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Post by curiouscrafter on Nov 8, 2024 18:30:28 GMT
I've done a lot of reading of peoples views over the past 2 days as there is a ton of hate going on, in addition to grief and projection of turmoil in the years to come.
This is what I've come up with:
* It's about Trump himself and not the Republican party.
* If another candidate had been running on behalf of the Republican party, the amount of grief people are having wouldn't be happening.
* Abortion rights are the #1 issue for those that voted for Harris.
* Feelings are that w/Trump (Vance), more womens rights will be taken away, control of womens bodies was just the first step.
* For those that voted for Trump, Abortion was not time of mind, the bigger issues are Immigration and Economy.
* If abortion wasn't part of the equation, would more people have voted for Trump based on Immigration and Economy.
* Women voted for Harris, strictly because she was a woman. It didn't matter what she stood for.
* Women wouldn't vote for Trump based on his past personal behavior (not what he did or didn't accomplish in his last presidency), no matter what.
* People would vote based on their party line - no matter who was running and what they stood for.
* Take Trump's issues and Abortion rights out of the equation - what would have been the outcome?
Honestly just trying to understand the mindset of why people voted the way they did, as I'm seeing hate for women that voted for Trump, without understanding that "maybe" for them the #1 wasn't women rights. There was not a perfect candidate, so people had to weigh what was most important for not only themself, but for the good of the country.
For me (a middle-age white woman), I voted for Harris. Not because she was a woman, and not because of womens rights. I absolutely agree that a womens body is for her to decide, no man should EVER decide what I have to do. I also don't look at this issue as the first step for womens rights to be taken away entirely. I didn't not vote for Trump based on how he treats women, I absolutely don't agree with his views and actions. I voted Harris because I think her being black, could help our very divided country unite. She's also younger than the previous presidents (since JFK ??) and able to relate to all generations. However, I was frustrated with Harris the past few weeks as all she talked about was Trump...STOP already, tell everyone what you are about, what your plan is, how you are going to unite us all. Her campaign even said that their strategy was to diss Trump...the talk now is that she shouldn't have ever mentioned Trumps name and just forged ahead with her plan, and she would have gained ground. Did she think she had it in the bag to win, as everybody witnessed first hand how Trump is, maybe? Did she think there is no way she could lose, maybe? So yes, voting for a candidate because she is black and young may not resinate with most people, but I believed she would have a strong team around her (as will Trump) that would have her do the American people good, in all areas. No president can do things solo, it takes a team, a big team, a team who are experts in what they know.
I now believe that Harris' #1 (womens right, how to treat women, etc) was not the #1 of most Americans. It's not "not important" its just something that can't lead our country for the next 4 years.
Please be kind in your responses, as overall more understanding is needed for everyone to have empathy for everyone involved.
and...for us to get thru the next 4 years, together.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Nov 8, 2024 18:54:36 GMT
I've done a lot of reading of peoples views over the past 2 days as there is a ton of hate going on, in addition to grief and projection of turmoil in the years to come. This is what I've come up with: * It's about Trump himself and not the Republican party. * If another candidate had been running on behalf of the Republican party, the amount of grief people are having wouldn't be happening. * Abortion rights are the #1 issue for those that voted for Harris. * Feelings are that w/Trump (Vance), more womens rights will be taken away, control of womens bodies was just the first step. * For those that voted for Trump, Abortion was not time of mind, the bigger issues are Immigration and Economy. * If abortion wasn't part of the equation, would more people have voted for Trump based on Immigration and Economy. * Women voted for Harris, strictly because she was a woman. It didn't matter what she stood for. * Women wouldn't vote for Trump based on his past personal behavior (not what he did or didn't accomplish in his last presidency), no matter what. * People would vote based on their party line - no matter who was running and what they stood for. * Take Trump's issues and Abortion rights out of the equation - what would have been the outcome? Honestly just trying to understand the mindset of why people voted the way they did, as I'm seeing hate for women that voted for Trump, without understanding that "maybe" for them the #1 wasn't women rights. There was not a perfect candidate, so people had to weigh what was most important for not only themself, but for the good of the country. For me (a middle-age white woman), I voted for Harris. Not because she was a woman, and not because of womens rights. I absolutely agree that a womens body is for her to decide, no man should EVER decide what I have to do. I also don't look at this issue as the first step for womens rights to be taken away entirely. I didn't not vote for Trump based on how he treats women, I absolutely don't agree with his views and actions. I voted Harris because I think her being black, could help our very divided country unite. She's also younger than the previous presidents (since JFK ??) and able to relate to all generations. However, I was frustrated with Harris the past few weeks as all she talked about was Trump...STOP already, tell everyone what you are about, what your plan is, how you are going to unite us all. Her campaign even said that their strategy was to diss Trump...the talk now is that she shouldn't have ever mentioned Trumps name and just forged ahead with her plan, and she would have gained ground. Did she think she had it in the bag to win, as everybody witnessed first hand how Trump is, maybe? Did she think there is no way she could lose, maybe? So yes, voting for a candidate because she is black and young may not resinate with most people, but I believed she would have a strong team around her (as will Trump) that would have her do the American people good, in all areas. No president can do things solo, it takes a team, a big team, a team who are experts in what they know. I now believe that Harris' #1 (womens right, how to treat women, etc) was not the #1 of most Americans. It's not "not important" its just something that can't lead our country for the next 4 years. Please be kind in your responses, as overall more understanding is needed for everyone to have empathy for everyone involved. and...for us to get thru the next 4 years, together. I don't really agree with many of your points. 1 and 2: It is largely about Trump but IMO, he represents the party now. There are very few, if any, Republicans that I would consider voting for because they all have taken on varying aspects of Trump's persona and will back him no matter what. 3. Abortion/access to reproductive rights are important to me but not the #1 issue. Stopping Trump's character and policy goals were probably even higher on the priority list for me than abortion. I think his policies will be disastrous for the US and the world if he implements them , as he and others close to him have stated. 4. I do agree that people think Trump/Vance will continue to take women's rights away. That is based on their own words and agenda. 5. I'm not sure. 6. I personally think people are misguided about the economy--how "bad" it is, how Trump's policies will affect the economy, the causes for high prices, and so on. I think a lot of us that voted for Harris can see this. 7. true. I would vote for my dog before I voted for Trump. I would not want him to be my neighbor or my coworker or my boss. Why would I want him to be the leader of our country who has access to any number of ways to screw us all over? 8. I don't know anyone who voted for Harris just because she was a woman. But I have heard of women (and men) who wouldn't vote for her because she is a woman. 9. I think this is true, mostly for Republicans. 10. I don't think you can take those out of the equation and try to speculate what would have happened. I do think that Harris could have focused more on her policy ideas rather than trying to remind people how horrible Trump is (many seem to have forgotten or don't care) but I also think it was important for people to know what he says and plans to do. I also think that she could have distanced herself more from Biden, but I also understand how that is difficult. But the rhetoric of her being in charge over the last four years resonated with people, especially those who don't seem to really understand how our government works, or care to understand. I also think that her online ads and marketing team were great, but her TV ads were not cutting it. I saw way more ads from Trump and there should have been some response to them. I think overall the main issue, besides ingrained racism and sexism, is that the Republicans messaging resonates with people because of fear and "othering." We asked how to combat that in 2016 and are still asking that now. Going high when they went low didn't work and there continues to be a huge double standard in expectations for Republicans vs Democrats. |
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Post by compeateropeator on Nov 8, 2024 19:11:46 GMT
There is a lot that I could say and try to explain…too much in fact. So I am starting by just putting stuff out there piece meal. I will start here for your question…
It is, IMO, not about Republicans but about MAGA Supporters. If you had a Republican who would be considered a RINO running on behalf of the Republicans I would not have anywhere near as much grief.
It is very much about Trump himself but also Trump/MAGA supporters. If a Marjorie Taylor Greene, A Mike Johnson, or A Jim Jordan, for example, was running as the Republican candidate I would have just as much angst and grief.
I will add the disclaimer if any of the ‘Republican’ candidates associate or have anything to do with Stephen Miller I automatically think they are aligned with the side of evil and have grief.
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Post by Lurkingpea on Nov 8, 2024 19:35:30 GMT
For me it was not women's rights that had me vote for Harris/Walz, it was HUMAN rights.
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Nov 8, 2024 20:23:26 GMT
In most states that actually had any part of abortion on their ballots the votes to pass them outnumbered the percent of votes for TFG/Vance.... So people consciously split their votes.
Hope I wrote that correctly.
***
There is no way on this earth I would have voted for any Republican who was the ballot this past November!!
Of course the overturning of Roe was on my mind. I remember some of those lost or damaged in 'back alley butchers'. I remember the haves who were able to visit their friendly parents' doctors'.. and yes I could name a few names....
I will not be around to see this mess resolved.
May my DGSs live their lives well and their children be able to protect their own bodies sooner than later!
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moodyblue
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,276 
Location: Western Illinois
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Jun 26, 2014 21:07:23 GMT
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Post by moodyblue on Nov 8, 2024 20:57:28 GMT
I read an interesting column this morning that talked about the huge impact right-wing media has on the people who watch and listen to Fox, Newsmax, I Heart Radio, Sinclair stations, etc. Many of the things that were most offensive in this election cycle, or were the biggest lies, weren’t started by Trump and Vance but were picked up by them when they got mentioned (people eating pets, for example) in some way by the right-wing media and then became huge memes and clips that got tons of exposure.
And, these right-wing media producers are owned by deep-pocket individuals and groups that of course will benefit from tax breaks and business policies that are targeted to the wealthy and their companies.
The column talked about how so many people only get their news from these sources, and the sources of course normalized Trump, and presented him as having to constantly fight against those who wanted to take him down, and how he was doing this all for "us." They didn’t present him as the insurrection-inciting, law-breaking, cruel, bigoted, racist, Fascist and wanna-be dictator. And the young people who were new to elections don’t have the memories and information that would make them see him in a different light.
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Post by hop2 on Nov 8, 2024 21:00:53 GMT
My number one issue was Supreme Court justices. Although it is related to rights of everyone. I can’t respect bought & paid for justices. I don’t like loosing my rights and I don’t like others loosing rights either, but it’s somehow more unconscionable that those rulings removing rights are being bought.
The more Trump spoke at rallies the more things he said that are entirely unacceptable to me.
*The use of the 1798 enemy alien act- why can’t we as a nation learn from our mistakes? Do we really want people rounded up without due process? Really?
*Repealing the civil rights act. No thank you, I like my civil rights, as I’m sure other minorities like theirs. Why would we want to go back to widespread discriminations like that? For what purpose?
*Tariffs- the last time the US enacted Tariffs as massive & as sweeping as he has spoken about it greatly contributed to the Great Depression. Dont trust me economists agree, look it up.
*The repeal of the ACA without out a patient first replacement. The ‘concept of a plan’ that put profits over people isn’t healthcare it’s a tragedy.
I could go on but those are the top points.
Wether or not any of them will ever admit it the next 4 years will hit everyone hard even his MAGAts
I may have as much trouble accessing my empathy as I do my rights.
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pantsonfire
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Post by pantsonfire on Nov 8, 2024 21:04:52 GMT
I do think that Harris could have focused more on her policy ideas rather than trying to remind people how horrible Trump is (many seem to have forgotten or don't care) but I also think it was important for people to know what he says and plans to do. And this is why I think local school board and city council members lost. A group focused on the behaviors of the right instead of focusing on plans, goals, etc. |
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huskergal
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Post by huskergal on Nov 8, 2024 21:05:29 GMT
53% of white women voted for Trump. I JUST DON'T GET IT!
As others said human rights was my number one issue.
There is no scenario that would have made me vote for Trump. Zero, zilch, nada, no way, no how.
At this point I am so disgusted by and Republican that voted for Trump. They gave their party to him. At least there are some reasonable Republicans. I like the ones who were voting to save our Democracy. Project 2025 is the fascism handbook. I read Trump's plans for public education. Scary stuff. If half of what he plans takes place, I will quit teaching.
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Post by leftturnonly on Nov 8, 2024 22:01:43 GMT
I've done a lot of reading of peoples views over the past 2 days as there is a ton of hate going on, in addition to grief and projection of turmoil in the years to come. This is what I've come up with: * It's about Trump himself and not the Republican party. TRUE* If another candidate had been running on behalf of the Republican party, the amount of grief people are having wouldn't be happening. TRUE* Abortion rights are the #1 issue for those that voted for Harris. TRUE for many* Feelings are that w/Trump (Vance), more womens rights will be taken away, control of womens bodies was just the first step. FALSE for people who voted for Trump.* For those that voted for Trump, Abortion was not time of mind, the bigger issues are Immigration and Economy. TRUE* If abortion wasn't part of the equation, would more people have voted for Trump based on Immigration and Economy. MAYBE, but that isn't the narrative that has been pushed night and day for years.* Women voted for Harris, strictly because she was a woman. It didn't matter what she stood for. TOO GENERAL an assumption.* Women wouldn't vote for Trump based on his past personal behavior (not what he did or didn't accomplish in his last presidency), no matter what. FALSE. His past personal behavior includes unremarked charity and beneficence for people of all colors and politics. People voted on only a small portion of what was reported of his past personal behavior. * People would vote based on their party line - no matter who was running and what they stood for. TRUE, IMO, through decades upon decades of listening to people personally tell me that they would vote D NO MATTER WHO OR WHAT.* Take Trump's issues and Abortion rights out of the equation - what would have been the outcome? An even greater landslide.Honestly just trying to understand the mindset of why people voted the way they did, as I'm seeing hate for women that voted for Trump, without understanding that "maybe" for them the #1 wasn't women rights. There was not a perfect candidate, so people had to weigh what was most important for not only themself, but for the good of the country. For me (a middle-age white woman), I voted for Harris. Not because she was a woman, and not because of womens rights. I absolutely agree that a womens body is for her to decide, no man should EVER decide what I have to do. I also don't look at this issue as the first step for womens rights to be taken away entirely. I didn't not vote for Trump based on how he treats women, I absolutely don't agree with his views and actions. I voted Harris because I think her being black, could help our very divided country unite. She's also younger than the previous presidents (since JFK ??) and able to relate to all generations. However, I was frustrated with Harris the past few weeks as all she talked about was Trump...STOP already, tell everyone what you are about, what your plan is, how you are going to unite us all. Her campaign even said that their strategy was to diss Trump...the talk now is that she shouldn't have ever mentioned Trumps name and just forged ahead with her plan, and she would have gained ground. Did she think she had it in the bag to win, as everybody witnessed first hand how Trump is, maybe? Did she think there is no way she could lose, maybe? So yes, voting for a candidate because she is black and young may not resinate with most people, but I believed she would have a strong team around her (as will Trump) that would have her do the American people good, in all areas. No president can do things solo, it takes a team, a big team, a team who are experts in what they know. I now believe that Harris' #1 (womens right, how to treat women, etc) was not the #1 of most Americans. It's not "not important" its just something that can't lead our country for the next 4 years. Please be kind in your responses, as overall more understanding is needed for everyone to have empathy for everyone involved. and...for us to get thru the next 4 years, together. What rights do women of all ages, from young girls to elderly women have when fully intact men are forced into their changing rooms and sports? What rights do unborn baby girls have? What rights are specifically protected by a Supreme Court Justice who didn't feel qualified to say what a woman means? What rights do women have when they are violently assaulted by people who already have convictions for violent crimes and who are allowed right back onto our streets? I'm a woman. I want the younger women in my family to be protected by more than platitudes and emotions. The baby boy or girl within her body has an independent anatomy and identity. His or her decision isn't given spit. King David in the Bible was far from perfect. If he had run, he wouldn't have been the perfect candidate either. BINGO! 1) Barrack Obama had the greatest opportunity of any person who ever lived in this country to do just that. He didn't do it. 2) You might be surprised at Kamala Harris's actual background. As with EVERY president we've ever had, her genealogy has been studied extensively recently and let's just say that historic documents are telling a different story than what the first version of her book presented. Yep But, but, but Trump! You don't have to look any further than the last 8 years on this very board to see that. Let's just take a look at some hard facts. One of these things is not like the others... and that's when she became the VP. Why expect anything different now? Trump's incoming White House Chief of Staff is a woman, the first for that position. She managed his 2024 presidential campaign. Trump's campaign manager for 2016 was a woman, the first to run a winning presidential campaign. That's just two of the easiest ones that come to mind of the reality of the opportunities that Trump has actually given to women. ABC, NBC, CBS, MSNBC, CNN, The New York Times.... Although I have to say that in the past several weeks, CBS and CNN have actually presented good, opposing commentators to Harris and Biden. Curiouscrafter - I responded to your post because it seemed genuine. I haven't read the board in a very long time and I don't know your post history, so there's nothing personal to you in my responses. I'm simply presenting an honest difference of opinion to this place and encouraging people to broaden their scope a bit.  |
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Post by lisae on Nov 8, 2024 22:35:20 GMT
Women voted for Harris, strictly because she was a woman. It didn't matter what she stood for. Around here women did not vote for Harris. 79% of our counties 20,000 + votes went to Trump. Clearly a lot of women voted for him. I probably know far more women who voted for him than for Harris. I voted for Harris because I consider Trump a danger to democracy and his economic proposals a disaster for the economy. I'm concerned about abortion rights but it is not my top issue. There are dozens more reasons why she was a better choice than him but those are at the top of the list. I do agree that if another Republican - a traditional Reagan/Bush/McCain/Romney Republican had won, we would be concerned about some issues but there wouldn't be nearly so much grief. |
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Post by aj2hall on Nov 8, 2024 22:48:42 GMT
My vote was not just against Trump (although I do have a million reasons to vote against him starting with the danger he poses to democracy). I voted for Harris because I strongly believe that she is the best candidate. Harris will protect the rights of everyone, especially vulnerable communities including women, minorities, people from low income brackets, immigrants, seniors and LGBTQ.
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Post by curiouscrafter on Nov 9, 2024 0:14:39 GMT
Thank you everyone for responding! This has been really insightful for me and I hope for others too.
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Olan
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Post by Olan on Nov 9, 2024 0:21:15 GMT
53% of white women voted for Trump. I JUST DON'T GET IT! As others said human rights was my number one issue. There is no scenario that would have made me vote for Trump. Zero, zilch, nada, no way, no how. At this point I am so disgusted by and Republican that voted for Trump. They gave their party to him. At least there are some reasonable Republicans. I like the ones who were voting to save our Democracy. Project 2025 is the fascism handbook. I read Trump's plans for public education. Scary stuff. If half of what he plans takes place, I will quit teaching. The numbers were similar the last time he was elected. And this idea that there are reasonable Republicans cracks me up. He all put called for Pence to be hung and Nancy wasn’t the only person running for her life on January 6th. Republicans don’t give a flying fuck about being reasonable when they support that type of administration. M |
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Post by MichyM on Nov 9, 2024 0:34:05 GMT
My vote was not just against Trump (although I do have a million reasons to vote against him starting with the danger he poses to democracy). I voted for Harris because I strongly believe that she is the best candidate. Harris will protect the rights of everyone, especially vulnerable communities including women, minorities, people from low income brackets, immigrants, seniors and LGBTQ. Exactly this for me. Social issues are of primary concern to me personally. Even back when I was barely (and I do mean VERY barely) scraping by, that was my focus when I voted. None of this "it's all about me and what I can get" crap. I worry about our entire population, and sure wish half the country did as well. I sure ain't seein' it from the folks who voted for the current president-elect. |
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Post by MichyM on Nov 9, 2024 0:38:00 GMT
BTW, I stay out of the political threads for the most part. That said, I REALLY appreciate that y'all have made a soft little spot where we/I can rant the last few days.
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scrappinmama
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Jun 26, 2014 12:54:09 GMT
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Post by scrappinmama on Nov 9, 2024 0:44:44 GMT
If it were any other Republican candidate, you would not have seen this level of anger at people who voted Republican. While some people may have been upset at the way Bush Vs Gore went down, people were not angry at the voters.
This is a moral issue for me. Trump lacks the morals, integrity or mental ability to be president. People who support Trump do not share my morals. Point blank. I do not support racism, homophobia, misogyny. They apparently are just fine with it. I mean, they voted for all of him, right? Am I being mean calling them out? I honestly don't care. If you vote for a racist, what does that say about you? I'm going to call it like I see it. If you didn't want to be called racist, you shouldn't have voted for one.
Why am I angry at Trump voters? Because they showed us who they are. People who voted for a con artist, racist, homophobic man who hates women. And they did all that for false promises of cheap groceries. So many people voted against their own interests. Women, Latino men, young people, poor people. Trump doesn't give a damn about them or their needs. He used them. They have been swindled. Some of them will find out the hard way. Some never will because they have been brainwashed by him.
But I'm not just angry at Trump, the Republican party and Trump voters. I'm angry at the Democratic party that dropped the damn ball. They ignored the concerns of the working class. Just listen to the comments from the exit polls. I'm also angry at Biden for not stepping out of the race much sooner. If he had done so, then maybe we could have had more choices on what to do and who would replace him? Maybe she wouldn't have had to squeeze a year-long campaign into 3 months?
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