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Post by Lexica on Aug 7, 2016 0:29:12 GMT
I just looked at my vet's site to see if I could provide any reading material for you, and I am happy to say that he, and all the vets in their practice, refuse to declaw a cat. If there are countries who outlaw this practice as cruel, vets who won't perform it, doesn't that give you pause? Please Please talk to someone about other options. And if you do choose to declaw the cat, please don't come back and tell us. I just can't know about it. Especially when there is a perfectly acceptable, easy alternative - the soft paws.
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marianne
Pearl Clutcher
Not my circus, not my monkeys. . . My monkeys fly!
Posts: 4,176
Location: right smack dab in the middle of SC
Site Supporter
Jun 25, 2014 21:08:26 GMT
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Post by marianne on Aug 7, 2016 0:32:09 GMT
Mutilation is not 'best' for the cat, what a load of fucking bullshit. People who torture animals do not deserve to own them and declawing is illegal in many countries because it's seen for what it is, barbaric and unnecessary. Keep kidding yourself that it's perfectly fine to cut off a cats body parts for your own convenience and for the sake of your furniture. It's absolutely vile. Excuse me, but in all your sanctimonious wisdom, you have absolutely no idea why or how my my cats came to be declawed, so please, spare me your judgmental outrage. And, uhm... have a nice evening.
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Post by Yubon Peatlejuice on Aug 7, 2016 0:44:49 GMT
The following 8 countries have made declawing a cat either illegal, or considered extremely inhumane and only preformed under extreme circumstances-England, Scotland, Wales, Italy, Austria, Switzerland, Norway, Sweden. That's only 6 countries.
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Post by PNWMom on Aug 7, 2016 0:44:53 GMT
Like everything else, everyone will have an opinion. Do what is best for your family! I couldn't agree more. Please, do not be guilted into anything by anyone. Do, what in your heart, you know is best for you, your family... and your cat. A well-loved, homed kitty is much better off than a homeless or sheltered kitty, declawed or not. Cats who have been declawed can have all kinds of problems afterwards including problems in the litterbox. You've been lucky so far it seems, but that doesn't mean it won't happen. Without getting into a heated debate about the claw issue, that statement is simply not correct. You can't generalize like that. Yes, I suppose some can have issues, but it doesn't mean that all will. I have owned long-lived (16-17+ yrs) declawed cats my entire adult life. None of them... not one... ever had "all kinds of problems," including the litterbox. They've lived long, healthy, indoor lives bouncing off the walls, running through the house, playing with their toys, eating like little piggies, and perfectly well-mannered in their bathroom habits. They've been well-loved and well taken care of. The only issues we've ever had have been when they get old and their little bodies start giving out on them, which has absolutely nothing to do with being declawed... or being lucky. OP, your kitty is totally adorable! My cat is in kidney failure. Has a very unusual anatomical issue that would have killed him back in 2011. He gets subQ fluids 5 days a week (about a 5 minute process). You would never be able to tell by looking at him. He runs around and does regular cat things, scarfs down his food and goes nuts for catnip. But he'd be dead within a month if I stopped giving him his fluids. He was literally at death's door when he was diagnosed. It seemed to me that he got sick all of a sudden, but the reality is that it took months and months for his kidneys to fail so spectacularly. Cats keep their pain and discomfort to themselves until things get pretty dire. I'm a trauma/ortho RN. I've worked with many, many patients who have had amputations at all levels (from a finger to a hand or a leg, etc). Just because they are living a full lifespan doesn't mean they wouldn't do better with their limb back. My mom lost 1 1/2 fingers in a metalshop accident. On her non dominant hand, but she'd be the first to tell you that even having just the very tip of your finger removed can be lifechanging. Your fingernails serve a huge purpose. When I was taking one of my chemo drugs, it made my fingernails lift off/unattach from the nailbed, so I had only a few mms of nails and the finger ends were all exposed. I had no idea how much nails protect the end of your finger. I would bump my fingers the smallest bit while reaching for something and it was shocking how much a little bump hurt. I had no idea fingertips were so sensitive. We don't do elective amputations on people. When someone comes in asking for an unnecessary amputation on a perfectly healthy body part, they get a psych eval (yes, this totally happens). Extensive psych evals. Chopping body parts off for no reason or someone else's convenience is uncontemplatable for people, so why would it be OK for an animal you consider part of your family?
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Nink
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,947
Location: North Idaho
Jul 1, 2014 23:30:44 GMT
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Post by Nink on Aug 7, 2016 1:30:23 GMT
I'm on the side of if you have to declaw the cat then don't get a cat. Yes, I know many cats have lived long lives while declawed, but that doesn't mean they weren't in pain. It is cruel and barbaric and inexcusable. Have your husband watch the documentary called "the paw project". If he still insists then get rid of one of them.
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Nink
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,947
Location: North Idaho
Jul 1, 2014 23:30:44 GMT
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Post by Nink on Aug 7, 2016 1:44:52 GMT
Mutilation is not 'best' for the cat, what a load of fucking bullshit. People who torture animals do not deserve to own them and declawing is illegal in many countries because it's seen for what it is, barbaric and unnecessary. Keep kidding yourself that it's perfectly fine to cut off a cats body parts for your own convenience and for the sake of your furniture. It's absolutely vile. Excuse me, but in all your sanctimonious wisdom, you have absolutely no idea why or how my my cats came to be declawed, so please, spare me your judgmental outrage. And, uhm... have a nice evening. No sanctimony about it. There is absolutely no reason that could be good enough to justify amputating your cats toes. None.
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Post by zztop11 on Aug 7, 2016 2:08:29 GMT
If you get one of these, the scratching will be much much less. They need TALL scratching posts like this one on Amazon. www.amazon.com/SmartCat-3832-Ultimate-Scratching-Post/dp/B000634MH8You can teach your cat not to mess up the furniture. I guarantee it will be much better. It has to do with their body. They need to be able to stretch and scratch. It's something that is in them. We have used this with all of our cats and they LOVE it. They are expensive but well worth it and last a long time. Our 4th cat is using the same one as our 1st cat. Don't declaw. Educate your husband. It's just so cruel.
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Post by pjaye on Aug 7, 2016 2:18:01 GMT
The following 8 countries have made declawing a cat either illegal, or considered extremely inhumane and only preformed under extreme circumstances-England, Scotland, Wales, Italy, Austria, Switzerland, Norway, Sweden. Add Australia to that list. . 20 million people and a few million cats and not one of those cats is declawed.
ETA: And in the video below Jackson says *22* countries have now banned declawing If all of those millions (billions?) of people can live happily with clawed cats all over the world, then so can you. It is possible and your husband is 100% wrong. A cat is like most other pets, you will need to train it and spend time with it to teach it what is appropriate behaviour and also inappropriate behaviour, and if you aren't prepared to do that, then don't have pets. It's that simple.
You ARE being cruel, declawing is animal abuse pure and simple. Kind people don't amputate perfectly healthy parts of their animals simply because they can't be bothered training them or because they are worried about a few scratches...what if your cat bites you one day, will you also have all of her teeth removed? There is so much research about this and all of it is negative, it's not a matter of personal opinion, it is simply animal cruelty and you are every bit as bad as the "very bad" situation you claim is the alternative.
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seaexplore
Prolific Pea
Posts: 8,408
Apr 25, 2015 23:57:30 GMT
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Post by seaexplore on Aug 7, 2016 2:39:25 GMT
Such a cute baby!
Growing up we always had kitties. They all had claws. When I met my DH, his ex wife dumped their cats off on him when she was moving and couldn't take them. It was a "you take them or they're going to the pound in 24 hours" situation. We took them! They were both declawed when we got them. I lived in fear of them getting out and not being able to defend themselves! They've since died and we've adopted more. They have no been declawed and while I don't like them going outside, they do. I trim the front claws on 2 of the 3. Yes, they scratch stuff sometimes. That's part of having cats. Ours have several scratching posts throughout the house. One (the one I can't trim) likes to claw our foam mats that the kids play on. It's all scratched up but, oh well.
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Post by compeateropeator on Aug 7, 2016 2:56:35 GMT
What a beautiful kitten. good luck to you and Skittles.
I am no help with the declawing debate other than good luck and maybe you can change you husband's mind by showing him some of the products out there to avoid having to do this.
circumcisions?
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Nink
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,947
Location: North Idaho
Jul 1, 2014 23:30:44 GMT
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Post by Nink on Aug 7, 2016 3:06:17 GMT
What a beautiful kitten. good luck to you and Skittles. I am no help with the declawing debate other than good luck and maybe you can change you husband's mind by showing him some of the products out there to avoid having to do this. circumcisions? Circumcision could be classified as mutilation perhaps. But definitely not amputation, unless they're doing it wrong.
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Post by compeateropeator on Aug 7, 2016 3:11:24 GMT
What a beautiful kitten. good luck to you and Skittles. I am no help with the declawing debate other than good luck and maybe you can change you husband's mind by showing him some of the products out there to avoid having to do this. circumcisions? Circumcision could be classified as mutilation perhaps. But definitely not amputation, unless they're doing it wrong. I understand that it is not classified as amputation. But it is removing a piece of the body unnecessarily, that is all I was getting at. Is mutilation better than amputation?
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Nink
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,947
Location: North Idaho
Jul 1, 2014 23:30:44 GMT
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Post by Nink on Aug 7, 2016 3:24:13 GMT
Circumcision could be classified as mutilation perhaps. But definitely not amputation, unless they're doing it wrong. I understand that it is not classified as amputation. But it is removing a piece of the body unnecessarily, that is all I was getting at. Is mutilation better than amputation? I think if you asked the majority of circumcised men, they'd say yes if they had to choose between the two. Eta: I'm not defending circumcision either, but I don't think it's a valid comparison to actually losing a limb or fingers etc.
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Post by Lexica on Aug 7, 2016 3:36:36 GMT
If you get one of these, the scratching will be much much less. They need TALL scratching posts like this one on Amazon. www.amazon.com/SmartCat-3832-Ultimate-Scratching-Post/dp/B000634MH8You can teach your cat not to mess up the furniture. I guarantee it will be much better. It has to do with their body. They need to be able to stretch and scratch. It's something that is in them. We have used this with all of our cats and they LOVE it. They are expensive but well worth it and last a long time. Our 4th cat is using the same one as our 1st cat. Don't declaw. Educate your husband. It's just so cruel. I don't know if you were the one that told me about this scratching post a while back. I purchased it, and I have to say, absolutely the best scratching post ever! My 4 use it every day, and it looks like the day I unpacked it. It holds up so nicely, and mine are not gentle with it. My one big male hangs himself on the side of it when scratching, and it has wobbled, but never fallen over. Expensive, but the best money I have ever spent on a scratching post. I would have gone through double that amount in the kind that I end up throwing out after a month or so. So, if you were the one that recommended it, thank you! SaveSave
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Post by compeateropeator on Aug 7, 2016 3:42:19 GMT
I understand that it is not classified as amputation. But it is removing a piece of the body unnecessarily, that is all I was getting at. Is mutilation better than amputation? I think if you asked the majority of circumcised men, they'd say yes if they had to choose between the two. Eta: I'm not defending circumcision either, but I don't think it's a valid comparison to actually losing a limb or fingers etc. Since I have no experience being circumcised I can't really say if it is preferable. I am not for declawing, and am kind of neutral on circumcision just to clarify. I guess I was just saying (typing) the first thing that came to my mind when numerous people argued that we wouldn't remove human parts unnecessarily.
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Post by worrywart on Aug 7, 2016 3:49:26 GMT
Adorable kitten. On the declawing, well honestly, claws are the only way that cats have to defend themselves..and even if you have an inside cat, they do escape from time to time and possibly be bothered by a dog. Cats need their claws!
Teach the kitten to use a scratching post and have some manners and you should be okay for the most part. Like any animal or human, there will be times that they do something that you do not like. Good luck, but I would not agree to the declawing. Just let dh know. It is your house too.
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Post by PNWMom on Aug 7, 2016 4:02:31 GMT
Circumcision is a whole 'nother ball of wax. There actually *are* reasons for circumscisions sometimes (I cover the ortho hand/foot/spine patients and also the Urology service--we get adult men in who need a circumcision for a variety of reasons). Regardless, it is something that is done for religious reasons or because people feel it is a societal norm. Some people feel that there are medical benefits (there are some good arguments out there and scientific data on both sides of the issue).
Regardless, that is not something that is done to protect furniture from being ruined =) (for the record, I am neutral on whether or not I would circumcise a son. I leave that decision fully in my husband's realm, since he actually has a penis and a more first hand view on what it's like to have a circumcised penis or not {he says he would choose to circumcise})
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 4, 2024 5:32:11 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2016 6:55:40 GMT
The following 8 countries have made declawing a cat either illegal, or considered extremely inhumane and only preformed under extreme circumstances-England, Scotland, Wales, Italy, Austria, Switzerland, Norway, Sweden. That's only 6 countries. That's not my quote. I wrote my 'sanctimonious' post under the influence of some alcoholic beverages. In the cold light of a slightly hungover new day I stand by every word I said. Declawing a cat to make it acceptable to humans is vile. Unless every single one of your cats had some kind of injury or birth defect that made the operation necessary it was for your own convenience. There is no justification for that. So many cats are abandoned or handed over to shelters because declawing goes wrong and brings on undesirable behaviour. That should tell you something! My cat scratches things sometimes, including me, absolutely not a big deal.
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Post by birukitty on Aug 7, 2016 7:00:28 GMT
The following 8 countries have made declawing a cat either illegal, or considered extremely inhumane and only preformed under extreme circumstances-England, Scotland, Wales, Italy, Austria, Switzerland, Norway, Sweden. That's only 6 countries. I'm sorry I made an honest mistake. I have a sinus infection (had a CT scan done recently and saw the proof of the infection). It's making me exhausted and mistakes are coming more easily. I'm also not visiting the board as much. Thank you Yubon for taking the time to point this out to me and everyone. New Zealand is probably one of the countries I missed. I've had this darn infection since November 2, 2015. I really getting tired of it.
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Post by birukitty on Aug 7, 2016 7:07:39 GMT
The following 8 countries have made declawing a cat either illegal, or considered extremely inhumane and only preformed under extreme circumstances-England, Scotland, Wales, Italy, Austria, Switzerland, Norway, Sweden. That's only 6 countries. WTF! I fell for your bogas answer the first time because I am so exhausted. No Yubon, those are 8 countries. Can't you count? England, Scotland and Wales are 3 different countries. The UK consists of England, Scotland Wales and Ireland. But England, Scotland and Wales in this list quoted above by me are 3 separate countries. Adding in Italy, Austria, Switzerland, Norway and Sweden equals 8 countries. What have you been smoking today, or can you just not add?
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wellway
Prolific Pea
Posts: 8,760
Jun 25, 2014 20:50:09 GMT
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Post by wellway on Aug 7, 2016 7:14:27 GMT
I'm sorry I made an honest mistake. I have a sinus infection (had a CT scan done recently and saw the proof of the infection). It's making me exhausted and mistakes are coming more easily. I'm also not visiting the board as much. Thank you Yubon for taking the time to point this out to me and everyone. New Zealand is probably one of the countries I missed. I've had this darn infection since November 2, 2015. I really getting tired of it. Actually, Scotland and Wales have devolved powers and can make their own rules/laws in certain areas, such as agriculture, education, health etc so it is quite possible for the rules to be very different in each area. But it seems thay all agree about declawing. EG the drink/drive laws in Scotland are much stricter than in England. Linking a BBC article about devolution. news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/election_2010/first_time_voter/8589835.stm
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Post by birukitty on Aug 7, 2016 7:21:28 GMT
The following 8 countries have made declawing a cat either illegal, or considered extremely inhumane and only preformed under extreme circumstances-England, Scotland, Wales, Italy, Austria, Switzerland, Norway, Sweden. Add Australia to that list. . 20 million people and a few million cats and not one of those cats is declawed.
ETA: And in the video below Jackson says *22* countries have now banned declawing If all of those millions (billions?) of people can live happily with clawed cats all over the world, then so can you. It is possible and your husband is 100% wrong. A cat is like most other pets, you will need to train it and spend time with it to teach it what is appropriate behaviour and also inappropriate behaviour, and if you aren't prepared to do that, then don't have pets. It's that simple.
You ARE being cruel, declawing is animal abuse pure and simple. Kind people don't amputate perfectly healthy parts of their animals simply because they can't be bothered training them or because they are worried about a few scratches...what if your cat bites you one day, will you also have all of her teeth removed? There is so much research about this and all of it is negative, it's not a matter of personal opinion, it is simply animal cruelty and you are every bit as bad as the "very bad" situation you claim is the alternative.
Great! I'm glad to hear that it's actually 22 countries that have banned declawing and not the 8 that I originally quoted. I did a quick search on Google today to get that number. OP that has got to tell you something if 22 countries have banned declawing. Another Pea had a great suggestion OP if you can't change your husband's mind. Find a no kill shelter to give this kitten to-that way this kitten can find a new family and won't have to undergo the vicious agony of brutal chopping off of it's toes. You can then adopt a kitten or cat that's already been declawed from the shelter that is looking for a new home. Our local SPCA who we've adopted from before has photos online of their cats that are looking for homes and they will list if the cat has been declawed. There is always one or two that has been each week that is up for adoption. You may not find a 8 week old kitten, but you will find a cat that is looking for a home. Our SPCA always list the ages of the cats. Hopefully you can change your husband's mind. DH and I have been married for 21 years last month. You know what makes our marriage work? Compromise. I believe compromise and trust are the secrets to a good marriage. Being willing to give in a bit and not always get your way goes a long way to making any relationship work. Having an open mind and being willing to listen to new ideas is a sign of intelligence.
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Deleted
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May 4, 2024 5:32:11 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2016 9:09:17 GMT
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Post by miaow on Aug 7, 2016 11:23:48 GMT
We have the same scratching posts as zztop11 suggested.
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Post by Yubon Peatlejuice on Aug 8, 2016 1:52:40 GMT
WTF! I fell for your bogas answer the first time because I am so exhausted. No Yubon, those are 8 countries. Can't you count? England, Scotland and Wales are 3 different countries. The UK consists of England, Scotland Wales and Ireland. But England, Scotland and Wales in this list quoted above by me are 3 separate countries. Adding in Italy, Austria, Switzerland, Norway and Sweden equals 8 countries. What have you been smoking today, or can you just not add? Nope, sorry, you're wrong. The UK is a country and England, Scotland, Wales and NORTHERN Ireland (you forgot the northern part) are constituent nations within the UK. Ireland is a separate country. You need to consult the ISO list of countries, and......stop smoking.
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theshyone
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,405
Jun 26, 2014 12:50:12 GMT
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Post by theshyone on Aug 8, 2016 8:14:48 GMT
Skittles is cute.
I'm actually shocked that declawing still exists. I thought it had been outlawed years ago.
Please regime the kitty or the husband. Your choice.
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Post by gillyp on Aug 8, 2016 12:46:31 GMT
WTF! I fell for your bogas answer the first time because I am so exhausted. No Yubon, those are 8 countries. Can't you count? England, Scotland and Wales are 3 different countries. The UK consists of England, Scotland Wales and Ireland. But England, Scotland and Wales in this list quoted above by me are 3 separate countries. Adding in Italy, Austria, Switzerland, Norway and Sweden equals 8 countries. What have you been smoking today, or can you just not add? Nope, sorry, you're wrong. The UK is a country and England, Scotland, Wales and NORTHERN Ireland (you forgot the northern part) are constituent nations within the UK. Ireland is a separate country. You need to consult the ISO list of countries, and......stop smoking. I was born in the country known as England and I live in the country known as Scotland. Those of us who actually live in the United Kingdom rarely view the UK as a country.
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Post by nurseypants on Aug 8, 2016 12:51:07 GMT
We lost our two precious furr babies within three months of each other and were devastated. I was wanting another cat and my daughter kept telling me to just wait that one would show up and not to push it. Well, she was right this little bundle needed a home as bad as we needed a kitten and from the first she stole my heart. We have had her now for two weeks and I can't imagine life without her already. She is just as cute as can be, follows me around like a shadow and races down the hall in order to get ahead and be able to pounce when I come around the corner. She has the halloween kitty sideways bounce down pat and is an expert at the wigglebutt pounce. My only concern now is hubby is insisting she have her front claws declawed when she is "fixed". I know that people say this is cruel and inhumane, but she can't stay without it, possibly going to a very bad situation if she does not stay. In my mind, I rationalize it by thinking of the alternative. Better alive and a long healthy life with front claws removed than a very short unhappy life elsewhere. Am I being cruel? What a cutie! The only advice I have is to do what's right for you and your family, never mention declawing online again for the rest of your life, and if any peas have the gall to ask, say you decided not to declaw even if you did. People are truly unhinged about this issue. We have seen stalker behavior from certain peas in the past. Don't let yourself become a victim.
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Deleted
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May 4, 2024 5:32:11 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2016 12:58:31 GMT
The only advice I have is to do what's right for you and your family Yes, fuck what is right and humane for the cat!
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Post by pjaye on Aug 8, 2016 13:30:16 GMT
We have seen stalker behavior from certain peas in the past. Don't let yourself become a victim. You're an idiot. Go back and read the OP again, she posted this herself and asked "am I being cruel?" There's never been any stalking related to this issue and the only victims are the people who start threads on this and ask for opinions...if you do that and you get those opinions, then you can't go crying that you were "victimised". Happy that you bumped this thread to the top again though, now more people will get to read about how barbaric this practice is.
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