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Post by lesserknownpea on Dec 6, 2022 7:02:04 GMT
I didn’t get a chance to go out to my friend’s the last couple weeks, as the family I live with all got the flu, and I couldn’t chance passing it to her. I got a text from her yesterday, It says that as much as she was looking forward to the trip, she doesn’t feel she is up to it. She acknowledged that she is so much weaker. And she was very concerned that I wouldn’t get my money back from the rental, or find someone else to go with me.
My DS, and his wife and daughter will probably go with me. That’s good for me, they are the ones I live with and always look out for me.
So now the stress of telling my friend is over. But I am very, very sad still. I really wanted to make it work.
OP:So my closest, girlhood friend who I’ve known for 50 years. Has stage 4 cancer. But that’s not the whole story.
She was diagnosed type 1 diabetes as a girl. Then, in her 30’s, her loser narcissistic husband left her, then did that cruel thing where they come back, and then cheat again, then rub the innocent party’s face in it, then want back. This went on for several years before he finally left for good.
Her spirit broken, she started overeating, and got to a very dangerous weight considering her T1. Her doctor recommended gastric bypass, which worked great… except she ended up replacing the food she could no longer eat with wine. People with that surgery have the alcohol go straight to their head. It’s a terrible thing.
Before the cancer dx, she did rehab 3 times, but each time went back to drinking. The cancer is slow growing, she’s done chemo, but they say they won’t do more.
Then one doctor recognized her gait, and she was also diagnosed as Parkinson’s. She falls, although she’s finally using a walker, which helps a lot.
She lives alone in low income housing on her SS check. I visit as often and for as long as I can, but I also visit my dad as often as I can.
Last year, I arranged for a trip to Hawaii to fulfill a dream of hers. It was insanely stressful. I had some family come to help, and I ended up enduring their judgement, while also desperately trying to keep her from falling and hurting herself, or spilling red wine on the rental’s nice cream carpet.
And when we got home, I got told off by one family member who “helped”, even though I had told her the way things were before she signed on. It just wasn’t the vacation she was expecting, ( she did not help with the costs ).
Because of a mistake in the booking process, I have the original place we were going to go rented in February. It was a more run down place, where the worry over spills wouldn’t be so bad. Last spring, we talked about going just the two of us. I was so hurt by the way things turned out, and wasn’t even sure if she’d be able to go after a year passed.
But then I found out the place has been completely redone, ( and is now renting for twice as much as I paid). Everything is new and nice.
The closer I get to the date, the more I realize I can’t take her while she’s still drinking. I can’t. I start getting the anxiety symptoms just thinking about it. She is drinking more, and her health is much worse.
I have to tell her that as long as she’s still drinking I can’t take her. I’ve had many conversations with her about the necessity and logistics of getting off alcohol. She agrees, but the whole thing terrifies her. I’ve told her I will come and stay as long as it takes if she detoxes at a facility and then does an outpatient program. Regular rehabs can’t take people in her condition.
The conversations go great, but she has only gotten worse.
If you could give me some encouragement, because I HATE that I have to tell her this. It would be amazing if she stops right away and is able to go on the trip. Of course. All that alcohol is making things worse, duh, tell me something I don’t know.
If you just want to comment to call me an enabler, or otherwise berate me, please just back out of this thread. You don’t know this woman, what she’s been through, and honestly, I don’t begrudge her anything that helps her through another day.
But I have to tell her and I hate that I do. I’ve talked it over with my son, and my cousin, ( who is a recovering alcoholic himself ).
I wish she were well, and we could go and truly enjoy a carefree vacation together.
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Post by cindytred on Dec 6, 2022 9:12:19 GMT
I am so sorry you are going through this. You are such a good person to try to help your friend. I have no advice for you.
Cindy
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Post by peasapie on Dec 6, 2022 9:15:37 GMT
You are a kind soul. You’ve already taken her on a lovely trip under difficult circumstances, so I hope you’re giving yourself lots of grace for that. It’s pretty clear she isn’t going to stop drinking, especially with the additional stress in her life now, even if she tells you she will. I’d hate to see a lifelong friend become angry about something and pass away with anger between you, but In no way would I take on the responsibility of taking her on this vacation.
So I guess the question is whether to tell her the truth or make excuses to be kind. I don’t have an answer to that — maybe wiser peas do. Please know I commiserate with your situation. I too have a lifelong friend and am imagining the stress you must be feeling right now.
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gsquaredmom
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,078
Jun 26, 2014 17:43:22 GMT
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Post by gsquaredmom on Dec 6, 2022 9:51:22 GMT
It sounds like you are doing a lot that is really beyond your expertise.
It also sounds like you need a vacation to get some rest.
You are unlikely to change her. You can only control you.
I think you should take that trip alone or with another friend. Rest and recoup so you can be there for her when you get home.
Remember, your oxygen mask goes on first.
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RedSquirrelUK
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,732
Location: The UK's beautiful West Country
Aug 2, 2014 13:03:45 GMT
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Post by RedSquirrelUK on Dec 6, 2022 9:57:07 GMT
What a lovely person you are. I don't think you're an enabler. It would be different with a younger, otherwise fitter or treatable person, but why would someone with multiple life-limiting conditions deny their one enjoyment?
Has the place now got light carpets? Or the more up-to-date tile/laminate/wood floors? If you haven't asked, it would be worth checking. Even if the floors are more cleanable, that would pose an increased risk in itself if she falls.
Is there something else you could suggest as an alternative for her, and take this vacation with someone else?
I'm so sorry you're in this difficult situation.
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Post by lesserknownpea on Dec 6, 2022 11:31:30 GMT
Thank you, all of you,, I wasn’t sure what I was hoping for when I created this post. I just felt a need to share and hopefully get good advice. And I completely did.
Thank you so much.
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Post by elaine on Dec 6, 2022 11:32:16 GMT
I’m so sorry. It sounds like you know what you need to do in terms of not taking her to Hawaii if she is drinking.
You cannot control her behavior, you can only control yours. You know that it would be too much for you to taker her as things stand now.
I sincerely doubt that given her diagnosis that she will be willing to give up alcohol, which I suspect is how she medicates herself to help her cope with how ill she is. That said, you certainly do not have to subject yourself to vacationing with her while she drinks.
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Post by smasonnc on Dec 6, 2022 12:56:07 GMT
I have to tell her that as long as she’s still drinking I can’t take her. I’ve had many conversations with her about the necessity and logistics of getting off alcohol. She agrees, but the whole thing terrifies her. I’ve told her I will come and stay as long as it takes if she detoxes at a facility and then does an outpatient program. Regular rehabs can’t take people in her condition. You're such a lovely person to want to help her and she's very lucky to have you. You have to have the conversation with her and not go on a trip with her. You don't have the skill set to make her stop drinking and maybe nobody does. You need to protect yourself because sometimes the swimmer drowns the lifeguard. The conversations go great, but she has only gotten worse. That's how it works. An addict tells you what you want to hear and really believes it when they say it, but when faced with a choice of whether to drink or not the decision is always the same. It's not your fault nor is it theirs. The disease always wins.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 1, 2024 23:12:07 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2022 13:12:43 GMT
You are kind and it sounds like she is very fortunate to have you as a friend. I would say you need to think of how you would feel and the possibility, given the drinking and her worse health, how safe a trip like that would be for her. Given that, don't take her. If anything, I'd replace it with something shorter and closer to home. You've gotten some good advice about taking care of yourself first, and I absolutely agree. The stress and worry over this will affect you, too, if you do go.
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Post by busy on Dec 6, 2022 13:25:59 GMT
If it’s too much for you, it is. It’s more than ok to acknowledge that and cancel the trip. But I don’t see any good in telling her the drinking is why. She has stage 4 cancer. She’s not going to get sober now. Getting sober is insanely hard in the best of circumstances and when you’re staring death in the face… it just doesn’t seem realistic.
Perhaps a short, casual, close to home getaway would be a better choice, where you can have the togetherness but not the stress. Just try not to expect her to be a different person.
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Post by jeremysgirl on Dec 6, 2022 13:44:13 GMT
If it were me, I'd tell her but I wouldn't mention the drinking, I'd blame it on the Parkinson's. I would say after your last trip, you are terrified she is going to fall and you know you are not strong enough to help her and wouldn't it be awful if she broke something, needing medical attention on the trip.
This is honesty without having to blame the drinking. Now if this were a member of my immediate family (my DD is an alcoholic), I would be honest about not being around her while she was drinking. I have done that with my DD. However, she is in good health, young, and behaves irresponsibly and angry when drinking.
In your case, this is a friend and she is dying. It's not the time for her to quit drinking and a vacation isn't going to be the carrot she needs to do so. In the interest of kindness, I would just blame the Parkinson's. That is not a lie either.
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Post by disneypal on Dec 6, 2022 13:47:05 GMT
First of all, it is wonderful that you want to make the Hawaii dream trip come true for your friend. That is so sweet and thoughtful. Plus, I am sure it is financially a strain.
I'm sorry you are dealing with her drinking issues and that will make it difficult to take the trip. It sounds like you are very special friends, since you've known each other for so long. I am sure she will appreciate and understand your honesty.
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Post by crazy4scraps on Dec 6, 2022 13:56:59 GMT
I don’t think you’re an enabler. I think you’re an exceptionally kind person in an incredibly difficult spot. The problem is that it’s totally up to her to quit and it’s very likely that no matter how much YOU care and want her to, she has to care more and it sounds like she doesn’t. Or she just can’t.
It’s a heartbreaking situation to be caught in the middle of. DH (and I, to a lesser degree) were in that situation with his mom. He flat out asked her when she would quit and her reply was, “When I’m dead.” She knew we didn’t want our kid to be around her when she was literally falling down drunk. At that point he knew she was choosing the liquor over her children and grandchildren and that hurt.
I really like the idea of changing your trip with her to somewhere closer, shorter and more amenable to her condition and just be honest about why you feel you have had to make that change. Obviously you care about her and want to keep your promise to her, but you also have to protect yourself. Like someone else said, put on your own oxygen mask first. Sending you hugs and wishes for strength.
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Post by mikklynn on Dec 6, 2022 14:13:17 GMT
I'm so sorry you have to deal with this. I think you should cancel the trip. It's clearly too much for you.
I would be honest and say it's the drinking. But, I will also say if you think that is too hard, blame her general health.
Hugs. You are an amazing friend.
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Dec 6, 2022 14:55:48 GMT
lesserknownpea you have known, survived and continue to endure pain far greater than many of us. You are an amazing person to even consider taking her on another trip to Hawaii. I don't think it would be safe for either of you to go. Heaven forbid she falls and incurs an injury requiring serious medical care of even hospitalization. Or for that matter, you do? Then what? As jeremysgirl and others have suggested, if you choose go, make it nearer home. And yes, blame the Parkinson's. Major fall risk! Please take care of you!!
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Post by Darcy Collins on Dec 6, 2022 15:06:55 GMT
I agree with previous posters that no matter what she says, considering all going on in her life right now and her previous struggles, she's not going to stop drinking. I would just cancel the trip and tell her it's too much for you with her health issues. It doesn't really sound like the trip would be enjoyable for anyone. I think being there for her and maybe planning something local and shorter is a much better idea. (((hugs)))
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Post by auntkelly on Dec 6, 2022 15:28:53 GMT
Your heart is in the right place, but the trip just doesn't sound safe for either of you. It sounds like she would be dependent on you to take care of her. If you got hurt (such as you strained your back trying to break her fall) you would both be unable to take care of yourselves, and you wouldn't have any friends or family nearby to help you out.
I would just tell her that no one is available this year to go w/ you to Hawaii and therefore you are going to have to cancel the trip.
I'm sorry your friend is in such poor health. She is fortunate to have you as a friend.
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Rhondito
Pearl Clutcher
MississipPea
Posts: 4,661
Jun 25, 2014 19:33:19 GMT
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Post by Rhondito on Dec 6, 2022 15:29:35 GMT
I agree with previous posters that no matter what she says, considering all going on in her life right now and her previous struggles, she's not going to stop drinking. I would just cancel the trip and tell her it's too much for you with her health issues. It doesn't really sound like the trip would be enjoyable for anyone. I think being there for her and maybe planning something local and shorter is a much better idea. (((hugs))) I agree with this, although I would still go on the trip alone or go with someone else. You've already taken her there once, which was extremely generous. Given how difficult it was I'm surprised you planned another trip with her. You're an amazing friend and she's lucky to have you. Where are the other people in her life?
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Post by Merge on Dec 6, 2022 15:35:26 GMT
You are a very kind friend. Often, all we can do for another adult is to be there and continue to love them when they make poor choices. That's not enabling.
I agree with everyone who has said that you should go on that amazing trip on your own, and plan other time to spend with your friend in a less stressful environment. Not exactly the same, but we've had to exclude MIL from trips she would have gone on with us in the past because it just isn't feasible or safe for her to walk as much as we walk, go hiking, etc. Nothing to do with drinking or her choices, but those trips are just not a good idea for her with her health situation. We have to plan other time to spend with her in ways that she can participate in and enjoy. It's the same with your friend. Really not about her drinking choices at all - that trip isn't safe for her to take at this time.
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Post by christine58 on Dec 6, 2022 16:26:44 GMT
If it were me, I'd tell her but I wouldn't mention the drinking, I'd blame it on the Parkinson's. I would say after your last trip, you are terrified she is going to fall and you know you are not strong enough to help her and wouldn't it be awful if she broke something, needing medical attention on the trip. This is honesty without having to blame the drinking. Now if this were a member of my immediate family (my DD is an alcoholic), I would be honest about not being around her while she was drinking. I have done that with my DD. However, she is in good health, young, and behaves irresponsibly and angry when drinking. In your case, this is a friend and she is dying. It's not the time for her to quit drinking and a vacation isn't going to be the carrot she needs to do so. In the interest of kindness, I would just blame the Parkinson's. That is not a lie either. Great points
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Post by scrapmaven on Dec 6, 2022 17:07:16 GMT
You are in no condition to care for someone so ill. That's your excuse. You are afraid that she'll fall and that you won't be able to help her w/your back issues.
ITA, that you should take the trip w/a healthy friend w/whom you could have a great time. Your other friend doesn't need to know that you're in Hawaii. Her situation is so unfortunate and it sounds like she needs so much more than you could give her. Can you plan some fun, local things to do w/her? A few hours together will likely tire her out, anyway. You can't help an alcoholic and it's a big burden to bear. Have some small fun w/her, but go on vacation w/someone w/whom you can really have fun.
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iowgirl
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,123
Jun 25, 2014 22:52:46 GMT
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Post by iowgirl on Dec 6, 2022 17:15:54 GMT
This is heartbreaking. You have gone above and beyond in your friendship and love. What a kind loving person you are to have done what you have already and what you continue to want to do.
I have someone in my life that is an alcoholic beyond help. I think the brain chemistry is just beyond repair.
Be honest. It's the best way to go, always. It's not the easiest, but in the end, honesty is easier for you to live with. Tell her that the trip just can't happen. You know she can't stop drinking, and it is more than you can handle to help her on the trip. You love her, you love her enough to be truthful.
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Post by chaosisapony on Dec 6, 2022 17:44:06 GMT
You've been exceptionally kind and caring toward your friend for a long time it sounds like. She's aware of her alcohol problem and is choosing at this time to continue drinking. Ultimately that is her choice and choices come with consequences. You cannot make her stop drinking, that's a choice she has to make for herself. I doubt your conversation with her will be a surprise but she might still get angry with you. You're not doing anything wrong though, you deserve to be able to enjoy a vacation without the stress and worry.
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Post by papersilly on Dec 6, 2022 17:53:36 GMT
there is no other way to do it than to just tell her. i don't think you have to tell her the drinking is the reason the trip is cancelled. i think you just need to say the trip had to be cancelled and leave it at that. i don't think blaming the drinking will help the situation any so leave it out.
if i were in your shoes, i would cancel the trip. drinking+falling risk+weakened body from cancer+potential rental property damage=disaster. the hawaii trip was an indication that a vacation is no longer in the cards for her. you are a great friend for making such a kind gesture with the trip but you have to know your limitations because of her limitations. enjoy the remaining time with her but don't put either of you in an unsafe situation.
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Post by KiwiJo on Dec 6, 2022 18:19:14 GMT
I think it would be kind to your friend to blame the trip’s cancellation on something else - maybe tell her the accommodation owner has cancelled it because of some major repairs that need to be done.
I think you can be sure that your friend knows what her drinking is doing to her body and mind; she also knows she has stage 4 cancer and Parkinson’s. Given those 3 life-limiting issues she probably thinks there is no good reason to put herself through the tough time of quitting the drink - completely understandable, I think.
it is certainly possible for alcoholics to stop drinking, but it can be extremely difficult and they really need the hope of a better life afterwards in order to do so. But your friend doesn’t really have that; she has the knowledge that her cancer is going to keep on growing, and her quality of life is going to start decreasing as the Parkinson’s gets worse. At this stage, the drinking is probably affording her a little comfort.
Many addicts in the height of their addiction would love to stop. They know what is going on, they know the dangers and the problems it causes, but the physical act of stopping is just so hard that it seems impossible. In your friend’s case, she could well feel that it’s just not worth it, given her other 2 diagnoses. 3 with the type 1 diabetes as well, which is probably not in good order because of her drinking.
And that’s why I suggest blaming the cancellation on something else. I really don’t think there is anything to be gained at all by telling her the real reason.
Normally I would absolutely be in favour of telling the truth, but not in your friend’s particular case. I just don’t see any reason to do so.
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Post by flanz on Dec 6, 2022 21:18:45 GMT
You are a kind soul. You’ve already taken her on a lovely trip under difficult circumstances, so I hope you’re giving yourself lots of grace for that. It’s pretty clear she isn’t going to stop drinking, especially with the additional stress in her life now, even if she tells you she will. I’d hate to see a lifelong friend become angry about something and pass away with anger between you, but In no way would I take on the responsibility of taking her on this vacation. So I guess the question is whether to tell her the truth or make excuses to be kind. I don’t have an answer to that — maybe wiser peas do. Please know I commiserate with your situation. I too have a lifelong friend and am imagining the stress you must be feeling right now. I agree... you ARE a very kind soul and have been of tremendous support to your friend. Like peasapie, "I would NOT take on the responsibility of taking her on this vacation." Please give yourself this gift.
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Post by fiddlesticks on Dec 6, 2022 21:25:10 GMT
Advice is often much easier said than done. I am sorry. I can hear how much you are struggling with knowing what you need to and having a hard time doing it.
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Post by lesserknownpea on Dec 6, 2022 23:14:36 GMT
Thank you all so very much. I am so relieved at the thought of not needing to blame the drinking. It’s absolutely true I have no business trying to do this by myself.
We actually did have a pretty good time on the last trip, except for the stress I was under, I think in my head this time things would go perfect.
To be honest, I was twisted and knocked over by the strong surf, and hurt my knee early in that week, so it was swollen and painful for several days. I have to admit I’m just not as strong as I wish I were.
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Post by Really Red on Dec 6, 2022 23:19:59 GMT
You are an amazing friend. I agree with others that telling her not to drink is not going to be helpful, unfortunately. And rather unimportant with all that is going on in her life.
What are going to be your regrets if you don't do this? Is it worth your unhappiness for 1 week if it makes her life? I am not suggesting that you do that; I'm just asking. It would not be worth mine. We all make our choices and your friend made hers, even though so so sadly circumstances probably didn't allow her much grace.
I would give her a white lie and give her two other choices of what you feel you are able to do. I would never ever share your thoughts. Never.
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Post by AussieMeg on Dec 7, 2022 0:12:09 GMT
I had typed out a long reply, but the board ate it, so I will instead make a short sharp statement:
Your friend is dying. She's most likely drinking to help her cope with that horrendous thought. To say that you won't take her on the trip because of her drinking would be unnecessarily cruel. Please don't do it.
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