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Post by hop2 on Jan 23, 2021 0:23:39 GMT
I feel like Biden is closer to my beliefs (registered republican) than Trump was. I believe normal republicans recognize that Biden is actually middle. The disagreement comes with Kamala. Many believe her to be far left like AOC. I will be honest that I don’t know enough about her to agree or disagree with that view. I do know that I am not worried about Biden. With Kamala’s past as a prosecutor, a tough one at that, how is she considered such a progressive? I don’t get it. The left certainly thinks she not left. I know people ‘move’ and lean different in as they age but I can’t see her as progressive.
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Post by catmom on Jan 23, 2021 0:27:42 GMT
And bears no relation to anything that has been proposed by this administration. Republicans get away with using words like socialism to describe normal, compassionate social programs and common sense things like fully funding public education because their supporters are either ignorant of what socialism is, or willing to prey on/profit off of those who are ignorant. I had to say to one person talking about Joe and his love affair with Antifa "Um, you do realize that Antifa thinks Joe is fascist, right?" If you're not a Republican, you're far left, I guess. I don't think they realize that Joe and Kamala are on the moderate to conservative end of the Democratic spectrum. When Kamala was named President Biden's running mate, CBC did an overview of her policies and the summary was that in Canada, she would actually be running for the conservative party, not the Liberal party. They are very much NOT the far left.
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moodyblue
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,276
Location: Western Illinois
Site Supporter
Jun 26, 2014 21:07:23 GMT
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Post by moodyblue on Jan 23, 2021 0:55:57 GMT
I feel like Biden is closer to my beliefs (registered republican) than Trump was. I believe normal republicans recognize that Biden is actually middle. The disagreement comes with Kamala. Many believe her to be far left like AOC. I will be honest that I don’t know enough about her to agree or disagree with that view. I do know that I am not worried about Biden. I know that many republicans believe that, but the facts don’t bear it out. And I have to think those beliefs are fueled in part by racism. All those brown-skinned people are radical leftists who want free stuff. 🙄 (Not shooting the messenger here, just tagging on to what you said.) I think it’s an attack (based in fear) on anyone the right considers lesser than themselves - they don’t want to give a helping hand, equal rights, or equal opportunities to those who are minorities, poor, LGBTQ, from poor countries, speak a different language or have different religious beliefs. They demonize those who aren’t like them, and any attempts to level the playing field brings out their cries of socialism or far-left agenda. They seem to feel they pulled themselves up by their bootstraps, or are entitled to what they have - and anyone else can and should do the same. "It's not fair." But don’t try to take away their Social Security ("we earned it") or health benefits, and they don’t see all the services that society provides as having anything to do with it.
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artbabe
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,396
Jun 26, 2014 1:59:10 GMT
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Post by artbabe on Jan 23, 2021 1:18:59 GMT
I’ll bite.
I have a long history of being Republican up to the first Trump election (voted for Hilary and then Biden).
My major though during all of those years being Republican: How are you paying for that?
That is it. How are you paying for that?
I agree with everything Biden is doing. Still....
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Jan 23, 2021 1:28:42 GMT
Pretty clear from those tweets that the new phrase that the R’s are supposed to repeat is “far left agenda.” They disgust me.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Jan 23, 2021 1:33:20 GMT
I feel like Biden is closer to my beliefs (registered republican) than Trump was. I believe normal republicans recognize that Biden is actually middle. The disagreement comes with Kamala. Many believe her to be far left like AOC. I will be honest that I don’t know enough about her to agree or disagree with that view. I do know that I am not worried about Biden. With Kamala’s past as a prosecutor, a tough one at that, how is she considered such a progressive? I don’t get it. The left certainly thinks she not left. I know people ‘move’ and lean different in as they age but I can’t see her as progressive. I agree. When she was nominated for VP my Bernie loving, progressive relatives were upset and said she is not progressive enough. But to the republicans she is the far left devil incarnate. That is why I think that race and gender has a big part to play in their impressions of her. She is a strong black woman and they are scared of those characteristics. So their response is to demonize her.
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Post by Merge on Jan 23, 2021 1:51:51 GMT
I’ll bite. I have a long history of being Republican up to the first Trump election (voted for Hilary and then Biden). My major though during all of those years being Republican: How are you paying for that? That is it. How are you paying for that? I agree with everything Biden is doing. Still.... Well ... how do we pay for anything? Wars, corporate welfare, tax cuts and loopholes to the point where the uber-wealthy pay nothing, and anything else that the GOP is fine with paying for. You and I pay more than we should for safety net programs so that companies like Walmart don’t have to pay their employees a living wage or provide them with insurance. I maintain that there is no such thing as a fiscal conservative. Both parties spend, both parties tax. No one is in favor of waste. It’s just a matter of what we prioritize to spend on, and who we choose to tax. I’d prefer to pay for domestic social initiatives and climate policy by making sure the wealthy and corporations pay their fair share. I’d prefer not to live in a country where the middle and working classes pay more than their fair share for a bare-bones social safety net, inadequate public education, substandard healthcare, and crumbling infrastructure, while the rich live under a protective umbrella of laws and policies designed to make them richer.
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Post by ktdoesntscrap on Jan 23, 2021 1:53:58 GMT
I consider myself a very progressive Democrat. I support single-payer health insurance, a universal living wage, affordable housing subsidized by the government when necessary. I believe no one in the US should be without food shelter and health care. I have family members who are way farther left them me. Maybe not true socialists but they hate capitalism and think it is the root of all ills. They did vote for Biden, but not Hillary. I think RBG's death made them realize that they had to vote for the "lesser of two evils". that said. There is a far left agenda Biden and Harris are so far right of it.. they are closer to the far right agenda than the far left. Scare tactics work!
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TheOtherMeg
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,541
Jun 25, 2014 20:58:14 GMT
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Post by TheOtherMeg on Jan 23, 2021 2:20:23 GMT
So apparently a far left agenda, aka “socialism” now has taken on a new meaning—anything unpalatable to the haters. Bingo.
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Post by hop2 on Jan 23, 2021 3:35:30 GMT
With Kamala’s past as a prosecutor, a tough one at that, how is she considered such a progressive? I don’t get it. The left certainly thinks she not left. I know people ‘move’ and lean different in as they age but I can’t see her as progressive. I agree. When she was nominated for VP my Bernie loving, progressive relatives were upset and said she is not progressive enough. But to the republicans she is the far left devil incarnate. That is why I think that race and gender has a big part to play in their impressions of her. She is a strong black woman and they are scared of those characteristics. So their response is to demonize her. I guess so, I think she’s less ‘left’ than I am lol. I guess I’m a far left radical and I had no idea.
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Post by hop2 on Jan 23, 2021 3:42:42 GMT
I’ll bite. I have a long history of being Republican up to the first Trump election (voted for Hilary and then Biden). My major though during all of those years being Republican: How are you paying for that? That is it. How are you paying for that? I agree with everything Biden is doing. Still.... Well ... how do we pay for anything? Wars, corporate welfare, tax cuts and loopholes to the point where the uber-wealthy pay nothing, and anything else that the GOP is fine with paying for. You and I pay more than we should for safety net programs so that companies like Walmart don’t have to pay their employees a living wage or provide them with insurance. I maintain that there is no such thing as a fiscal conservative. Both parties spend, both parties tax. No one is in favor of waste. It’s just a matter of what we prioritize to spend on, and who we choose to tax. I’d prefer to pay for domestic social initiatives and climate policy by making sure the wealthy and corporations pay their fair share. I’d prefer not to live in a country where the middle and working classes pay more than their fair share for a bare-bones social safety net, inadequate public education, substandard healthcare, and crumbling infrastructure, while the rich live under a protective umbrella of laws and policies designed to make them richer. If anything the last 4 years HAS to show that the GOP has no plan to pay for ANYTHING other than corporate welfare. And corporate welfare doesn’t fund anything. They increased the deficit more than any other administration and didn’t pay for a god damned thing. I don’t expect Biden can get this under control anytime soon and the GOP are going to blame it all on him, but they made these issues. Anyone who has concerns for ‘how will we pay for that’ can’t possibly sign on with the GOP because they haven’t paid for anything and they still ran us broke. If you want a thriving economy have healthy people who aren’t overly burdened by inconceivable debt ( for healthcare & such ) and can spend their money in the economy.
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Post by lucyg on Jan 23, 2021 4:50:25 GMT
By shutting down things(pipeline, blue collar jobs) "we" will become more and more dependent on the government/welfare. There are lots of options for jobs in new and growing industries, but we (the country) have to be willing to help grow those jobs and industries, and the displaced workers have to be open to learning new skills.
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Post by scrapsotime on Jan 23, 2021 5:40:01 GMT
The right is going so far right that far left is actually the middle.
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lesmcf
Full Member
Posts: 221
Jul 10, 2014 0:50:47 GMT
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Post by lesmcf on Jan 23, 2021 5:42:32 GMT
A far left agenda is anything that helps the citizens and the right doesn't like.
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Post by hookturnian on Jan 23, 2021 6:03:29 GMT
The right is going so far right that far left is actually the middle. In Europe Bernie Sanders would be considered centre to slightly left of centre. The Democratic Party needs to be careful that it doesn't keep moving to the right in some bizarre effort to mop up Republicans who are not Trumpers.
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Post by gar on Jan 23, 2021 10:19:09 GMT
By shutting down things(pipeline, blue collar jobs) "we" will become more and more dependent on the government/welfare. There are lots of options for jobs in new and growing industries, but we (the country) have to be willing to help grow those jobs and industries, and the displaced workers have to be open to learning new skills. Nothing stands still...as unsustainable industries like fossil fuels die out, renewable energy industries expand, and are doing massively, as you say. It's the same the world over.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Nov 23, 2024 4:44:23 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2021 11:52:09 GMT
Certainly not what the some of these republicans think it is, that's for sure. No different to their interpretation of socialism.
Maybe if Marco Rubio's president hadn't tried to destroy America and the World, President Biden might not have had to issue so many of the EO's on his first day in office.
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Post by peasapie on Jan 23, 2021 12:09:54 GMT
It’s the BS right wing news media gin up to increase their audience.
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Post by jeremysgirl on Jan 23, 2021 12:23:10 GMT
I agree with artbabe assessment on my justification for voting republican for years. Merge said: I maintain that there is no such thing as a fiscal conservative. Both parties spend, both parties tax. No one is in favor of waste. It’s just a matter of what we prioritize to spend on, and who we choose to tax. This is what Merge said in response and I have to say that I can see this now. The Trump tax cut really left a bad taste in my mouth. And then his follow up budget proposals to cut social security and Medicare. I can wholeheartedly say I support those two social programs. And I have always felt that we should be supporting the food stamp program. I am sickened at the thought of anyone going hungry in our country. And really I donate more per year to my local food bank than my tax dollars devote to this program. And really too, as I've gotten more progressive I can see the need for healthcare as well. I personally stay in a job that pays me less than I could make because of the cadillac healthcare plan. We are high users of healthcare and that is super important to me. And even though I love my job and there are definitely other reasons to stay there (I will most likely stay until retirement) I would like the freedom and flexibility to be able to change positions if I wanted to without losing my coverage. In addition, my ex DH and I both lost our jobs during the last recession and what that meant for me personally was a loss of my medication for my bipolar disorder. I couldn't afford it. And that is so detrimental to my stability. I would love to live in a country where my healthcare isn't dependent on my job. So I'm willing to pay for it.
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Post by hop2 on Jan 23, 2021 13:00:27 GMT
By shutting down things(pipeline, blue collar jobs) "we" will become more and more dependent on the government/welfare. There are lots of options for jobs in new and growing industries, but we (the country) have to be willing to help grow those jobs and industries, and the displaced workers have to be open to learning new skills. And many of those jobs won’t ignore treaties our nation has with the nation of native people. Why the hell can we not, as a nation, honor a single treaty with the native people. Why can we not honor their lands and their sovereignty over even the small the pittance of lands that we ‘allowed’ them to keep? If we can not honor treaties with them why should anyone else think we would honor any treaty?
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Post by Merge on Jan 23, 2021 13:44:28 GMT
The right is going so far right that far left is actually the middle. In Europe Bernie Sanders would be considered centre to slightly left of centre. The Democratic Party needs to be careful that it doesn't keep moving to the right in some bizarre effort to mop up Republicans who are not Trumpers. Exactly my concern with nominating Biden in the first place (I supported Elizabeth Warren). If “unity” means sliding ever further right to try to appease the GOP, that’s a problem. But it is what it is, and we’ve got control of things now. I’m sure the Biden administration is aware that progressives will be holding his feet to the fire for the duration of his term.
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Post by jeremysgirl on Jan 23, 2021 14:02:17 GMT
Building on what Merge just said, I think that the Democrats ought to just go forth with their plans and pay no attention to Republicans. Because there are some people who are never going to be convinced that certain programs are good for the country, as a whole until it personally impacts them. No negotiations. Pass the bills and make the Republicans eat it. There was such a stink about the ACA but years later? I think like 68% of Americans supported it and didn't want to see it overturned.
So just go forth. And let people see what happens. I'm sure there were naysayers about social security when it was being considered. And look how overwhelmingly popular it is now. I say focus on things that impact lower and middle class americans in a broad and positive way. And just let the Republicans scream about it.
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Post by sabrinae on Jan 23, 2021 15:08:26 GMT
I’ll bite. I have a long history of being Republican up to the first Trump election (voted for Hilary and then Biden). My major though during all of those years being Republican: How are you paying for that? That is it. How are you paying for that? I agree with everything Biden is doing. Still.... You invest tax money into priorities that help everyone instead of giving corporations and the wealthiest multi-trillion dollar tax cuts
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Post by hop2 on Jan 23, 2021 16:01:30 GMT
I’ll bite. I have a long history of being Republican up to the first Trump election (voted for Hilary and then Biden). My major though during all of those years being Republican: How are you paying for that? That is it. How are you paying for that? I agree with everything Biden is doing. Still.... You invest tax money into priorities that help everyone instead of giving corporations and the wealthiest multi-trillion dollar tax cuts THATs fiscally responsible.
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tincin
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,382
Jul 25, 2014 4:55:32 GMT
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Post by tincin on Jan 23, 2021 19:04:21 GMT
All the far left people I know want crazy things like health insurance for everyone, ensuring children and the poor have food to eat, free education, crazy shit like that. You know like they have in other industrialized countries, who do we think we are Australia?
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tincin
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,382
Jul 25, 2014 4:55:32 GMT
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Post by tincin on Jan 23, 2021 19:07:35 GMT
I’ll bite. I have a long history of being Republican up to the first Trump election (voted for Hilary and then Biden). My major though during all of those years being Republican: How are you paying for that? That is it. How are you paying for that? I agree with everything Biden is doing. Still.... We could pay for it by being certain EVERYONE pays their share of taxes. Drop the damned loopholes and deductions and tax on a graduated scale. Plus we should make corporations actually pay taxes. Yes Amazon, I’m looking at you and the 7 other companies that we know about who paid ZERO. Taxes. That’s how we f’ing pay for it.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Nov 23, 2024 4:44:23 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2021 14:43:49 GMT
What's on your "far left" agenda today "radical left" peas?
Mine is a walk, some scrapping, make stew, make billionaires a tiny bit sad. You?
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