MizIndependent
Drama Llama
Quit your bullpoop.
Posts: 5,836
Jun 25, 2014 19:43:16 GMT
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Post by MizIndependent on Nov 9, 2016 21:38:45 GMT
*Some swearing (Michael is no saint), but I think this really is what's behind America's "Brexit".Posted on 25OCT: FWIW, Moore supported Hillary.
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Post by ellewood on Nov 9, 2016 22:13:37 GMT
Thank you for posting this. I hadn't seen it and it really gives me a new perspective on the types of people who would choose Trump and why. I understand the populist message and I can get behind it (Bernie was not off the table for me). This helps me have compassion for the people who chose differently than I did and it will help me in the coming days (weeks? years?) as I grapple with this. It also gives me hope that "blowing up the system" might net some positive effects after the initial shock. I don't know. I can only say I wish the message hadn't been cloaked in racism, xenophobia, misogyny, and other backwards-looking sentiments. Maybe it had to be? Maybe a more well-spoken messenger could have fomented this change without alienating half the country in the process? Or maybe it had to happen this way. Maybe we got the candidate we deserved. Anyways, thank you.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 17, 2024 21:03:59 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2016 22:20:11 GMT
Are you sure he's not a mazel tov cocktail?
(Sorry. Couldn't resist.)
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Post by mom on Nov 9, 2016 22:22:12 GMT
I can agree with the video and definitely see where his observations are correct.
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MizIndependent
Drama Llama
Quit your bullpoop.
Posts: 5,836
Jun 25, 2014 19:43:16 GMT
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Post by MizIndependent on Nov 9, 2016 22:23:53 GMT
Are you sure he's not a mazel tov cocktail? (Sorry. Couldn't resist.) No, but I'm also not sure he's not a life-size Cheeto either.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Nov 9, 2016 22:32:07 GMT
I saw him earlyish in the night on CNBC I think - I was all over the place watching results. They were just getting Michigan and Wisconsin returns in and they asked if he was surprised by Trump being up. He managed to not curse on air - but not by much.
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Post by cindosha on Nov 10, 2016 1:22:34 GMT
I normally can't stand Michael Moore. But he absolutely hit the bullseye on this one. I loved it!!! And I live in Michigan.
Cindy
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Post by Yubon Peatlejuice on Nov 10, 2016 1:23:46 GMT
Human Molotov cocktail is the perfect description.
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Post by leftturnonly on Nov 10, 2016 1:57:04 GMT
That's the closest I've come to agreeing with Michael Moore in the history of ever.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Nov 10, 2016 2:04:15 GMT
This might be applicable to some, but not to the Trump supporters that I know.
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paget
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,751
Jun 25, 2014 21:16:39 GMT
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Post by paget on Nov 10, 2016 4:01:23 GMT
This might be applicable to some, but not to the Trump supporters that I know. You are just bound and determined to not listen to others telling you why they voted Trump. It's not just about the people YOU know. It's literally half the country and their reasons are varied and unique and this video does a great job of explaining a few of them. You can't lump all trump voters together as racist, ignorant, etc etc etc.-- all the garbage I've heard here. guess what? You kind of "know" the peas. And some of us have been saying those aren't the reasons we voted Trump and you just won't listen. I have many characteristics that go against your opinion of what a trump voter is/stands for and I could list them out one by one but I've already seen your intolerance on this subject and so I won't bother throwing my "pearls before swine."
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MizIndependent
Drama Llama
Quit your bullpoop.
Posts: 5,836
Jun 25, 2014 19:43:16 GMT
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Post by MizIndependent on Nov 10, 2016 19:04:25 GMT
You kind of "know" the peas. And some of us have been saying those aren't the reasons we voted Trump and you just won't listen. I tend to agree - Trump voters cannot be lumped into one box labeled "racist/mysogenist/zenophobic" or, more commonly known as "deplorable". There is a strategic ideology behind some people's vote...as demonstrated in the video above. I don't disagree with this strategy. As Bernie Sanders said waaaaay back in August 2016:
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Post by leftturnonly on Nov 10, 2016 19:39:36 GMT
The people of our country understand that given the collapse of the American middle class... The horrific collapsing of our American middle class. Bullseye. I agreed with Bernie on virtually nothing but this.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 17, 2024 21:03:59 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2016 19:49:44 GMT
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 17, 2024 21:03:59 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2016 20:15:31 GMT
MizIndependent, I truly believe if Bernie had been the nominee, he would have beaten Trump. I think the Democratic party leadership really screwed this one up
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MizIndependent
Drama Llama
Quit your bullpoop.
Posts: 5,836
Jun 25, 2014 19:43:16 GMT
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Post by MizIndependent on Nov 10, 2016 20:21:18 GMT
MizIndependent , I truly believe if Bernie had been the nominee, he would have beaten Trump. I think the Democratic party leadership really screwed this one up It is not possible for me to agree with you more I do.
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Post by cade387 on Nov 10, 2016 20:24:10 GMT
Moore called a Trump victory back in June. I agreed with him then, and it was more obvious as we got closer to the election.
I get what he has said, I think people are sorely mistaken if they think Trump cares about the middle class, but I get it.
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Post by leftturnonly on Nov 10, 2016 20:46:21 GMT
I get what he has said, I think people are sorely mistaken if they think Trump cares about the middle class, but I get it. People have loudly, frequently and most importantly sorely been wrong every step along the way of this election. Now, they are supposed to be right? Think about it this way..... Legacy. Donald Trump can build a lasting legacy by lifting those who fell out of the middle class back into it and finally give those that managed to hang on a chance to have a real pay increase. That would be remembered in history. The very idea that he would now say "F YOU" to the middle class that just gave him the White House, the Senate, the House and a slew of governerships makes absolutely no sense. I am going to repeat the line I have heard constantly for nearly 8 years now. Stop listening to whatever media you have been listening to or reading *if they declared Hillary would win by a landslide; they clearly don't have a clue what they are talking about. * Grammar corrected to clarify the meaning
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Post by Darcy Collins on Nov 10, 2016 21:25:19 GMT
I get what he has said, I think people are sorely mistaken if they think Trump cares about the middle class, but I get it. People have loudly, frequently and most importantly sorely been wrong every step along the way of this election. Now, they are supposed to be right? Think about it this way..... Legacy. Donald Trump can build a lasting legacy by lifting those who fell out of the middle class back into it and finally give those that managed to hang on a chance to have a real pay increase. That would be remembered in history. The very idea that he would now say "F YOU" to the middle class that just gave him the White House, the Senate, the House and a slew of governerships makes absolutely no sense. I am going to repeat the line I have heard constantly for nearly 8 years now. Stop listening to whatever media you have been listening to or reading. If they declared Hillary would win by a landslide, they clearly don't have a clue what they are talking about. I don't know that it's about "F YOU" to the middle class as much as it sure as hell isn't going to be easy. Let's face it, if dealing with the issue was easy, it would have already been done.
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Post by cade387 on Nov 10, 2016 21:27:37 GMT
I get what he has said, I think people are sorely mistaken if they think Trump cares about the middle class, but I get it. People have loudly, frequently and most importantly sorely been wrong every step along the way of this election. Now, they are supposed to be right? Think about it this way..... Legacy. Donald Trump can build a lasting legacy by lifting those who fell out of the middle class back into it and finally give those that managed to hang on a chance to have a real pay increase. That would be remembered in history. The very idea that he would now say "F YOU" to the middle class that just gave him the White House, the Senate, the House and a slew of governerships makes absolutely no sense. I am going to repeat the line I have heard constantly for nearly 8 years now. Stop listening to whatever media you have been listening to or reading. If they declared Hillary would win by a landslide, they clearly don't have a clue what they are talking about. Your posted has me really confused?
My point about Trump and the middle class is that in the past he has shown us that he doesn't care about the middle class. He doesn't value tradesmen, he wants to lower the minimum wage, he doesn't care about supporting jobs or bringing manufacturing back to the USA. So while folks wanted to buck the system and push back from the establishment, I don't see Trump as their knight in shining armor was my point.
I'm also not clear on what media I'm supposed to be walking away from?
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Post by leftturnonly on Nov 10, 2016 21:45:13 GMT
Let's face it, if dealing with the issue was easy, it would have already been done. Why? The middle class hasn't been a priority for a very long time. My point about Trump and the middle class is that in the past he has shown us that he doesn't care about the middle class. He doesn't value tradesmen, he wants to lower the minimum wage, he doesn't care about supporting jobs or bringing manufacturing back to the USA. So while folks wanted to buck the system and push back from the establishment, I don't see Trump as their knight in shining armor was my point.
I'm also not clear on what media I'm supposed to be walking away from? Donald Trump has created at least an estimated 34,000 jobs, as of 3 Sep 2015 according to CNN Money. That's a lot of jobs created by someone who "doesn't care about supporting jobs." What part of this is unclear? Hillary was soundly defeated in the House, Senate, White House and a slew of Governerships. That's a lot to miss.
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scorpeao
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,521
Location: NorCal USA
Jun 25, 2014 21:04:54 GMT
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Post by scorpeao on Nov 10, 2016 21:47:00 GMT
I get what he has said, I think people are sorely mistaken if they think Trump cares about the middle class, but I get it. People have loudly, frequently and most importantly sorely been wrong every step along the way of this election. Now, they are supposed to be right? Think about it this way..... Legacy. Donald Trump can build a lasting legacy by lifting those who fell out of the middle class back into it and finally give those that managed to hang on a chance to have a real pay increase. That would be remembered in history. The very idea that he would now say "F YOU" to the middle class that just gave him the White House, the Senate, the House and a slew of governerships makes absolutely no sense. I am going to repeat the line I have heard constantly for nearly 8 years now. Stop listening to whatever media you have been listening to or reading. If they declared Hillary would win by a landslide, they clearly don't have a clue what they are talking about. I'm middle class and I expect under a Trump presidency I will become less so. I fully expect to experience an increase in the cost of goods and services and the status quo of my wages...IF I stay employed under his regime. I didn't expect any great things with Hillary, but I didn't expect my life to change much. Only time will tell...I'll just continue as I have for the last 44 years, and hope for the best.
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Post by cade387 on Nov 10, 2016 21:50:06 GMT
What part of this is unclear? Hillary was soundly defeated in the House, Senate, White House and a slew of Governerships. That's a lot to miss.
Because I said that Michael Moore was calling that Trump will most likely beat Hilary long before many Democrats wanted to consider it. I also said that I agreed with him then and when various polls were shared online, here, on TV etc I felt that they were not accurate and Trump would still win. So when did I say she would win by a landslide?
ETA - she was not soundly defeated for the white house and she was not running for Governor of any state nor was she running for any seat in Congress.
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Post by leftturnonly on Nov 10, 2016 21:51:22 GMT
People have loudly, frequently and most importantly sorely been wrong every step along the way of this election. Now, they are supposed to be right? Think about it this way..... Legacy. Donald Trump can build a lasting legacy by lifting those who fell out of the middle class back into it and finally give those that managed to hang on a chance to have a real pay increase. That would be remembered in history. The very idea that he would now say "F YOU" to the middle class that just gave him the White House, the Senate, the House and a slew of governerships makes absolutely no sense. I am going to repeat the line I have heard constantly for nearly 8 years now. Stop listening to whatever media you have been listening to or reading. If they declared Hillary would win by a landslide, they clearly don't have a clue what they are talking about. I'm middle class and I expect under a Trump presidency I will become less so. I fully expect to experience an increase in the cost of goods and services and the status quo of my wages...IF I stay employed under his regime. I didn't expect any great things with Hillary, but I didn't expect my life to change much. Only time will tell...I'll just continue as I have for the last 44 years, and hope for the best. My life has changed dramatically under Obama, and I am not alone. "Affordable" health care does not mean paying more for health insurance that won't cover anything but catastrophic coverage than you do for a mortgage. Hillary wasn't going to fix that.
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Post by leftturnonly on Nov 10, 2016 22:11:19 GMT
Hillary was soundly defeated in the House, Senate, White House and a slew of Governerships. That's a lot to miss.
Because I said that Michael Moore was calling that Trump will most likely beat Hilary long before many Democrats wanted to consider it. I also said that I agreed with him then and when various polls were shared online, here, on TV etc I felt that they were not accurate and Trump would still win. So when did I say she would win by a landslide?
ETA - she was not soundly defeated for the white house and she was not running for Governor of any state nor was she running for any seat in Congress.
The occupant of the White House is determined by the Electoral College. Hillary was soundly defeated. She will not be inaugurated as the 45th president of the US. Her coattails should have carried the 4 seats needed for the Democrats to win control of the Senate. Just to be clear, I'm being questioned on restating one of the most consistent things that has been repeated on political threads in the nearly 8 years I've been here. Instead of calling out out particular media by name, as is typical, I included all media that were so wrong. Michael Moore clearly does not fall into that category. My post would have been clearer if it had read "Stop listening to whatever media you have been listening to or reading if they declared Hillary....." I'll make the grammar correction now to make it more understandable. Hope that helps.
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Post by gmcwife1 on Nov 10, 2016 23:23:35 GMT
MizIndependent , I truly believe if Bernie had been the nominee, he would have beaten Trump. I think the Democratic party leadership really screwed this one up I keep wondering when democrats are going to accept some of the blame for his win. I think the party leadership and the many democrat voters that didn't get out and vote are part of why he won also.
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