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Post by putabuttononit on Jul 26, 2022 2:27:02 GMT
Long- sorry!
My dad has terminal cancer. He’s 85 and still going like crazy. He drives, rides four-wheelers, works in his shop, etc. Not your typical 85 yr old for sure but has slowed down a lot from treatment and the cancer. He can’t sit still and he’s MAD at the world. His treatments are over for now, until his next scan. He “could” be enjoying grandkids, beautiful home, kids, wife etc. We don’t know how much time he has left but he’s holding his own it appears.
His marriage to my mom is long and precious. 57 years and counting! The problem is he is acting so hateful and bitter and mean to Mom that she can hardly bear up under it. I love him dearly but told her to leave and set some boundaries and stand up for herself. She doesn’t want to leave him while he’s sick but his mistreatment of her is breaking her heart. She’s always been crazy about him even through some hard times. They did a counseling appointment and it didn’t help. The counselor felt sorry for dad and didn’t call him on his “stuff”. She feels like running away. Mom has been a saint throughout past three years of surgeries, recoveries, treatment, sickness from that etc.
I’ve talked to dad numerous times. He always apologized to mom but it starts up again.
I feel so bad for mom. I’d like to check her into a hotel. Told her she can come stay with me. Love dad dearly but so disappointed in his actions right now. Any ideas? Anyone been through it? .
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Post by Laurie on Jul 26, 2022 2:33:35 GMT
((Hugs))
I am sorry that you are trying to navigate his terminal diagnosis and loving and being with him even when he is being difficult.
I have never been through this nor have any experience so I am just thinking out loud. Do you think he is being difficult to make it easier on your mom (and you) when he passes?
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inkedup
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,837
Jun 26, 2014 5:00:26 GMT
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Post by inkedup on Jul 26, 2022 2:36:43 GMT
I'm so sorry for all of this pain.
My mom and dad were married for nearly 45 years at the time of her death. She began acting terribly toward all of us, especially my sweet dad, a few months before her death.
She was, at times, so cruel verbally. She attacked our dad physically. Looking back, we think the cause was two fold: side effects of disease and medication, and, sadly, just plain grief.
During her last hospital stay, my sister told her she was wasting her last months being angry and hurtful.
My mom said, "but won't that make it easier for all of you? If you hate me before I go?"
My heart goes out to you. Please don't hesitate to reach out to me if you ever want to. This is such a terrible and painful thing to experience. I'm so sorry you are all hurting this way.
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Post by hop2 on Jul 26, 2022 2:38:12 GMT
I’m so sorry.
I don’t know my dad withdrew in the end he did not lash out. My mother lashed out but that had always been a part of her personality being ill just magnified it.
Any chance he’d be up to tell/write 3 things he liked/loved/was thankful for about her each day/week ( preferably each day ) ? Would some acknowledgement like that help your mom when he lashes out? Help bring back the focus that it’s his illness causing the lashing out? If he does agree dual purpose is she’d have those notes later.
But, yeah she shouldn’t have to stay to be abused that’s not right.
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Post by destined2bmom on Jul 26, 2022 2:51:37 GMT
I have no advice. But I wanted to let you know how sorry I am that your family is going through this terrible time. Sending prayers to you and your family.
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Post by quinlove on Jul 26, 2022 2:55:02 GMT
What a heart breaking story. I’m so sorry for everyone. Can you talk with her to see if she would like to go stay with you for awhile ? Or a nice hotel ? Some quality time away would probably be good for both of them.
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Post by FuzzyMutt on Jul 26, 2022 3:00:37 GMT
I'm so sorry people you love and so close to your heart are hurting so much.
I'm glad your mom has you to care, but maybe a hybrid living environment may be best. Or living with you full time if that works for you.
Honestly, being sick, and maybe unconsolably sad and unable to properly express or work through it (these things take time with the willing.. it sounds like he is being robbed of time) is a nightmare I hope to never experience, either as the person in decline or the person in emotional pain.
I'm so sorry I have no advice to offer, other than to commend you for looking out for your mom and loving your dad with eyes wide open. That is unimaginable.
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Jul 26, 2022 3:12:09 GMT
UTI? Starting of dementa..?
His pain..
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Post by FuzzyMutt on Jul 26, 2022 3:19:41 GMT
UTI? Starting of dementa..? His pain.. That's a really good point. |
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Post by tentoes on Jul 26, 2022 3:28:10 GMT
I agree with the two above. It may be dementia. My bil is 80 and does have dementia, and his personality has totally changed. He can be violent at times also. It's so sad to see what it is doing to my sister and his marriage. They have been married for 60 years!!
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Post by KiwiJo on Jul 26, 2022 3:33:07 GMT
Is hospice involved with your Dad? If not, could they be?
Organisations like that can really help both partners in your parents’ situation.
It certainly sounds like your Dad needs help, and I don’t think “calling him” on his stuff is going to do anything except make everyone more miserable. He probably isn’t choosing to act as he is, and may well be very upset at what he’s putting your Mom through but be unable to help himself. Unusual behaviors are not uncommon in these circumstances.
Hospice can also directly help your Mom, suggesting things she can do in particular situations, giving her some respite from caring for him etc.
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Post by jenjie on Jul 26, 2022 3:59:49 GMT
I’m so sorry. My dh wasn’t nasty but he became very needy. And He would say hurtful things. He was shocked to learn I was upset with him.
We were both under a lot of stress. One of the best pieces of advice I was given was:
Don’t take it personally. It’s the disease talking.
I didn’t quite get it until I had a day I wasn’t feeling well (nothing compared to what he was going through). I didn’t want to deal with anyone, didn’t feel like being kind, I was snappy.
It was the best thing that could have happened. Because it opened my eyes to the bigger picture of how his discomfort, pain, worries were affecting how he engaged with me.
Above all, your mom doesn’t want to have regrets later. If she doesn’t want to leave, encourage her to take some time for herself each day to catch a break and catch her breath, too.
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Deleted
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May 18, 2024 20:07:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2022 4:13:53 GMT
Just went through almost this exact same scenario.
He's afraid. Know that first and foremost. He's dying, losing everything with full knowledge that it's happening and what's to come, and he's afraid. Nothing makes people meaner than fear. It doesn't excuse their meanness, but once everyone understands that, it can take the bite out of their words.
It's a terribly hard time for families, of course, so I will say this as gently as I can -- you need to disallow your mother to share this part of their marital strife with you. I'm sorry that on top of losing your dad, you've been put in the middle of this. It's not a place anyone should ever put you in, including yourself.
I'll second the hospice advice.
Take care of yourself. My heart goes out to you all.
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Post by KiwiJo on Jul 26, 2022 5:15:24 GMT
………. Above all, your mom doesn’t want to have regrets later. If she doesn’t want to leave, encourage her to take some time for herself each day to catch a break and catch her breath, too. Oh, that’s such a good about the OP’s Mom not wanting to have any regrets later. If she was talked into leaving her husband after 57 years of marriage (a “long and precious’ marriage in the OP’s words) she would be so likely, after his death, to have regrets about leaving. And at that point there would be nothing she could do about it, she would have to live with those regrets, with the heartache, for the rest of her life. |
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Post by scrappintoee on Jul 26, 2022 5:45:01 GMT
Do you think he is being difficult to make it easier on your mom (and you) when he passes? My mom said, "but won't that make it easier for all of you? If you hate me before I go?" probably isn’t choosing to act as he is, and may well be very upset at what he’s putting your Mom through but be unable to help himself Don’t take it personally. It’s the disease talking. Nothing makes people meaner than fear. It doesn't excuse their meanness, but once everyone understands that, it can take the bite out of their words. I've never been through this, so it was interesting to see others' experiences and thoughts. Can your Mom seek counseling or a support group NOW, to help her with all the current stress, and then to help her after he dies? I think it's even harder for you to witness all of this, because you're emotionally involved and it's so hard for you to see! (( HUGS )) If she could reach out to other, objective people (therapist, support group), maybe it'd help her quite a bit.  |
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Post by scrappintoee on Jul 26, 2022 5:47:23 GMT
I feel so bad for mom. I’d like to check her into a hotel. Told her she can come stay with me I hope she accepts---she deserves a big break ! And maybe treat her to a massage, facial, pedicure, manicure, etc.  |
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craftykitten
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,304
Jun 26, 2014 7:39:32 GMT
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Post by craftykitten on Jul 26, 2022 6:48:13 GMT
If he hasn't ever been like this before, then it is the illness that's making him this way. He needs counselling - not to call him out for his behaviour, but to be somewhere safe he can let go of all that anger and hurt. He is probably being mean to your mom because she has always been his safe place. He knows she'll stick with him. And maybe partly he wants to push her away because he thinks that might make it easier for her.
Your mom needs a break. And he knows that too. And he probably feels like a burden on his family which is a horrible, horrible feeling.
Someone mentioned hospice, I know resources are different over there but I think both your parents would benefit from talking to someone separately. This isn't a marriage counselling situation, it's different.
I myself have incurable cancer, although I don't use the word terminal yet because I am still having treatment even though it's not going particularly well right now. So I have a lot of sympathy for your dad. This is HARD.
And I have a lot of sympathy for your mom and the rest of your family, because I know how hard it is to watch someone you love go through this. There are no easy answers. Give yourselves grace.
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Post by christine58 on Jul 26, 2022 11:10:54 GMT
His stress and grief is the root cause. He needs some help to deal with end of life things. I kind of saw this in my parents as my dad got sicker and sicker. Mom was stress/worried and Dad was sad and filled with his own grief. My mom said, "but won't that make it easier for all of you? If you hate me before I go?"  |
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peabay
Prolific Pea
Posts: 9,617
Jun 25, 2014 19:50:41 GMT
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Post by peabay on Jul 26, 2022 11:42:54 GMT
If he hasn't ever been like this before, then it is the illness that's making him this way. He needs counselling - not to call him out for his behaviour, but to be somewhere safe he can let go of all that anger and hurt. He is probably being mean to your mom because she has always been his safe place. He knows she'll stick with him. And maybe partly he wants to push her away because he thinks that might make it easier for her. Your mom needs a break. And he knows that too. And he probably feels like a burden on his family which is a horrible, horrible feeling. Someone mentioned hospice, I know resources are different over there but I think both your parents would benefit from talking to someone separately. This isn't a marriage counselling situation, it's different. I myself have incurable cancer, although I don't use the word terminal yet because I am still having treatment even though it's not going particularly well right now. So I have a lot of sympathy for your dad. This is HARD. And I have a lot of sympathy for your mom and the rest of your family, because I know how hard it is to watch someone you love go through this. There are no easy answers. Give yourselves grace. totally agree. He needs it and she needs it, but not together. He's terrified and angry; she's the same, I'm sure. But it's not that it's their relationship - it's their individual issues. I agree with calling hospice and seeing if you can get some therapists to work with them. I'm so sorry for all of this. |
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Post by mikklynn on Jul 26, 2022 12:36:42 GMT
No advice, just a hug.
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Post by Spongemom Scrappants on Jul 26, 2022 12:39:21 GMT
My mother’s personality and behavior did not change as she inched closer to dying, but hospice was invaluable to us in so many other ways. I would strongly encourage you to investigate their services. You might be surprised at how much support they can offer. And the changes you are seeing in him are quite familiar to them as it does occur in a percentage of people due to changes in their health.
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Post by epeanymous on Jul 26, 2022 12:55:05 GMT
I am sorry. My parents were married for 59 years; my father died of cancer, and he was absolutely impossible at the end. I don't have any advice, but wanted to send support. It sucks.
ETA: one thing I did learn when my father was in hospice was that restlessness is part of the dying process for a lot of people. My father's inability to sit still, rest, be at peace, etc. was exhausting.
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kate
Drama Llama
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Jun 26, 2014 3:30:05 GMT
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Post by kate on Jul 26, 2022 13:11:51 GMT
No advice here, just profound sympathy.
I am in awe of the wisdom here on the board.
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sweetpeasmom
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by sweetpeasmom on Jul 26, 2022 14:03:10 GMT
Sometimes we lash out at those we love the most during hard times. Several years ago, dh was miserable in his job. He’s lash out at me. Almost immediately after he quit that job, he changed. I didn’t excuse it but I recognized where it came from.
I’m sorry your mom is having to navigate this. Hopefully your dad will come around and not waste these precious moments with you all.
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Deleted
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May 18, 2024 20:07:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2022 14:42:33 GMT
My heart hurts reading this. I"m so very sorry. You have gotten some very thoughtful responses on here. I agree that if this is not typical behavior for him, that it very well could be the disease/treatment/depression from both of those. That will not make it any easier on your family or your mom, but perhaps could guide what help they receive. If this has not been mentioned to his Dr yet, I would start there to make sure there is nothing else underlying that might be causing this. My other thought is to just continue to be there for her. Perhaps a grief share group that she could join? My FIL passed from a rare form of cancer in January and my MIL wishes she had started attending that sooner. It would have really helped process things earlier. And encourage her that barring any severe physical need in that moment - when he is being nasty it is okay for her to take a break. Go take a walk. Call a friend. Do something for her. She does not need to stand there and take it even if he cannot really help it. <3 Gentle hugs to all of you!
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Post by silverlining on Jul 26, 2022 17:49:34 GMT
I'm so sorry that your parents are in such a difficult situation. Every family is different, but when my dad had dementia and my mom had ovarian cancer, they had a wonderful woman who lived with them. This gave my Mom breaks from dealing with my dad. It also helped to have another person there because my dad was able to control his anger better when there was a change from the constant one-on-one dynamic.
As difficult as it was, they both wanted to be together and at home. My folks didn't need someone to provide nursing care, but they really benefitted from the companionship and help with the house and cooking that they got. Even if it had been a few hours a day instead of a live-in person, it would have been much better than the two of them on their own, or living separately.
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Post by auntkelly on Jul 26, 2022 18:23:51 GMT
I'm sorry you and your parents are going through such a difficult time. My mom lived w/ my family when she was dying of cancer, and fortunately, although she was scared and sad, she didn't have the kind of mood swings your dad is having.
Would your dad be willing to have you accompany him to one of his appointments w/ his oncologist? I think you should rule out any physical causes for his sudden change in behavior. Hopefully, the oncologist will have a better insight as to what is causing your dad's mood swings and what can be done about them, if anything.
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Post by finsup on Jul 26, 2022 21:11:22 GMT
I think because of TV, movies and novels we tend to picture most cancer patients as stoic, peaceful, and wise, but in reality what your family is experiencing isn’t uncommon and shows another way cancer is so ugly and how much it robs from people and their families. I’m sorry for you and your family and anyone else who has had to deal with this additional pain. I agree that hospice may have some good resources to help.
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Post by Spongemom Scrappants on Jul 26, 2022 21:20:26 GMT
ETA: one thing I did learn when my father was in hospice was that restlessness is part of the dying process for a lot of people. My father's inability to sit still, rest, be at peace, etc. was exhausting. My mother wasn't mobile, but she could not stop fiddling with anything, everything, and even just the air toward the end. She would look at me at times and say, "Come take this from me so I'll stop." And I would look and it would simply be a corner of the throw or even just the pattern on her nightgown that she traced obsessively with her finger. We'd rearrange things, but it would usually be only moments before she was back at it. It was very hard for some of our family members to watch. |
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Post by putabuttononit on Jul 28, 2022 7:51:06 GMT
………. Above all, your mom doesn’t want to have regrets later. If she doesn’t want to leave, encourage her to take some time for herself each day to catch a break and catch her breath, too. Oh, that’s such a good about the OP’s Mom not wanting to have any regrets later. If she was talked into leaving her husband after 57 years of marriage (a “long and precious’ marriage in the OP’s words) she would be so likely, after his death, to have regrets about leaving. And at that point there would be nothing she could do about it, she would have to live with those regrets, with the heartache, for the rest of her life. Oh she definitely won’t actually leave, but possibly has to draw some hard boundaries and leave for a week or two. If you ask my dad, he would say that he would die without her, that his life has no meaning without her, things like that. He loves her and can’t seem to help himself from the lashing out. Maybe he resents her for her health and energy? I know he’s scared. Can’t imagine being in his shoes 😢 |
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