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Post by Bridget in MD on Dec 1, 2022 14:15:36 GMT
Background: My son attends a private Catholic HS. They have a spring/fall uniform (polo shirt, khaki skirts/shorts) and a winter uniform (button down shirt, tie for boys, khaki pants or skits, and a blazer). There is an optional quarter zip sweatshirt that can be worn at any time, even under the blazer. The school also gives a hoodie sweatshirt when you enroll, and sells them at the book store too. The school allows certain clubs to sponsor "tag days", where students can pay $1 to dress out of uniform (on specific days).
Winter uniform started on 10/31. The week before Thanksgiving, students who participated in a school fundraiser were allowed a week of tag days (and we participated).
On Monday, my husband got an email at 230, with my son CC'd from an assistant dean of students who said he needed to report to lunch detention for 3 uniform infractions on Tuesday. 2 of the "infractions" happened on the week of tag days. I wasn't on the email, and my husband was on a call, so he forwarded it to me at 2:55, and I sent an email at 3:03. I replied to all three people (son, husband and asst. dean) to explain that 2 of those infractions shouldn't count as it happened during the tag day week, and I forwarded the email that we got saying my son was eligible for that week to be out of uniform. The dean didn't reply.
On Tuesday, I waited until 830, and replied to the email I sent, and added the head dean of student life (in case the asst dean wasnt there) to verify they got my email, and to say that we told our son that we were waiting to hear back, but there was a scholarship luncheon my son should attend on Tuesday, and we told him to attend that event, as we felt there was a clerical error about the uniform infractions. The asst. dean responded 15 min later, thanking me for the information and that he would adjust the system or whatever.
However, 15 min later, the head dean replied that DS should attend the scholarship luncheon but he should report to detention today because he had a whole bunch of infractions anyway (3 infractions should mean lunch detention). He listed the dates of these infractions, going back to October.
One was an untucked shirt, which DS corrected immediately.
One was forgetting is tie, which could not be corrected.
But several other were for wearing these school hoodies, under his blazer. and 2 of the infractions listed were before the blazers were even required (10/31), so he wouldnt have had the blazer as part of his uniform.
The school has been wishy washy on the wearing of the hoodie. It's a school logo, and the school has gone back and forth on allowing the kids to wear it or a college sweatshirt too. I understand if it was something like "eat at Joes" but this is for his HS and I swear the school has allowed them to wear it. I watched him walk out the door almost every morning wearing the damn thing.
I emailed to ask the head dean for clarification bc my kid's not the only one who thinks that hoodie is allowed, plus mentioned that several of the listed infractions (wearing the hoodie under the blazer) happened before the blazer was even required, so I didn't think they should count as infractions. I responded at 930 yesterday, and I have not heard back.
DH said I should call, but now he's saying that if I call or email, I could provoke this dean, who seems to not really like DS. I mean, is he passing out infractions to every single student wearing these sweatshirts? Its not fair if he does for some kids and not others. IMO they need to either put out a policy and enforce it, or not punish any student.
I just don't want DS (who swears the hoodie is allowed) to keep getting pinged - but I also don't want to aggravate the dean. Perhaps he didn't like that we told DS to attend the scholarship luncheon, but since the asst. dean didn't respond, we told DS to attend the event because we thought the detention was bullshit anyway.
So, DH doesnt have time for me to bounce this off - and I know there are a lot more important things going on in this world. So do I call? Email? Let it go?
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seaexplore
Prolific Pea
Posts: 9,366
Apr 25, 2015 23:57:30 GMT
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Post by seaexplore on Dec 1, 2022 14:22:13 GMT
I think DS needs to email himself asking for clarification on dress code.
As a teacher, ALWAYS email. Avoid phone conversations. That way you have a paper trail and words to show what actually went down.
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Post by Bridget in MD on Dec 1, 2022 14:25:24 GMT
I think DS needs to email himself asking for clarification on dress code. As a teacher, ALWAYS email. Avoid phone conversations. That way you have a paper trail and words to show what actually went down.This is how I feel too. I told DS to attend detention today, as instructed, and maybe he can ask the dean there (assuming he is there) and follow up with an email. ETA: the reason I emailed was bc I feel the school is being wishy washy. They could tell DS one thing and the whole rest of the student body will do something else, and I think that sucks. |
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Post by lily on Dec 1, 2022 14:26:18 GMT
I don't know --- I think I would go in and speak in person to the dean with my son, because things written in email can be taken different/wrong ways.
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MorningPerson
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,579 
Location: Central Pennsylvania
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Post by MorningPerson on Dec 1, 2022 14:37:46 GMT
Is this spelled out in the student handbook?
Our kids received a new student handbook on the first day of school each year, and we had to return our signature acknowledging that we received it. A section of the handbook included dress codes, consequences for infractions, etc. Maybe something changed but you/your son hadn’t noticed it? If the school’s dress code isn’t spelled out somewhere it’s not fair that he is punished for some randomly changing rule.
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Post by Bridget in MD on Dec 1, 2022 14:45:20 GMT
Is this spelled out in the student handbook? Our kids received a new student handbook on the first day of school each year, and we had to return our signature acknowledging that we received it. A section of the handbook included dress codes, consequences for infractions, etc. Maybe something changed but you/your son hadn’t noticed it? If the school’s dress code isn’t spelled out somewhere it’s not fair that he is punished for some randomly changing rule.
Yes it is spelled out - the basic uniform, which i listed above - but when they make changes Ie the hoodies, I am not quite sure how they disseminate that news. Yesterday I got a text that students are now allowed to wear a Christmas sweater (of course it has to be appropriate - who the hell knows what that means) under their blazers thru the 15th. |
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Post by crazy4scraps on Dec 1, 2022 15:13:56 GMT
Reason #8,496 for why my kid doesn’t attend a private school. Uniforms suck.
Signed,
A person who wore them for seven straight years before breaking free.
Honestly, since it doesn’t appear that the emails are doing anything as far as giving you the answers to your questions, I would make an appointment to see whoever the Powers that Be are in person, with your son and get the answers you need face to face. I would go so far as to record the meeting for confirmation later should you need it.
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Post by Really Red on Dec 1, 2022 15:40:07 GMT
I like uniforms. My son had to wear one at his school, but they were not that strict. Your school sounds stricter than I have ever heard of! How old is your son? Can he handle some of this himself? I agree with everything you said, but sometimes it's not worth the fight and only you and your son can make that decision. If he is kept out of something like a scholarship luncheon, that makes it important enough to fight. If he has to do one lunch detention, then it's likely not as important.
I definitely think that there needs to be clarification. It sounds really, really strict.
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bethany102399
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,859
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Post by bethany102399 on Dec 1, 2022 15:43:36 GMT
Reason #8,496 for why my kid doesn’t attend a private school. Uniforms suck. Signed, A person who wore them for seven straight years before breaking free. AMEN. To this day I don't own a white button down shirt. Took me years to add plaid back into my wardrobe and honestly, I have one or two pieces. |
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Post by Bridget in MD on Dec 1, 2022 16:42:25 GMT
I like uniforms. My son had to wear one at his school, but they were not that strict. Your school sounds stricter than I have ever heard of! How old is your son? Can he handle some of this himself? I agree with everything you said, but sometimes it's not worth the fight and only you and your son can make that decision. If he is kept out of something like a scholarship luncheon, that makes it important enough to fight. If he has to do one lunch detention, then it's likely not as important. I definitely think that there needs to be clarification. It sounds really, really strict. I actually like uniforms too, takes the guesswork out in the morning, LOL. My DS is 17, a Junior. I called another mom friend and she helped me find the online policy, they have scrubbed the website and it explicitly says no hoodies at all now, so I told DS to go serve detention and that is the rule stated on the website. It's not fair, but it's like speeding in a car - the one time I do it I'll be caught, even though tons of others will get away with it. Such is life  |
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Aug 18, 2025 19:52:17 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2022 16:45:06 GMT
That sounds way too confusing to try and keep track of.
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Post by epeanymous on Dec 1, 2022 16:58:52 GMT
Probably an unpopular answer, but, at 17, given that the stakes here seem relatively low (detention is annoying but not life-altering), I'd let the kid manage the situation himself and would not be involved other than offering to talk things through with him in terms of strategy, wording, etc.
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Post by ~summer~ on Dec 1, 2022 17:01:30 GMT
This sounds very confusing.
I would just have my kid attend the lunch detention, not argue with the school and move on.
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Post by crazy4scraps on Dec 1, 2022 17:22:53 GMT
Reason #8,496 for why my kid doesn’t attend a private school. Uniforms suck. Signed, A person who wore them for seven straight years before breaking free. AMEN. To this day I don't own a white button down shirt. Took me years to add plaid back into my wardrobe and honestly, I have one or two pieces. Tell me about it! White polo shirts and either ugly ass navy blue plaid skirts or navy blue corduroy long pants. I refused to wear the plaid skirts and chose the corduroy even though it was horrifically hot come the end of May. I haven’t owned a pair of corduroy pants since.  I’ve been scarred for life, LOL. |
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Post by stingfan on Dec 1, 2022 17:29:15 GMT
A kid shouldn't be punished for breaking a rule that may or may not have been a rule the day he was cited. I would let them know that he wouldn't be serving detention until they could tell you the dates that different policies were enacted/changed and the dates of his "infractions".
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Post by Embri on Dec 1, 2022 17:41:40 GMT
I like uniforms. My son had to wear one at his school, but they were not that strict. Your school sounds stricter than I have ever heard of! How old is your son? Can he handle some of this himself? I agree with everything you said, but sometimes it's not worth the fight and only you and your son can make that decision. If he is kept out of something like a scholarship luncheon, that makes it important enough to fight. If he has to do one lunch detention, then it's likely not as important. I definitely think that there needs to be clarification. It sounds really, really strict. I actually like uniforms too, takes the guesswork out in the morning, LOL. My DS is 17, a Junior. I called another mom friend and she helped me find the online policy, they have scrubbed the website and it explicitly says no hoodies at all now, so I told DS to go serve detention and that is the rule stated on the website. It's not fair, but it's like speeding in a car - the one time I do it I'll be caught, even though tons of others will get away with it. Such is life If it is, then you'd be able to prove that the policy changed, or conversely that the website has always not mentioned hoodies being allowed.
TBH your school sounds like an oppressive authoritarian nightmare. Conformity or else!
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Post by ScrapbookMyLife on Dec 1, 2022 17:48:14 GMT
No kids, but my opinion is...
Sounds like the clothing policies are inconsistent and sometimes change. I would go by whatever the current policy is listed on the website.
I would make checking the website and clothing policy, a weekly task for your Son.
Sounds like some of the Administrators and staff will let things slide, ignore, not write up a student...and some purposely looks for any and all infractions, especially if they don't care for the Student and their Parents or have been challenged by a Parent or if the feel the Parent has gone above them in the chain of command.
Then there's the >> proverbial "favorites" are being played.
Some students likely get a pass or ignored every time (therefore always getting away with it) and others are watch and targeted waiting for the most minute of infractions.
This "favorites being played" is a common type of behavior in every situation and aspect of life. Not fair, but it happens frequently.
Since you Son had previously infractions(not wearing tie), he should pay the consequences and serve the detention.
Lesson learned:
Every day follow the dress code and clothing policies. Doesn't matter what everyone else is doing. Check the website weekly for the rules, as it seems they are changed periodically and without notice.
Personally, I think it sounds like a lot of "power trip" game playing going on.
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Post by bc2ca on Dec 1, 2022 18:08:37 GMT
I'd let it go. You and your DS now know the hoodie is not allowed. It doesn't really matter if the rule wasn't clear before or if it is not strictly enforced across the board. To push for an exemption or acknowledgement IMHO makes you as nit-picky as whoever is issuing the infractions. I am confused at infractions given on "tag days" as I'd assume students would be so clearly dressed out of uniform that there would be no question they were exempt from the dress code that day.  |
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Post by Bridget in MD on Dec 1, 2022 20:06:25 GMT
No kids, but my opinion is... Sounds like the clothing policies are inconsistent and sometimes change. I would go by whatever the current policy is listed on the website. I would make checking the website and clothing policy, a weekly task for your Son. Sounds like some of the Administrators and staff will let things slide, ignore, not write up a student...and some purposely looks for any and all infractions, especially if they don't care for the Student and their Parents or have been challenged by a Parent or if the feel the Parent has gone above them in the chain of command.
Then there's the >> proverbial "favorites" are being played.
Some students likely get a pass or ignored every time (therefore always getting away with it) and others are watch and targeted waiting for the most minute of infractions.
This "favorites being played" is a common type of behavior in every situation and aspect of life. Not fair, but it happens frequently.Since you Son had previously infractions(not wearing tie), he should pay the consequences and serve the detention. Lesson learned: Every day follow the dress code and clothing policies. Doesn't matter what everyone else is doing. Check the website weekly for the rules, as it seems they are changed periodically and without notice. Personally, I think it sounds like a lot of "power trip" game playing going on.Yep all that. The head dean is not really liked by the student body, and has his favorites (I guess my son is not one of them LOL). DS went and served detention. He spoke with the asst. Dean who was monitoring detention, the asst dean said he is very frustrated with the unclear policies, and that he's been trying to work with the head dean on that. He feels he just gets the infractions and has to notify the kids they serve detention, but he is frustrated that the policy seems to change or is unclear, or some kids are written up and others aren't. I'd let it go. You and your DS now know the hoodie is not allowed. It doesn't really matter if the rule wasn't clear before or if it is not strictly enforced across the board. To push for an exemption or acknowledgement IMHO makes you as nit-picky as whoever is issuing the infractions. I am confused at infractions given on "tag days" as I'd assume students would be so clearly dressed out of uniform that there would be no question they were exempt from the dress code that day. That was my point, of course he was out of dress code, he didn't have one stitch of uniform on his body during the tag days. So that's what first riled me up. Then the unclear hoodie thing too. |
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Post by mom on Dec 1, 2022 21:38:51 GMT
Late to this thread, but I have DS handle this. At 17, this is a great chance for him to practice standing up to himself and defending his actions.
That said, I'd also roll my eyes and send him to detention if, at the end of it all, he had actually broken the rules. It's just not a hill I'd die on. Live, learn the lesson and move on.
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scrapngranny
Pearl Clutcher
Only slightly senile
Posts: 4,948
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Post by scrapngranny on Dec 1, 2022 21:49:45 GMT
It’s time for your DS to handle his infractions of minor rules. How else is he going to learn there are consequences for behaviors and you are going to bail him out , it’s his responsibility. It’s a silly petty offense, a good place for him to start running his school life. Time to cut the apron strings.
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RosieKat
Drama Llama
PeaJect #12
Posts: 5,690
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Post by RosieKat on Dec 1, 2022 21:49:58 GMT
Glad the policy is maybe a little more clear at this point, for now, lol.
The school I attended my senior year of HS required navy blue socks. Nowhere did it say solid or anything. I went to Catholic school from 4th-12th grades, mind you, and got one detention. What was it for? One day wearing navy blue socks WITH A SINGLE BLACK STRIPE ON THEM! I was SUCH the rebel. After all, black on navy must have stood out like a sore thumb, too!
Having said that, I sucked it up and did the detention. I figured it was fair for all the times I'd deserved one (gum chewing, anyone?) and hadn't been caught. Maybe your son can look at it the same way.
And they sure as heck need to get the policy clarified and stated clearly on all platforms. Yeesh.
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Post by Lexica on Dec 1, 2022 23:23:24 GMT
The school gives out the hoodies, as well as sells them in their store, but they are not allowed to be worn on campus at any time? What kind of odd policy is that? It makes no sense to me. When exactly are they allowed to wear this hoodie, again, given to them by the school itself? Only when away from school as some sort of free advertising for the school? This is something that would not go over well with me.
I would recommend my son do as the dean instructed and serve the one detention. If detention is anything like it was when I was in school a million years ago, we all just got our homework out of the way so that we were free to go somewhere when we got home.
I only had detention once during all my years in school, but my ex husband and I went to school together and he was serving it all the time. Back then, detention was the lowest form of punishment a person could receive. The boys were given swats most of the time and depending on what they did wrong, they were sometimes offered a choice between a week's detention or x number of swats to get it over with right away.
The swats were given by the boys' gym teacher. He had a wooden paddle that was about an inch thick. He had drilled multiple holes in the paddle to allow it to travel through the air faster so that he could get more force with each swing. The boys were told to bend over and grab their ankles and he let them have it with this paddle. I saw so many guys leaving his office with tears in their eyes over the pain. It was barbaric. I don't know when that was outlawed, but it was years too late. The girls were given a toothbrush and told to go sweep the blacktop with it. They had to get on their knees and crawl around to do this. I imagine it was terribly painful to kneel on the blacktop. And this was just a generic public school, not a private school with uniforms. We did have a dress code though. Girls had to wear dresses long enough to touch the floor all around when they were on their knees. We were allowed to wear pant suits on Fridays. And never anything denim. It seems so archaic to me now.
I personally would then follow up with the dean as to exactly when these hoodies are allowed to be worn. Don't make it about them being lousy at posting clear rules, which they obviously are, make it about you being unable to easily locate a clear policy.
Then I would ask how, when a policy changes, are parents or students notified? Have the hoodies always been banned or is this a recent development? I might mention that I frequently saw students wearing them when you dropped your son off for school. And if they had always been banned, were the students told that when they received the hoodie in the first place? Is the onus upon the students to do a weekly check of their website to see if any rules have changed? Do they announce any changes in a general assembly at school? Maybe a family email? There is a serious lack of communication going on here, but you don't want to directly point that out to the dean because it might blow back on your son. Just say that you are seeking clarification as to when/where these school hoodies are allowed and where/how do you make sure you are keeping up on current dress code policy. Use the "I" statements, not the "you" statements so he doesn't feel attacked.
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Post by supersoda on Dec 1, 2022 23:30:59 GMT
Your son needs to handle this himself. He's got a year and a half until college/the workforce/the military, and in any of those situations he will need to be able to navigate situations much more serious than this without your help.
Signed,
the mom who did way too much for her oldest but is getting better
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Post by crazy4scraps on Dec 2, 2022 5:12:48 GMT
No kids, but my opinion is... Sounds like the clothing policies are inconsistent and sometimes change. I would go by whatever the current policy is listed on the website. I would make checking the website and clothing policy, a weekly task for your Son. Sounds like some of the Administrators and staff will let things slide, ignore, not write up a student...and some purposely looks for any and all infractions, especially if they don't care for the Student and their Parents or have been challenged by a Parent or if the feel the Parent has gone above them in the chain of command. Then there's the >> proverbial "favorites" are being played.
Some students likely get a pass or ignored every time (therefore always getting away with it) and others are watch and targeted waiting for the most minute of infractions. This "favorites being played" is a common type of behavior in every situation and aspect of life. Not fair, but it happens frequently. Since you Son had previously infractions(not wearing tie), he should pay the consequences and serve the detention. Lesson learned: Every day follow the dress code and clothing policies. Doesn't matter what everyone else is doing. Check the website weekly for the rules, as it seems they are changed periodically and without notice. Personally, I think it sounds like a lot of "power trip" game playing going on. OMG, the private school I went to was so much this. There were the really rich kids whose parents donated all the money for stuff like new football uniforms, and those kids could literally do anything and wouldn’t ever get in trouble because of who their daddy was. And then there was everybody else. God forbid if you were one of the scholarship kids who were attending the school at a cut rate and you happened to get caught doing anything remotely wrong. You learned quick to follow the rules and keep your head down and your mouth shut even though the rules obviously didn’t apply to everyone. |
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bethany102399
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,859
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Post by bethany102399 on Dec 2, 2022 18:00:17 GMT
Tell me about it! White polo shirts and either ugly ass navy blue plaid skirts or navy blue corduroy long pants. At least you got to wear pants! We were forced into skirts and the white button down tops. I remember wearing sweats under my skirt during the winter months (midwest) then having to shuck them off at the last minute once the bell rang. The school building was so freaking cold and drafty. |
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Post by crazy4scraps on Dec 2, 2022 21:47:31 GMT
Tell me about it! White polo shirts and either ugly ass navy blue plaid skirts or navy blue corduroy long pants. At least you got to wear pants! We were forced into skirts and the white button down tops. I remember wearing sweats under my skirt during the winter months (midwest) then having to shuck them off at the last minute once the bell rang. The school building was so freaking cold and drafty. Well, I’ll see your cold and drafty and raise you with sweltering and no air conditioning in the late spring months. In corduroy pants. 🥵🥵🥵 That school building was so ratty and falling apart it wasn’t even funny. I remember there was some kind of fluffy stuff that on the gym ceiling that would fall down in chunks. The kids would play with it. It was probably asbestos, I wouldn’t be surprised. |
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I’ve been scarred for life, LOL.
