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Post by Merge on Jan 29, 2024 22:54:50 GMT
We are fostering a little girl who was set for euthanasia in the pound. A rescue stepped in to save her and we’re the fosters. She has had no training whatsoever, but she is a little love and we want to help her. I had no problem teaching our other two dogs to sit and stay. You hold the treat a bit over their heads and slowly move it back, and their bottom naturally goes down. Not this girl! She just backs up and/or jumps for the treat. I’ve tried doing this while sitting and standing in front of her. Same result. YouTube has given me no further instruction than what I already know to do, so I’m turning to the peas. If it helps, she’s some kind of terrier mix and about 20 lbs. Other issues we will have to tackle - she was mistreated at some point and is terrified of collars, leashes, and the crate. She growls and snaps if any of these are introduced. She also will not potty outside but does use pee pads inside. But those are for a little further down the road when she’s decompressed a bit more. Any thoughts? Here’s a pic of her sleeping because I know how the peas are.  |
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Post by **GypsyGirl** on Jan 29, 2024 23:30:54 GMT
I’d consider clicker training used in conjunction with treats. How long have you had her?
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pantsonfire
Pearl Clutcher
Take a step back, evaluate what is important, and enjoy your life with those who you love.
Posts: 4,762 
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Post by pantsonfire on Jan 29, 2024 23:40:44 GMT
I had this issue with our recent adopted dog. She would jump or spin on her hind legs if the treat was near her or went over her head for sit. LOL
Anyways, I first taught her to come to me via her name. Worked over and over to help with recall.
After that was established, we taught her to come to my hand with her nose and would immediately treat.
Then worked on no treat. It helped with the jumping impulse. She realized treats happen without the need to jump.
Then I would call her and used my legs to help her sit with treat in hand but not over her head. I never touched her, but just bent my knees a bit and got into her space. Once her butt was down I said sit! Yes sit!
After that, I began word command sit, again no treat over head and she would sit. I would treat at nose level as if she was looking forward.
Then we began hand communication with word sit.
Now I can do hand command.
But teaching that treat us low really helped as well as other tasks first to show her treat happens down.
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pantsonfire
Pearl Clutcher
Take a step back, evaluate what is important, and enjoy your life with those who you love.
Posts: 4,762
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Post by pantsonfire on Jan 29, 2024 23:51:35 GMT
Toby our other adopted dog was terrified of leash too. He wouldn't growl but woukd hunker down and shake.
Have her collar or harness out and every time she sniffs it say yes, harness/collar, yes! And treat the heck out of her.
Get to a point where it can move to her.
Then lay across back.
Then get on. Etc.
Same for leash.
Thank you for keeping this sweetie safe
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Post by Merge on Jan 29, 2024 23:59:04 GMT
I had this issue with our recent adopted dog. She would jump or spin on her hind legs if the treat was near her or went over her head for sit. LOL Anyways, I first taught her to come to me via her name. Worked over and over to help with recall. After that was established, we taught her to come to my hand with her nose and would immediately treat. Then worked on no treat. It helped with the jumping impulse. She realized treats happen without the need to jump. Then I would call her and used my legs to help her sit with treat in hand but not over her head. I never touched her, but just bent my knees a bit and got into her space. Once her butt was down I said sit! Yes sit! After that, I began word command sit, again no treat over head and she would sit. I would treat at nose level as if she was looking forward. Then we began hand communication with word sit. Now I can do hand command. But teaching that treat us low really helped as well as other tasks first to show her treat happens down. Thanks, that's helpful. I hadn't thought to teach her to come and touch first. I can see how that would help with keeping the jumping down. |
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Post by Merge on Jan 29, 2024 23:59:55 GMT
I’d consider clicker training used in conjunction with treats. How long have you had her? Only four days. Haha. Maybe I'm jumping the gun. We've never tried clicker training and I'd need to read up on that and/or watch some videos. |
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dogbyte
Full Member
Posts: 117
Feb 23, 2018 3:45:52 GMT
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Post by dogbyte on Jan 30, 2024 0:01:05 GMT
Leerburg.com is a great site with tons of free info. Especially Forrest Micke for "pet dog" type of dogs.
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Post by mom on Jan 30, 2024 0:03:25 GMT
I’d consider clicker training used in conjunction with treats. How long have you had her? Haha. Maybe I'm jumping the gun. We've never tried clicker training and I'd need to read up on that and/or watch some videos. I think this is probably your problem. Give her some time to decompress and truly trust you. Just love her on for now -- maybe a few weeks? -- and then try again. |
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Post by Merge on Jan 30, 2024 0:05:18 GMT
Only four days. Haha. Maybe I'm jumping the gun. We've never tried clicker training and I'd need to read up on that and/or watch some videos. I think this is probably your problem. Give her some time to decompress and truly trust you. Just love her on for now -- maybe a few weeks? -- and then try again. Thanks. You might be right. She is getting lots of love, cuddles, and treats, so we'll keep on doing that. She is our first foster and I want to make sure we are able to turn out a dog that won't get returned to the rescue because of behavior issues, KWIM? |
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Post by mom on Jan 30, 2024 0:13:12 GMT
I think this is probably your problem. Give her some time to decompress and truly trust you. Just love her on for now -- maybe a few weeks? -- and then try again. Thanks. You might be right. She is getting lots of love, cuddles, and treats, so we'll keep on doing that. She is our first foster and I want to make sure we are able to turn out a dog that won't get returned to the rescue because of behavior issues, KWIM? I might 'play' with her sitting to get the treat -- to get her use to the idea of what you eventually want to accomplish. Then once she's been with you a little while, get serious about training her. Bu then, it wont be some foreign concept. |
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Post by **GypsyGirl** on Jan 30, 2024 0:17:44 GMT
Definitely need to give her some more time to get used to you and your home. Are you crate training as well? We have used clicker training and had great results with it, including with a rat terrier. Whatever method you use, make it fun. Good luck!
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naby64
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,929
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Post by naby64 on Jan 30, 2024 1:06:27 GMT
We went through obedience class with one of ours. Our way won't work with you. We had a lead on and were told to pull up while grabbing the haunches to push down. Ours already knew sit so we didn't have to work hard at it. That's not gonna work for you though.
Having only had her 4 days, she needs to decompress. I read somewhere that it takes about 3 weeks for that to happen. I would just love on her, praise her and see what happens. However as mentioned above, I would keep the leash/collar visible so she can see it is a good thing.
Thank you so much for doing this!!
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gsquaredmom
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,078
Jun 26, 2014 17:43:22 GMT
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Post by gsquaredmom on Jan 30, 2024 1:08:20 GMT
I agree with waiting to do that training. She has a lot of healing to do. Maybe ptsd. When she is ready, call some trainers, maybe even a class at Petco or other. We have had some amazing trainers at Petco who had worked with very challenging behaviors and saved dogs.
And thank you for taking this one in.
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Post by Merge on Jan 30, 2024 1:20:19 GMT
Thanks all. She is a very good girl. She looooooves toys and frequently goes to the dog toy box. Today she pulled out one of our heeler's old tennis balls, and after playing with it for a few moments, she came over to me and dropped it in my lap. I tossed it for her and she chased it down and brought it back again. This time she dropped it in my hand. She did that over and over again. I have never seen a dog willingly give up a tennis ball without having been taught a 'drop it' command and/or having it traded for a treat. So she's smart enough to know, at least, that if she wants to chase the ball she has to give it back to me. Our old blue heeler - supposedly one of the smartest breeds out there - never did figure that out.  |
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Post by supersoda on Jan 30, 2024 1:44:57 GMT
You might try working on lay down first so that you're holding the treat on the ground instead of over her head.
Her coat looks a lot like my Belgian Malinois mix. If she has any Mal, they're very high energy and excitable, but also super smart. It was tough training my girl where there were lots of distractions, but once she gets it she's good.
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Post by Basket1lady on Jan 30, 2024 3:00:15 GMT
Thanks all. She is a very good girl. She looooooves toys and frequently goes to the dog toy box. Today she pulled out one of our heeler's old tennis balls, and after playing with it for a few moments, she came over to me and dropped it in my lap. I tossed it for her and she chased it down and brought it back again. This time she dropped it in my hand. She did that over and over again. I have never seen a dog willingly give up a tennis ball without having been taught a 'drop it' command and/or having it traded for a treat. So she's smart enough to know, at least, that if she wants to chase the ball she has to give it back to me. Our old blue heeler - supposedly one of the smartest breeds out there - never did figure that out. When she does that, give her the command to drop it/give it. Then if she has something else or picks something up that you don’t want her to have, she will subconsciously learn the command. Same with sit. PantsOnFire gave you some great tips. You can also work on just catching her doing the command and naming it. This is the monks of New Skete method and how I train my dogs. She can learn organically without having any anxiety over it. |
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Post by sabrinae on Jan 30, 2024 3:28:19 GMT
I’d consider clicker training used in conjunction with treats. How long have you had her? Only four days. Haha. Maybe I'm jumping the gun. We've never tried clicker training and I'd need to read up on that and/or watch some videos. . Clicker training is helpful in this type of situation because you can more precisely mark the behaviors you want to reward. You start by clicking and treating repeatedly to associate the click with the reward. Then you start clicking the behavior you want while rewarding as close to the click as you can. You can gradually reduce the click/reward timing. I’ve never been great at it bc I don’t keep a clicker on me often enough. |
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Post by sabrinae on Jan 30, 2024 3:32:15 GMT
Thanks all. She is a very good girl. She looooooves toys and frequently goes to the dog toy box. Today she pulled out one of our heeler's old tennis balls, and after playing with it for a few moments, she came over to me and dropped it in my lap. I tossed it for her and she chased it down and brought it back again. This time she dropped it in my hand. She did that over and over again. I have never seen a dog willingly give up a tennis ball without having been taught a 'drop it' command and/or having it traded for a treat. So she's smart enough to know, at least, that if she wants to chase the ball she has to give it back to me. Our old blue heeler - supposedly one of the smartest breeds out there - never did figure that out. Since she loves fetch associate it with the behaviors you want. It can work as a reward as well. For now I’d leave the leash/collar out where she can see and explore it and treat whenever she even approaches it. The clicker might be very helpful here as you can click every time she goes near it and then treat. If you h e somewhere you can leave the less h/collar with treats surrounding and on top of it and she can approach at her comfort level I would try that as well. |
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Post by Zee on Jan 30, 2024 3:53:09 GMT
Thanks all. She is a very good girl. She looooooves toys and frequently goes to the dog toy box. Today she pulled out one of our heeler's old tennis balls, and after playing with it for a few moments, she came over to me and dropped it in my lap. I tossed it for her and she chased it down and brought it back again. This time she dropped it in my hand. She did that over and over again. I have never seen a dog willingly give up a tennis ball without having been taught a 'drop it' command and/or having it traded for a treat. So she's smart enough to know, at least, that if she wants to chase the ball she has to give it back to me. Our old blue heeler - supposedly one of the smartest breeds out there - never did figure that out. When she does that, give her the command to drop it/give it. Then if she has something else or picks something up that you don’t want her to have, she will subconsciously learn the command. Same with sit. PantsOnFire gave you some great tips. You can also work on just catching her doing the command and naming it. This is the monks of New Skete method and how I train my dogs. She can learn organically without having any anxiety over it. Agree with the monks of New Skete! Their puppy training book was a great resource for my current dog. She was an older "puppy", five months old, and required different tactics than my previous dogs. |
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Post by grammadee on Jan 30, 2024 4:07:56 GMT
Rescue dogs who have been mistreated and possibly gone hungry may jump for the treat even after they are fed on a regular basis. The instinct to grab food when it's available is a survival instinct.
You might try getting her to sit just by using hand signals. But first you would need to gently push her into a sitting position and praise her for sitting. Keep the food in your pocket and treat from your palm once she sits, even when you have helped her to do that. Always give the same hand signal and the same one word command.
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Post by peasapie on Jan 30, 2024 11:13:26 GMT
I think this is probably your problem. Give her some time to decompress and truly trust you. Just love her on for now -- maybe a few weeks? -- and then try again. Thanks. You might be right. She is getting lots of love, cuddles, and treats, so we'll keep on doing that. She is our first foster and I want to make sure we are able to turn out a dog that won't get returned to the rescue because of behavior issues, KWIM? So good of you to save her. We adopted an old boy cancer survivor last year. It’s fascinating to watch their personalities emerge. Even after a couple of months he was still revealing new things about himself, like the fact that he must have been paper trained in a bathroom. (He has trained us to put a peepee pad in the bathroom.) |
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peppermintpatty
Pearl Clutcher
Refupea #1345
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Post by peppermintpatty on Jan 30, 2024 15:32:55 GMT
You will need to use the clicker with her for a long while. Have her collar and leash out and immediately click, praise and treat. Leave them out all the time. If she goes up to sniff them, click, praise,treat. Keep doing this. Same with the crate. Click, praise, treat.
Eventually when you can put a pinch collar on her (they are not inhumane if used correctly) you can use that to train her. We trained my pup (through multiple levels of training at a very reputable center) who is a 15 pound maltipoo with a pinch collar. The collar is only used when we walk him and was only used when we were training and we were taught how to correctly use it. He is incredibly well trained and doesn't need the collar except when we take him for a walk.
She is sweet! I would find out if there are services to help with training a clearly abused dog through the rescue. It's going to be a long road for her. Thank you for helping her!
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Post by disneypal on Jan 30, 2024 16:01:12 GMT
I once taught my dog to sit up in a manner of hours. I was surprised how quickly he learned.
I read this somewhere, so used this technique and it worked like a charm.
I had some small treats to give him. I sat him on the couch in the corner of it and I would say "SIT UP" and then sit him up on his hind legs and let him lean into the corner of the couch. I would say "Good boy!!" several times while petting and praising him and then give him a treat. I did this over and over and after about an hour, he started sitting up by himself, using the couch corner as support. I was amazed.
Then after he would do that by himself for a few times, I sat him on the floor and said "SIT UP " and he would sit up by himself and again, he'd get praise and a treat.
It takes some patience, but starting them out in the couch corner so they have something to lean against for support when first learning, I think is a big key.
I know this isn't the same as 'SIT' but a similar training method may work.
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Post by Merge on Jan 30, 2024 16:32:20 GMT
Thanks. You might be right. She is getting lots of love, cuddles, and treats, so we'll keep on doing that. She is our first foster and I want to make sure we are able to turn out a dog that won't get returned to the rescue because of behavior issues, KWIM? So good of you to save her. We adopted an old boy cancer survivor last year. It’s fascinating to watch their personalities emerge. Even after a couple of months he was still revealing new things about himself, like the fact that he must have been paper trained in a bathroom. (He has trained us to put a peepee pad in the bathroom.) Yeah, she quickly showed us where she wanted to go potty (dining room) and that’s where we put the pad. |
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Post by gryroagain on Jan 30, 2024 16:33:41 GMT
Treats may be too high value for her just yet, try the ball as a reward or just praise.
Also try a hand signal (I use my hand up,palm forward) and place her in front of a wall or couch so she can’t keep moving back. Move toward/over her saying sit with the hand up, when she backs up she should sit naturally if there is nowhere else to go behind her. When the butt hits the ground praise reward treat and generally lose your mind with glee. You know her best though- may be scary or intimidating if she is fearful to loom over her to get her to sit.
I start working on commands and tricks right out of the gate because it really builds a bond with a foster dog who probably has little positive interactions with humans. I’ve had fosters who could sit, lay down, spin but not actually be petted yet because fearful still of actual human contact.
Thank you for fostering her, she is beautiful 😍
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craftymom101
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,631
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Post by craftymom101 on Jan 30, 2024 16:36:02 GMT
Our Great Dane, Finn, did not want to sit when he was a pup. The only thing that worked was kneeling down and I held a treat up and said "sit", then I gently pushed his bum to the ground so he was sitting, then gave him the treat. We worked on "sit" for DAYS before he finally made the connection! Even now, he prefers to lay down vs. sit, and if I ask him to sit, most of the time he goes all the way to the ground. Goofy dog.
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Post by thundergal on Jan 30, 2024 20:28:17 GMT
I think this is probably your problem. Give her some time to decompress and truly trust you. Just love her on for now -- maybe a few weeks? -- and then try again. Thanks. You might be right. She is getting lots of love, cuddles, and treats, so we'll keep on doing that. She is our first foster and I want to make sure we are able to turn out a dog that won't get returned to the rescue because of behavior issues, KWIM? This is the sweetest... |
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Post by crazy4scraps on Jan 30, 2024 20:45:59 GMT
I think with only a few days with you, it’s probably a little too soon for a dog that has been through a lot already. I would wait for her to decompress and come out of her shell a little before hitting the training too much. It will be much easier for her (and for you) once she learns to associate the collar and leash with something nice (treats!) or fun (walks!) instead of something awful. Thank you so much for fostering her and giving her a chance for a forever home. That’s a beautiful thing.
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Post by mollycoddle on Jan 30, 2024 21:15:27 GMT
We went through obedience class with one of ours. Our way won't work with you. We had a lead on and were told to pull up while grabbing the haunches to push down. Ours already knew sit so we didn't have to work hard at it. That's not gonna work for you though. Having only had her 4 days, she needs to decompress. I read somewhere that it takes about 3 weeks for that to happen. I would just love on her, praise her and see what happens. However as mentioned above, I would keep the leash/collar visible so she can see it is a good thing. Thank you so much for doing this!! This. I am no dog trainer, but I follow a little fearful rescue on X She has a great family and a dog trainer who comes and works with her for days at a time. She is #sophiefromromania, and she is afraid of her harness. It is always visible, and her trainer has been very slowly working to get her accustomed to it. She spent her first 6 months hiding behind a couch, and she has made great progress. |
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