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Post by keesha on Jan 28, 2020 1:47:04 GMT
When I heard the news my first thought was of how hard this would be for Sabrina Ionescu who would be taking the court for a game soon. Then I heard the destination was a basketball tournament and Kobe's daughter was also involved and my heart went out to her teammates. It is tragic for so many many people. Here is a news story about the Oregon/Oregon State Womens BB game that went on after the news broke: Death of Kobe Bryant and the Civil War that became about much more than basketball
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama

La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Jan 28, 2020 10:13:37 GMT
I don't think it's up to us to judge him. If you don't like him...so what. We really don't need to know. His wife obviously forgave him, and they recently had a new baby, plus other children. He was an accomplished BB player. We can be sad for that. A loss of life, husband, father. He was a rapist who also happened to be an exceptional basketball player. And, to be perfectly frank, his wife’s forgiveness for his infidelity shouldn’t be the benchmark for forgetting that. Another sleazy athlete who rapes people gone from the world. So sad /s. Four little girls no longer have a father on this earth. Children lose parents every minute of every day (there are two Altobelli children who lost both parents and a sister in that crash). This isn’t a 5-page thread because children lost their father but because he’s a celebrity. Like myshelly, I would prefer that, in all this hagiography, it isn’t forgotten that, in 2003, he raped a woman.
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Post by fkawitchypea on Jan 28, 2020 12:42:13 GMT
Children lose parents every minute of every day (there are two Altobelli children who lost both parents and a sister in that crash). This isn’t a 5-page thread because children lost their father but because he’s a celebrity. Like myshelly, I would prefer that, in all this hagiography, it isn’t forgotten that, in 2003, he raped a woman. Of all of the nonsense that is discussed here, the posting of the tragic death of a legendary basketball player really shouldn't be that shocking. Yes we all remember that he was accused of rape, settled out of court and the charges were dropped. The fact that 9 people died in a helicopter crash, including 3 children, is newsworthy. But definitely hold on to your moral outrage. It's very important to so many of you here.
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Post by cakediva on Jan 28, 2020 13:10:58 GMT
And many of the sports articles and tributes I have watched don’t gloss over that fact.
And all of them mention the other lives lost and pay tribute to them as well.
Before my kid played basketball I knew who Kobe was. A lot of players, my son included, are devastated over the loss of one of the greatest talents to play the game. His drive for perfection and skill motivates young players all over the globe.
Yep he did a very bad thing. And it was highly publicized because of who he is. And my son knows it was bad and incredibly wrong.
But what he’s done for young players and women’s basketball can’t be ignored either.
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama

La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Jan 28, 2020 13:21:25 GMT
Children lose parents every minute of every day (there are two Altobelli children who lost both parents and a sister in that crash). This isn’t a 5-page thread because children lost their father but because he’s a celebrity. Like myshelly, I would prefer that, in all this hagiography, it isn’t forgotten that, in 2003, he raped a woman. Of all of the nonsense that is discussed here, the posting of the tragic death of a legendary basketball player really shouldn't be that shocking. Yes we all remember that he was accused of rape, settled out of court and the charges were dropped. The fact that 9 people died in a helicopter crash, including 3 children, is newsworthy. But definitely hold on to your moral outrage. It's very important to so many of you here. If I can't be morally outraged over rape, what in your mind is the benchmark that warrants it?
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zztop11
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,573
Oct 10, 2014 0:54:51 GMT
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Post by zztop11 on Jan 28, 2020 13:26:22 GMT
We live in a democracy. Charges were dropped. Not convicted. Period.
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Post by pierkiss on Jan 28, 2020 13:31:15 GMT
We live in a democracy. Charges were dropped. Not convicted. Period. I think it’s important to note that the charges were dropped because she wouldn’t testify. And after watching the Kavanaugh hearings and the awful things that were said, I can’t say I blame her for 1. Not wanting to rehash a traumatic experience for the whole world to judge, and 2. For not wanting to be attacked relentlessly from the lawyers and the Kobe fans.
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama

La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Jan 28, 2020 13:36:00 GMT
We live in a democracy. Charges were dropped. Not convicted. Period. The charges were dropped because, after months of having her life torn apart, the 19-year-old decided not to testify. He settled the civil case. Exclamation mark.
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Post by christine58 on Jan 28, 2020 13:38:09 GMT
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Post by busy on Jan 28, 2020 13:45:22 GMT
I think it’s reprehensible that she was suspended.
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Post by beepdave on Jan 28, 2020 16:42:45 GMT
I think it’s reprehensible that she was suspended. I'm all for freedom of speech, but if your employer has rules and you agree to the rules, the employer has a right to investigate if they think you broke a rule. Freedom of speech is not free from consequences.
ETA: For the record, I hope she is reinstated.
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lizacreates
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,919
Aug 29, 2015 2:39:19 GMT
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Post by lizacreates on Jan 28, 2020 17:20:56 GMT
I think it’s reprehensible that she was suspended. I'm all for freedom of speech, but if your employer has rules and you agree to the rules, the employer has a right to investigate if they think you broke a rule. Freedom of speech is not free from consequences.
ETA: For the record, I hope she is reinstated.
Their social media policy states in part, “Post journalists must refrain from writing, tweeting or posting anything – including photographs or video – that could objectively be perceived as reflecting political, racial, sexist, religious or other bias or favoritism.” There’s nothing biased about what Sonmez tweeted. What she wrote and the article she linked were factual. WaPo overreacted and needs to stay true to the facts and support their staff who have the courage to give victims a voice. That’s why there’s open revolt in their newsroom right now. Heck, WaPo’s masthead reads “Democracy Dies in Darkness.” You either stand for that principle or you don’t. If Katharine Graham were still alive, I’m convinced she would have Sonmez’s back.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Aug 18, 2025 19:52:53 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2020 17:42:19 GMT
I'm all for freedom of speech, but if your employer has rules and you agree to the rules, the employer has a right to investigate if they think you broke a rule. Freedom of speech is not free from consequences.
ETA: For the record, I hope she is reinstated.
Their social media policy states in part, “Post journalists must refrain from writing, tweeting or posting anything – including photographs or video – that could objectively be perceived as reflecting political, racial, sexist, religious or other bias or favoritism.” There’s nothing biased about what Sonmez tweeted. What she wrote and the article she linked were factual. WaPo overreacted and needs to stay true to the facts and support their staff who have the courage to give victims a voice. That’s why there’s open revolt in their newsroom right now. Heck, WaPo’s masthead reads “Democracy Dies in Darkness.” You either stand for that principle or you don’t. If Katharine Graham were still alive, I’m convinced she would have Sonmez’s back.
Interesting that they are taking a stand considering (or perhaps because of) their role in the Sandmann reporting.
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lizacreates
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,919
Aug 29, 2015 2:39:19 GMT
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Post by lizacreates on Jan 28, 2020 18:00:15 GMT
Their social media policy states in part, “Post journalists must refrain from writing, tweeting or posting anything – including photographs or video – that could objectively be perceived as reflecting political, racial, sexist, religious or other bias or favoritism.” There’s nothing biased about what Sonmez tweeted. What she wrote and the article she linked were factual. WaPo overreacted and needs to stay true to the facts and support their staff who have the courage to give victims a voice. That’s why there’s open revolt in their newsroom right now. Heck, WaPo’s masthead reads “Democracy Dies in Darkness.” You either stand for that principle or you don’t. If Katharine Graham were still alive, I’m convinced she would have Sonmez’s back.
Interesting that they are taking a stand considering (or perhaps because of) their role in the Sandmann reporting.
You do know that 30 out of the 33 statements central in the Sandmann suit were already dismissed by the court as non-libelous, right? The remaining three are still to be adjudicated. So at this juncture, no one can draw a definitive conclusion as to whether the reporter had committed libel or not. I suggest you wait for the outcome.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Jan 28, 2020 18:16:56 GMT
I think that different people are going to have different perceptions of who Kobe was, or what kind of person he was, depending on their experiences, age, and interests. The rape allegation was a long time ago, and I don't remember much about the circumstances or evidence. But it has always been in the back of my mind that he was accused of rape. I am not a huge basketball fan, so haven't looked up to him in that way. But my kids sure do. The oldest (16) knows about the allegations. Last night he and my 11 year old were talking about Kobe and that there was talk of making 8/24 "Kobe day." I said that I felt like the adoration was going too far, partly because I think doing that for any athlete is a little much, but especially with his history. Oldest DS blew it off and said that it wasn't proven and that the charges were dropped, that lots of people accuse someone of rape when it didn't happen. Later last night I read a post that talked more about the evidence, how the victim was raked through the coals, etc and it brought back memories of a situation that I had in college with athletes. I didn't tell my son about that, but the conversation really did trigger me at the time.
My 11 year old has been really affected and I don't think he knows anything about the rape allegations.
I personally have been feeling sad about it, not because "a legend" is gone, but because I feel horribly for all of the families involved. The pictures of Kobe and his daughter bring home the fact that he was a loving father, and that so many families are broken after this accident. We know more about Kobe and his family than the other victims, but they are in my mind as well. It is a reminder that each day is a gift and we should spend our time wisely and being the people that we want to be.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Aug 18, 2025 19:52:53 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2020 18:27:13 GMT
I feel horribly for ALL the families involved. But the canonization of celebrities posthumously is ridiculous.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Aug 18, 2025 19:52:53 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2020 18:32:55 GMT
You do know that 30 out of the 33 statements central in the Sandmann suit were already dismissed by the court as non-libelous, right? The remaining three are still to be adjudicated. So at this juncture, no one can draw a definitive conclusion as to whether the reporter had committed libel or not. I suggest you wait for the outcome.Yes, I know the outcome of the lawsuit is still pending, but I do think it's hypocritical to treat Sonmez the way they did.
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Post by busy on Jan 28, 2020 18:33:03 GMT
I think it’s reprehensible that she was suspended. I'm all for freedom of speech, but if your employer has rules and you agree to the rules, the employer has a right to investigate if they think you broke a rule. Freedom of speech is not free from consequences.
ETA: For the record, I hope she is reinstated.
As far as I've seen, she didn't post anything that was untrue. And if journalists are being punished for sharing factual information, even if some perceive it to be in poor taste/insensitive, that's a huge problem.
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Post by 16joy on Jan 28, 2020 18:39:00 GMT
CNN settled with Sandman earlier this month
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Post by 16joy on Jan 28, 2020 18:50:28 GMT
i wonder if the WaPo has an unwritten rule to not go negative within a certaint amount of time of a person's death?
My husband said he was a great businessman and possibly the smartest NBA player.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Jan 28, 2020 19:09:44 GMT
I feel horribly for ALL the families involved. But the canonization of celebrities posthumously is ridiculous. This. My initial thought was for the children/spouses left behind when in a split second life went from going to your kids' game to tragedy. I didn't feel the need to dwell on the rape charges initially. But the more "hero" talk that flooded media outlets for 2 days, the more I was uncomfortable with the narrative.
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Post by pierkiss on Jan 28, 2020 19:50:21 GMT
I feel horribly for ALL the families involved. But the canonization of celebrities posthumously is ridiculous. Absolutely!!! I wish we (collective) didn’t idolize celebrities, musicians, and sports figures while they’re living as much as we do too. It’s kind of gross.
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Post by jubejubes on Jan 28, 2020 19:55:28 GMT
I feel horribly for ALL the families involved. But the canonization of celebrities posthumously is ridiculous. I agree with your statement above. I also think that the canonization of celebrities posthumously is an outlet for (general) people to release tears of grief, sorrow, stress and possibly other human emotions. Grief isn't dealt within our general society. People feel shamed and don't want to express their sorrows in public. However, when it is a celebrity grief that is felt by most, then it seems to be more appropriate to shed tears and let some of the hidden emotions expel from (general) people.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Aug 18, 2025 19:52:53 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2020 20:07:44 GMT
I feel horribly for ALL the families involved. But the canonization of celebrities posthumously is ridiculous. I had to sleep 5 of my friends on FB because all they were posting were photos and poems and crying emojis. Over a dude. Who played basketball. And I lost it when the mayor of LA called him a hero. Whhhhhaaaa??? When did he protect, serve, or save a life?!
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Aug 18, 2025 19:52:53 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2020 20:12:13 GMT
I feel horribly for ALL the families involved. But the canonization of celebrities posthumously is ridiculous. I had to sleep 5 of my friends on FB because all they were posting were photos and poems and crying emojis. Over a dude. Who played basketball. And I lost it when the mayor of LA called him a hero. Whhhhhaaaa??? When did he protect, serve, or save a life?! Yesssssss. This. I am sure he donated time/money/talent but jeez louise.
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Post by NanaKate on Jan 28, 2020 20:23:01 GMT
We live in a democracy. Charges were dropped. Not convicted. Period. Thank you!
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Post by LiLi on Jan 28, 2020 20:51:07 GMT
We live in a democracy. Charges were dropped. Not convicted. Period. Thank you! Michael Jackson, OJ Simpson, Hillary Clinton, etc etc.
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama

La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Jan 28, 2020 22:08:39 GMT
We live in a democracy. Charges were dropped. Not convicted. Period. Thank you! WTF, does living in a democracy have to do with any of this? Question mark.
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