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Post by Darcy Collins on Aug 28, 2017 18:49:22 GMT
I'm sorry OP, you sound so miserable! You don't really talk a lot about consequences in the your post. There's a lot about your actions and how she finds them unreasonable. What HAVE your tried? Maybe some of the been there done that mom's can offer additional tools. I for one would never pay for a phone that I did not have access to - that's just crazy. You should absolutely be able to turn off her data when she exceeds it, as well as to expect her to reimburse your for overage charges - or no phone. What were the consequences when she swore at you? Does she have a currency?
I'm lucky that both my kids have very strong currencies, I imagine things are infinitely more difficult when you have a child who just doesn't care about anything.
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Post by cookiemum on Aug 28, 2017 21:43:40 GMT
Thank you everyone for your feedback; it's very much appreciated. Believe me, most of the questions that were asked, we've addressed, I just don't know where to go from here.
What I wrote last night was written in the heat of the moment. Did I escalate something with her that in the long run really isn't a big deal? Absolutely. I'm not making excuses or rationalising. I've been sick for the last week, my defences are down and my normal reactions just didn't happen and I flew off the handle.
I'll try to address all the questions so if I miss something, I apologise.
1. Her father is very much in this with me and we are on the same page. I am the clear disciplinarian; always have been. I never tolerated any disrespect when they were toddlers etc and there were consequences that we followed through on. Both of my girls have always been "high spirited", strong-willed, independent, you name it going back to the toddler years.
2. To clarify, I've not been told to F-off for over a year at least. When that happened, she lost her phone, wasn't allowed to go out etc. She lost all privileges.
3. Laundry - that's an easy one. I'll admit I've threatened to not wash it and have them do their own, but it's not happened. I will put that one into action.
4. Rooms - I've never cleaned either of their rooms. They are expected to keep them tidy especially if they want to go out and do things. Not really with the older one now because it's not an issue but with the younger one, you want to go out, you need to make sure these few things are done. They arent? You aren't going out. Simple.
5. When I'm getting yelled or screamed at or whatever, I refuse to engage - 99% of the time. I've said I will talk when you can speak to me respectfully and we can have a discussion. Until that happens, not talking to you and I will walk away. Unfortunately I'm very good at the silent treatment and cold shoulder.
6. Surprisingly enough, she's always had a lovely group of friends. They aren't in the slightest bit entitled so again, I'm not sure where it's all coming from. She was at a comprehensive girls' catholic school. Yes there were some wealthy kids but there were also girls there who's parents were scraping together every penny they could to send their girls there. To me it offered a far more realistic view of life than a school that's $25K/yr. She always called us cheap for not sending her to one of the private schools and what I said was if you think the girls at your school are snobs, you'd really hate one of the expensive schools.
7. I've always been about the currency, even when they were little. Right now it's the phone and computer and I have no problem using them. Also going out with her friends. There's no mollycoddling happening here and both know that they are not special snowflakes. I swear my gravestone is going to say, "tell it to some one who cares" & "it's not just about you". I'll back them when necessary but I refuse to fight their battles and don't give in to every whim which makes things very difficult - it always has. It would make life easier in the short term, but as we all know, definitely not in the long run.
8. Most of this started when she hit puberty so it could be hormones which I should probably check out with the GP. I know she's been under a lot of stress with the new school etc but I refuse to be a punching bag for my child. She's not rude to anyone outside the immediate family and no one outside the home would have any idea she acts like this. Aside from her friends I suppose. Luckily they know us and know what we're like because I can only imagine the things she says about us.
I'm sure there are things I've missed. I have to get ready for work and will try to come back later today.
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Post by Really Red on Aug 28, 2017 22:51:27 GMT
I don't have teens (yet), but I often peek into these threads to see what I'm in for and to gain insight. But this comment has me curious. What do you mean? Like make sure you're not FB friends? Or make sure tgey can't log into your accounts? And most importantly, why is this important? Imagine you are a teenage girl, going through the angsts and travails of hormonal puberty and you read about yourself on a public message board. And how your mother doesn't like you. Don't get me wrong here. Sometimes, I think it can be very helpful to correct a child and tell them that you do not like their behavior, or even, possibly, that you do not like someone when they engage in such terrible behavior no matter how much you still love them. But, I believe in doing that one-on-one with the child. Private conversations are different. You can be freer with what you say in private than you should be in public. This seems to me to be a private conversation occurring in public. And because it is in public, the chances of this teen girl reading or hearing about it go up significantly and the problems between mother/parents and this teen girl could become dramatically worse. If I understand you correctly, you're saying that OP shouldn't be writing down her problems here. I disagree. It's highly doubtful that her daughter will find it here and if she does, what then? Will she be surprised? Maybe it would be the virtual slap in the face she needs. More likely, however, is that OP is venting, upset and is doing her very best as a parent in trying to find solutions to help her child. There are a lot of helpful posts here and good ideas for her to get started. Should she have kept everything to herself in the unlikely event her child reads this post and it gets what? worse? I don't think so. I think she's doing the right thing coming here and trying her best to make things better. I say good for her to open up with something difficult to share. We should all be supporting that as she is trying her very best. |
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peaname
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Post by peaname on Aug 28, 2017 22:58:03 GMT
I'm sorry that your vent made you feel like you had to defend your parenting. You are not responsible for her behavior. It's hard. Take care care of yourself right now.
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Deleted
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May 19, 2024 18:50:20 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2017 1:54:50 GMT
8. Most of this started when she hit puberty so it could be hormones which I should probably check out with the GP. I know she's been under a lot of stress with the new school etc but I refuse to be a punching bag for my child. She's not rude to anyone outside the immediate family and no one outside the home would have any idea she acts like this. Aside from her friends I suppose. Luckily they know us and know what we're like because I can only imagine the things she says about us. Does she have Autism or any sensory disorders, anxiety, ocd, even add or adhd? ODD? I ask because my teen dd (14) is like you described above. I am her "punching bag" because home and mom are her safe place. She has Aspergers, ocd, anxiety, SPD APD VPD. She deals with a lot of sensory input and has to let it out. When she is on her period it is hell. After yyeeaarrss of therapies the other 3-4 weeks are better now. She knows how to safely and respectfully deal with all the input, anxiety, ocd, etc. She has horrible periods. Super super super heavy and long. We see Gyn in Oct to get on the pill. We pray it helps. Hugs. Just lots of hugs. |
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Post by hop2 on Aug 29, 2017 2:32:51 GMT
Thank you everyone for your feedback; it's very much appreciated. Believe me, most of the questions that were asked, we've addressed, I just don't know where to go from here. What I wrote last night was written in the heat of the moment. Did I escalate something with her that in the long run really isn't a big deal? Absolutely. I'm not making excuses or rationalising. I've been sick for the last week, my defences are down and my normal reactions just didn't happen and I flew off the handle. I'll try to address all the questions so if I miss something, I apologise. 1. Her father is very much in this with me and we are on the same page. I am the clear disciplinarian; always have been. I never tolerated any disrespect when they were toddlers etc and there were consequences that we followed through on. Both of my girls have always been "high spirited", strong-willed, independent, you name it going back to the toddler years. 2. To clarify, I've not been told to F-off for over a year at least. When that happened, she lost her phone, wasn't allowed to go out etc. She lost all privileges. 3. Laundry - that's an easy one. I'll admit I've threatened to not wash it and have them do their own, but it's not happened. I will put that one into action. 4. Rooms - I've never cleaned either of their rooms. They are expected to keep them tidy especially if they want to go out and do things. Not really with the older one now because it's not an issue but with the younger one, you want to go out, you need to make sure these few things are done. They arent? You aren't going out. Simple. 5. When I'm getting yelled or screamed at or whatever, I refuse to engage - 99% of the time. I've said I will talk when you can speak to me respectfully and we can have a discussion. Until that happens, not talking to you and I will walk away. Unfortunately I'm very good at the silent treatment and cold shoulder. 6. Surprisingly enough, she's always had a lovely group of friends. They aren't in the slightest bit entitled so again, I'm not sure where it's all coming from. She was at a comprehensive girls' catholic school. Yes there were some wealthy kids but there were also girls there who's parents were scraping together every penny they could to send their girls there. To me it offered a far more realistic view of life than a school that's $25K/yr. She always called us cheap for not sending her to one of the private schools and what I said was if you think the girls at your school are snobs, you'd really hate one of the expensive schools. 7. I've always been about the currency, even when they were little. Right now it's the phone and computer and I have no problem using them. Also going out with her friends. There's no mollycoddling happening here and both know that they are not special snowflakes. I swear my gravestone is going to say, "tell it to some one who cares" & "it's not just about you". I'll back them when necessary but I refuse to fight their battles and don't give in to every whim which makes things very difficult - it always has. It would make life easier in the short term, but as we all know, definitely not in the long run. 8. Most of this started when she hit puberty so it could be hormones which I should probably check out with the GP. I know she's been under a lot of stress with the new school etc but I refuse to be a punching bag for my child. She's not rude to anyone outside the immediate family and no one outside the home would have any idea she acts like this. Aside from her friends I suppose. Luckily they know us and know what we're like because I can only imagine the things she says about us. I'm sure there are things I've missed. I have to get ready for work and will try to come back later today. Reading the book 'yes your teenager is crazy ( loving your kid without losing your mind)' by Michael Bradley was an eye opener for me. It explained a lot, which helped me to understand them more. Your not crazy, or lazy or a bad parent. You are not alone. Vent away. Mine went to 2 different counselors from 8th grade until junior year when she began to reclaim her decency. So there is hope. |
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Post by kernriver on Aug 29, 2017 2:34:26 GMT
Oh, hon. My son is an asshole. A more beautiful child you have never seen but the teen years hit him hard. That's when he turned into an asshole (although truth be told, there were signs before that). He has called me a fucking cunt at least a thousand times. But my love for him is at a molecular level. Its in my dna to love him unconditionally no matter what. But if we weren't related, we wouldnt even be friends.
life got much much better when we moved him out. We are all much happier and he and I are working on having an adult relationship. There have been times of backsliding, but overall its 98% better than it was 6 months ago.
good look to you. Do what you have to to make it through.
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Post by cookiemum on Aug 29, 2017 2:41:38 GMT
Imagine you are a teenage girl, going through the angsts and travails of hormonal puberty and you read about yourself on a public message board. And how your mother doesn't like you. Don't get me wrong here. Sometimes, I think it can be very helpful to correct a child and tell them that you do not like their behavior, or even, possibly, that you do not like someone when they engage in such terrible behavior no matter how much you still love them. But, I believe in doing that one-on-one with the child. Private conversations are different. You can be freer with what you say in private than you should be in public. This seems to me to be a private conversation occurring in public. And because it is in public, the chances of this teen girl reading or hearing about it go up significantly and the problems between mother/parents and this teen girl could become dramatically worse. If I understand you correctly, you're saying that OP shouldn't be writing down her problems here. I disagree. It's highly doubtful that her daughter will find it here and if she does, what then? Will she be surprised? Maybe it would be the virtual slap in the face she needs. More likely, however, is that OP is venting, upset and is doing her very best as a parent in trying to find solutions to help her child. There are a lot of helpful posts here and good ideas for her to get started. Should she have kept everything to herself in the unlikely event her child reads this post and it gets what? worse? I don't think so. I think she's doing the right thing coming here and trying her best to make things better. I say good for her to open up with something difficult to share. We should all be supporting that as she is trying her very best. She has no idea this message board even exists. Aside from giving my city I've got no other identifying information on here. I've read far more with more revealing details and if she finds it well. So be it. I'll own it. |
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Post by cookiemum on Aug 29, 2017 2:43:39 GMT
8. Most of this started when she hit puberty so it could be hormones which I should probably check out with the GP. I know she's been under a lot of stress with the new school etc but I refuse to be a punching bag for my child. She's not rude to anyone outside the immediate family and no one outside the home would have any idea she acts like this. Aside from her friends I suppose. Luckily they know us and know what we're like because I can only imagine the things she says about us. Does she have Autism or any sensory disorders, anxiety, ocd, even add or adhd? ODD? I ask because my teen dd (14) is like you described above. I am her "punching bag" because home and mom are her safe place. She has Aspergers, ocd, anxiety, SPD APD VPD. She deals with a lot of sensory input and has to let it out. When she is on her period it is hell. After yyeeaarrss of therapies the other 3-4 weeks are better now. She knows how to safely and respectfully deal with all the input, anxiety, ocd, etc. She has horrible periods. Super super super heavy and long. We see Gyn in Oct to get on the pill. We pray it helps. Hugs. Just lots of hugs. Good question. No, there's no spectrum disorders or ADD. I do at times wonder about ODD. |
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Post by cookiemum on Aug 29, 2017 2:48:55 GMT
I do think the best thing for her would be to go away to college. She'd then realise just how good she's got it - or I could hope so. Most kids in Australia that live in a major metropolitan area go to Uni in their city and live at home. My oldest wants to go away and we are all for her having that experience since we've had it ourselves. At this point I'd be hard pressed to pay for my youngest to live away from home when she feels it's "owed" to her.
As someone else pointed out, I owe her food, clothing, shelter and love. Everything else is extra and is earned rather than an automatic entitlement.
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anniebygaslight
Drama Llama
I'd love a cup of tea. #1966
Posts: 7,394
Location: Third Rock from the sun.
Jun 28, 2014 14:08:19 GMT
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Post by anniebygaslight on Aug 29, 2017 6:33:51 GMT
Another thing that many here are not considering is that what works for one kid will not necessarily work for a very independent determined kid with no real "currency". Always the hardasses show up and start taking about taking off doors, etc but I can guarantee that would have only made my son worse. Probably would have worked fine on DD. You have to consider the individual. Anyway, they're both a real pleasure now at ages 23 & 19. So don't give up. But definitely stop doing her laundry, that's insane. Completely agree. That sort of reaction/action would have broken one of my DDs as it would have been like using a sledgehammer to crack a nut. I'm sure it's justified and works in some cases but not necessarily all or even most. I also agree. No laundry and removal of priveleges. No lifts, no phone, no spending money, no friends round. Oh, and everything not tidied away by the time I say will be put in black bags and taken to the tip. This last one works a treat. You only have to do it once. |
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Post by gar on Aug 29, 2017 7:40:53 GMT
cookiemum, sounds like you're already doing most of the things suggested here so I think it's just a case of plugging away through the teen years  They can be tough so few free to come and vent when necessary!
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Post by AussieMeg on Aug 29, 2017 8:24:06 GMT
cookiemum what can I say? I feel for you, what you are going through with your daughter sounds absolutely horrendous. I can see a lot of similarities with what I am starting to see from my 12yo son and I am terrified that if I don't put a stop to it now, our relationship is going to completely deteriorate. I also want to say that I know what you mean when you say you love her but don't really like her - last night after an argument with my son I was feeling exactly how you described. You have got some good advice here, so I just want to send some good thoughts your way. I am sure that you will all come through this (relatively) unscathed, and she will not be a self absorbed little cow forever. "geez, it's only data, OMG calm down". Want me to calm down, start making better choices. Ah, the old "OMG calm down mum" line.... we all know how well that works don't we? I get that from my son all the freaking time. With the bedroom, close the door and forget that battle. My room was horrendous as a teen and my Mum for years was on my case about it and it didn't make a jot of difference. I eventually worked out that if my friends were coming around I didn't want them to see it that way and started keeping it tidier. Laundry, easy - if it isn't in the basket where it should be, don't even ask. She'll work it out eventually. If she say something or gets angry about not having clean clothes, just calmly say that they weren't in the basket and she doesn't want you to nag, you didn't say anything. My dd started doing her own at about 13 so there is no reason why yours can't. Have you read any of Michael Carr-Gregg's books. I find him slightly preachy however he does have really good advice about entitled teens. Princess Bitchface Syndrome is very good and you will probably read it and think that it has been written about your dd. I agree with what Allie has written about the bedroom. This definitely falls into the "pick your battles" territory. Allie - a friend of mine gave me the Princess Bitchface Syndrome book for my 40th birthday to prepare me for the teenage years (DD was 10 at the time)! Luckily we got through the teenage years without too many problems with her. I wonder if there is a male equivalent book - Prince Shit Head Syndrome perhaps?
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AllieC
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by AllieC on Aug 29, 2017 8:44:28 GMT
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Post by heltr on Aug 29, 2017 8:50:29 GMT
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AllieC
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by AllieC on Aug 29, 2017 10:55:09 GMT
Michael Carr-Greg is a very well known psychologist and parenting expert in Australia. He has written a number of very good books. I don't always agree with all his advice but generally he has great sensible advice.
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Post by Jockscrap on Aug 30, 2017 12:52:02 GMT
I haven't read all the replies yet in detail, but my thoughts are
1) Forget the room completely. Close the door, and let it become a disgusting, stinking mess. But no friends can go there. I also wouldn't bother washing anything that wasn't in the wash basket, but in my case I had to make an exception to this to make sure there was school uniform clean or that would be the excuse to avoid school.
2) I don't cook meals and do favours for folk who swear at me. If I was spoken to disrespectfully, the offender was not called downstairs for tea, no plate was made up for them, if there was something left of the meal they could plate up and heat the leftovers themselves. If I didn't make enough, they could eat whatever they could find - didn't care.
3) I'd be changing the mobile plan now if there was any possible way to do so.
Good luck. This is a tough time, but the vast majority of kids just grow up and come out the other side as proper humans. Definitely choose your battles. I know my biggest mistakes were not doing so. If they aren't doing truly dangerous stuff like drunk driving or drugs where outside intervention and professional help might be needed, sometimes all you can do with obnoxious teens is get them through these years in one piece. I don't think there are many folk who have parented teens who haven't said at one time that they love their teen to the depth of their soul, but can't stand the sight of them.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 30, 2017 13:07:03 GMT
Does she have Autism or any sensory disorders, anxiety, ocd, even add or adhd? ODD? I ask because my teen dd (14) is like you described above. I am her "punching bag" because home and mom are her safe place. She has Aspergers, ocd, anxiety, SPD APD VPD. She deals with a lot of sensory input and has to let it out. When she is on her period it is hell. After yyeeaarrss of therapies the other 3-4 weeks are better now. She knows how to safely and respectfully deal with all the input, anxiety, ocd, etc. She has horrible periods. Super super super heavy and long. We see Gyn in Oct to get on the pill. We pray it helps. Hugs. Just lots of hugs. Good question. No, there's no spectrum disorders or ADD. I do at times wonder about ODD. I would look into see a psychologist or therapist trained to help those with ODD. A friends son was diagnosed with ODD and goes to a special therapy group for pre teens and sees a special therapist for specific behavior modification therapy for his ODD. It has made a huge difference. |
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Post by jumperhop on Aug 30, 2017 15:52:55 GMT
I have teens and I get it. My only advice is to love, love, love and love her some more.
Jen
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Post by Zee on Aug 30, 2017 16:20:50 GMT
If you think part of the problem is ODD, I really think you'd have better luck using a partnership approach rather than a dictatorship. I'm not calling you a dictator in particular, but all the "my house my rules everything you have in the world is by my grace and you work for it" I see here only makes that kind of kid worse in my limited experience, which consists of two very different types of kids.
I do like the idea of setting up things to do that are neutral and fun, if you can get her interested.
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They can be tough so few free to come and vent when necessary! 
