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Post by crazy4scraps on Jan 29, 2019 16:53:51 GMT
I'm sorry, Ashley...that's a crappy place to be in. Her life (and his for that matter) is going to be hell when he's a teen. Maybe you could come at it from that angle? "Because I love you both, we're having this discussion about Johnny's actions. Again, I love you...please try to just hear me" and explain that you have children already and have seen (assuming your kids have no real school issues) how hard it is for parents of teens with trouble, and I don't want that for you. Can we work on this together? Our homes are the perfect place to lay down those boundaries. I want you to know I support you and am here for you." I dunno...other than that...I had a friend who let her kid punch my kid in the stomach, spit and cuss....yet still got to go to chess class with grandma that night. I was done. We haven't spoken since (although she tried, and I told her why not. So I realize how hard this is. You just have to decide if you can do this w/o your Mom's support (would she cut you off for not wanting to hang out with a little terrorist? She can't enjoy it either!) Best wishes! I could try talking to her again. I have attempted to suggest I can be the “bad cop” and let her give me the stress of squashing his behaviour, but she has not agreed. If his behaviour was directed at my children it would be much easier to put an end to. But because it’s usually just at his mom, it’s easier for everyone to tell me to mind my own. BUT, even though his rage is only directed at his mom it is still being WITNESSED by all the other kids. They are still being impacted negatively by seeing that, and that kind of makes it your business too. My 8 yo kid is an even tempered, mild mannered kid and when she sees or witnesses some other kid going totally off the rails, she gets very upset by that. One of her BFFs in school is a kid with serious self control issues so she witnesses this kid’s tantrums daily at school. Even though in the past DD has begged to be in this girl’s class, now she is seriously regretting the fact that they’re in the same class this year because the other girl is SO disruptive. Every.Single.Day. |
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caangel
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,025 
Location: So Cal
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Post by caangel on Jan 29, 2019 16:55:59 GMT
I would stop focusing on trying to help your nephew, no one in your family has the skills for that. Work on getting your sister OUTSIDE help. I would start with your mom. As some one said she opened a door with her comment about the parents struggling with his behaviors. Talk to her about getting your sister outside help, like a therapist or family counseling. Because she and your sister have a better relationship I would encourage your mom to be the one to bring it up with sis. With your mom, focus on how much you love your sister and how much you want to help her now so that she isn't calling the cops on her child later as a single parent. It may take several conversations with Mom to get there. If you think your sister will listen to you go ahead and try it but doesn't seem like she "hears" you.
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ashley
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by ashley on Jan 29, 2019 16:57:07 GMT
I could try talking to her again. I have attempted to suggest I can be the “bad cop” and let her give me the stress of squashing his behaviour, but she has not agreed. If his behaviour was directed at my children it would be much easier to put an end to. But because it’s usually just at his mom, it’s easier for everyone to tell me to mind my own. That makes me so sad for his mom! Just curious, does he come to your house? how does he behave? If he’s here without his parents his behaviour is ok, and I won’t tolerate anything else, so a couple warnings about going home or a time out (without cuddles and attention!) is usually sufficient. But I rarely have him here by himself. I think my sister doesn’t trust me. |
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janroe
Shy Member
Posts: 41
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Post by janroe on Jan 29, 2019 16:57:17 GMT
If you can’t talk to your sister, tell your mom that either she speaks to her or you will be taking a break. Also if she was my sister and she corrected my kids....her ass would be grass. I roll like that with my siblings.😀
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Post by quietgirl on Jan 29, 2019 16:58:07 GMT
It sounds like you have a plan. I hope that it works. You have been through so much in the past few years that it seems to have undermined your confidence. As a smart and talented woman you should not be worrying about your family shunning you with emotional blackmail. You, and those 4 daughters, deserve so much more. Perhaps a few sessions with a therapist could help you with building your confidence and expanding your circle of friends? I wish you strength to stick with your plan when you attend the next family dinner. Yes, these have been recurrent therapy topics for almost a year now. I feel more confident than I did a year and a half ago when I threw my ex husband out... I am proud of what I’ve achieved.  I’m working on friendships, but judging from the number of topics Insee raises here regularly on making friends as an adult, I’m guessing I’m not alone in knowing it’s not that easy. And friends with their own young children and busy families and own obligations aren’t made quickly, nor are they an overnight (or overyear, even!) support system. I can’t call a friend I go out with once a month and say, hey, my pap results just came back abnormal, can you drive me to the next city over for follow up appointments? Sure you can! You can. Even though you only see your friend once a month, a true friend will step up to the plate for you! People want to help. Let them in. I get how hard that is, but it may truly deepen your connections. I hope it gets better. |
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ashley
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,571
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Post by ashley on Jan 29, 2019 16:58:14 GMT
I would stop focusing on trying to help your nephew, no one in your family has the skills for that. Work on getting your sister OUTSIDE help. I would start with your mom. As some one said she opened a door with her comment about the parents struggling with his behaviors. Talk to her about getting your sister outside help, like a therapist or family counseling. Because she and your sister have a better relationship I would encourage your mom to be the one to bring it up with sis. With your mom, focus on how much you love your sister and how much you want to help her now so that she isn't calling the cops on her child later as a single parent. It may take several conversations with Mom to get there. If you think your sister will listen to you go ahead and try it but doesn't seem like she "hears" you. I know that these attempts have been made and my sister told my mom that her family was none of my mom’s business. |
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ashley
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,571
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Post by ashley on Jan 29, 2019 16:58:51 GMT
Yes, these have been recurrent therapy topics for almost a year now. I feel more confident than I did a year and a half ago when I threw my ex husband out... I am proud of what I’ve achieved. I’m working on friendships, but judging from the number of topics Insee raises here regularly on making friends as an adult, I’m guessing I’m not alone in knowing it’s not that easy. And friends with their own young children and busy families and own obligations aren’t made quickly, nor are they an overnight (or overyear, even!) support system. I can’t call a friend I go out with once a month and say, hey, my pap results just came back abnormal, can you drive me to the next city over for follow up appointments? Sure you can! You can. Even though you only see your friend once a month, a true friend will step up to the plate for you! People want to help. Let them in. I get how hard that is, but it may truly deepen your connections. I hope it gets better. Yeah, I’m not asking someone to take the day off work to drive me around. No one has time for that. |
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flute4peace
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,757
Jul 3, 2014 14:38:35 GMT
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Post by flute4peace on Jan 29, 2019 16:59:36 GMT
ashley What happens if the behavior is ignored?? Try catching him being 'good' and praise him. Not saying you don't already but give it a try. He sounds like a very smart young boy if he can manipulate his parents and all the adults around him. I think part of the problem is that when he’s behaving (less than half the time we’re together, I’d estimate) he’s pretty sweet and considerate, it’s easy for the adults in his life to excuse his poor behaviour. What *I* see is that he is pleasant on his own terms, when he gets his own way. He receives abundant praise. I also occasionally wonder if that isn’t a contributing factor — it’s almosr like double-rewarding him for poor behaviour, he gets one-in-one attention from his parent(s) when he misbehaves, and then celebrated afterwards. I don’t know what would happen if his behaviour was fully ignored. They don’t even ignore him when he’s in time out, kicking and screaming. BINGO!!!! |
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Post by mustlovecats on Jan 29, 2019 17:01:36 GMT
Is there any chance this child has some mild special needs thatsre undiagnosed and mom is defensive? Young boys sometimes have a really hard time in unstructured activities like family gatherings. Their bodies and brains can’t always handle every situation, they may need more room or time to move their bodies and they may not have good impulse control especially with varied stimuli and changes of routine. What would happen if you had some indoor and/or outdoor games for the kids and left the TV off altogether so no fighting for the remote? The idea that this is a “boy issue” is exactly why he’s 7 years old and still behaving like this. The developmental research supports the idea that boys and girls have certain differences and sometimes need different things... speaking broadly sometimes boys are more kinesthetic... one of the best pieces of wisdom I got in teacher training over the years is that if you have a child who moves a lot, melts down a lot, demands a lot, gets in trouble a lot, maybe the first answer isn’t that you have a brat on your hands but that you have a child with a body that needs to move more and their empathy and impulse control haven’t caught up as much... which describes a lot of children that age and can really be characteristic of boys. Years and years teaching third and fourth grade really bear that out for me... I didn’t say “boy issue”, I said need to move, need a structured activity, varied stimuli and changes of routine... those are solutions to a developmental need, not “boys will be boys” |
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Post by quietgirl on Jan 29, 2019 17:03:25 GMT
Sure you can! You can. Even though you only see your friend once a month, a true friend will step up to the plate for you! People want to help. Let them in. I get how hard that is, but it may truly deepen your connections. I hope it gets better. Yeah, I’m not asking someone to take the day off work to drive me around. No one has time for that. I understand that. I do. |
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Post by crazy4scraps on Jan 29, 2019 17:04:12 GMT
Sure you can! You can. Even though you only see your friend once a month, a true friend will step up to the plate for you! People want to help. Let them in. I get how hard that is, but it may truly deepen your connections. I hope it gets better. Yeah, I’m not asking someone to take the day off work to drive me around. No one has time for that.  If you don’t ask, you won’t know. My BFF just flew from MN to FL for over a week to help take care of a friend that ultimately needed to be hospitalized, and will be there for another week to help the friend’s DH to care for her now that she’s back home again. I never hesitate to do what I can to help out a friend. People make time for their friends. I know how hard it can be to ask for help when you need some extra support, but sometimes you just have to. |
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Post by gar on Jan 29, 2019 17:05:07 GMT
Sure you can! You can. Even though you only see your friend once a month, a true friend will step up to the plate for you! People want to help. Let them in. I get how hard that is, but it may truly deepen your connections. I hope it gets better. Yeah, I’m not asking someone to take the day off work to drive me around. No one has time for that. Is this something current ashley, if you don't mind me asking? |
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ashley
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,571
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Post by ashley on Jan 29, 2019 17:06:41 GMT
I’ve composed a text to my sister. Just sitting on it a bit to make sure it’s not too emotional. Thanks for the ideas, suggestions, and criticisms. |
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ashley
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,571
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Post by ashley on Jan 29, 2019 17:08:05 GMT
Yeah, I’m not asking someone to take the day off work to drive me around. No one has time for that. Is this something current ashley, if you don't mind me asking? The doctor’s appointment? Yes. I received a phone call from the office this morning as I was composing a text to my mom to address my nephew’s behaviours. |
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Post by gar on Jan 29, 2019 17:09:17 GMT
Is this something current ashley , if you don't mind me asking? The doctor’s appointment? Yes. I received a phone call from the office this morning as I was composing a text to my mom to address my nephew’s behaviours. I hope you're not too worried about it - easy as that is to say! Let us know how you get on won't you? |
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Post by mygigiscraps on Jan 29, 2019 17:11:04 GMT
I have one sibling, a sister. She has one child, a son. He was very much a lying, manipulative, and spoiled little boy. He got away with anything and everything, even speaking disrespectfully to our grandmother. The day he did that, I spoke up. He ran to tell his mommy, and my sister got extremely ugly with me, then didn't speak to me for almost a year. Over the years, I have watched as he has been allowed to have his way, even as they all know he's a compulsive liar.
My parents even lost friends who couldn't stand to be around him. He in his 20s now, and is no better.
I have every sympathy for your situation and I do understand what it feels like. But the worst part of anything you've said is that your mother and sister basically ganged up against you and became closer because of a rift with you. That says a lot about what kind of mother you have.
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ashley
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,571
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Post by ashley on Jan 29, 2019 17:11:24 GMT
The doctor’s appointment? Yes. I received a phone call from the office this morning as I was composing a text to my mom to address my nephew’s behaviours. I hope you're not too worried about it - easy as that is to say! Let us know how you get on won't you? I’m not too too worried. More annoyed it will likely mean more appointments in the future, slightly uncomfortable procedures, etc. |
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flute4peace
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,757
Jul 3, 2014 14:38:35 GMT
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Post by flute4peace on Jan 29, 2019 17:22:32 GMT
Sure you can! You can. Even though you only see your friend once a month, a true friend will step up to the plate for you! People want to help. Let them in. I get how hard that is, but it may truly deepen your connections. I hope it gets better. Yeah, I’m not asking someone to take the day off work to drive me around. No one has time for that. You might be surprised. I have a friend who has a lot of health problems and no car. She, like you, has been dependent on her (raving bitch of a) mother for transportation. Lately I've been taking her to appointments, and we've had so much fun together!! I'm not really in the best financial situation to be spending gas money on trips to the city, but I figure it's helping her and me both emotionally so it's worth it. Also, I wanted to mention that I have a nephew who was having issues with tantrums/rages when he was 4, very similar to what you're describing. My former BIL had left the marriage and there was a lot of tension, etc. My sister immediately put him into therapy and learned some amazing skills to diffuse and work with his behavior. He's just turned 9 and very rarely has them anymore. BUT it took a LOT of hard work by my sister and the counselors, and he will likely always have anger issues (thanks to his Dad). When he's not raging he is the sweetest, brightest, most thoughtful kid. I hope you're able to find a solution that everyone is comfortable with, at least eventually. |
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Post by femalebusiness on Jan 29, 2019 17:29:49 GMT
I haven't read the entire thread but my first thought is you are teaching your children to put up with other's obnoxious behavior, that their discomfort is not important and one should never stick up for oneself. Always put up with whatever behavior is dumped on you so that you will always be the good guy.
To me that is the scariest part. When they are a little older and have an abusive lover or boss they have no tools to help them have boundaries.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Aug 18, 2025 20:02:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2019 17:30:40 GMT
I’m not sure if he has an undiagnosed problem. I’ve asked my sister to have him tested — she claims the school says it’s not necessary. And yes, he’s been in school full time since JK (he’s in grade 1 now). I think he does behave poorly at school on occasion, just not to the extent he does with family (prob because he has boundaries at school) It may well be that he does have some kind of self regulation issues. He may do well in school where there is structure, and not bad at home when there are fewer people, but the excitement of the family dinners, playing with cousins, less structure may set him off. My dd has a little guy whose anxiety level sometimes pushes him out of control. Most kids learn how to regulate themselves as they grow out of toddlerhood, and seem to be able to adapt to social situations almost naturally: others need to actually think about every social action they take. For my dgs, "normal" disciplining--as in yelling NO, making threats, adults or other kids becoming angry--only raise his anxiety and put his behavior further out of his control. She finds that these things help: Giving him positive reinforcement. Praise the behavior you WANT to see. Talk directly to the kid when he is in a good place. Tell him how much the little guys enjoy playing with him. But also let him know that it scares you when the play gets too rough. Catching him early. He has "cues" that can alert her that he will go over the edge if left to continue on this tack. Dd has been able to teach his cousins and friends these cues, and has invited them to let her know as soon as they notice them. If an adult can intervene early enough, disaster and upset can be greatly reduced. Get him away from the crowd. Not a punishment as in "Go to your room!", but "I think you need to go somewhere quiet to calm down before you can come back and play properly." I know you are not the mom, but if you can see the cues and pull him aside for a quiet chat from time to time (just a chat. not a reading of the riot act), you may find that his behavior improves a lot. Talk to your kids before the family times to remind them that whether or not their cousin is disciplined for his behavior, THEY are still accountable for theirs. You do not want to see them egging him on or throwing their own tantrums. They are still expected to follow your rules. Please don't separate your kids from their cousin. And try not to label him as "the little shit", in his hearing or in theirs. Let them know he seems to have trouble toeing the line and that they may need to help him--not in ordering him around, but in helping him to get along. Thank you for saying this. And for Christ sake do NOT tell him you love him but not his behavior. If he truly does does have a syndrome or condition of some sort you are basically telling him you dont love him period because unfortunately he is his behavior. It sucks yes but either ignore it or stop going. You are all making excuses. None of that helps anyone |
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ashley
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,571
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Post by ashley on Jan 29, 2019 17:38:56 GMT
I sent a text to both my mom and sister, separately. Polite but firm, saying we can no longer tolerate his behaviour. I suggested we could come up with a family game plan to tackle the problem behaviour and I would be happy to be helpful and supportive but until there were consistent consequences and follow through to nephew’s poor behaviour I could no longer be complacent and expose my children to it. So we will be quietly and calmly leaving from now on following his uncontrolled outbursts.
Oh, I feel so sick and anxious. My head is floating and fuzzy and fucked. I am near tears.
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Post by mellowyellow on Jan 29, 2019 17:55:57 GMT
I sent a text to both my mom and sister, separately. Polite but firm, saying we can no longer tolerate his behaviour. I suggested we could come up with a family game plan to tackle the problem behaviour and I would be happy to be helpful and supportive but until there were consistent consequences and follow through to nephew’s poor behaviour I could no longer be complacent and expose my children to it. So we will be quietly and calmly leaving from now on following his uncontrolled outbursts. Oh, I feel so sick and anxious. My head is floating and fuzzy and fucked. I am near tears. This hurts my heart so much for you but I get it.....I truly do. Big hugs to you. |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Jan 29, 2019 17:56:14 GMT
My 7 year old nephew is nothing short of an unparented heathen. I’m sick and tired of every family gathering (dinner once a week plus holidays) being dominated by his uncontrolled behaviour. Screaming, temper tantrums, demands everyone do what he want, full control of the tv, etc. My sister won’t let me interfere with him (although she jumps all over my kids for every minor little thing). My mom feels sorry for my sister. I’ve mentioned how tiresome this is to my mom, but she won’t do anything. I’m at the point where I’d like to say we’re going to leave when he misbehaves but that will cause a huge family rift and the only result will that I will become a scapegoat. Any thoughts? I’m so exhausted by it I’m seriously considering booking a therapy appointment just to discuss it. Please save me $100 and have some really good ideas.  Stop going to these dinners. |
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Post by crimsoncat05 on Jan 29, 2019 17:57:42 GMT
Stop going to these dinners. keep reading; she feels like she can't do that. |
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flute4peace
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,757
Jul 3, 2014 14:38:35 GMT
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Post by flute4peace on Jan 29, 2019 17:59:16 GMT
I sent a text to both my mom and sister, separately. Polite but firm, saying we can no longer tolerate his behaviour. I suggested we could come up with a family game plan to tackle the problem behaviour and I would be happy to be helpful and supportive but until there were consistent consequences and follow through to nephew’s poor behaviour I could no longer be complacent and expose my children to it. So we will be quietly and calmly leaving from now on following his uncontrolled outbursts. Oh, I feel so sick and anxious. My head is floating and fuzzy and fucked. I am near tears. I'm sitting here holding your hand. |
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ashley
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,571
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Post by ashley on Jan 29, 2019 17:59:51 GMT
Here’s the text I sent (trust me, much better than in person discussion).
A is my nephew.
“Hi M. I hope you know that I love both you and A and our entire family, but A’s behaviour is taking a stressful toil on both me and my girls and we have reached a point where we must make difficult decisions. I can’t deal with the stress of A’s abhorrent behaviour. It also distresses the girls greatly. We have discussed it and from now on will be leaving when he begins to misbehave. I just wanted to let you know so there are no surprises and hopefully no hard feelings. I am sure this won’t be easy for anyone, but I have come to realize it’s really not fair to my girls, and also the rest of us. No one in the family would tolerate this behaviour from anyone else and I can no longer tolerate it from A. If you’d like to come up with a family game-plan to tackle his behaviour when we are together, I’d be willing to be part of a team to help deal with it but until there are consistent consequences to his behavioural choices and consistent follow through, I can’t be complacent in subjecting my family to this stressful and disruptive behaviour. “
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Post by Merge on Jan 29, 2019 18:00:57 GMT
I sent a text to both my mom and sister, separately. Polite but firm, saying we can no longer tolerate his behaviour. I suggested we could come up with a family game plan to tackle the problem behaviour and I would be happy to be helpful and supportive but until there were consistent consequences and follow through to nephew’s poor behaviour I could no longer be complacent and expose my children to it. So we will be quietly and calmly leaving from now on following his uncontrolled outbursts. Oh, I feel so sick and anxious. My head is floating and fuzzy and fucked. I am near tears. Take a deep breath and do something nice for yourself. I saw a funny "adulting" pin recently that read, "I set appropriate boundaries today!" 😂 Good job, girl! Pat yourself on the back and have some chocolate or a nice cup of tea. |
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Post by papersilly on Jan 29, 2019 18:04:33 GMT
that is one thing about my family, if any of the kids acted up, any adult could step in to nip it in the bud. uncle/auntie's admonishment held the same weight as mom/dad's. if uncle/auntie had to tell mom/dad, heads would roll. thank goodness it never had to come to that.
i'm sorry you have to go through this. it would make me bonkers to the point that i wouldn't go to a gathering unless it was absolutely necessary.
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ashley
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,571
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Post by ashley on Jan 29, 2019 18:07:07 GMT
that is one thing about my family, if any of the kids acted up, any adult could step in to nip it in the bud. uncle/auntie's admonishment held the same weight as mom/dad's. if uncle/auntie had to tell mom/dad, heads would roll. thank goodness it never had to come to that. i'm sorry you have to go through this. it would make me bonkers to the point that i wouldn't go to a gathering unless it was absolutely necessary. The frustrating thing is both my sister and BIL (and my mother, obviously) nitpick and chastise all four of my girls constantly. The double standard is clear and excruciating. Even outsiders (like my ex boyfriend) noticed it on their own and have mentioned it to me. Any attempt I’ve made to address this double standard has not been tolerated. |
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Deleted
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Aug 18, 2025 20:02:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2019 18:07:32 GMT
When he’s misbehaving, frame it in “I” terms.
“I will not allow you to treat me this way.”
“I will not listen when you speak to me this way.”
“I can’t tolerate this volume of noise.”
“I will not spend time with you while you’re acting like this.”
“I need to leave if you’re going to continue this.”
Instruct your kids to say the same.
Lather, rinse, repeat.
Then you’re not directing him, you’re enforcing your boundaries.
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