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Post by Darcy Collins on May 31, 2020 20:12:50 GMT
Spain built their entire society around blood quotas and people were specifically identified based on their percentage of races. And I’m sure the Gypsies would have a whole lot to say about Germany’s racism. My thoughts were about the holocaust and people’s views about Jews and other groups. Is there still strong discrimination there? My gypsy reference was also to the holocaust as they were specifically deemed racially inferior and an estimated 500,000 were killed. I didn't mention Jews as I always mix up ethnicity vs race and didn't want to offend and everyone knows the history of Nazism and Jews. I don't live there so am not going to opine on current conditions other than that there has been many, many references of continued white supremacy groups in Germany. I'll link one, but you can find many: www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/germany-racism-mainstream-200226125612344.html
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Post by revirdsuba99 on May 31, 2020 20:57:27 GMT
Hasn’t slavery, in some form, been around forever? Korea had slaves. The Vikings had slaves. Egyptians had slaves, the Dutch colonized South Africa and enslaved the natives, they are still working on major issues. There are numerous tribes in Africa who capture and enslaves members of other tribes, many times young girls!
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Post by bc2ca on May 31, 2020 22:04:02 GMT
All countries deal with racism. A few things make the American racism problems unique IMHO: - Slaves were imported, not enslaved as part of an army/colonist conquering a country and enslaving the citizens (the most traditional sources of slaves).
- Slavery in the US was abolished after a bitter civil war, not because the general public agreed it was wrong. Half the country still wanted it.
- After slavery was abolished many laws in the country continued to reduce the rights of black people for another 100 years. The Confederate leaders were hailed as heroes and statues built in their honor decades after their defeat and the flag proudly flown on state government buildings.
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Post by monklady123 on May 31, 2020 22:07:20 GMT
I agree that slavery didn't orginate in the USA, but it seems like a major talk point with the black community. And I wondered if that was the same in other countries. Maybe because we are the US we hear more about it? I honestly do not know. Then there is the whole Native American population where I am and the racism around them. So it mainly stems from the minority race being kept down I think? It's a major "talk point" with African-Americans because for so many of them their origins are from slavery in this country. (I say "for many of them" because we do of course have African immigrants also). But as others have said, slavery in some for or another has existed forever. In fact, American slave holders often used the bible to justify owning slaves, and they would quote verses such as Ephesians 6:5 that says "slaves obey your earthly masters with respect and fear" to remind their slaves to be content with their life. This was one reason the slave owners usually didn't want slaves to learn to read, because once you learn to read you learn all sorts of things. There's a whole section in the Old Testament about how to treat slaves, including that you have to set them free after a certain amount of time. American slave owners didn't want anyone getting those ideas.
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Post by Darcy Collins on May 31, 2020 22:25:17 GMT
I don't presume to speak for African Americans but we also can't forget that slavery was really not that long ago. When your great or great-great grandparent was enslaved it's part of your family history. It's not a talking point.
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Post by sleepingbooty on May 31, 2020 22:30:18 GMT
The US racism is different from the one experienced in my nook of Europe. I witnessed an African-American person arguing with a black French person and they could not see eye to eye on the experience of racism although they both had been victims of it and found that it affected their life. As a white person, I can't fully understand or relate those differences but the conversation got heated at one point because it seemed unbbelievable (literally) to the African-American participant that the French could not directly relate to some of the systemic racism in the US. I wish I'd remember it better... I do recall that the French black person absolutely refuted the notion of being African-French and that was one of the major identitary differences between them.
Racism, xenophobia, people being targeted because of ethnicity, this all exists worldwide. However, the actual experience of minorities who are victimised isn't necessarily the same and the way racism is systemic also isn't expressed in a similar manner through countries and cultures. Reminder that how your police forces are set up also greatly influence the systemic abuse and mistreatment of minorities. The US have a very, very specific police force system that is difficult to understand and fully comprehend to foreigners. Most of my friends weren't even aware that sheriffs were politically elected. All of this affects the way racism is expressed on a daily basis.
Race generally speaking is far more discussed in the US than in Western Europe. Xenophobia is definitely very present here. But race is more of a taboo topic. In France, it is legally forbidden to ask someone to tick their race/ethnicity for official documents. There is no such thing as a little box for Caucasion/African-American/Hispanic/etc. I know this may come as a shock to Americans but that's the way it is.
Found this video of African-American women discussing their experience of being black in France:
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Post by Leone on May 31, 2020 23:05:04 GMT
When I worked in Singapore, racism was very out in the open. Job advertisements would actually say what races need not apply. When I worked in Arizona, my female Caucasian colleagues who were married to Hispanic men often talked about that they couldn’t go to Rocky Point (Puerto Pensacola) Mexico because their husbands were given such a bad time there for being married to a white American. My neighbor across the street in AZ was white and married to an African American. They RV’d a lot. When I suggested camping at Rocky Point she said it wasn’t a good place for her husband due to the “black brown” issue.
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Post by maryland on May 31, 2020 23:18:56 GMT
One of my grand-daughters did a mission to India through her church. She was routinely excluded from prayer groups, outreach, meals and so on. It was so bad that she cut her 5 month mission short and came home early. My daughter's boyfriend is Indian. They have been dating over 3 yrs., but his parents still don't know about her (but I think they may know more than she thinks). She is white and they would not accept her (according to her boyfriend). They are both 22 yrs. old.
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Post by AussieMeg on May 31, 2020 23:32:40 GMT
I'm 0% surprised that Leone has come on here to post about "racism" towards the poor oppressed white people.
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Deleted
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Nov 24, 2024 7:27:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2020 0:28:36 GMT
For sure there are racism issues throughout the world.
I can speak to the racism in the city where I live. The neighboring town of Sale (which used to be a pirate city back in the day) is looked down upon by those people living in Rabat. They have been socio-economically oppressed over the years. The people of Rabat see themselves as better educated and more cultured than people of Sale.
There is even racism here against sub-Saharan Africans trying to make their way up into Europe.
Don't even get me started on modern day slavery. You might want to fact check me, but I am pretty sure that Mauritania still has a big problem with slavery. Even here, some young girls are "pimped" out by their families as maids. The employer PAYS the family, not the girl. Thankfully, the tide is changing and they are beginning to have more laws to protect maids.
I think we could have a whole discussion about the dark world of "maids" throughout the Middle East and Asia.
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Post by pjaye on Jun 1, 2020 0:31:00 GMT
I'm 0% surprised that Leone has come on here to post about "racism" towards the poor oppressed white people. and there's a couple of others here doing the same thing! White people are not oppressed and if people from other cultures are not welcoming of them, it really isn't "racism"
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Post by pjaye on Jun 1, 2020 1:13:54 GMT
There's definitely racism in Australia, but it is different in how it is in the USA. We never imported slaves, so that element doesn't apply to us. But white people colonized Australia and their first act was to dehumanize/nullify the indigenous population...we had native aboriginal people living here, but because they were seen as nomadic and did not appear to settle in one place the European explorer declared Australia "terra nullius" which mean unoccupied or uninhabited. Then followed the usual white man invasion and decimation of the native inhabitants. They took their land, they stole their children, they gave them diseases etc etc That racism is less about the different skin colour and more about the total disregard of the value of an entire race and that issue still pervades today. That is more similar to the USA's Native American issues than it is to African American issues.
The next wave of racism was/is against Asian immigrants, initially the Chinese, then more commonly people from other Asian countries as Japan, Vietnam, Korea etc. From early 1900 to the med 1960's we had an official "white Australia policy" which excluded pretty much everyone of non European origin, but was primarily aimed at Asian countries. That's probably our biggest racist issue still and we have some very vocal politicians currently that are anti-Asian, with the idea that "they take all our jobs, come in illegally" etc. In USA terms the issues are more similar to "illegal Mexican immigrants" then to the African American situation.
So yes we definitely have racism, but it is different, it isn't based on the slavery issue that is at the core of the USA racism, and we don't have guns in the population, so we don't have the gun violence that feeds into the American version as well. Our police have guns, but because in general the population does not, the police aren't as trigger happy. Police shooting account for only 4-5 deaths per year. In fact of the few police shooting we have, the only ones I can think of where white males...often with a mental illness. Therefore our racism issues are not as "explosive" as in the USA and don't lead to the same type of rioting behaviour.
I can only think of one race related riot in recent memory in 2005 in Sydney and it was between Middle Eastern/Lebanese & Anglo-Australians.
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seaexplore
Prolific Pea
Posts: 8,878
Apr 25, 2015 23:57:30 GMT
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Post by seaexplore on Jun 1, 2020 1:51:27 GMT
Another country that comes to mind is S. Africa. I know next to nothing about their issues but it seems that I have heard about racial things happening there.
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Deleted
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Nov 24, 2024 7:27:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2020 1:59:20 GMT
There's definitely racism in Australia, but it is different in how it is in the USA. We never imported slaves, so that element doesn't apply to us.But white people colonized Australia and their first act was to dehumanize/nullify the indigenous population...we had native aboriginal people living here, but because they were seen as nomadic and did not appear to settle in one place the European explorer declared Australia "terra nullius" which mean unoccupied or uninhabited. Then followed the usual white man invasion and decimation of the native inhabitants. They took their land, they stole their children, they gave them diseases etc etc That racism is less about the different skin colour and more about the total disregard of the value of an entire race and that issue still pervades today. That is more similar to the USA's Native American issues than it is to African American issues. The next wave of racism was/is against Asian immigrants, initially the Chinese, then more commonly people from other Asian countries as Japan, Vietnam, Korea etc. From early 1900 to the med 1960's we had an official "white Australia policy" which excluded pretty much everyone of non European origin, but was primarily aimed at Asian countries. That's probably our biggest racist issue still and we have some very vocal politicians currently that are anti-Asian, with the idea that "they take all our jobs, come in illegally" etc. In USA terms the issues are more similar to "illegal Mexican immigrants" then to the African American situation. So yes we definitely have racism, but it is different, it isn't based on the slavery issue that is at the core of the USA racism, and we don't have guns in the population, so we don't have the gun violence that feeds into the American version as well. Our police have guns, but because in general the population does not, the police aren't as trigger happy. Police shooting account for only 4-5 deaths per year. In fact of the few police shooting we have, the only ones I can think of where white males...often with a mental illness. Therefore our racism issues are not as "explosive" as in the USA and don't lead to the same type of rioting behaviour. I can only think of one race related riot in recent memory in 2005 in Sydney and it was between Middle Eastern/Lebanese & Anglo-Australians. This is incorrect. There is a large population of Australians with ancestors who were bought here as slaves. Articles below: www.abc.net.au/news/2017-09-17/blackbirding-australias-history-of-kidnapping-pacific-islanders/8860754www.abc.net.au/news/2017-12-22/australian-south-sea-islanders-blackbirding/9270734en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackbirdingtheconversation.com/australias-hidden-history-of-slavery-the-government-divides-to-conquer-86140humanrights.gov.au/our-work/race-discrimination/publications/australian-south-sea-islanders-century-racewww.nma.gov.au/defining-moments/resources/islander-labourersIt is also happening still under the guise of government programs supposed to help: www.theguardian.com/global-development/2017/aug/03/hungry-poor-exploited-alarm-over-australias-import-of-farm-workerswww.abc.net.au/news/2018-05-30/pacific-islands-australian-seasonal-workers-program-fruitpicking/9807894www.smh.com.au/national/slavery-claims-as-seasonal-workers-from-vanuatu-paid-nothing-for-months-work-20170327-gv7k99.html
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Post by pjaye on Jun 1, 2020 2:01:58 GMT
I see Olan has another new ID - you're an idiot & you know ZERO about Australia - except that as usual you can search the web to find any tiny article that you thinks supports your rhetoric - off to block you yet again
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Post by cindyupnorth on Jun 1, 2020 2:09:02 GMT
I see Olan is back already - you're an idiot - off to block you yet again shut up??! really???
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Post by pjaye on Jun 1, 2020 2:10:45 GMT
I see Olan is back already - you're an idiot - off to block you yet again shut up??! really??? I amended my post, it seems she hasn't been banned yet, so I gather this is a new ID ready to go for when the old one gets deleted - or she's cottoned on that I have her on ignore and no longer read her posts.
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Deleted
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Nov 24, 2024 7:27:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2020 2:18:37 GMT
I see Olan has another new ID - you're an idiot & you know ZERO about Australia - except that as usual you can search the web to find any tiny article that you thinks supports your rhetoric - off to block you yet again Wha-what?? I live in Australia. Born here, always have lived here, and always will as it's an amazing country BUT you're still incorrect with your statement about slaves not being bought here. Any tiny article - ABC is tiny? I also included two government websites, including the Australian Human Rights Commission. I see from your post that you'd rather stay ignorant which is ok, because everyone else can read the links themselves and see what you said was incorrect....and that you didn't accept it when it was pointed out to you because it's apparently rhetoric. I wish I could say I was gobsmacked.
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muggins
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,861
Jul 30, 2017 3:38:57 GMT
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Post by muggins on Jun 1, 2020 2:32:45 GMT
Another country that comes to mind is S. Africa. I know next to nothing about their issues but it seems that I have heard about racial things happening there. Apartheid started in S Africa in the late 1940s and lasted until the 1990s. It was horrific. There are plenty of short YouTube videos which give a potted history or snapshot of the main events. Nelson Mandela’s autobiography is a great place to start, also anything by Mark Mathabane who grew up in the same ghetto as NM. Trevor Noah’s book Born A Crime is fantastic.
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Post by FuzzyMutt on Jun 1, 2020 2:57:43 GMT
There is racism in Japan, especially against Chinese and Koreans residents. Many Koreans have adopted Japanese names to help with assimilation. There is also bias against the Ainus, the native peoples of Northern Japan. Someone mentioned Canada. I have a friend who lived in the Montreal area. There is a form of cultural racism she said there. It is not against the law to not rent an apartment to someone based on where they are from. And she was sometimes looked down upon and treated badly because of her bad French. I’m surprised because I know quite a few Koreans that (acknowledging the Korean-Japanese racism in Korea) went to lengths to advise me how to know the difference between Japanese (and Hawaiian) and.. this white girl (me) can easily tell. A name change isn’t going to help. Japanese and Korean in our lifetime are two of the most (proudly) homogenous gene pools on the Earth.
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Post by ntsf on Jun 1, 2020 3:54:47 GMT
slaves were in the middle east, in africa, in south america.. all over. I have lived in Asia.. and there is plenty of racism there too. slavery existe/exists in india and all over...
you could argue that the serfs of russia were slaves too..
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Deleted
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Nov 24, 2024 7:27:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2020 4:30:50 GMT
There’s plenty of racism in the U.K. My friend’s goddaughter lives somewhere near London. I am not sure why she stays there. The stories she tells.
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muggins
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,861
Jul 30, 2017 3:38:57 GMT
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Post by muggins on Jun 1, 2020 5:26:26 GMT
There’s plenty of racism in the U.K. My friend’s goddaughter lives somewhere near London. I am not sure why she stays there. The stories she tells. I’m in MI and would swap with her in a hot minute. I cannot wait to get out of here.
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Post by jess on Jun 1, 2020 5:32:34 GMT
We definitely have racism in Australia. We have several cases of deaths of aboriginal people in custody. It's largely swept under the carpet. We also have Islamophobia and racism against Asians. I'd like to think it's not as bad as in the US, but that's probably my white, middle-class life experience.
I don't think though that our police would ever feel able to openly murder someone while being videoed. They might do it in a lock-up, but not where there were witnesses, and I'm FAIRLY certain if it did happen the recriminations and repercussions from the police hierarchy and government would be swift. That's what especially blew me away with this one. They felt so enabled that they didn't care that it was being videoed. They were so confident there would be no consequences, that it was fine to do it. I can't, no matter how hard I try, wrap my head around that.
And whilst I don't think it was officially recognised as slavery, we did have slavery in Australia with the South Sea Islanders being stolen from their homes and used on the sugar plantations. Many aboriginal people were effectively slaves in that they worked for food only and were treated appallingly. But no official "ownership" so most Australians would deny that it was slavery.
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Post by prapea on Jun 1, 2020 6:23:00 GMT
There is racism in other countries. But then why is everyone looking at our country right now shaking their heads when there are incidents happening in their own backyards? Probably because of the way we are handling the racism issues.
If we had a President who brought us together instead of tweeting shit and making things worse with his dickhead comments, we wouldn’t be where we are today.
How many world leaders do we see daily tweeting stupid shit like our clown?
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muggins
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,861
Jul 30, 2017 3:38:57 GMT
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Post by muggins on Jun 1, 2020 6:57:28 GMT
There is racism in other countries. But then why is everyone looking at our country right now shaking their heads when there are incidents happening in their own backyards? Probably because of the way we are handling the racism issues. If we had a President who brought us together instead of tweeting shit and making things worse with his dickhead comments, we wouldn’t be where we are today. How many world leaders do we see daily tweeting stupid shit like our clown? People in other countries are also shaking their heads at the way the USA is handling gun issues, refugee issues, immigrant issues, environmental issues, pandemic issues, etc. Obviously other countries have their fair share of poorly managed issues and leadership too. But since 45 took office the country seems to be spiralling out of control and for a nation that was once respected by many others, it’s a very sad thing to see.
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Post by prapea on Jun 1, 2020 7:01:31 GMT
There is racism in other countries. But then why is everyone looking at our country right now shaking their heads when there are incidents happening in their own backyards? Probably because of the way we are handling the racism issues. If we had a President who brought us together instead of tweeting shit and making things worse with his dickhead comments, we wouldn’t be where we are today. How many world leaders do we see daily tweeting stupid shit like our clown? People in other countries are also shaking their heads at the way the USA is handling gun issues, refugee issues, immigrant issues, environmental issues, pandemic issues, etc. Obviously other countries have their fair share of poorly managed issues and leadership too. But since 45 took office the country seems to be spiralling out of control and for a nation that was once respected by many others, it’s a very sad thing to see. I agree. It is the lack of leadership that everyone is rolling their eyes at. How I miss the respect we had when Obama was President 😢
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Post by worldwanderer75 on Jun 1, 2020 9:25:33 GMT
I live in the middle east and the racism is bad here. Different than in the USA but very ingrained about certain races and religions. My kids are minorities here (we are caucasian) so that has been interesting for them but they are mostly treated well. People from the Philippines, India and Bangladesh suffer from the worst of the racism here.
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Deleted
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Nov 24, 2024 7:27:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2020 15:00:26 GMT
I was in Germany late last year. There is a bar on the main street in the town I was staying in (well known city) that was also there that last time I visiting 19 years ago. It was/is a skinhead bar with the patrons proudly wearing their tattoos and clothing advertising their cause. You could feel the negative energy in that place. Me and my work mates (all US citizens) walked in, glanced around, and immediately walked back out. As for today, there is still some level of racism I witnesses, mostly muslim Indians and Middle Easterns. I can't recall a specific event but you could tell how white-skinned and brown-skinned walked on seperate sides of the street and did not visit the same restaurants and stores. You could also see an immediate uptick in security presence when a group of brown-skinned young adults showed up.
In Austria (19 years ago) there was a long-term rooming home I stayed in (again for work - well known city) where I left my windows open to get some fresh air. The owners came by to check on me and told me not to keep the windows open at certain groups active at dusk going from their homes to their meeting places. They also said I probably wouldn't have any issues because I was white skin but being a women could cause problems.
In 1960's Ireland there was no distinction between skin color. The Irish were considered the black people of Europe so they kept a very low profile if they traveled out of the country. My current functional lead is Irish. She said things have gotten better, that people don't bat an eye at mixed marriages. She says it is more of a "class rivalry" than out and out racism. She adds that living in a university town tends to allow for more open and progressive thinking that some of the bigger cities or smaller villages.
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Post by pierogi on Jun 1, 2020 15:06:14 GMT
People in other countries are also shaking their heads at the way the USA is handling gun issues, refugee issues, immigrant issues, environmental issues, pandemic issues, etc. Obviously other countries have their fair share of poorly managed issues and leadership too. But since 45 took office the country seems to be spiralling out of control and for a nation that was once respected by many others, it’s a very sad thing to see. I agree. It is the lack of leadership that everyone is rolling their eyes at. How I miss the respect we had when Obama was President 😢 But Trumpers assert that Obama made us the laughingstock of the world, and thanks to the Orange King we’re finally respected again. How could they be wrong?
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