scrappinmama
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,009
Jun 26, 2014 12:54:09 GMT
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Post by scrappinmama on Dec 8, 2018 20:24:49 GMT
I just want to thank the peas who are explaining the ins and outs of this craziness. Lizacreates and twinsmomfla99, your insight is much appreciated!
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lizacreates
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,856
Aug 29, 2015 2:39:19 GMT
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Post by lizacreates on Dec 8, 2018 20:39:15 GMT
I just want to thank the peas who are explaining the ins and outs of this craziness. Lizacreates and twinsmomfla99, your insight is much appreciated! That’s very kind of you to say. Right now, there’s so much to absorb and understand that it's a challenge untangling it all! Lol. (sigh) The times we're in...so many unprecedented circumstances that defy easy answers.
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jayfab
Drama Llama
procastinating
Posts: 5,587
Jun 26, 2014 21:55:15 GMT
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Post by jayfab on Dec 8, 2018 21:52:33 GMT
I just want to thank the peas who are explaining the ins and outs of this craziness. Lizacreates and twinsmomfla99, your insight is much appreciated! I agree!
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 21, 2024 4:40:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2018 22:47:39 GMT
Mike Memoli....
“In his closed-door testimony, Comey told lawmakers that comments from Rudy Giuliani and others in fall of '16 "gave me a general concern that we may have a leak problem" from FBI's NY field office. He launched investigation, but was fired before (if) it ended”
I read that it was because of this possible leak that Comey released the letter about nothing just days before the election. He did it to protect the FBI.
FiveThirtyEight has maintained that when that letter came out Hillary’s poll numbers tanked and while they started to recover it was too late. That letter about nothing, they claim, was the reason why she lost.
I believe enough people in those three states that trump won by less than 100,000 votes split between them, could have decided to not vote or voted for a third party candidate instead of voting for Hillary because of that letter. I also believe those who voted for trump were going to do so regardless of what was happening. It was those who chose not to vote or voted third party is the reason we have that petty little coward sitting in the Oval Office now.
If it’s true he released the letter days before the election to protect the FBI, then the irony is, his actions may lead to serious damage being done to it once trump gets finished with it. IMO.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 21, 2024 4:40:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2018 0:34:58 GMT
David Axelrod...
“.@rahmemanuel on @joebiden playing experience card: "I have a different premise.. Jimmy Carter, @billclinton, @barackobama, all younger than 50, all from outside DC…So my attitude is, who brings a fresh face, an energy that contrasts w/ @realdonaldtrump?" #AxeFiles on @cnn”
I agree with Rahm Emanuel on this.
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gsquaredmom
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,091
Jun 26, 2014 17:43:22 GMT
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Post by gsquaredmom on Dec 9, 2018 1:00:18 GMT
David Axelrod... “.@rahmemanuel on @joebiden playing experience card: "I have a different premise.. Jimmy Carter, @billclinton, @barackobama, all younger than 50, all from outside DC…So my attitude is, who brings a fresh face, an energy that contrasts w/ @realdonaldtrump?" #AxeFiles on @cnn” I agree with Rahm Emanuel on this. I agree with Rahm. I have been thinking this for several months. Recently, I have added Susannah Mendoza and Sean Casten to my potential presidents list. Mendoza is a dynamic, fast-rising star in Illinois. Sean Carsten is an environmental scientist-entrepreneur.
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Post by lucyg on Dec 9, 2018 2:24:08 GMT
I want someone who knows how to work Congress. I’d take LBJ at this point.
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Post by fuji on Dec 9, 2018 3:59:37 GMT
I want someone who knows how to work Congress. I’d take LBJ at this point. At this point, I would be happy with someone who can read... and speak complete sentences... and spell... So basically, your average 2nd grader.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 21, 2024 4:40:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2018 6:53:34 GMT
Rep Jim Jordan... You know the clown who claims he knew nothing about boys on the wrestling team were being sexually molested even though young men claim they told him. That guy.
“James Comey:
“I don’t recall”—8 times “I don’t remember”—71 times “I don’t know”—166 times
AND he said he didn’t know that Christopher Steele was passing information to Bruce Ohr, who was giving it to the FBI.”
It seems to me he shouldn’t call anyone out for not recalling anything or not knowing something. Twitter did not treat him kindly for this comment.
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Dec 9, 2018 6:59:53 GMT
Rep Jim Jordan... You know the clown who claims he knew nothing about boys on the wrestling team were being sexually molested even though young men claim they told him. That guy. “James Comey: “I don’t recall”—8 times “I don’t remember”—71 times “I don’t know”—166 times AND he said he didn’t know that Christopher Steele was passing information to Bruce Ohr, who was giving it to the FBI.” It seems to me he shouldn’t call anyone out for not recalling anything or not knowing something. Twitter did not treat him kindly for this comment. Right you are! Is that wrestling case over or are they still working on it? I find him to be a bit off, swarmy?
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Dec 9, 2018 7:24:47 GMT
The New York Times Just Released an Eye-Opening Report on Jared Kushner’s Ongoing Chats With the Saudi Crown PrinceThat’s the same prince who ordered a journalist’s death. MOTHER JONES DECEMBER 8, 2018 5:13 PM Jared Kushner, President Donald Trump’s son-in-law and Middle East advisor, has been having informal, private conversations in recent months with Saudi Prince Mohammed bin Salman while simultaneously defending the prince against charges that he ordered the killing of journalist Jamal Khashoggi, according to a new report from the New York Times. Kushner’s chats with Prince Mohammed, which took the form of text messages, emails, and phone calls, concerned senior American officials, who attempted to tighten security by reimposing longstanding protocols stipulating that National Security Council members participate in conversations with foreign leaders. Still, the two men—both in their 30s and heirs to family fortunes—kept chatting on a first-name basis, often over WhatsApp. When American intelligence authorities concluded that Prince Mohammed had ordered the October slaying of Khashoggi, Kushner “became the prince’s most important defender inside the White House,” according to the Times. The relationship between the two men was long in the making: When Trump was elected, a delegation of Saudis close to the prince identified Kushner as a key player to court. In a slideshow prepared for the Saudi government, the Saudi delegation reportedly wrote that the inner circle of the incoming Trump administration “is predominantly deal makers who lack familiarity with political customs and deep institutions, and they support Jared Kushner.” The courtship appears to have worked: The Times continues, “Only a few months after Mr. Trump moved into the White House, Mr. Kushner was inquiring about the Saudi royal succession process and whether the United States could influence it, raising fears among senior officials that he sought to help Prince Mohammed, who was not yet the crown prince, vault ahead in the line for the throne.” ** More at link: www.motherjones.com/politics/2018/12/the-new-york-times-just-released-an-eye-opening-report-on-jared-kushners-ongoing-chats-with-the-saudi-crown-prince/
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twinsmomfla99
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,067
Jun 26, 2014 13:42:47 GMT
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Post by twinsmomfla99 on Dec 9, 2018 9:42:04 GMT
SOL is generally tolled if you cannot be legally prosecuted. If the law says you cannot indict a sitting president, then you can wait until he is out of office to do it. I don’t think there is a specific law that provides for this. Inbelievenit is just interpretation. I don’t have a citation, but I have seen it discussed a few times since 2016. Of course, this assumes that there is actually a decision that the president cannot be indicted. I have no doubt that there will be state charges filed if there is any risk the SOL will run out. Then, if a court ruled he cannot be indivmcted while in office, the statute would be tolled. Of course he can be indicted when out of office, but you cannot toll a SoL just because he’s a sitting president unless there’s a sealed indictment against him because that is what would hold the prosecution in abeyance until he’s out of office. Is there one you know of? Otherwise, the general SoL of five years for federal crimes is still running. If he wins in 2020, the SoL will expire before that term is up. If he doesn’t win, then no problem. I think you are probably correct. I remember this conversation on a Facebook thread a while back, and someone had posted links to support what I said above. I looked for it and can’t find it any longer, so I’m thinking it was deleted. I researched what you said, and I can’t find anything other than speculation for what I posted earlier. I stand corrected.
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AmeliaBloomer
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,842
Location: USA
Jun 26, 2014 5:01:45 GMT
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Dec 9, 2018 12:50:33 GMT
The New York Times Just Released an Eye-Opening Report on Jared Kushner’s Ongoing Chats With the Saudi Crown PrinceThat’s the same prince who ordered a journalist’s death. MOTHER JONES DECEMBER 8, 2018 5:13 PM Jared Kushner, President Donald Trump’s son-in-law and Middle East advisor, has been having informal, private conversations in recent months with Saudi Prince Mohammed bin Salman while simultaneously defending the prince against charges that he ordered the killing of journalist Jamal Khashoggi, according to a new report from the New York Times. Kushner’s chats with Prince Mohammed, which took the form of text messages, emails, and phone calls, concerned senior American officials, who attempted to tighten security by reimposing longstanding protocols stipulating that National Security Council members participate in conversations with foreign leaders. Still, the two men—both in their 30s and heirs to family fortunes—kept chatting on a first-name basis, often over WhatsApp. When American intelligence authorities concluded that Prince Mohammed had ordered the October slaying of Khashoggi, Kushner “became the prince’s most important defender inside the White House,” according to the Times. The relationship between the two men was long in the making: When Trump was elected, a delegation of Saudis close to the prince identified Kushner as a key player to court. In a slideshow prepared for the Saudi government, the Saudi delegation reportedly wrote that the inner circle of the incoming Trump administration “is predominantly deal makers who lack familiarity with political customs and deep institutions, and they support Jared Kushner.” The courtship appears to have worked: The Times continues, “Only a few months after Mr. Trump moved into the White House, Mr. Kushner was inquiring about the Saudi royal succession process and whether the United States could influence it, raising fears among senior officials that he sought to help Prince Mohammed, who was not yet the crown prince, vault ahead in the line for the throne.” ** More at link: www.motherjones.com/politics/2018/12/the-new-york-times-just-released-an-eye-opening-report-on-jared-kushners-ongoing-chats-with-the-saudi-crown-prince/ Boy princes bonding over WhatsApp. Oy.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 21, 2024 4:40:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2018 14:51:44 GMT
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lizacreates
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,856
Aug 29, 2015 2:39:19 GMT
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Post by lizacreates on Dec 9, 2018 15:14:31 GMT
Of course he can be indicted when out of office, but you cannot toll a SoL just because he’s a sitting president unless there’s a sealed indictment against him because that is what would hold the prosecution in abeyance until he’s out of office. Is there one you know of? Otherwise, the general SoL of five years for federal crimes is still running. If he wins in 2020, the SoL will expire before that term is up. If he doesn’t win, then no problem. I think you are probably correct. I remember this conversation on a Facebook thread a while back, and someone had posted links to support what I said above. I looked for it and can’t find it any longer, so I’m thinking it was deleted. I researched what you said, and I can’t find anything other than speculation for what I posted earlier. I stand corrected. No problem at all. No harm done.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 21, 2024 4:40:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2018 16:43:23 GMT
The Mercury News
lFind LawCan a sitting president be indicted for crimes he committed before becoming president or during his presidency that are not considered impeachable offenses? What are impeachable offenses? From Find Law.. “The President, Vice President and all civil officers of the United States, shall be removed from office on impeachment for, and conviction of, treason, bribery, or other high crimes and misdemeanors." Thus, the operative legal standard to apply to an impeachment of a sitting President is "treason, bribery, or other high crimes and misdemeanors." There is substantial difference of opinion over the interpretation of these words.” There are essentially four schools of thought concerning the meaning of these words, although there are innumerable subsets within those four categories.”
From San Jose Mercury News. “Can a sitting president be indicted?” “ Legal experts are divided on that question. The Supreme Court has never ruled on whether the president can be indicted or whether the president can be subpoenaed for testimony.
The Justice Department’s Office of Legal Counsel, which provides legal advice and guidance to executive branch agencies, has maintained that a sitting president cannot be indicted. Two Justice Department reports, one in 1973 and one in 2000, came to the same conclusion. Those reports essentially concluded that the president’s responsibilities are so important that an indictment would pose too many risks for the government to function properly. Trump’s lawyers have said that special counsel Robert Mueller plans to adhere to that guidance, though Mueller’s office has never independently confirmed that. Trump’s personal attorney, Rudy Giuliani, has also said that a president cannot be indicted.” Bottom line is we don’t know for sure. We don’t know for sure what are impeachable offenses and we don’t know for sure if a sitting president can be indicted for crimes he committed before taking office or while in office that don’t fall under impeachable offenses. The idea that a sitting president can be indicted has never been tested to the extent that is facing this country as it is now with trump. trump’s actions have made Nixon’s look like those of a choir boy and Bill Clinton lying is but a blip in history compared to what we are facing with trump. We really are in uncharted waters with trump.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 21, 2024 4:40:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2018 17:07:28 GMT
I want someone who knows how to work Congress. I’d take LBJ at this point. If I was in your shoes I think I'd settle for the cleaner....they probably know more about the workings than the shower that's in there at the moment.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 21, 2024 4:40:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2018 17:12:30 GMT
Kyle Griffin...
“A month after Florida voters approved a measure to restore the franchise to former felons, a GOP-led battle over implementing that change is beginning, MoJo reports.
The state's Republican elections chief is resisting swift implementation of the measure.”
Of course they are.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 21, 2024 4:40:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2018 17:25:41 GMT
Back to if a sitting president can be indicted and this
“The Justice Department’s Office of Legal Counsel, which provides legal advice and guidance to executive branch agencies, has maintained that a sitting president cannot be indicted. Two Justice Department reports, one in 1973 and one in 2000, came to the same conclusion.
Those reports essentially concluded that the president’s responsibilities are so important that an indictment would pose too many risks for the government to function properly.”
If that is the only reason The Justice Department has decided a sitting can’t be indicted, then IMO, it’s pretty short sited on their part. What about the “risks for the government “ if they leave a president in office who knows they will be indicted once they leave office? Do they think this person would act honorably and concern himself with what’s best for the country instead of taking steps to cover his ass for when he is out of office and facing potential indictments? I mean really?
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 21, 2024 4:40:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2018 18:27:41 GMT
AP..
“General Motors is fighting Trump and other Republicans in a bid to preserve the $7,500 tax incentive for buying electric vehicles.”
But cutting this tax incentive its yet another example of the cost of the tax cut for the rich and of trump not #MAGA.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 21, 2024 4:40:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2018 18:30:13 GMT
Meet the Press...
“WATCH: Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) reacts to the news of Michael Cohen's false testimony to Congress and its prior circulation.
@randpaul: "I don't know what's illegal about trying to build a hotel in Russia."
Then why go to great lengths to lie about it?
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 21, 2024 4:40:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2018 21:38:46 GMT
FiveThrityEight...
“The 4 Types of Constitutional Crises: 1. The Constitution doesn’t say what to do. 2. The Constitution’s meaning is in question. 3. The Constitution tells us what to do, but it’s not politically feasible. 4. Institutions themselves fail.”
And I’m sure trump will test them all as well as point out any flaws that the FF couldn’t begin to imagine.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 21, 2024 4:40:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2018 21:48:05 GMT
Steve Herman...
“The Beltway buzz this hour is @repmarkmeadows is now the leading candidate to succeed Kelly as chief of staff.”
He is a member of the Freedom Caucus aka the Tea Party.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 21, 2024 4:40:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2018 22:18:26 GMT
An opinion about the possible Kelly replacement.
Southpaw...
“He's an idiot. I can't tell you what makes him tick.” -Fmr. Speaker John Boehner, on Rep. Mark Meadows vanityfair.com/news/2017/10/j…”
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 21, 2024 4:40:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2018 22:32:45 GMT
The man of the hour Nick Ayers..
“Thank you @realdonaldtrump, @vp, and my great colleagues for the honor to serve our Nation at The White House. I will be departing at the end of the year but will work with the #MAGA team to advance the cause. 🇺🇸 #Georgia”
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 21, 2024 4:40:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2018 22:57:56 GMT
trump....
“The Trump Administration has accomplished more than any other U.S. Administration in its first two (not even) years of existence, & we are having a great time doing it! All of this despite the Fake News Media, which has gone totally out of its mind-truly the Enemy of the People!”
Such a insecure little person.
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scrappinmama
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,009
Jun 26, 2014 12:54:09 GMT
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Post by scrappinmama on Dec 9, 2018 23:06:20 GMT
trump.... “The Trump Administration has accomplished more than any other U.S. Administration in its first two (not even) years of existence, & we are having a great time doing it! All of this despite the Fake News Media, which has gone totally out of its mind-truly the Enemy of the People!” Such a insecure little person. If by accomplish he means undoing anything positive that Obama did, then yes. I was reading that he has even authorized some of the healthy school meals that Obama put in place. what would anyone have against healithier school meals?
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 21, 2024 4:40:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2018 23:23:58 GMT
I have said many times that I like it when someone says so much better what I was trying to say.
David Rothkopf..
“It is time to re-examine the idea that a sitting president cannot be indicted. Following that re-examination it will also be time to reject the idea. First, we need to remind the majority of American people that this is not a law nor is it a constitutional requirement.”
“Rather the idea is a Department of Justice guideline. However, it is one that runs directly contrary to the idea that no man or woman is above the law-including the president of the United States. This is idea is a founding principle of this Republic,born of the abuses of a king.”
“The argument that presidents should not be indicted is based on a couple of core theories. One is that such indictments would distract presidents from their duties. This is a flawed notion on several levels.”
“First, the idea that the president is too busy to face the due process of our system of justice would seem to establish the idea that he or she is above the law. Next, the idea that such cases would be brought without merit is one that doesn't exist elsewhere.”
“Somehow, this notion gives the benefit of the doubt to the president over those bringing the charges which would implicitly suggest a superiority of mission for the president above that of the courts.”
“That would seem to run contrary to the ideas underpinning core decisions of the Supreme Court like Marbury v. Madison. If an indictment is brought following the appropriate steps of due process, why should it not be honored? Why should it wait?”
“Further, of course, we are presented with the very real case that a president could commit crimes in order to become president and then be protected from prosecution by holding the office he achieved through fraud, deception or other crimes.”
“Those who argue against indictment of presidents say the Constitution says the responsibility to enforce such laws rests with the Congress via the route of impeachment. First, while the Constitution creates that mechanism for dealing with...”
“Treason, Bribery and other high Crimes and Misdemeanors" it is silent on whether that is the only avenue available for dealing with other issues. It also should be noted while it grants members of Congress certain immunities it grants none to the president.”
“Further, since John Marshall, it has been believed by the Supreme Court that presidents are subject to subpoena power...which raises the question, "Why that and not a more serious form of legal process like an indictment."
“Scholars are divided on the issue. And while some memoranda on the point are the president should not be indicted, the ones I am familiar with were created by scholars with at least some interest in protecting or serving the president.”
“Which brings us to the impeachment process. While it was assumed Congress would serve as a check on the president through this process, it was done so by framers who did not know of our political party system and its abuses.”
“It is very clear that the GOP Senate is so political that it has repeatedly ignored its oversight responsibilities under the Constitution. What are we to do as a nation if pols take over one or the other house of our legislature and enable commissions of crimes by a president?”
“Because that is exactly what has happened. The GOP has essentially demonstrated that it will not uphold its constitutional responsibilities. So we must have a check against such willful nonfeasance. The courts are the only available answer short of new elections.”
“Right now, we face the reality of a president who used fraud to enter office and who has violated his oath to preserve, protect and defend the constitution on multiple levels--from ignoring the emoluments clause to serving foreign enemies at odds with American interests.”
“He is defiling the White House, using it not as the seat of executive power in our government but as a hideout for him and his gang of liars, thieves and worse. Absent a true test of the idea of indicting a sitting president...”
“...he will remain there, the worst example in our history of an idea that was anathema to our founders. He will be above the law and beyond its reach. He will continue to profit from his crimes and put our democracy and our security at risk. He will remain a threat.”
“We must not let that happen simply because this idea is untested in the courts and to date has been dominated by the theoretical arguments of interested parties. We deserve better. Our system deserves better.”
“And if in the end the courts reject the idea that a sitting president can be indicted then it will shift the responsibility on the Congress and on voters as they will know the risks we face.”
“There is again a cancer on the presidency. It is the president himself but it puts us in dire jeopardy if we do not have a means to excise it that is above and beyond our broken, shameful politics. We should explore this avenue even as we pursue every other.”
“Because if the facts of our time demonstrate one thing, it is the primary test America faces right now is whether it has the wherewithal to defend itself from the profound corruption and serial abuses of its president. That's why this is an issue for every one of us.”
“And that is why it one we must address with all the urgency we can muster.”
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Post by bc2ca on Dec 9, 2018 23:57:36 GMT
The man of the hour Nick Ayers.. “Thank you @realdonaldtrump, @vp, and my great colleagues for the honor to serve our Nation at The White House. I will be departing at the end of the year but will work with the #MAGA team to advance the cause. 🇺🇸 #Georgia” Someone should tell him can jump ship but it's too late to avoid the consequences of having been Pence's right hand guy. I can't imagine why Mark Meadows would want to take on the CoS job.
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Post by SockMonkey on Dec 9, 2018 23:59:51 GMT
The man of the hour Nick Ayers.. “Thank you @realdonaldtrump, @vp, and my great colleagues for the honor to serve our Nation at The White House. I will be departing at the end of the year but will work with the #MAGA team to advance the cause. 🇺🇸 #Georgia” Someone should tell him can jump ship but it's too late to avoid the consequences of having been Pence's right hand guy. I can't imagine why Mark Meadows would want to take on the CoS job. I'd really like to know how they define "the cause."
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