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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2016 23:57:13 GMT
link“Sales can not be the only driver [of business], it has to be a part of it,” he said. “I think many department stores have failed, they put too much emphasis in sales. But product, presentation, excitement in the stores, the salespeople in terms of servicing the customer” are part of the equation. Yeah, but see, this is where you (JCP) and others fail. I don't shop there much, but when I do, the lines are ALWAYS long, the transactions take a long time, and the stores seem overcrowded and disorganized. If I'm not there for a sale, I'm not there. So, yeah, if you want to rely less on sales, try really dealing w/that other stuff, vs. just talking about it.
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Post by Delta Dawn on Dec 5, 2016 0:16:20 GMT
The Bay near me is higher end than JCPenney and Sears and on par with Macy's I'd say. (Bigger city Bay stores are nicer). My Bay is in rough shape. The floors have oodles of cracks in the tiles everywhere. The carpets haven't been cleaned or REPLACED in how long? They shuffle the clothes from one area to another all the time, but the arrangement still looks awful. (No merchandising skills required I guess). The purse section is cluttered and not displayed. The brands my store carries are not good like Toronto or Winnipeg. There are no sales staff. All they have are cashiers. Most of the cashiers seem to hate their jobs as they are extremely unhelpful and unfriendly. They don't know anything about the merchandise and don't care either. If you were to ask a question they would have no idea. Eaton's had some of the same staff back in the day and they were happy working at Eaton's but they seem to hate working for The Bay. Is it a morale thing for them? Are the wages really low? Terrible management? Not enough staff to cover breaks and sickness/holidays? Everyone there seems so unhappy. Sure retail is about the sales but everyone always seems so angry. One cashier who is a classmate's mother hisses when she talks. She looks just so unhappy. She doesn't take it out on you the customer but she seems very unhappy. She isn't the only one either. It's like the customer is the hated person in the equation. They would rather not have to ring through transactions. No one smiles. No one says thank you or have a nice day. They just hand you your purchase and say bye. What happened?
The guy the OP from JCPenney is right. They are lost now.
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Post by danalz on Dec 5, 2016 0:34:15 GMT
I hate shopping at JCPenney. The shoe department is a cluttered mess of boxes, the checkout lines are long and it takes forever to check out. Customer service is a lost art. The only reason I go there is to get my son's hair cut.
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Post by Merge on Dec 5, 2016 0:36:36 GMT
Honestly, the only thing we go into Penney's for these days is the little Sephora in there because it's easier than driving to the mall. The lines are always long, service is slow, the store is trashed. Sometimes I buy something from them online when they're having a good sale, but the stores themselves are a disaster.
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Post by **GypsyGirl** on Dec 5, 2016 0:49:26 GMT
It's not just Penney's though. I've given up on shopping at Macy's because the racks are disorganized, the departments and dressing rooms are trashed. Finding a salesperson to ring up the sales is nearly impossible, so forget even finding someone to help answer questions, find another size, etc. Too many stores, in an effort to cut costs, have cut into the very things that make them different from online sales.
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Post by cindyupnorth on Dec 5, 2016 0:55:09 GMT
I was just at JCPs this wkend! and it was wonderful! It was clean and organized. They had plenty of registers open, and helpful clerks that helped me find a better discount at checkout! I say thumbs up!! I had stopped going there when they stopped sending coupons in the mail. Now I'm going back!
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MsKnit
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Post by MsKnit on Dec 5, 2016 1:02:15 GMT
My husband buys his jeans there when they are like $17. Otherwise, it's a pass through.
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Post by epeanymous on Dec 5, 2016 1:10:07 GMT
I think the problem is that people say they want good service, sturdy and reliable products, etc., but they vote with their wallets and their wallets want cheap. It amazes me that clothing prices often are the same as those I remember in the 1980s. The cycle of endless sales everywhere also makes people feel like chumps for paying the sticker price -- I feel like I am a pretty rational person, but for sure, if I shop somewhere that I know has a zillion sales and discounts and membership rebates, etc., I will sometimes pass something up that I want when it seems to be full price because I feel like the store is taking advantage of me. It is totally and completely irrational. Anyhow, it's part of why I hate shopping, period. And why I picked a look in 1998 and stick with it  . |
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mimima
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Post by mimima on Dec 5, 2016 1:10:33 GMT
I once went to Penneys, looked through the dresses, found one, tried it on, needed another size, tried that one on and the first sales clerk I saw was the cashier.
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Post by melanell on Dec 5, 2016 1:11:46 GMT
You know, there's really a point there. I worked retail in my early 20s and the sales were so frantic that it was very difficult to do anything other than check-out an endless line of customers. We were never staffed enough to have people who could devote themselves to the singular tasks of helping customers or cleaning things up. And so, especially during the holidays, the stores would be wrecked by the end of the sale, and customers who needed special attention had to wait exceedingly long times or else we'd have to leave a line of people waiting to check out to go help them.
Then after the sale, we'd return everything to its "regular price" for only one or two days, and we'd use those days to clean, clean, clean. Any customers who came in were advised to come back the next day, when the products they wanted would be "on sale"---again. It was ridiculous. Yet, for a few regular customers, it worked. Because they figured out how to work the system. They would come in the day before an advertised sale. They could have our full attention as we helped them find everything they wanted. We'd put it all on hold, and they'd come in the next day and buy it "on sale", with coupons, and store charge savings, etc.
So on the days with no "sales", which were very few and far between, we'd make very little sales. Which of course led the powers that be to create even more sales.
And yet, here in the mid-atlantic states, we do have a grocery chain, Wegmans, that does not run advertised sales. There is no weekly ad in the Sunday or mid-week paper for them like everyone else has. They used to have them, but then they stopped. They announced that they would have regular low prices on some items and occasional mark-downs in store, but that they were stopping the weekly ads.
And the store is consistently busy. They haven't died a slow death due to lack of sales. Now, that's a grocery store, a totally different animal than a department store, but yet they are still competing against Walmart, Sam's Club, Costco, Target, and probably a dozen different grocery stores and they hold their own. But they are consistently ranked high up in the list of best grocery stores. They still accept coupons and even mail out their own, but the weekly sales have stopped.
And for my family, we shop there far more now than we did when they ran a weekly ad. So there is a way to survive without advertised sales. But I don't know what the secret is, or how to make it work for your basic mall department store.
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Post by crazy4scraps on Dec 5, 2016 1:16:42 GMT
I think the last time I shopped there was when I was pregnant with DD and looking for petite maternity clothes. It was a near total bust. I ended up buying a couple zip front hoodies in the regular section of the store and I think that was it. I couldn't find anything that I liked or that fit. Most of the stores in that category pretty much suck in terms of regular price, selection and service (JCP, Herberger's, Kohl's, etc.), so if I can get what I want at Kohl's with a really good sale or at Herberger's outlet store that's where I'll go. It's not like any of them are going to win me over with their neat and clean stores or stellar customer service so it all comes down to price and having the stuff in stock that I want to buy.
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Post by crazy4scraps on Dec 5, 2016 1:32:01 GMT
I think the problem is that people say they want good service, sturdy and reliable products, etc., but they vote with their wallets and their wallets want cheap. It amazes me that clothing prices often are the same as those I remember in the 1980s. The cycle of endless sales everywhere also makes people feel like chumps for paying the sticker price -- I feel like I am a pretty rational person, but for sure, if I shop somewhere that I know has a zillion sales and discounts and membership rebates, etc., I will sometimes pass something up that I want when it seems to be full price because I feel like the store is taking advantage of me. It is totally and completely irrational. Anyhow, it's part of why I hate shopping, period. And why I picked a look in 1998 and stick with it . I think in general you're right. But I for one *AM* willing to pay somewhat more for better service or better quality. The problem is no one provides it anymore. The boutique type stores have the service, but they only carry styles that are too upscale for my taste and lifestyle (plus they're few and far between). The upscale department stores like Macy's and Nordstrom's are out of my price range unless the stuff is on last ditch clearance, which means there isn't much selection. I can't afford to spend $200 on one pair of pants or $30 for a basic t-shirt. Not happening. I hate buying cheaply made, throwaway clothing no matter how inexpensive it is. |
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ellen
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Post by ellen on Dec 5, 2016 1:49:14 GMT
My local Penney's store is pretty decent. I live in an area where local shopping is terrible. I feel fortunate that our Penney's store has stayed open. Today I stopped in and bought two pairs of gloves and a shirt for for my daughter. A couple weeks ago I was there and bought new pillows and towels.
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PaperAngel
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Post by PaperAngel on Dec 5, 2016 2:07:55 GMT
I didn't know JCP was still in business; of course, I avoid malls like the plague.  |
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trollie
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Post by trollie on Dec 5, 2016 2:09:48 GMT
I was just in a Sears the other day and it was awful. No sales help and it looked like a really crappy Walmart. Did not make me want to return.
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used2scrap
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Post by used2scrap on Dec 5, 2016 2:14:17 GMT
I was excited for them when they announced "no more sales, just low prices" a few years back. Followed by a very confusing calendar of which days the prices were low, and other days lower, and other days lowest. So yeah, still sales, only much more confusing to follow. I think the real complaint here is people's wages aren't keeping up with the need for rising profits, hence consumers are bargain driven.
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blue tulip
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Post by blue tulip on Dec 5, 2016 2:18:36 GMT
I love Penney's! They have the very softest fleece lounge pants for boys and men, I always get them for Christmas Eve presents. And my boys love their athletic fleece and workout type clothes. I hope they don't away.  |
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Post by lisae on Dec 5, 2016 2:26:00 GMT
About the only thing I go to department stores for is makeup and maybe shoes, if there is a sale. I hate shopping for clothes in department stores as there is so much to go through and I don't know what brands fit me. I have certain retailers like Talbots where I know the clothes fit me and I can easily browse online before going to the store.
Department stores aren't just cluttered inside, their websites are cluttered with too much merchandise. Shopping has changed for every type of product. If a retailer can't give you a good shopping experience from your living room sofa, they will lose out.
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Post by ~Sherri~ on Dec 5, 2016 2:36:53 GMT
Our JCPenney is a fairly nice store. The cash registers are not in convenient spots anymore but they do have several people running them. I like the coupon and sales, especially for my grand kids. They are growing like weeds and I hate to spend a lot on clothes that they out grow so quickly. My DGS needs a new coat for Christmas. I found him a very nice coat that was on sale for $27 and used a coupon on my phone for $10 off, making the $70 coat less than $20. I ordered fleece jammies for myself and with discounts, two pair only cost $13. Our Sears store is like a ghost town, very few staff and fewer customers.
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YooHoot
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Post by YooHoot on Dec 5, 2016 2:42:35 GMT
Our JCP is great. It's full and sales are decent...always coupons and rewards to use.
I think a lot of retail has gone down hill because most stores don't pay by commission anymore. Now it's more of a "I don't give a shit if you buy it or not...I'll make the same money either way". So there's no point in working for that sale for salespeople.
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pudgygroundhog
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Post by pudgygroundhog on Dec 5, 2016 2:48:35 GMT
I was just in a Sears the other day and it was awful. No sales help and it looked like a really crappy Walmart. Did not make me want to return. The only reason I go to Sears once in awhile is that ours has a fantastic Lands End swimwear section. And I like the Lands End dresses too. |
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scrappinghappy
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Post by scrappinghappy on Dec 5, 2016 2:51:51 GMT
It's not just Penney's though. I've given up on shopping at Macy's because the racks are disorganized, the departments and dressing rooms are trashed. Finding a salesperson to ring up the sales is nearly impossible, so forget even finding someone to help answer questions, find another size, etc. Too many stores, in an effort to cut costs, have cut into the very things that make them different from online sales. Macy's has the most amazing personal shoppers, as does Nordstroms. I simply call ahead, tell them what I want, arrive at their office and they direct me to my own, huge, dressing room where everything is hung up and waiting for me to try on and choose. No wading through racks and racks of disorganized mess. I'm usually in and out in an hour or less. And they often have an extra coupon for me to. If something I love is too pricey, they call me when it goes on sale. Love the personal shoppers. |
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moodyblue
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Post by moodyblue on Dec 5, 2016 3:01:09 GMT
I go into one of our JCPenney stores to visit the Sephora inside it. I really hadn't bought much from Penney's for many years, but occasionally went there looking for housewares. However, in the last couple years, I've done a little more shopping there - jeans for my husband, a winter coat for him, things like that. Then I started looking at the plus size women's clothing and I have gotten several things for myself. They have some nice comfortable leggings that I wear around the house. I recently bought a couple of long sweaters and a fleece zip up jacket that fits better than others I've tried on.
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Post by Zee on Dec 5, 2016 3:08:50 GMT
I once went to Penneys, looked through the dresses, found one, tried it on, needed another size, tried that one on and the first sales clerk I saw was the cashier. Sounds heavenly |
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Post by chaosisapony on Dec 5, 2016 3:14:37 GMT
If I want to stay local and buy clothing there are two choices: JCPenney and Kohls. I hate Kohls and generally won't go in their store. But Penney's... it just makes me sad as it used to be such a nice store.
Simply put the store is a mess. The employees are nice but they are the typical overworked and under paid retail employee. The store is always in a state of disarray regardless of if there is a sale going on or not. I was in the fitting room a few weeks ago and it was just gross. In desperate need of paint, new carpet, anything would help really. Of course there was the ever present dirty feet smell that this particular Penney's is afflicted with. Has management not heard of Febreze? About six months ago they remodeled the center of the store and put in a Sephora. That Sephora is beautiful and brightly lit and it really makes it apparent how neglected the rest of the store really is.
I think a previous poster really hit the nail on the head with wages not going up with the cost of goods. It forces people to become bargain shoppers when they'd rather not be.
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Post by angel97701 on Dec 5, 2016 3:23:51 GMT
I worked retail in my early twenties and customer service was important . . . but that was 30 years ago! Yikes!
Today we went shopping at Macy's and had to buy DH a suit for a business meeting. Mind you, I've NEVER seen DH in a suit. He wore a Mandarin collar tux for our wedding. For our court date to adopt our boys he wore a white dress shirt, tie, and dress slacks. Other than that I've never seen him in anything but khakis and button down shirts! All that to say I had no clue what size he needed.
We asked a clerk for some assistance and she went out of her way to help us get the right fit on his suit coat, measured his dress shirt size, and unpinned several shirts so he could find he one that felt the best. She suggested which brand of shirt for him to consider because of the cut and fit. DH was a wrestler and has a big chest but narrow hips and athletic build. She also served a bit as a fashion consultant as I liked one style of shirt over another and she agreed that it was more dressy. DH will look great for his overseas business meeting. She was super helpful and I am thankful she stepped up and assisted us in the process. I plan on writing a note to her store manager commending her for her excellent customer service!
Thought peas would appreciate a good customer service story!
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Post by lisacharlotte on Dec 5, 2016 4:07:01 GMT
I worked at JCP Hq when Questrom was CEO. I kept binders full of the daily/weekly ads. They were copious. I loved that job and worked on a great team in product development. Also, the pay was above average.
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Post by crazy4scraps on Dec 5, 2016 4:29:21 GMT
If I want to stay local and buy clothing there are two choices: JCPenney and Kohls. I hate Kohls and generally won't go in their store. But Penney's... it just makes me sad as it used to be such a nice store. Simply put the store is a mess. The employees are nice but they are the typical overworked and under paid retail employee. The store is always in a state of disarray regardless of if there is a sale going on or not. I was in the fitting room a few weeks ago and it was just gross. In desperate need of paint, new carpet, anything would help really. Of course there was the ever present dirty feet smell that this particular Penney's is afflicted with. Has management not heard of Febreze? About six months ago they remodeled the center of the store and put in a Sephora. That Sephora is beautiful and brightly lit and it really makes it apparent how neglected the rest of the store really is. I think a previous poster really hit the nail on the head with wages not going up with the cost of goods. It forces people to become bargain shoppers when they'd rather not be. I think part of it too is the proliferation of discount superstores. I hate to always be dogging on Walmart but I believe they probably have contributed more to creating that mindset than any other single retailer simply because as a corporation they are so big and they are EVERY.WHERE. Even when costs on everything are going up, they are arm twisting their vendors to sell for lower, lower, lower, and often the only way they can achieve that is to cheapen the quality, lower the value and/or move factories overseas where people are being paid pennies to make the stuff. Walmart turns around and sells it really cheap and still make money because they in turn offer zero service. So when the average person shops there, they eventually become conditioned to that and come to expect it pretty much everywhere they shop. It doesn't help that the brands people used to associate with quality products have been cheapened so much (and that people couldn't easily distinguish between the premium higher priced lines some stores still sold vs. the cheap versions sold by discounters), people were no longer willing to pay any more than the discount price for ANY of it. Take Levi's jeans for example. Back in the day, you could only buy Levi's from mid-range to upscale department stores and you couldn't buy them for less than $35-50 (back when that was a lot for jeans). The fabric was heavy weight, 100% cotton denim that wore well and lasted forever. But once they started doing business with Walmart in the early 2000's they had to retool the entire process to develop a product line that would fit Walmart's price point. That retooling resulted in every product line across the board to be dragged down, even the premium lines sold at the higher end stores. This article from dailykos.com explains it very well. link to articleLevi's isn't the only brand that this has happened to, and once people feel like they can't trust a brand anymore they are no longer willing to pay premium prices for it anywhere. |
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Post by mztfied on Dec 5, 2016 4:33:31 GMT
I was in Penny's today and it was a ghost town. I was amazed.
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Post by workingclassdog on Dec 5, 2016 15:36:32 GMT
I love our Penny's. It's a free standing store about 5 minutes from me (plus Kohls). It's a fairly new store...about five years old and just got a remodel a few months ago. They are now selling large appliances. I haven't gone back to that area just because I am not in the market. But our store is generally always VERY clean and kept up. There are times when huge clearance sales are going on, it gets a little messy or around Christmas time.
I love the store. I would say the only gripe I have sometimes it seems like their inventory is low. I can go into the woman's department and there are huge isles between racks of clothes. I don't like it all jammed in there like Kohl's but this is on the other side of the spectrum.
I worked at Penny's about 20 years ago and funny thing is, the same rumor was they were going out of business. Any day now, they were shutting the doors. I hope the rumors continue and the stores stay open!!!
Another tidbit.. my mom's Penny's in her ity bity town, is one of those strip mall stores they used to have. One floor, probably the size of a Ross or Michael's... It is SOOOOO tiny and old.
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