|
WWYD
Feb 18, 2015 15:31:36 GMT
Post by jumperhop on Feb 18, 2015 15:31:36 GMT
My mentally ill MIL was diagnosed with terminal cancer two weeks ago. 6 mo to 6years to live. She can not take care of herself and can't walk on her own. She has 8 kids and they have been e-mailing each other back and forth on how to care for her. One BIL is pushing to put her in an assisted living facility that has the capability of helping her now and if she get her strength back from radiation. One SIL thinks MIL care of herself once radiation starts. And will not use any of MIL's money to use for care. This is the SIL in charge of MIL's finances. BIL finally says he would pay the money to get MIL in the assisted living facility which is 5k a month. This is my WWYD question. I am the in law so I usually keep my mouth shut. But I know for a fact the another SIL (#2) who has power of attorney over MIL borrowed 100k from MIL estate so she could pay cash for her home. And SIL (#1) who does the finances for MIL also borrowed money from MIL estate also but I don't know how much.
Now in my world you don't go there. I see things black and white and that you shouldn't take a step into grey. and even if they pay back the money in full if you have power of attorney over someone you don't touch their finances.
Should I tell BIL who is planning on spending 5k a month that his sisters owe MIL money. I feel that it's my moral obligation. But I am the in law so part of me thinks I should keep my mouth shut. Jen
|
|
scorpeao
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,521
Location: NorCal USA
Jun 25, 2014 21:04:54 GMT
|
Post by scorpeao on Feb 18, 2015 15:37:29 GMT
I'd tell my dh my thoughts and let him handle it. I would probably be vocal that one sibling shouldn't be on the hook for all of his mother's care; the cost should be split between those siblings that can afford it.
Sorry about your MIL's illness. I hope she outlives her prognosis.
|
|
|
WWYD
Feb 18, 2015 15:41:02 GMT
Post by Dictionary on Feb 18, 2015 15:41:02 GMT
Unless that BIL was my husband I wouldn't. Do you have concrete proof they owe the money? My mother has power of attorney over her aunt and runs her finances, now mind you she gives us from time to time $$$ but she keeps track of it and it will go against our inheritance is there any chance the same is being done by the SILs?
Honestly if your MIL can not care for herself with Chemo Medicare should be providing that assistance. Personally I am with your BIL if he can afford it, but $5k a month adds up quickly.
|
|
|
WWYD
Feb 18, 2015 15:41:19 GMT
via mobile
Fidget likes this
Post by myshelly on Feb 18, 2015 15:41:19 GMT
When you say one SIL is in charge of MIL's finances...is that official with a POA or is that just the family understanding?
MIL should go into assisted living and she should use her own money to pay for it.
|
|
|
WWYD
Feb 18, 2015 15:44:24 GMT
Post by annabella on Feb 18, 2015 15:44:24 GMT
I don't think they need to pay the money back, their mother may have left it in her will to them anyway, so they just got it early. I say you use some of her funds to pay the monthly rent then all 8 kids kick in a little money each month for the rent as well.
|
|
Kerri W
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,769
Location: Kentucky
Jun 25, 2014 20:31:44 GMT
|
WWYD
Feb 18, 2015 15:49:13 GMT
Post by Kerri W on Feb 18, 2015 15:49:13 GMT
If I had factual information I would share with DH and suggest he share with BIL or ask if he was ok with my sharing.
|
|
|
Post by littlemama on Feb 18, 2015 15:53:00 GMT
I'd tell my dh my thoughts and let him handle it. I would probably be vocal that one sibling shouldn't be on the hook for all of his mother's care; the cost should be split between those siblings that can afford it. Sorry about your MIL's illness. I hope she outlives her prognosis. Actually, the MIL's care should be paid out of her assets, then when those are depleted, Medicaid should be applied for to cover the rest.
|
|
loco coco
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,662
Jun 26, 2014 16:15:45 GMT
|
Post by loco coco on Feb 18, 2015 15:58:49 GMT
i think the $ should come out of her estate and she should go into care, isnt that what the $ is there for? retirement and later years? 1 sibling should not be responsible for financing this.
|
|
|
Post by krazykatlady on Feb 18, 2015 16:03:32 GMT
I wonder if the SILs are balking at spending mom's money because they've used up too much of it and there's not much there for moms care. Or perhaps they're holding out hoping for a more sizable inheritance once mom dies? Who knows.
What does your husband say about the situation? As much as I'd like for you to tell BIL it's really not your place. Your husband needs to be the one to speak up. However, I wouldn't be willing to pay for her care out of my budget if she has money available and your SIL is balking about using mom's own funds.
|
|
Kerri W
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,769
Location: Kentucky
Jun 25, 2014 20:31:44 GMT
|
Post by Kerri W on Feb 18, 2015 16:07:38 GMT
i think the $ should come out of her estate and she should go into care, isnt that what the $ is there for? retirement and later years? 1 sibling should not be responsible for financing this. Exactly and two of the SILs shouldn't get their inheritance early while the rest of the siblings share goes to pay for the care she needs. MIL needs should be taken care of FIRST then her estate distributed equally after the fact.
|
|
|
Post by jumperhop on Feb 18, 2015 16:11:01 GMT
No will or trust she is mentally ill and doesn't believe in them. I am completely in shock with the answers. I thought for sure you would agree that my BIL should know before coughing up 5k a month that MIL could pay for this but SIL's borrowed the money from the estate. And even if MIL knows about her daughters borrowing the money she is mentally ill and can't make rational decisions. Thanks ladies guess I will keep my mouth shut. But I can say I won't give her a dime until the SIL's have paid back their Mom. One SIL owns four homes and the other never spends a dime so it shouldn't be a problem for the to pay back MIL and get a loan from the bank. Thanks again. Jen
|
|
gloryjoy
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,332
Jun 26, 2014 12:35:32 GMT
|
Post by gloryjoy on Feb 18, 2015 16:17:13 GMT
I wonder if the SILs are balking at spending mom's money because they've used up too much of it and there's not much there for moms care. Or perhaps they're holding out hoping for a more sizable inheritance once mom dies? Who knows. What does your husband say about the situation? As much as I'd like for you to tell BIL it's really not your place. Your husband needs to be the one to speak up. However, I wouldn't be willing to pay for her care out of my budget if she has money available and your SIL is balking about using mom's own funds. This. If there is money to pay for her care, your bil should not be paying out of his pocket. I wouldn't have a problem mentioning it to my husband and telling him to talk to his brother about it.
|
|
|
Post by katlaw on Feb 18, 2015 16:17:30 GMT
Your SIL is in charge of the money so she can assist MIL. How is refusing to use her own money to provide care for her helping her out? The other siblings should be insisting that MIL's own money be used for her care first. We had a similar situation in our family last year. My cousin had access to her father's money. When he ended up going into a home she was taking the money out of the account to pay her own bills and the cheque to the home was bouncing. After 3 months of unpaid fees my mom and I took my uncle to the bank and had all of his accounts changed so she no longer had access. Her reply was to cut me out of her life. I have no regrets, he was frightened everyday he would get kicked out of the home, they would not have done that but I could not convince him otherwise.
|
|
|
Post by Darcy Collins on Feb 18, 2015 16:18:05 GMT
No will or trust she is mentally ill and doesn't believe in them. I am completely in shock with the answers. I thought for sure you would agree that my BIL should know before coughing up 5k a month that MIL could pay for this but SIL's borrowed the money from the estate. And even if MIL knows about her daughters borrowing the money she is mentally ill and can't make rational decisions. Thanks ladies guess I will keep my mouth shut. But I can say I won't give her a dime until the SIL's have paid back their Mom. One SIL owns four homes and the other never spends a dime so it shouldn't be a problem for the to pay back MIL and get a loan from the bank. Thanks again. Jen You didn't address the multiple questions about what your husband (or is it ex-husband?) thinks. It's his family. It's not that most don't think the BIL should know, it's that most think that the information should come from their BROTHER, not the SIL.
|
|
scorpeao
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,521
Location: NorCal USA
Jun 25, 2014 21:04:54 GMT
|
WWYD
Feb 18, 2015 16:19:41 GMT
Post by scorpeao on Feb 18, 2015 16:19:41 GMT
I'd tell my dh my thoughts and let him handle it. I would probably be vocal that one sibling shouldn't be on the hook for all of his mother's care; the cost should be split between those siblings that can afford it. Sorry about your MIL's illness. I hope she outlives her prognosis. Actually, the MIL's care should be paid out of her assets, then when those are depleted, Medicaid should be applied for to cover the rest. true, but if the individual's in control of her money won't allow it. I guess the other siblings could take them to court?
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
May 18, 2024 6:23:46 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2015 16:20:12 GMT
I'll be the oddball. I'd have a conversation with him and then let him sort it out.
|
|
loco coco
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,662
Jun 26, 2014 16:15:45 GMT
|
WWYD
Feb 18, 2015 16:20:53 GMT
Post by loco coco on Feb 18, 2015 16:20:53 GMT
No will or trust she is mentally ill and doesn't believe in them. I am completely in shock with the answers. I thought for sure you would agree that my BIL should know before coughing up 5k a month that MIL could pay for this but SIL's borrowed the money from the estate. And even if MIL knows about her daughters borrowing the money she is mentally ill and can't make rational decisions. Thanks ladies guess I will keep my mouth shut. But I can say I won't give her a dime until the SIL's have paid back their Mom. One SIL owns four homes and the other never spends a dime so it shouldn't be a problem for the to pay back MIL and get a loan from the bank. Thanks again. Jen I do think he should know but I think it should be your husband who tells him. It sounds like SILs spent moms money and now there is none left. The family should communicate and SIL may have to sell one of her homes if thats where MILs $ went
|
|
|
Post by my2apps2 on Feb 18, 2015 16:21:02 GMT
MIL's money and assets are HERS and should be used for HER care and upkeep. If her money and assets are depleted because of that, well...that is as it should be. I went through this when my own mother took over finances for my grandmother. She just could not keep her hands out of Gran's money...claiming she could help herself because it was "her inheritance". Her behavior resulted in my Gran having to be put in a state funded home and receiving sub par care (not saying that always happens, but it isn't uncommon) because the money and assets she worked her whole life to save were not available to her because someone thought she deserved an inheritance. Disgusting. As for the OP, I agree with another poster who said to discuss it with your DH and let him broach the subject with his siblings. I'm so sorry to hear about your MIL's diagnosis.
|
|
|
Post by myshelly on Feb 18, 2015 16:21:36 GMT
SIL owing money to MIL isn't the true issue.
The true issue is SIL has no right to say she won't spend MIL's money on MIL's care.
*That* is what needs to be addressed first and foremost by all the siblings.
|
|
|
Post by crazy4scraps on Feb 18, 2015 16:26:26 GMT
I would tell my husband that he needs to talk to ALL of his siblings about the situation, and together they need to take steps to document the loans that were previously made to the sisters and get that out in the open. If MIL had the funds to pay for her own care and those funds were siphoned off by some of her kids and now she needs money to pay for her care, those who borrowed the money need to step up NOW and take responsibility for what they owe. The sister who took the money to pay cash for her home should be told she needs to refinance the home at this point and pay her mom back ASAP because it wasn't a gift. It isn't right for one kid out of eight to be saddled with the expense of helping his mom pay for needed care when others have brazenly helped themself to her money previously.
I can tell you from my own very similar personal experience that this will probably not end well. My mom passed away over 3.5 years ago and it's still not completely done, and it has cost a small fortune in legal fees while the whole mess was dragged out to the bitter end in probate court. Things have gotten irreparably ugly and my family has been splintered needlessly by the greedy actions of a few.
ETA: And yes, if MIL still has any funds of her own remaining to pay for her own care, that is where that money should go right now to get her set up somewhere where she will get the care she needs. She may have to prove that she has personally spent down her assets to pay for her care before the state will take over paying for it.
|
|
julieb
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,845
Jul 3, 2014 16:02:54 GMT
|
WWYD
Feb 18, 2015 16:30:31 GMT
Why likes this
Post by julieb on Feb 18, 2015 16:30:31 GMT
SIL owing money to MIL isn't the true issue. The true issue is SIL has no right to say she won't spend MIL's money on MIL's care. *That* is what needs to be addressed first and foremost by all the siblings.
SIL owing money is an issue, but I agree that it isn't the true issue. MIL's owed money can be used to take better care of her. You can put her in a place for 5k a month or a place for 7-10k a month. If she has the money, put her in a nicer place.
I 100% would tell BIL.
|
|
|
WWYD
Feb 18, 2015 16:39:14 GMT
Post by jumperhop on Feb 18, 2015 16:39:14 GMT
I am done with this family. They minus BIL are all crazy. I just had a conversation with my husband. I told him my concerns with having BIL pay for the care when the money would be there if his sisters hadn't borrowed the money. His reply was that he doesn't know if his sisters actually borrowed money and that he isn't going to trust his wives opinion. I told him that his sisters are the ones who told me they borrowed money. One said it was to pay cash for a house in Spokane and the other borrowed money so they could go in with friends and flip a house in TX. Whatever I am tired of caring more about their Mom than they do. Jen
|
|
|
Post by littlemama on Feb 18, 2015 16:41:16 GMT
Actually, the MIL's care should be paid out of her assets, then when those are depleted, Medicaid should be applied for to cover the rest. true, but if the individual's in control of her money won't allow it. I guess the other siblings could take them to court? It is not an option for that individual to refuse to pay for the care, although if that person is the one who has to sign the paperwork to admit her, I'm not sure how that would work. In any event, the BIL should not pay for the care. If his funds run out and he has signed the paperwork to be legally responsible for the costs, that debt will be forever his
|
|
|
WWYD
Feb 18, 2015 17:25:36 GMT
Post by mikklynn on Feb 18, 2015 17:25:36 GMT
I think if MIL goes into assisted living, you will need to provide financial documents.
I'd stay out of the financials. It's up to her kids.
|
|
|
Post by Darcy Collins on Feb 18, 2015 18:33:13 GMT
I am done with this family. They minus BIL are all crazy. I just had a conversation with my husband. I told him my concerns with having BIL pay for the care when the money would be there if his sisters hadn't borrowed the money. His reply was that he doesn't know if his sisters actually borrowed money and that he isn't going to trust his wives opinion. I told him that his sisters are the ones who told me they borrowed money. One said it was to pay cash for a house in Spokane and the other borrowed money so they could go in with friends and flip a house in TX. Whatever I am tired of caring more about their Mom than they do. Jen Say what? He doesn't trust his wife's opinion? There's some deeper issues going on here. It's highly possible his family is dysfunctional and he doesn't want to deal with it - in which case you need to disengage. But I'll be honest, I really can't fathom my husband suggesting he doesn't value my opinion - I think you've got way more important problems than whether your SILs are taking advantage of your BIL.
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
May 18, 2024 6:23:46 GMT
|
WWYD
Feb 18, 2015 18:40:45 GMT
Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2015 18:40:45 GMT
I am done with this family. They minus BIL are all crazy. I just had a conversation with my husband. I told him my concerns with having BIL pay for the care when the money would be there if his sisters hadn't borrowed the money. His reply was that he doesn't know if his sisters actually borrowed money and that he isn't going to trust his wives opinion. I told him that his sisters are the ones who told me they borrowed money. One said it was to pay cash for a house in Spokane and the other borrowed money so they could go in with friends and flip a house in TX. Whatever I am tired of caring more about their Mom than they do. Jen Are you sure you don't care more about the money? In any event, there are so many dynamics at play here -- and they're for your husband to sort out. Like, does BIL expect to be reimbursed by the estate, are SILs motivated by keeping as much money available in the estate as possible - not drain it with paying for a care home, is anyone willing to provide the physical care until MIL can be back on her feet (if she ever is)? I think you should feel free to express yourself to your DH, but no one else. However, it sounds like he doesn't trust your input...which is another whole issue. Sorry you're going through this. I know it's tough to sit on the sidelines as an observer, but it's your place to do so, IMO.
|
|
|
WWYD
Feb 18, 2015 18:48:31 GMT
Post by iamkristinl16 on Feb 18, 2015 18:48:31 GMT
I wonder if the SILs are balking at spending mom's money because they've used up too much of it and there's not much there for moms care. Or perhaps they're holding out hoping for a more sizable inheritance once mom dies? Who knows. What does your husband say about the situation? As much as I'd like for you to tell BIL it's really not your place. Your husband needs to be the one to speak up. However, I wouldn't be willing to pay for her care out of my budget if she has money available and your SIL is balking about using mom's own funds. This is what I am wondering as well. Do you know if there was some agreement in place when the sisters borrowed the money? Or did they just take it without MIL knowing? How much money is left? If I was the BIL I wouldn't be happy not knowing what was going on with the sisters using the money for themselves but not for MIL's care. That is what the money is for. If there is any leftover, that is to be decided by her will. What does your DH say?
|
|
|
Post by elaine on Feb 18, 2015 18:54:07 GMT
I am done with this family. They minus BIL are all crazy. I just had a conversation with my husband. I told him my concerns with having BIL pay for the care when the money would be there if his sisters hadn't borrowed the money. His reply was that he doesn't know if his sisters actually borrowed money and that he isn't going to trust his wives opinion. I told him that his sisters are the ones who told me they borrowed money. One said it was to pay cash for a house in Spokane and the other borrowed money so they could go in with friends and flip a house in TX. Whatever I am tired of caring more about their Mom than they do. Jen Say what? He doesn't trust his wife's opinion? There's some deeper issues going on here. It's highly possible his family is dysfunctional and he doesn't want to deal with it - in which case you need to disengage. But I'll be honest, I really can't fathom my husband suggesting he doesn't value my opinion - I think you've got way more important problems than whether your SILs are taking advantage of your BIL. I would easily shed this responsibility you feel for your MIL if I were you. She has 8 adult children. As long as it isn't costing you any money at this point, I'd completely let it go. If your own husband doesn't want to hear what you have to say about it, I am 110% sure that the rest of the siblings will be even LESS receptive to you butting in. It is not fair, but true. I would focus more on the issues in your own home.
|
|
|
Post by mommaho on Feb 18, 2015 18:57:06 GMT
Hugs to you and prayers and positive thoughts for your MIL. You talked to your DH - it is off your plate and you shouldn't have to worry about it. Key word being worry because I sense that you will, as would I. Sometimes it is better to step back and watch everything unfold, resist the I told you so at the end and know that you tried.
|
|
|
WWYD
Feb 18, 2015 19:15:29 GMT
Post by vpohlman on Feb 18, 2015 19:15:29 GMT
I know from our experience with my mom that Medicare will only pay for assisted living or nursing home care after all, ALL, of her assets are gone. Including house, car and any belongings of value. If she gave a gift or loan in the previous five years it counts as an asset so the family member will have to give it back or sell it and use the proceeds to pay for care. When there is zero left Medicare will kick in and pay. This is what the financial assistance lady at the hospital told us. We were really lucky mom had long term care insurance!!! We paid only $300 a month after her insurance paid.
You said your MIL has mental illness. My mom had Lewy Body dementia. Usually 2-7 years with that. She lived a month short of 2 years. Her children should have access to her bank records so everyone can see exactly where her money went. Good luck and don't give up on your husband. He's probably pretty stressed out, too. Could be why he's reacting this way.
|
|