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Post by iamkristinl16 on Jun 19, 2019 3:28:13 GMT
"Not donald trump" I hope it's catching. I agree! The statements that Democrats need to find a unicorn of a candidate that will satisfy everyone's political needs and desires in order to beat Trump make me feel hopeless for society and humanity.
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Post by quinlove on Jun 19, 2019 3:30:01 GMT
Well, I’m hopeful. If this election is anything like 2018 - we got this. The Blue Wave was strong then and if everyone gets behind it again, we can do it. 🌊🌊🌊
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PLurker
Prolific Pea
Posts: 9,790
Location: Behind the Cheddar Curtain
Jun 28, 2014 3:48:49 GMT
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Post by PLurker on Jun 19, 2019 3:36:11 GMT
This has me thinking of election night 2020. (or when results are in) I can already feel the sigh of relief or the increased impending doom, despair and agony; all depending on the outcome. quinlove I'm hopeful most of the time. Here's hoping we, as a country, have come to our senses and will vote.him.out.
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Post by 950nancy on Jun 19, 2019 3:36:13 GMT
Joe Biden said that last week. But when Joe Biden says it, he means it. I mean, maybe it won’t happen, but he cares. He lost his son to cancer. He really wants to cure it. When Trump says it, it’s just another lie. He couldn’t care less about curing cancer other than does it make him look good? He is despicable. And the cultists like him that way. I just think he took Joe's words.
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Country Ham
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,314
Jun 25, 2014 19:32:08 GMT
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Post by Country Ham on Jun 19, 2019 3:44:24 GMT
Independents need to vote for the dem candidate. There cannot be this mass 3rd party voting like there was in 2016. If that happens again WE ARE FUCKED. I am one of those independent voters and I reserve my right to vote third party again if I do not like either candidate from the 2 major parties. The only way to break out of this 2 party system is for more third party votes. We need to get the percentage of votes up for a third party candidate enough they can get on TV as part of the national debates etc.
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Post by 950nancy on Jun 19, 2019 3:52:32 GMT
Independents need to vote for the dem candidate. There cannot be this mass 3rd party voting like there was in 2016. If that happens again WE ARE FUCKED. I am one of those independent voters and I reserve my right to vote third party again if I do not like either candidate from the 2 major parties. The only way to break out of this 2 party system is for more third party votes. We need to get the percentage of votes up for a third party candidate enough they can get on TV as part of the national debates etc. I am an independent who will vote Dem this year. I can't let my vote not count for this next election.
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Jun 19, 2019 4:22:24 GMT
if the democrats put up someone worth voting for, maybe not. if not, probably so. Comments like this ASTOUND me. There is not a Democrat in the pool of what 18-20 who is as dangerous as trump. Nor is there one who lies as much as he does. There is not one single democrat who is currently running who is as ignorant or as stupid or as insulting as trump.
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Post by lucyg on Jun 19, 2019 4:32:10 GMT
if the democrats put up someone worth voting for, maybe not. if not, probably so. Comments like this ASTOUND me. There is not a Democrat in the pool of what 18-20 who is as dangerous as trump. Nor is there one who lies as much as he does. There is not one single democrat who is currently running who is as ignorant or as stupid or as insulting as trump. There isn’t a Democrat running who wouldn’t make a better president, a MUCH better president, than Trump. Even the ones I don’t like, and there are several. But I think you’re talking to a Republican (maybe?), and if she’s even talking about the possibility of voting Trump out, I’m relieved. And happy. And grateful. I’ll take it.
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Post by LavenderLayoutLady on Jun 19, 2019 4:33:27 GMT
We are discussing this as if it will be an honest election.
Not for one second do I think that there won't be foreign interference again.
And maybe the Trump voters really do have enough voters in the right configuration for him to win the electoral vote, even while losing the popular vote by millions.
But if there aren't enough legitimate Trump voters, I think Russia or Saudi Arabia will tip the election in his favor.
I think there is a good chance he wins, and then we really do have to wait to see if he willingly leaves after two terms.
I don't think that even one positive thing will come of his presidency. He will be noted in the history books as a cancer to our country.
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Post by dewryce on Jun 19, 2019 6:00:21 GMT
What do they say about his obvious racism, his corruption, his lack of transparency, his fighting Congress tooth and nail on their oversight duties, his ruining our relationships with our allies, etc.? Do they even discuss it? Nothing about racism, but most are very anti LBGT. That’s not Christian. Congresss etc are all just crooked, and purposely getting in the way of his great plans. Other countries are taking jobs away, we are the USA, they should be listening to us...oooh yea. There’s an excuse for it all. Never mind he treats women like dogs, they probably deserve it.. ie hilary, pelosi, Warren, etc Thank you for sharing your experiences. It is very disheartening to hear, but as I expected and have seen online. I only have a few people in my life that may/probably believe this way, and they don’t discuss political topics...which is probably best for our relationship. I can’t imagine knowing a lot of people or having a lot of family that held such hateful, damaging views and discussed it openly. These are people you love and respect for other aspects, and because they’re family. I wouldn’t be able to say nothing if they were discussing it, and I imagine it wouldn’t go well.
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Post by dewryce on Jun 19, 2019 6:06:54 GMT
I am one of those independent voters and I reserve my right to vote third party again if I do not like either candidate from the 2 major parties. The only way to break out of this 2 party system is for more third party votes. We need to get the percentage of votes up for a third party candidate enough they can get on TV as part of the national debates etc. I am an independent who will vote Dem this year. I can't let my vote not count for this next election. And I am so thankful to independent voters like you that can see what is at stake right now and understand how your vote can impact that instead of using it to make a statement that no one will hear right now because our democracy is falling down around our ears. If there was ever a time in our history not to make a statement vote, this is it.
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Post by peatlejuice on Jun 19, 2019 6:44:27 GMT
Yes, I think he will get elected. I believe the Democrats will cannibalize themselves in the primaries, as they did in 2016, then, when the majority of them don't get their preferred candidate into the general, will allow their hurt feelings to goad them into not voting or voting third party. Then they will spend the next four years blaming independents.
I also think there is a non-zero chance that Bernie will run as an independent in the general if he doesn't get the Democratic nomination, thus splitting their vote.
And I also think there's a 100% chance that Saudi Arabia, Russia, and/or another foreign agency will tamper with our elections.
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YooHoot
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,432
Jun 26, 2014 3:11:50 GMT
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Post by YooHoot on Jun 19, 2019 11:23:26 GMT
I hope there are many republicans who have jumped ship like myself and vote dem. I cannot look at that man for another 4 years.
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Country Ham
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,314
Jun 25, 2014 19:32:08 GMT
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Post by Country Ham on Jun 19, 2019 12:44:17 GMT
If there was ever a time in our history not to make a statement vote, this is it. Voting independently for a third party is not always a statement vote. Something has to give and the only way to affect change for most of us is when we vote and while I haven't made up my mind yet, if I chose to vote third party again my vote will just as legitimate as a person who votes democrat or republican. Because the US votes for the person and not the party for President I will look at each individual candidate and decide then. I have a good idea what I want to see happen in my mind but whether that happens I don't know. I live in the south in a very small county. I have worked every election since becoming a US citizen and well, every election so far is like 80% republican. People are very tied to their parties here. That's also part of the reason I will wait and see who rises out of the ashes for the democratic party, and who stands up as independents before I commit. Most folks are correct in their "anyone has to be better then Trump" declaration, but I truly think the "anyone but" ideology has gotten us where we are today. Some folks also vote with their hearts, emotionally. No one wants to be mocked for their votes when only half the country can't even be even bothered to vote. I think this is best time in our recent history for an Independents to step up and make a difference. Legitimate 3rd party candidates to step up. The republican party, right now, is what it is, and the democratic party doesn't have anyone to truly rally around at the moment. A third party candidate can truly affect change. If not now when? If not this election then when?
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Post by jeremysgirl on Jun 19, 2019 14:04:42 GMT
I think the republicans who actually care about country over party and who are paying attention to news sources beyond trump himself and Fix News can see that he has no idea what he is doing Pierkiss, I don't want to be contrary, but I know you're a fellow Michigander. Have you seen and heard some of the backlash going on regarding Amash? It has been so ugly on social media. I am not convinced he's going to come out the victor in 2020.
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Post by dewryce on Jun 19, 2019 14:05:08 GMT
If there was ever a time in our history not to make a statement vote, this is it. Voting independently for a third party is not always a statement vote. Something has to give and the only way to affect change for most of us is when we vote and while I haven't made up my mind yet, if I chose to vote third party again my vote will just as legitimate as a person who votes democrat or republican. Because the US votes for the person and not the party for President I will look at each individual candidate and decide then. I have a good idea what I want to see happen in my mind but whether that happens I don't know. I live in the south in a very small county. I have worked every election since becoming a US citizen and well, every election so far is like 80% republican. People are very tied to their parties here. That's also part of the reason I will wait and see who rises out of the ashes for the democratic party, and who stands up as independents before I commit. Most folks are correct in their "anyone has to be better then Trump" declaration, but I truly think the "anyone but" ideology has gotten us where we are today. Some folks also vote with their hearts, emotionally. No one wants to be mocked for their votes when only half the country can't even be even bothered to vote. I think this is best time in our recent history for an Independents to step up and make a difference. Legitimate 3rd party candidates to step up. The republican party, right now, is what it is, and the democratic party doesn't have anyone to truly rally around at the moment. A third party candidate can truly affect change. If not now when? If not this election then when? Not when the candidate and his party have been destroying the country. Not when you know that a third party will not be elected this election, and your third party votes will help allow this candidate and his party to remain in power and do unprecedented damage for four more years. I didn’t say your vote wouldn’t be legitimate, I just think it will be wasted when it is desperately needed to remove this man and his party from office/the majority. I also live in a small southern town, who votes 84% Republican, but I’m not sure what that has to do with 3rd party voting. I was not mocking you for your vote, I just disagree with you completely and think this is a horrible time to waste a vote for a party that holds no chance this election, especially when you could be helping to take this terrible President and his complicit party out of power. We are talking about a vote for a person who has yet to emerge less than a year and a half prior to the election. This unnamed/unknown person is somehow going to be able to turn the tide and make history by winning the election as an independent? Unless you’ve got Oprah in your pocket, I don’t see it happening.
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trollie
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,580
Jul 2, 2014 22:14:02 GMT
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Post by trollie on Jun 19, 2019 14:10:11 GMT
Praying that he is not reelected, but I am not optimistic. Will do what I can to turn out the vote though.
eta - Hoping for a Harris/Buttigieg ticket. Those 2 are smart cookies!
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Post by jeremysgirl on Jun 19, 2019 14:19:49 GMT
I am one of those independent voters and I reserve my right to vote third party again if I do not like either candidate from the 2 major parties. The only way to break out of this 2 party system is for more third party votes. We need to get the percentage of votes up for a third party candidate enough they can get on TV as part of the national debates etc. I am an independent who will vote Dem this year. I can't let my vote not count for this next election. I also will not waste my vote on a third party candidate, as I did in 2016. I thought Hillary had it in the bag. This time I'm doing all I can to oppose Trump.
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Post by thundergal on Jun 19, 2019 14:35:05 GMT
I can already feel the sigh of relief or the increased impending doom, despair and agony; all depending on the outcome. For exactly this reason, I will likely schedule myself to be off work for at least that Wednesday and possibly the rest of the week. It will be a lot to process for me, no matter what happens. Whether in celebration or defeat, I think some self-care will be in order.
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Post by kmcginn on Jun 19, 2019 14:42:18 GMT
While I hate the thought of it, I think it's entirely possible he will get a 2nd term. Democrats HAVE to get out and vote for whomever runs against him.
My hope is that the Democrats can keep the House and win the Senate. Then, I almost hope (almost) hope that rather than impeaching him, they just vote against everything he proposes so he can't get ANYTHING done.
I would say impeach, but I think Pence might even be worse. He sounds more intelligent, but he's silently dangerous!
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Post by thundergal on Jun 19, 2019 14:45:21 GMT
A third party candidate can truly affect change. If not now when? If not this election then when? I don't know when, but absolutely not now. Under no circumstances. A 3rd party candidate can't win right now. I'm intrigued by the idea of a viable 3rd party. But right now, there isn't one. And right now is what matters. That trump and the GOP are not the governing powers in the 4 years spanning from 2020 to 2024 is monumentally imperative.
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Post by mom on Jun 19, 2019 14:47:05 GMT
Yes, I think he will get elected. I believe the Democrats will cannibalize themselves in the primaries, as they did in 2016, then, when the majority of them don't get their preferred candidate into the general, will allow their hurt feelings to goad them into not voting or voting third party. Then they will spend the next four years blaming independents.
I also think there is a non-zero chance that Bernie will run as an independent in the general if he doesn't get the Democratic nomination, thus splitting their vote. And I also think there's a 100% chance that Saudi Arabia, Russia, and/or another foreign agency will tamper with our elections. I agree with this, 1000%. I don't think the Democrats will be able to get out of their own way. And Bernie will do anything he can to be President, even if it means spitting the Party.
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Post by cindyupnorth on Jun 19, 2019 14:52:35 GMT
Thank you for sharing your experiences. It is very disheartening to hear, but as I expected and have seen online. I only have a few people in my life that may/probably believe this way, and they don’t discuss political topics...which is probably best for our relationship. I can’t imagine knowing a lot of people or having a lot of family that held such hateful, damaging views and discussed it openly. These are people you love and respect for other aspects, and because they’re family. I wouldn’t be able to say nothing if they were discussing it, and I imagine it wouldn’t go well. oooh yea. It's a touchy subject for sure. Like I said, I hide their page on FB. we are still friends, but once in awhile I will go over to their pages, to see what they have been up too, and then I read allll that crap.
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Country Ham
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,314
Jun 25, 2014 19:32:08 GMT
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Post by Country Ham on Jun 19, 2019 15:00:50 GMT
I also live in a small southern town, who votes 84% Republican, but I’m not sure what that has to do with 3rd party voting Not when you know that a third party will not be elected this election, and your third party votes will help allow this candidate and his party to remain in power In reality the only way my vote will "count" is if I vote republican. If I want to be on the side of who will win my area. The specific riding I worked had 142 voters last election. I would say about 20 of those were democrat. That is too much of a difference to expect anything but a republican voter turn out again next election. That is why I will weigh my vote between the democratic candidate and any third party/independents that are on my ballot. I already know a third party or independent will not win in my county. I know a democrat will not win in my county. The only way to push for third party recognition is percentage of voter turn out at the polls (whether opinion polls or voter polls). Perhaps if I lived in an area where the races were closer and every vote counted I might approach it differently. In my county that's just not going to happen.
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Post by dewryce on Jun 19, 2019 15:18:47 GMT
I also live in a small southern town, who votes 84% Republican, but I’m not sure what that has to do with 3rd party voting Not when you know that a third party will not be elected this election, and your third party votes will help allow this candidate and his party to remain in power In reality the only way my vote will "count" is if I vote republican. If I want to be on the side of who will win my area. The specific riding I worked had 142 voters last election. I would say about 20 of those were democrat. That is too much of a difference to expect anything but a republican voter turn out again next election. That is why I will weigh my vote between the democratic candidate and any third party/independents that are on my ballot. I already know a third party or independent will not win in my county. I know a democrat will not win in my county. The only way to push for third party recognition is percentage of voter turn out at the polls (whether opinion polls or voter polls). Perhaps if I lived in an area where the races were closer and every vote counted I might approach it differently. In my county that's just not going to happen. That may be true. But a lot of people may feel the way you do and just aren’t saying so. So speak up to those people, and personally place the vote that has a smidgen of a chance of counting. Look at Texas for midterms, even I was shocked. Not just Beto’s race either, red districts were flipped for the House, and many districts while they didn’t flip went from strongly red to purple. There is zero chance of that happening if people in your position don’t vote for the most viable candidate and against Trump and the complicit GOP.* The most viable candidate for this election will not be an Independent nominee. *And obviously if Dems don’t turn out to vote.
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janeliz
Drama Llama
I'm the Wiz and nobody beats me.
Posts: 5,641
Jun 26, 2014 14:35:07 GMT
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Post by janeliz on Jun 19, 2019 15:29:15 GMT
In the world of politics, we’re still in early days. I can’t say I don’t give in and feel defeated about it all, and rallies like the one in Florida last night scare the shit out of me. But I’m trying to hang on to hope and taking action where I can. What else have we got?
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cycworker
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,387
Jun 26, 2014 0:42:38 GMT
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Post by cycworker on Jun 19, 2019 15:55:10 GMT
I don't think Trump will get back in. I don't think there's any Dem as hated as Clinton. and Russia has already succeeded in creating chaos. No need for foreign interference.
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PLurker
Prolific Pea
Posts: 9,790
Location: Behind the Cheddar Curtain
Jun 28, 2014 3:48:49 GMT
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Post by PLurker on Jun 19, 2019 16:14:47 GMT
trump has shown himself to be well, himself. and yet his cult supports him. I don't know if anything will change that. I always think of the movie Dead Zone when a politician shows his true self by using a baby as a shield from an assassin. Would that even change things for them?
But more hope is that those that did vote for him but haven't drank the Kool Aid may have a change of heart and those who sat out the vote will get.out.and.vote.
I have to believe there is more good in the world. 3 million+ people voted for his opponent. Too bad we need more.
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Post by mom on Jun 19, 2019 18:52:51 GMT
I don't think Trump will get back in. I don't think there's any Dem as hated as Clinton. and Russia has already succeeded in creating chaos. No need for foreign interference. Very good point.
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scrappinmama
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,016
Jun 26, 2014 12:54:09 GMT
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Post by scrappinmama on Jun 19, 2019 21:24:41 GMT
There is a good chance that he will be re-elected. Democrats, Independents and Republicans who want to claim their party back from madness need to be united and vote for whoever runs against Trump. But Bernie brothers need to stop with the Bernie or nobody nonsense. And I can see Democrats picking each other apart so badly that a lot of people stay home for election.
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