Deleted
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May 4, 2024 3:33:43 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2019 15:59:03 GMT
@stamptastic She may have earned it, but that doesn't change the fact she is privileged. Is there something wrong with that?
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Deleted
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May 4, 2024 3:33:43 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2019 16:13:53 GMT
@stamptastic She may have earned it, but that doesn't change the fact she is privileged. Is there something wrong with that? your answer to the fact that she was privileged was that she earned it. I was just pointing out that doesn't deny the point mom was making. No matter the circumstances, Ali is privileged.
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Deleted
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May 4, 2024 3:33:43 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2019 16:23:16 GMT
Is there something wrong with that? your answer to the fact that she was privileged was that she earned it. I was just pointing out that doesn't deny the point mom was making. No matter the circumstances, Ali is privileged. By most of the world’s standards, we all are. 🤷🏼♀️
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sneakylatina
Full Member
Posts: 107
Dec 28, 2018 5:16:09 GMT
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Post by sneakylatina on Dec 31, 2019 17:02:56 GMT
Hey, has Ali shared her OLW yet anywhere? She usually does by now.
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Post by sleepingbooty on Dec 31, 2019 17:15:55 GMT
your answer to the fact that she was privileged was that she earned it. I was just pointing out that doesn't deny the point mom was making. No matter the circumstances, Ali is privileged. By most of the world’s standards, we all are. 🤷🏼♀️ It's not the fact of being privileged that was discussed, it was the talk from the privileged POV. sneakylatina Ali has shared it on social media and it's 'less' for 2020.
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julie5
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,611
Jul 11, 2018 15:20:45 GMT
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Post by julie5 on Dec 31, 2019 18:03:49 GMT
To be fair, Ali was only able to make her “hobby” into a business was because she was already privileged by marrying an educated man and having his support through the divorce. And an education of her own.
I found myself divorced at 30 after being a stay at home mom while my husband got the education and he had the money to lock me out of everything when I left. I’m privileged now only because of my current husband. Lucky for me he believes we both earn by me helping him with the business. If left to my own devices, I would certainly not be privileged and I never forget that.
Those stupid self help memes do nothing when you’re living out of your car.
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Post by hop2 on Dec 31, 2019 18:49:41 GMT
Hey, has Ali shared her OLW yet anywhere? She usually does by now. I saw a post about ‘less’
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Post by teacherlisa on Dec 31, 2019 19:03:13 GMT
I have a slightly different take on this "its ok to have no idea what's next" thing. I want to start out saying I do not mean any disrespect for anyone who's view is different from mine. I have been on both sides of the privilege coin, although I have always slept inside I have had times in my life where I did not make a decision because of not knowing how said decision would turn out. Anxiety, analysis paralysis, whatever you want to call it had me so wound up, and instead of "being brave" or "going for it" I just kept plodding along not making a decision. In hindsight, I wish I had been more brave, or made better choices. I never stopped working hard, and I doubt that Ali is going to stop working/moving forward. Even in the most dire of situations, the sun is coming up tomorrow. Life is moving, what is going to happen, is going to happen. Worrying or not taking a step at all is not going to help.
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pancakes
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,993
Feb 4, 2015 6:49:53 GMT
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Post by pancakes on Dec 31, 2019 19:06:41 GMT
Although I agree that AE is coming from a place of privilege (and I think many of us do, in comparison to a lot of folks), I don't understand why there are so many negative comments about AE's post.
She does a lot of stuff I am not a big fan of, but people speak from their own experience. And I don't think she's doing it to be braggy or push her privilege in anyone's face.
But based on some of the comments, it seems like we're expecting her to post things that are only applicable and mindful of everyone from every walk of life.
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Post by lisacharlotte on Dec 31, 2019 19:09:05 GMT
Yes she’s privileged and the majority of her customers are privileged and her social media messages are geared toward those privileged customers. I’m not sure I understand the point of pointing out her privilege. Is it to say she can’t publicly mention she’s unsure where she’s going next because she’s privileged?
I guess it feels little like telling someone who is complaining about a broken leg, “well, at least you’re not dying if cancer” as if being privileged denies you the right to not be happy and sure of where you’re going in life.
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Deleted
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May 4, 2024 3:33:43 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2019 20:16:38 GMT
To be fair, Ali was only able to make her “hobby” into a business was because she was already privileged by marrying an educated man and having his support through the divorce. And an education of her own. I found myself divorced at 30 after being a stay at home mom while my husband got the education and he had the money to lock me out of everything when I left. I’m privileged now only because of my current husband. Lucky for me he believes we both earn by me helping him with the business. If left to my own devices, I would certainly not be privileged and I never forget that. Those stupid self help memes do nothing when you’re living out of your car. Wow. What an astonishing way to steal another woman’s success and lay it at the feet of her husband. I wonder how we account for those years she was successful *after* her divorce, as a single parent and a business owner? Who do we credit that to? Never mind. Don’t bother. I’m out.
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Deleted
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May 4, 2024 3:33:43 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2019 20:22:26 GMT
Yes she’s privileged and the majority of her customers are privileged and her social media messages are geared toward those privileged customers. I’m not sure I understand the point of pointing out her privilege. Is it to say she can’t publicly mention she’s unsure where she’s going next because she’s privileged? I guess it feels little like telling some who is complaining about a broken leg, “well, at least you’re not dying if cancer” as if being privileged denies you the right to not be happy and sure if where you’re going in life. This feels different to me from the someone-with-a-broken-leg scenario because saying things like “In case you need this today...” makes it sound like the intention is to impart some sort of wisdom for the reader, and maybe strum up the relatability factor, which is a very different thing from volunteering how you’re feeling just because it’s getting you down and you’d like to be understood and supported.
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Post by hop2 on Dec 31, 2019 21:18:24 GMT
I apologize, I’m the one who started on the phrase Ali posted. It was timing really, I normally don’t get annoyed over stuff like that but after working with a person Monday who doesn’t know where they will live come Wednesday it seemed a bit trite. BTW the person I worked with has 2 jobs & works hard. Not knowing what would be happening was certainly not ok for them. I pointed them to the proper agency to help them and said a prayer I’m not equipped to help more than that.
I still think the saying is a bit trite but I do understand the points by other peas having to do with indecision & anxiety.
I didn’t mean to start a whole thing, so I apologize for bringing that here.
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Post by lisacharlotte on Dec 31, 2019 22:03:17 GMT
@knickknacknz but maybe one of her followers needed to see that and it made them feel better about not knowing their next step. We all have our own baggage and some can think her message is trite, but it doesn’t negate that her feelings are as valid as anyone else’s.
I’ve been in this argument before on this board where the word privilege is thrown out as a weapon. I don’t think it fits in this instance as her audience is not coming to her for help with their lack of privilege.
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Deleted
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May 4, 2024 3:33:43 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2019 23:38:17 GMT
lisacharlotte that we can benefit from each other’s experiences and perspectives is a powerful and valuable thing; it’s probably the single biggest factor that attracted me to scrapbooking as a new wife and mother all those years ago. At the same time, as you say, we all have our own baggage so it makes sense we aren’t necessarily going to have the same reaction to something. Personally, I find using self disclosures as a marketing tool reprehensible. Even so, using personalised messages is consistent with a customer-centric approach to marketing but success is dependent on understanding your customers. Focusing on one segment of your audience, even if it might be the largest, is likely to leave others feeling alienated. I’m sorry you’ve experienced the word privilege being used as a weapon on this board before and I get you don’t think it fits in this instance. For what it’s worth, it’s not where I was coming from and it didn’t feel to me like that’s how others were using it here.
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sneakylatina
Full Member
Posts: 107
Dec 28, 2018 5:16:09 GMT
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Post by sneakylatina on Dec 31, 2019 23:54:12 GMT
I am probably just reiterating what I've said before, but I like Ali, when she's being creative. I like her asthetic on paper and I used to like her product but I'm burned out. By following several OLWs, I've noticed she is always trying to pare down, get to the essence, make more space, eat better, move, be authentic, etc. Then enjoying 7 Christmas trees and adding increasingly expensive junk to her shop. She strikes me as a very conflicted person. Aware of her privilege, but not ready to step out of the ego-driven insta world she needs for her biz/lifestyle. She's in the thick of the crap but doesn't exactly like it. I feel for her but would like to see her make some bold decisions instead of going the marketed guru route. My two cents, of course.
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julie5
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,611
Jul 11, 2018 15:20:45 GMT
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Post by julie5 on Jan 1, 2020 0:10:45 GMT
To be fair, Ali was only able to make her “hobby” into a business was because she was already privileged by marrying an educated man and having his support through the divorce. And an education of her own. I found myself divorced at 30 after being a stay at home mom while my husband got the education and he had the money to lock me out of everything when I left. I’m privileged now only because of my current husband. Lucky for me he believes we both earn by me helping him with the business. If left to my own devices, I would certainly not be privileged and I never forget that. Those stupid self help memes do nothing when you’re living out of your car. Wow. What an astonishing way to steal another woman’s success and lay it at the feet of her husband. I wonder how we account for those years she was successful *after* her divorce, as a single parent and a business owner? Who do we credit that to? Never mind. Don’t bother. I’m out. I’m simply responding to whoever it was saying “were all privileged” because that’s a bunch of shit if I ever heard. ETA it was you. You who made a sweeping judgment about everyone heee despite knowing none of us or our situations.
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Post by teacherlisa on Jan 1, 2020 1:23:18 GMT
I apologize, I’m the one who started on the phrase Ali posted. It was timing really, I normally don’t get annoyed over stuff like that but after working with a person Monday who doesn’t know where they will live come Wednesday it seemed a bit trite. BTW the person I worked with has 2 jobs & works hard. Not knowing what would be happening was certainly not ok for them. I pointed them to the proper agency to help them and said a prayer I’m not equipped to help more than that. I still think the saying is a bit trite but I do understand the points by other peas having to do with indecision & anxiety. I didn’t mean to start a whole thing, so I apologize for bringing that here. From my POV, I think it is totally OK to discuss and look at this from different points of view. I have been thinking about it on/off all day and I am thankful for the discussion. Just because "to me" I can see the message as positive, does not mean everyone else does.
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Post by sleepingbooty on Jan 1, 2020 7:30:23 GMT
This thread, man. I swear. It always goes haywire over the smallest of things. A hint of critical thinking and boom, there's someone ready to draw blood in defense of Ali's honour. Can we all just chill? 1. Extreme relativism reduces the world to a place of chaos with no possibility of moral absolutes. No need to get all "we're ALL privileged" on other people. Be better in your attitude and thinking for humanity and society's sake. 2. It doesn't matter what one's privilege is. It's the way you are aware of it and you relate to this very inequal world that counts. Some of us merely pointed out that the quote felt like coming from a place of privilege, that's all. Zeus knows there are more privilege-blind SB celebs out there. *cough Becky Higgins cough* 3. Ali's growing less relatable over time. That's the conclusion I've come to and that the recent discussion cemented. Her audience is growing less diverse as the products become more expensive, international shipping options reach luxury levels and her content revolves around the same me-in-my-bubble thematic. That's a very simple fact. Whether it's a conscious business decision or not, I don't know (and I don't really care). 4. Can we stop apologising for daring to bring up criticism and start a discussion? If somebody wants a fangirl-safe space, there is a Facebook group. This board has always enjoyed an open-minded, untied tongue policy and I'd hate to lose it to tiptoeing around each other. Anyhoo, happy new year! New chapter, blank paper and all that jazz.
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Post by sleepingbooty on Jan 1, 2020 7:34:21 GMT
enjoying 7 Christmas trees Clearly, I've not kept up with the AE gossip lately. What's this about 7 Christmas trees?
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Post by gynergy on Jan 1, 2020 12:15:45 GMT
I didn’t say she didn’t work for it. But, as with so many of those ‘self help’ sayings it comes from a place of privilege.BTW many people who have no idea how they’ll pay this months rent bill also work very hard. They are doing those jobs that no one thinks is worth paying for Nobody's taking Ali's success away from her. It's the "It's okay to not know, it's okay for it to be grey, it's okay to not be in a hurry and have it all figured out" part that comes from a place of privilege. For most people, it's not okay to not know. You can't have this attitude when you're struggling to make ends meet. Ali's main market is in the US where 78% of workers live paycheck to paycheck. Financial comfort doesn't come to the vast majority of people who work hard and should qualify to "earn" it. It *is* a "self-help" quote coming from a place of privilege. And it *is* a toxic message for all those who can't afford such privilege. But what's new in the self-help world, right? Brené Brown may come from a background in psychology but she's now a brand and business thriving from a place of privilege, not someone catering or actually factoring in the masses. This article on Brené Brown's argument that we ought to show more empathy toward the privileged is an interesting read for anyone wondering what the problem (and, frankly, deafness) with Ali's favourite guru is. Ouch. Thank you so much for sharing the article on Brene Brown. She’s been an important resource for me over the years, and somehow I missed this. Yikes, she’s got some of her own work today (like most of us white folks, but I expect someone with a PhD in social work who’s a researcher & professor to know & do better).
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hutchfan
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,103
Jul 6, 2016 16:42:12 GMT
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Post by hutchfan on Jan 1, 2020 15:35:22 GMT
I am not sure about the 7 trees I only seen the one big tree, a small tree in her work room and I believe the girls had a small tree in their room. I am one of those who think to each their own. There are so much worse things going on in this world. On IG there were people who had trees in every room mostly huge trees and never did I give it a second thought other than how beautiful they were. enjoying 7 Christmas trees Clearly, I've not kept up with the AE gossip lately. What's this about 7 Christmas trees?
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sneakylatina
Full Member
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Dec 28, 2018 5:16:09 GMT
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Post by sneakylatina on Jan 1, 2020 15:48:40 GMT
I read about the 7 Christmas trees somewhere on her blog or social media. If I remember correctly, she was taking about how Aaron told her not to buy any more when she went to Target.
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sneakylatina
Full Member
Posts: 107
Dec 28, 2018 5:16:09 GMT
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Post by sneakylatina on Jan 1, 2020 15:53:42 GMT
Also, the point of my post was not how many trees she has, but her documented struggle for having and doing less and cutting back versus reality. I was pointing out that I think she is a conflicted person and since she is public about it, I'm wondering if she is conflicted about the consumerism she promotes through her business while at the same time feeling compelled to cut back herself. She's always displayed this paradox in OLW. I find it almost endearing now that I don't buy stuff from her any more. I don't mean that in a condescending way. I just mean she's human.
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julie5
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,611
Jul 11, 2018 15:20:45 GMT
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Post by julie5 on Jan 1, 2020 17:18:06 GMT
Yes I absolutely see the paradox too. It seems the more she preaches less stuff, the more product she releases for sale. I think this is where Becky Higgins messed up. She wanted to produce less stuff and become more of a Brene brown self help guru. It didn’t work. Ali has dipped her toe in that with the water bottles and clothing and it didn’t work.
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hutchfan
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,103
Jul 6, 2016 16:42:12 GMT
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Post by hutchfan on Jan 1, 2020 19:07:29 GMT
For me personally I like that Ali offers many products for sale. Some appeal to me some do not but I like to have many options. Just because she offers many products I don't expect her to use every single one. Ali has for the most part been a simpler scrapbooker focused more on words and pictures than products. I know there has been times I have wished she used more of her products and I really think that she did a wonderful job with her December Daily album this year. It wasn't simple or phoned in at least that is how I felt.
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craftymom101
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,622
Jul 31, 2014 5:23:25 GMT
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Post by craftymom101 on Jan 1, 2020 19:51:33 GMT
My issue with Ali isn’t the amount of products she offers, but her price points. She regularly priced products 40%-60% higher than comparable products on the market. I can’t bring myself to buy embellishments for $1.50/each! I would purchase so much more if her prices were reasonable.
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Post by sleepingbooty on Jan 1, 2020 20:18:37 GMT
Expect AE's stamp sets to go up. 4x6 should soon be 18.99 to align with SC's new prices.
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Post by sleepingbooty on Jan 1, 2020 20:27:07 GMT
Brené Brown may come from a background in psychology but she's now a brand and business thriving from a place of privilege, not someone catering or actually factoring in the masses. This article on Brené Brown's argument that we ought to show more empathy toward the privileged is an interesting read for anyone wondering what the problem (and, frankly, deafness) with Ali's favourite guru is. Ouch. Thank you so much for sharing the article on Brene Brown. She’s been an important resource for me over the years, and somehow I missed this. Yikes, she’s got some of her own work today (like most of us white folks, but I expect someone with a PhD in social work who’s a researcher & professor to know & do better). Privilege, particularly financial success, can be very blinding and numbing when it comes to "regular" people's struggles. In any case, the article will have given you an extra lens to read her work/watch her talks through and remain critical in the process. I'd added Yancy's Look, a White!: Philosophical Essays on Whiteness to my reading list since reading this article and this discussion is just the reminder I needed to actually get to it. Glass half full!
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Post by needtime2scrap on Jan 1, 2020 20:29:38 GMT
I'm thinking that its not her raising the prices alone. I really believe that SC has raised the prices to offset their other brands that don't have the solid market that Ali has. I still respect her more than BH and while I don't buy everything she sells, she still is someone I will support.
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