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Post by monklady123 on Nov 12, 2014 16:55:26 GMT
In k, my dd had a child who spoke only Hebrew arrive and she cried for two weeks, after which time she settled down and now, in grade 4, doesn't even have an accent so you wouldn't know she wasn't a native speaker. Her parents were fluent - to a degree - in English when they arrived. They could work in Israel in Engish (doesn't take much English to do that) or talk with me and I could decipher, but they weren't great speakers. Had they taught her daughter anything she probably would have been in a worse position grammar wise. This year, my younger dd sits next to another grade 1 student who had no English skills when school started in September. She was upset at the start of the year too. Her parents are fluent enough to talk with me, teachers, have a phone conversation, etc, but their grammar is poor and their teaching her also would have hurt her more. Now, in November, she is reading and speaking and participating in class. Our school moves at a fast pace, doing general studies in half a day, and Hebrew immersion / religious education in half the day, and the kids still managed to learn quickly. Crying in K is not uncalled for, especially for someone on his situation. But his parents fluent English might not be enough to teach anyone or speak it with a spouse at home. I doubt they're fluent, more like able to get by and have a conversation. But Hebrew grammar is different from English grammar. To be truly fluent is difficult, with any languages. Teaching the little boy some basic vocabulary would not have set him back at all, or hurt his English grammar development. I would never try to teach my kids French grammar before enrolling them in a French school, but I could teach them some basic vocabulary so that when the teacher said "bonjour" my kid would know what he/she was saying. Etc. And I would give the teacher a list of the vocabulary I had taught my kid and would tell her that this was all the French my child knew. I wouldn't just drop him or her off and leave.  |
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Post by elaine on Nov 12, 2014 17:14:52 GMT
It was a hoped for move, but that doesn't mean it wasn't sudden or unexpected (from the point of view of someone who has gone through immigration & visa applications). Maybe, but if you knew a move was coming up, whether it happens in 6 days or 6 years, wouldn't you at least start preparing your child for school where you know they will be speaking a different language? Especially if you also speak that different language? I don't know. I just can't imagine moving to a non-English speaking place and just dumping my kid off at a school without a clue on even the most basic words. I think it is an assumption to say that they hadn't tried to teach some basic words. Most 5 year olds appear to forget a lot of what they know in their own language when you place them in a brand new environment. It is only when they are comfortable that many are able to demonstrate what they actually know. I don't know if you've tried, but it is also hard to teach a 5 year old a new language when they don't hear it at daycare, school, their friends. How many 5 year olds do you know who would truly be able to understand the concept "you need to learn this new language that you don't use here because you are moving very far away where that is the language they speak"? If you found out that in 2 months you were moving to Israel, both you and your husband (who works doctor hours) are working full time, and you were packing up your house, how likely do you think you would be able to teach your 5 year old a language that not only sounds very different, but also has a completely different alphabet? And even if you managed to teach your 5 yo how to speak the basics, like "my name is...." in Hebrew, how likely do you think he would produce it when placed in a school full of people he doesn't know and who all speak Hebrew 20 times faster than you ever did when you were trying to teach him? Again, the judgement against the parents is unfounded IMO. I'm not surprised the mom rubbed Merge the wrong way. Native Israelis can come across as abrupt and rude - the closest I can come to in explaining it is that culturally their style of communication can be similar to those who are native New York City residents. My mom finds most people in Israel rude whenever we go over to visit - I always have to run interference. But that certainly, in my mind, doesn't deserve the labeling the parents as irresponsible people who have set their child up to fail in school. |
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Post by bc2ca on Nov 12, 2014 17:49:00 GMT
Maybe, but if you knew a move was coming up, whether it happens in 6 days or 6 years, wouldn't you at least start preparing your child for school where you know they will be speaking a different language? Especially if you also speak that different language? I don't know. I just can't imagine moving to a non-English speaking place and just dumping my kid off at a school without a clue on even the most basic words. I think it is an assumption to say that they hadn't tried to teach some basic words. Most 5 year olds appear to forget a lot of what they know in their own language when you place them in a brand new environment. It is only when they are comfortable that many are able to demonstrate what they actually know. I don't know if you've tried, but it is also hard to teach a 5 year old a new language when they don't hear it at daycare, school, their friends. How many 5 year olds do you know who would truly be able to understand the concept "you need to learn this new language that you don't use here because you are moving very far away where that is the language they speak"? If you found out that in 2 months you were moving to Israel, both you and your husband (who works doctor hours) are working full time, and you were packing up your house, how likely do you think you would be able to teach your 5 year old a language that not only sounds very different, but also has a completely different alphabet? And even if you managed to teach your 5 yo how to speak the basics, like "my name is...." in Hebrew, how likely do you think he would produce it when placed in a school full of people he doesn't know and who all speak Hebrew 20 times faster than you ever did when you were trying to teach him?
Again, the judgement against the parents is unfounded IMO. I'm not surprised the mom rubbed Merge the wrong way. Native Israelis can come across as abrupt and rude - the closest I can come to in explaining it is that culturally their style of communication can be similar to those who are native New York City residents. My mom finds most people in Israel rude whenever we go over to visit - I always have to run interference. But that certainly, in my mind, doesn't deserve the labeling the parents as irresponsible people who have set their child up to fail in school. It is unbelievably overwhelming as an adult to think you know enough of a language to communicate and try to follow a group of native speakers, I can't imagine doing it as a child. You don't even recognize words and phrases you have been taught because the context is so different. My sis had a classmate that immigrated from Yugoslavia when he was about 10 and it is very funny to hear his stories about how they thought they knew English. He and his siblings were taught to answer the phone and just say "wrong number" if it wasn't someone they knew. It was several years before they could all laugh about how confused people must have been by every inquiry being met with "rock number" until in frustration someone hung up  . Merge, given this child's response to the new situation, IMHO, learning a few vocabulary words would not have helped much and at K level I don't really think they have hurt the child's chance of long term success in school. |
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Aug 18, 2025 20:22:09 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2014 18:27:24 GMT
The situation may not affect the child's long-term success, but in my opinion needlessly complicated the situation. And if my child were spending that much time screaming at school–whatever the reason–I certainly would expect to try to be part of the solution and not expect the school to deal with it all.
I think that situation is a part of a much larger issue – that we are increasingly expecting schools and teachers to be all things to all people, with less resources (both in personnel and materials) then ever before.
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Post by melanell on Nov 12, 2014 21:49:23 GMT
No matter the situation, I do feel bad that the poor little guy was so upset.
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