to kneel, he can kneel. Not sure who was upset about that. It was a huge controversy. It was about the same time pagans started the war on merry Xmas and homosexuals wanted same sex marriages so they can destroy the sanctity of straight couples marriages. Oh I’m sorry. I forgot none of that happened. Huh? Is this for real? There is no war on Christmas. Every store I go into at holiday time is all about Christmas. I have already begun to see Christmas items. It is only September! (I love Christmastime btw.) And gay people wanting to be married does not destroy straight peoples' marriages. |
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Post by Zee on Sept 5, 2018 13:54:34 GMT
It was a huge controversy. It was about the same time pagans started the war on merry Xmas and homosexuals wanted same sex marriages so they can destroy the sanctity of straight couples marriages. Oh I’m sorry. I forgot none of that happened. Huh? Is this for real? There is no war on Christmas. Every store I go into at holiday time is all about Christmas. I have already begun to see Christmas items. It is only September! (I love Christmastime btw.) And gay people wanting to be married does not destroy straight peoples' marriages. Maybe reread her post, she clearly said those things didn't happen. |
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Post by peano on Sept 5, 2018 13:57:46 GMT
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Post by brina on Sept 5, 2018 14:18:21 GMT
And I see nothing wrong with Tebow kneeling. I knew nothing of this controversy. If he wants to kneel, he can kneel. Not sure who was upset about that. He was mocked by fans. Many fans... He was mocked by some fans, yes. However, I don't remember fans threatening to stop watching football if he didn't cease his behavior. I don't remember our president saying that he should be fired. I don't remember our vice-president flying in to attend a game with the express intent of getting up and leaving if such behavior was observed, and then actually following through |
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trollie
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,580
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Post by trollie on Sept 5, 2018 14:44:43 GMT
Huh? Is this for real? There is no war on Christmas. Every store I go into at holiday time is all about Christmas. I have already begun to see Christmas items. It is only September! (I love Christmastime btw.) And gay people wanting to be married does not destroy straight peoples' marriages. Maybe reread her post, she clearly said those things didn't happen. Oh. Couldn't tell if she was being facetious or serious. Trump seems to think there is a war on Christmas and I have seen video where he takes credit for people saying "Merry Christmas" again. link |
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Post by tara on Sept 5, 2018 15:04:50 GMT
It was a huge controversy. It was about the same time pagans started the war on merry Xmas and homosexuals wanted same sex marriages so they can destroy the sanctity of straight couples marriages. Oh I’m sorry. I forgot none of that happened. Huh? Is this for real? There is no war on Christmas. Every store I go into at holiday time is all about Christmas. I have already begun to see Christmas items. It is only September! (I love Christmastime btw.) And gay people wanting to be married does not destroy straight peoples' marriages. Lol sorry, I was being sarcastic. A certain group of Christians have a persecution complexe. I followed Tebow and I remembered he got more praise for his convictions than insults. (I personally think God has better things to do than watch football but anyway) These are the kind of people that will get butthurt if you wish them happy holidays instead of merry Xmas and will say same sex marriages destroys the sanctity of marriage. These kind of Christians really get to me because I’m a Christian and it gives me and my god a bad name. |
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trollie
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,580
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Post by trollie on Sept 5, 2018 15:06:26 GMT
Huh? Is this for real? There is no war on Christmas. Every store I go into at holiday time is all about Christmas. I have already begun to see Christmas items. It is only September! (I love Christmastime btw.) And gay people wanting to be married does not destroy straight peoples' marriages. Lol sorry, I was being sarcastic. A certain group of Christians have a persecution complexe. I followed Tebow and I remembered he got more praise for his convictions than insults. (I personally think God has better things to do than watch football but anyway) These are the kind of people that will get butthurt if you wish them happy holidays instead of merry Xmas and will say same sex marriages destroys the sanctity of marriage. These kind of Christians really get to me because I’m a Christian and it gives me and my god a bad name. I was hoping so! You never know these days though....LOL.  |
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Post by annabella on Sept 5, 2018 15:10:01 GMT
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RosieKat
Drama Llama
PeaJect #12
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Post by RosieKat on Sept 5, 2018 15:17:41 GMT
I get the point of the ad, but I do think saying he "lost everything" is disingenuous. I also think that by saying that, they (Nike) certainly opens up the weak point of the narrative - he's just a football player who's lost some money, but let's talk about the number of our military who have been killed in the line of duty.
I support K's stance and do believe it has helped call attention to a very real problem. I think he has every right to protest by kneeling. I do not personally find it disrespectful, but he is basically an at-will employee and if your boss isn't happy with you, you will deal with the repercussions. He has lost plenty, but he has *not* lost everything.
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Post by Zee on Sept 5, 2018 15:20:36 GMT
It's very convenient to turn his peaceful protest against violence into an anti-military, anti-American stance. Takes the focus right off what he's actually protesting.
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PLurker
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Jun 28, 2014 3:48:49 GMT
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Post by PLurker on Sept 5, 2018 15:26:25 GMT
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Post by tara on Sept 5, 2018 15:41:29 GMT
It's very convenient to turn his peaceful protest against violence into an anti-military, anti-American stance. Takes the focus right off what he's actually protesting. Bingo! |
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inkedup
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Jun 26, 2014 5:00:26 GMT
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Post by inkedup on Sept 5, 2018 15:46:14 GMT
It's very convenient to turn his peaceful protest against violence into an anti-military, anti-American stance. Takes the focus right off what he's actually protesting. Also interesting is Trump's newfound love of the military. Too bad he didn't love the military or the USA this much when he was dodging the draft. |
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Post by Darcy Collins on Sept 5, 2018 15:57:39 GMT
This statement is unfortunately being covered by a pretty offensive article. I don't have an issue with her statement though. I tried to articulate something similar yesterday, but couldn't quite find the right words. The Nike ad actually annoyed me way more than Kaepernick and other players protest. I know it's hyperbole and advertisements often used hyperbole. But by using "sacrifice everything" regarding an athlete that arguably sacrificed part of his career was insensitive to the survivors of those who truly did sacrifice everything. |
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AmeliaBloomer
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Sept 5, 2018 16:08:36 GMT
It's very convenient to turn his peaceful protest against violence into an anti-military, anti-American stance. Takes the focus right off what he's actually protesting. Yup. Admittedly, I have never understood the need for public flag reverence at sporting events (why not concerts, plays, movies?), but what is truly baffling is the insistence on interpreting any flag-based protest (actually, the athlete kneeling seems more like a mourning) as explicitly disrespecting veterans. Why don’t we recognize the myriad of other concepts equally represented in our “logo,” including equal opportunity and freedom from oppression...or even just plain freedom, our supposed dearest value, as this same flag flew over a slave nation, and we’re still dealing with the repercussions. Or not dealing, which is kind of the point. I have no idea what manner of protest would be acceptable in such a politically charged Us Against Them climate. Because how can people‘s eyes be opened to systemic oppression when so many of them are suckling their own lopsided interpretation of oppression/persecution? |
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Post by tara on Sept 5, 2018 16:10:39 GMT
On the other hand Pat Tillman’s widow, Marie, made a statement when Trump escalated the situation. She said something to the effect of not to use Pats example and sacrifice to try to silence others. This is what Pat and others died for. So people has the freedom to do what kaepernick is doing. Also his biographer said he thought if Pat were here today he would be kneeling along side of kaepernick. I’m paraphrasing because I don’t know how do provide links but you can google. |
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AmeliaBloomer
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Jun 26, 2014 5:01:45 GMT
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Sept 5, 2018 16:14:43 GMT
I fully support Kaepernick’s message but I don’t support how he delivered that message. I know that he wanted to protest peacefully and bring attention to the issues of racial injustice and police brutality. I get it; those are issues that should concern us all. However, when you have a message of such import, the best way to deliver it is by unifying people, not dividing them and causing an uproar in this country so the message gets lost in all that noise. He is a sports figure – he and the other NFL players could have banded together and called a press conference and spoken about those issues to a wide audience. I bet every major and cable network would have televised that press conference. By doing what he did, Kaepernick just caused an unnecessary fight that has divided people even more AND overshadowed the underlying issues. Even if I took Trump out of the equation, I think any Republican president would have said something critical (though none of them would call the players “sons of bitches” like Trump did). Is there anyone who really thinks a Reagan or a Bush would be mum about it? Now it’s all about the NFL, Trump and Kaepernick because the ACTUAL issues (the really, truly important element) have been overwhelmed by the scandal. This resonates for me. Mostly. Didn’t a year ago but does now. Because you’re right, it’s become a divisive, flag-draped lightening rod. The message of the protest/mourning has been subsumed by all the umbrage over the method of protest. Either subsumed or, worse, viewed with more disbelief. Presidents Bush and Reagan: I think their criticisms would be very different in tone. When President Trump uses public written commands (“Fire them!” “Suspend them!” “Fine them!” “Boycott!”), it sure doesn’t read like suggestions or opinion; I can’t be the only one for whom it communicates a startlingly unprecedented abuse of influence. (I would also bet all the change on the floor of my car that he does not know all the words to the national anthem.) |
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used2scrap
Drama Llama
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Post by used2scrap on Sept 5, 2018 16:16:32 GMT
Perhaps this will finally shine a light on the ever widening military civilian divide in a country where so few actually serve, that a company as large as Nike wouldn’t see the problem with depicting an athlete losing his job as “sacrificing everything”. This will probably not shine a brighter light on the issues Kaepernick is kneeling to draw attention to in the first place. There seems to be little coverage of the fundraising that is paired with the ad.
And hopefully those outraged and wanting to destroy shoes/clothes and boycott Nike, will consider donating or purchasing a competitors’ products and donating them to a reputable veterans service organization.
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lindas
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,305
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Post by lindas on Sept 5, 2018 16:19:12 GMT
How convenient that the article didn't publish his entire statement. “But I think it’s a terrible message that they’re sending and the purpose of them doing it, maybe there’s a reason for them doing it,” Trump mused, “but I think as far as sending a message, I think it’s a terrible message and a message that shouldn’t be sent. There’s no reason for it.” Despite that, Trump acknowledged that it’s Nike’s right to make its own business decisions. “As much as I disagree with the Colin Kaepernick endorsement, in another way — I mean, I wouldn’t have done it,” Trump said. “In another way, it is what this country is all about, that you have certain freedoms to do things that other people think you shouldn’t do, but I personally am on a different side of it.” |
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Post by busy on Sept 5, 2018 16:21:10 GMT
It's very convenient to turn his peaceful protest against violence into an anti-military, anti-American stance. Takes the focus right off what he's actually protesting. Cannot be said enough. |
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MsKnit
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Jun 26, 2014 19:06:42 GMT
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Post by MsKnit on Sept 5, 2018 16:37:01 GMT
It's very convenient to turn his peaceful protest against violence into an anti-military, anti-American stance. Takes the focus right off what he's actually protesting. Yes! |
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PLurker
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Location: Behind the Cheddar Curtain
Jun 28, 2014 3:48:49 GMT
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Post by PLurker on Sept 5, 2018 16:38:32 GMT
How convenient that the article didn't publish his entire statement. “But I think it’s a terrible message that they’re sending and the purpose of them doing it, maybe there’s a reason for them doing it,” Trump mused, “but I think as far as sending a message, I think it’s a terrible message and a message that shouldn’t be sent. There’s no reason for it.” Despite that, Trump acknowledged that it’s Nike’s right to make its own business decisions. “As much as I disagree with the Colin Kaepernick endorsement, in another way — I mean, I wouldn’t have done it,” Trump said. “In another way, it is what this country is all about, that you have certain freedoms to do things that other people think you shouldn’t do, but I personally am on a different side of it.” I read the whole statement he made. If not in that article, another. Still is quite a contrast to his usual twitter rants. A little (lot) toned down because $$. Where did all his usual twitter rants every time the kneeling topic comes up go? He never gave anyone a benefit of a doubt before, as in "maybe there's a reason for them doing it". Maybe if he considered that when Kaeoernick and others first started kneeling, this would not have become the huge controversy it has. "Maybe there's a reason for them doing it". Does that statement of grace only apply when it affects his bottom line? |
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muggins
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Post by muggins on Sept 5, 2018 16:42:45 GMT
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MsKnit
Pearl Clutcher
RefuPea #1406
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Post by MsKnit on Sept 5, 2018 16:53:11 GMT
Damn...Vick. I forgot about NIKE and Vick. Someone reminded me yesterday evening. There is no way I can give them any support. This organization will be receiving my hoodie money: Equal Justice Initiative |
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Post by crimsoncat05 on Sept 5, 2018 16:58:33 GMT
a very thought-provoking excerpt from the article: " It isn’t surprising that the folks so violently shaken by Colin Kaepernick, profess to defend a freedom they don’t like him exercising.
They’re the same ones saying that they love both America—and a draft-dodging, Russian-beholden, POW-belittling President.
They’re the same people who say they want to rewind and reclaim America’s “greatness”, while ignoring how much suffering and injustice that supposed greatness created for so many.
They’re the same people who claim allegiance to both Jesus and to Donald Trump.
Cognitive dissonance doesn’t register when you’re white and terrified of losing your dominance.
By kneeling, Colin Kaepernick let us do the work for him. He didn’t need to belabor the point, he just let us show ourselves. He allowed white America’s responses to reveal who we are. He saw something ugly in us that we didn’t and still don’t want to see." |
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janeliz
Drama Llama
I'm the Wiz and nobody beats me.
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Post by janeliz on Sept 5, 2018 18:02:17 GMT
It’s certainly true that Colin Kaepernick has not sacrificed his life. But to be fair, Colin Kaepernick has never compared himself to members of our armed forces and Nike is not, in that ad, pitting him against the military.
Honestly, what does any of this have to do with the military? He’s not protesting the military. He’s not protesting the anthem. He refused to stand in support of a flag which he believes represents a country that does not value black lives. If people insist on turning his peaceful show of protest and resistance into an attack on the United States Armed Forces, then they’re purposely refusing to hear his message.
The American flag that was laid across my father’s casket is in my cedar chest upstairs. I love my country. And I respect the hell out of Colin Kaepernick.
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lizacreates
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,862
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Post by lizacreates on Sept 5, 2018 18:04:27 GMT
This resonates for me. Mostly. Didn’t a year ago but does now. Because you’re right, it’s become a divisive, flag-draped lightening rod. The message of the protest/mourning has been subsumed by all the umbrage over the method of protest. Either subsumed or, worse, viewed with more disbelief. Presidents Bush and Reagan: I think their criticisms would be very different in tone. When President Trump uses public written commands (“Fire them!” “Suspend them!” “Fine them!” “Boycott!”), it sure doesn’t read like suggestions or opinion; I can’t be the only one for whom it communicates a startlingly unprecedented abuse of influence. (I would also bet all the change on the floor of my car that he does not know all the words to the national anthem.) Thank you for understanding. |
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Post by femalebusiness on Sept 5, 2018 18:16:49 GMT
The way to really own the libs apparently is to destroy expensive merchandise you have already purchased, @nike, @keurig... Better if they go buy even more so it can be a really impressive bonfire. You know, if it were layered, that would be so awesome. Say like go buy some books as the base, i.e. Handmaid's Tale, 1984, etc., then the Nike apparel, topped off with every k-cup their local stores had. That would totally show me how wrong I am. And I noticed in the burning pictures the Nike logo is prominent. Yeah, protesters are really hurting Nike. 😂 |
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