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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2019 1:34:45 GMT
NBC News.
“Republican politicians, states join NRA in backing gun-maker in Sandy Hook case”
“HARTFORD, Conn. — Ten states and nearly two dozen members of Congress are joining the National Rifle Association in supporting gun-maker Remington Arms as it fights a Connecticut court ruling involving liability for the Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting.
Officials in the 10 conservative states, 22 House Republicans and the NRA are among groups that filed briefs with the U.S. Supreme Court on Tuesday and Wednesday. They urged justices to overturn the Connecticut decision, citing a much-debated 2005 federal law that shields gun makers from liability, in most cases, when their products are used in crimes.
Remington, based in Madison, North Carolina, made the Bushmaster AR-15-style rifle used to kill 20 first graders and six educators at the Newtown, Connecticut, school on Dec. 14, 2012.
A survivor and relatives of nine victims of the massacre filed a wrongful death lawsuit against Remington in 2015, saying the company should have never sold such a dangerous weapon to the public and alleging it targeted younger, at-risk males in its marketing and through product placement in violent video games.
Citing one of the few exemptions in the 2005 federal law, the Connecticut Supreme Court ruled 4-3 in March that Remington could be sued under state law over how it marketed the rifle. The decision overturned a ruling by a state trial court judge who dismissed the lawsuit based on the federal law, named the Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act.
The federal law has been criticized by gun control advocates as being too favorable to gun makers, and it has been used to bar lawsuits over other mass killings.
The Connecticut case is being watched by gun control advocates, gun rights supporters and gun manufacturers across the country because it has the potential to provide a roadmap for victims of other mass shootings to circumvent the federal law and sue firearm makers.
One of the supporting papers filed this week was by officials in Alabama, Arkansas, Georgia, Louisiana, Mississippi, Oklahoma, South Dakota, Texas, Utah and West Virginia.
"The Connecticut Supreme Court's decision reads a narrow exception broadly," the states' brief says. "That reading is inconsistent with the text of the PLCAA. And it creates uncertainty for States seeking to implement sound gun policies consistent with federal law."
Among the Republican members of Congress who filed a brief Wednesday were Reps. Jim Jordan, of Ohio, Jim Sensenbrenner, of Wisconsin, and Greg Walden, of Oregon.
The congressional Republicans' brief says they "have a strong interest in ensuring the Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act of 2005 ... is interpreted and applied consistent with Congress's stated purpose, and that the narrow exceptions to the PLCAA are not applied in a way that frustrates congressional intent and renders the PLCAA's protections meaningless."
The NRA filed a brief with the Connecticut Citizens Defense League, a fellow pro-gun rights group, saying the Connecticut ruling threatens the gun rights of all Americans.
"The right to keep and bear arms means nothing if the ability to acquire those arms is not possible because the firearm industry is put out of business by unlimited and uncertain liability for criminal misuse of their products," their brief says.
A lawyer for the victims' relatives suing Remington defended the lawsuit and the Connecticut court decision.
None of the politically-motivated briefs filed on Remington's behalf undermine the well-reasoned determination by our state's highest court that these families deserve their day in court," Katie Mesner-Hage said in a statement.”
Do you think the law suit should proceed?
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Post by peano on Sept 6, 2019 2:18:55 GMT
HELL YES! When our forefathers encoded the right to keep and bear arms, they weren't referring to weapons that are essentially weapons of war, and that no civilian needs. If you are incapable of protecting yourself with something other than an AR-15, then you shouldn't be packing heat.
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Post by annabella on Sept 6, 2019 2:35:34 GMT
Columbine happened 20 years ago, in a small town in Colorado, not much different from sandy hook. If the general you allows your children to go to schools without security when there’s a shooting at a school every year, then you should take personal responsibility for not lobbying your local school board and government for proper security.
My high school was like going to the airport and no I didn’t go to school in a dangerous neighborhood and there was never a fight at my school. My middle school locked all the doors against the fire code and had a security officer at the front door. Back then we had students who would call in bomb threats for fun, different times.
I read the only changes made to schools after sandy hook is adding, bullet proof windows, buzzers or cameras, well a camera’s great for identifying the shooter after the fact. A buzzer probably lets everyone in that doesn’t look homeless. The shootings I’ve read are done face to face, don’t know how the glass will protect people? The fact is you have to search every single person like at the airport, or shoot I think after the Oklahoma bombing all government office buildings, at least in my city, also have airport security to enter.
My point is these parents are blaming the wrong person. They need to blame themselves for not advocating and demanding a safe school building for their children when this was a known threat, a shooting can happen in any school and will again.
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Sept 6, 2019 3:08:59 GMT
The NRA filed a brief with the Connecticut Citizens Defense League, a fellow pro-gun rights group, saying the Connecticut ruling threatens the gun rights of all Americans. No one needs a military type gun for self defense within their home! Shooting some one a distance away is not self defense! There is no reason to make them for 'home' use! |
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Post by peano on Sept 6, 2019 3:16:10 GMT
Columbine happened 20 years ago, in a small town in Colorado, not much different from sandy hook. If the general you allows your children to go to schools without security when there’s a shooting at a school every year, then you should take personal responsibility for not lobbying your local school board and government for proper security. My high school was like going to the airport and no I didn’t go to school in a dangerous neighborhood and there was never a fight at my school. My middle school locked all the doors against the fire code and had a security officer at the front door. Back then we had students who would call in bomb threats for fun, different times. I read the only changes made to schools after sandy hook is adding, bullet proof windows, buzzers or cameras, well a camera’s great for identifying the shooter after the fact. A buzzer probably lets everyone in that doesn’t look homeless. The shootings I’ve read are done face to face, don’t know how the glass will protect people? The fact is you have to search every single person like at the airport, or shoot I think after the Oklahoma bombing all government office buildings, at least in my city, also have airport security to enter. My point is these parents are blaming the wrong person. They need to blame themselves for not advocating and demanding a safe school building for their children when this was a known threat, a shooting can happen in any school and will again. Annabella, bless your heart. Since you have no children in public school, you can't possibly understand how uber-safe school buildings just aren't going to happen. Where do you propose those funds come from? I live in Newtown, a fairly affluent community, and though I'm sure the new Sandy Hook School has the gold standard in safety features, our real advantage is the improbability that lightning will strike twice. Even with our history, we have highly contested school budget referendums every year, which pit residents who understand that well-financed schools are crucial to preparing students for an increasingly technical world as well as have a positive effect upon property values vs those who are in the "readin', writin' and 'rithmetic were good enough for me when I attended school back in the Cretaceous era. We have trouble getting funds for enough tech equipment, much less state of the art building security. And most of all, why in God's name should we blame these parents, who already paid the ultimate price, for living in a country in which people, before Columbine, never had to worry that when they sent their children off to school in the morning, they might never see them again. I think you may be a little confused about how Sandy Hook went down. There was no "known threat" of gun violence. One thing you are right about: a shooting can happen in any school and will again. Especially as long as this country maintains its love affair with guns. |
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Deleted
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Nov 23, 2024 10:45:50 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2019 9:23:00 GMT
My point is these parents are blaming the wrong person. They need to blame themselves for not advocating and demanding a safe school building for their children when this was a known threat, a shooting can happen in any school and will again. Are you seriously for real? You blame the victims, yes, their parents are victims too? Every child should have the right to go to school and be safe from being killed.In a normal civilized society you don't sent your children to a school that it built like a fortress......they're going to school not a prison! Every parent has the right to expect that their child should be as safe in school as they are at home. Do you also blame the victim for being raped for wearing the wrong clothes? Do you blame the victim of a drunk driver because they decided to drive to the store at that particular time? Do you blame the victims in Las Vegas because they decided to attend a concert? Seriously annabella ! |
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Gennifer
Drama Llama
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Post by Gennifer on Sept 6, 2019 10:12:01 GMT
Annabella, bless your heart. I feel like 99% of my responses to Annabella start the same. She certainly lives a different life than most of us.  |
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Deleted
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Nov 23, 2024 10:45:50 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2019 10:37:00 GMT
Columbine happened 20 years ago, in a small town in Colorado, not much different from sandy hook. If the general you allows your children to go to schools without security when there’s a shooting at a school every year, then you should take personal responsibility for not lobbying your local school board and government for proper security. Are you fucking kidding? Your ignorance is stunning. |
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Post by elaine on Sept 6, 2019 10:44:42 GMT
Columbine happened 20 years ago, in a small town in Colorado, not much different from sandy hook. If the general you allows your children to go to schools without security when there’s a shooting at a school every year, then you should take personal responsibility for not lobbying your local school board and government for proper security. My high school was like going to the airport and no I didn’t go to school in a dangerous neighborhood and there was never a fight at my school. My middle school locked all the doors against the fire code and had a security officer at the front door. Back then we had students who would call in bomb threats for fun, different times. I read the only changes made to schools after sandy hook is adding, bullet proof windows, buzzers or cameras, well a camera’s great for identifying the shooter after the fact. A buzzer probably lets everyone in that doesn’t look homeless. The shootings I’ve read are done face to face, don’t know how the glass will protect people? The fact is you have to search every single person like at the airport, or shoot I think after the Oklahoma bombing all government office buildings, at least in my city, also have airport security to enter. My point is these parents are blaming the wrong person. They need to blame themselves for not advocating and demanding a safe school building for their children when this was a known threat, a shooting can happen in any school and will again. This is akin to saying that if you are ever in a car accident in which someone hits your car (you are not at fault), and you are injured, you should bear all the responsibility and costs involved. Because you should have demanded that car manufacturers build cars that are 100% accident-proof, since 16,000 car accidents happen every day. If you get hurt in an accident, even though you were driving faultlessly following all rules of the road, you need to blame yourself because you should have known better and demanded safer cars. If you, while walking down the street, are ever hit by a car and seriously injured, you should take personal responsibility and realize it is your fault for not demanding safer roads and sidewalks since 15 people per day in the USA are hit by motor vehicles. You have no reason to expect the person who struck you with their car to be legally liable for your injuries, nor should your family go after that person in court in you are killed. When it is something you have experience with, do you see how absurd your argument is? |
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Deleted
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Nov 23, 2024 10:45:50 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2019 11:20:09 GMT
Once again, annabella proves that she is an idiot. She contributes nothing of substance. |
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johnnysmom
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,685
Jun 25, 2014 21:16:33 GMT
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Post by johnnysmom on Sept 6, 2019 11:29:21 GMT
You know annabella usually when you post outlandish things I can somewhat see where you coming from, even agree with you from time to time; but this?!?! Blaming a 6 year old for getting shot because their school didn't have enough security? Blaming a parent for sending their child to a school, an ELEMENTARY SCHOOL without metal detectors and guards and patdowns? No, sorry I can't see where you're coming from here. The ONLY thing I can think of is that you're trying to protect your heart. You're trying to find a way it won't happen to you; that you won't lose a child-size loved one because they all attend school with top security. I hope it doesn't happen to you, I hope it doesn't happen to anyone ever again but I don't think gun violence will end when kindergartens start doing patdowns. As for this lawsuit. Legally speaking it seems they found a loophole (I'm not a lawyer, I have no idea what I'm talking about  ) and they have the right to see where that loophole leads them. I don't really think we can say that playing video games with the same gun used in the shooting caused the shooting.....that's a helluva a stretch; but if this brings more attention to the issue and gets gun manufacturers talking about gun issues then great. FWIW I'm not saying ban guns (even these guns) or ban video games but I'm all for making harder to for certain people to gain access to certain guns. |
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sassyangel
Drama Llama
Posts: 7,456
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Post by sassyangel on Sept 6, 2019 13:25:27 GMT
Columbine happened 20 years ago, in a small town in Colorado, not much different from sandy hook. If the general you allows your children to go to schools without security when there’s a shooting at a school every year, then you should take personal responsibility for not lobbying your local school board and government for proper security. My high school was like going to the airport and no I didn’t go to school in a dangerous neighborhood and there was never a fight at my school. My middle school locked all the doors against the fire code and had a security officer at the front door. Back then we had students who would call in bomb threats for fun, different times. I read the only changes made to schools after sandy hook is adding, bullet proof windows, buzzers or cameras, well a camera’s great for identifying the shooter after the fact. A buzzer probably lets everyone in that doesn’t look homeless. The shootings I’ve read are done face to face, don’t know how the glass will protect people? The fact is you have to search every single person like at the airport, or shoot I think after the Oklahoma bombing all government office buildings, at least in my city, also have airport security to enter. My point is these parents are blaming the wrong person. They need to blame themselves for not advocating and demanding a safe school building for their children when this was a known threat, a shooting can happen in any school and will again. Damn. 😶🤐 Bless your heart, indeed. |
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LeaP
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,939
Location: Los Angeles, CA where 405 meets 101
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Post by LeaP on Sept 6, 2019 14:29:38 GMT
I go back to Ralph Nader and the Ford Pinto. What is the purpose of your product? Is it safe? So Remington makes a gun designed to mow down people indiscriminately. Are there safety features they can add to make it safer? No? Yes? I don't know, but I do know that they don't have rat poison in the bulk food section so safety is often a concern in most places. Let the lawsuit go forward and see if what happens.
Annabella students are very clever and schools are very porous and security is very expensive. Your measures might help for a while, but then it will reach the point of diminishing returns kind of like the arms race. Also, kids don't want to feel like they go to prison daily. When we lived in New Zealand and Canada the only fences were to keep balls in. The elementary school in Canada had gaps in the fence to make retrieving balls easy. In the U.S. schools have tall fences designed to keep the kids in and violent people out. It is so common we don't even question it. Truly we have exchanged our freedom for a sense of security.
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DEX
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by DEX on Sept 6, 2019 14:36:07 GMT
Once again, annabella proves that she is an idiot. She contributes nothing of substance. Youch!  |
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Sept 6, 2019 15:06:26 GMT
And we should not go or send our kids to the movies, Walmart or go out on a Saturday night to visit with friends at the local bar or a food festival. That is just in the last month!
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Post by MichyM on Sept 6, 2019 15:44:18 GMT
Columbine happened 20 years ago, in a small town in Colorado, not much different from sandy hook. If the general you allows your children to go to schools without security when there’s a shooting at a school every year, then you should take personal responsibility for not lobbying your local school board and government for proper security. My high school was like going to the airport and no I didn’t go to school in a dangerous neighborhood and there was never a fight at my school. My middle school locked all the doors against the fire code and had a security officer at the front door. Back then we had students who would call in bomb threats for fun, different times. I read the only changes made to schools after sandy hook is adding, bullet proof windows, buzzers or cameras, well a camera’s great for identifying the shooter after the fact. A buzzer probably lets everyone in that doesn’t look homeless. The shootings I’ve read are done face to face, don’t know how the glass will protect people? The fact is you have to search every single person like at the airport, or shoot I think after the Oklahoma bombing all government office buildings, at least in my city, also have airport security to enter. My point is these parents are blaming the wrong person. They need to blame themselves for not advocating and demanding a safe school building for their children when this was a known threat, a shooting can happen in any school and will again. Have you lost your mind? Serious question. How the heck does someone’s thought process get to this? |
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Post by pierkiss on Sept 6, 2019 16:02:43 GMT
Columbine happened 20 years ago, in a small town in Colorado, not much different from sandy hook. If the general you allows your children to go to schools without security when there’s a shooting at a school every year, then you should take personal responsibility for not lobbying your local school board and government for proper security. My high school was like going to the airport and no I didn’t go to school in a dangerous neighborhood and there was never a fight at my school. My middle school locked all the doors against the fire code and had a security officer at the front door. Back then we had students who would call in bomb threats for fun, different times. I read the only changes made to schools after sandy hook is adding, bullet proof windows, buzzers or cameras, well a camera’s great for identifying the shooter after the fact. A buzzer probably lets everyone in that doesn’t look homeless. The shootings I’ve read are done face to face, don’t know how the glass will protect people? The fact is you have to search every single person like at the airport, or shoot I think after the Oklahoma bombing all government office buildings, at least in my city, also have airport security to enter. My point is these parents are blaming the wrong person. They need to blame themselves for not advocating and demanding a safe school building for their children when this was a known threat, a shooting can happen in any school and will again. Annabella, if you think this couldn’t have happened/won’t happen in your school with its enhanced security features you are mistaken. At this point it is only a matter of time. A determined enough person who wants to watch the world burn by killing a bunch of kids while they’re in school will find a way in. They will shoot the guards in charge of the gates. They will smash the glass to get in. They will try every single door or window or crawl space cubby until they find an unlocked one. They will ram a car into the building and get in that way. They will find a way. All the security in the world is just window dressing if we’re not going to talk about the actual problem in this country. And that’s the ridiculously easy access to weapons designed with the sole purpose of killing living things. When we start taking this seriously and make and implement meaningful changes to who can bear arms and what kind, then we will start to see decreases. We will not see decreases in the number of school shootings just because overstretches schools start spending precious $ resources on security features. |
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Deleted
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Nov 23, 2024 10:45:50 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2019 16:22:38 GMT
Funny how other countries don't have schools-cum-prisons and yet don't deal w/mass school (theater, shopping center, church, office, etc.) shootings on a monthly (or more) basis.
They must be magic, I guess.
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) and they have the right to see where that loophole leads them. I don't really think we can say that playing video games with the same gun used in the shooting caused the shooting.....that's a helluva a stretch; but if this brings more attention to the issue and gets gun manufacturers talking about gun issues then great. FWIW I'm not saying ban guns (even these guns) or ban video games but I'm all for making harder to for certain people to gain access to certain guns.
