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Post by 950nancy on Jun 30, 2015 22:35:51 GMT
To make a long story short, my husband just got his mom into an assisted living home this last week. She had a stroke in March. She is better, but cannot function at all on her own. She is 90 and has lived by herself for 34 years. Three of the siblings want her in this home (in the same town as two of the siblings), but the fourth sibling wants the mother to live with her in another state. SIL works from home, travels frequently, and raises her three grandchildren already. Her husband is not in a position to help with MIL or the grandchildren. Dissenting SIL was visiting family in New York for the past two weeks (her FIL is in hospice). She said that no one there could believe that they would put their mother in a home. She should live with her children and that is how it is done. SIL wants her to stop using a walker and Depends. She won't get better if she is given these "crutches." I was wondering if feelings about assisted living are more regional or if they are personal. In my MIL's case, she is just now able to use the bathroom by herself but cannot bathe, walk well, and her memory is very weak as the day progresses.
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Post by papersilly on Jun 30, 2015 22:48:00 GMT
I think it is personal far more than it is regional. it is what is best for the patient. you may not want to but you may HAVE to if it ensures their safety and constant care. assisted living can be loud, chaotic, unfamiliar and uncomfortable for the patient. it's not always the first option people want to exercise. there is also a stigma with placing a parent in a home. no child wants to feel like they have failed their parent or are abandoning their parent but people are faced with that difficult and personal decision every day. in the end, it's what's best for the patient that matters.
when my mom got really sick, between her savings and what we siblings pitched in, there enough to hire live-in care for her until her final days. staying with one of us was not a feasible option for her. my mom would never have agreed to it anyway. all she wanted was to stay in her home and we agreed so long as she was safe and cared for.
good luck to you guys. this is certainly not an easy situation. I hope you find the answer that works best for all of you, especially your MIL.
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Post by 950nancy on Jun 30, 2015 22:53:08 GMT
Sixteen people are on one side of the home who require more care (MIL's side) and 16 people are on the other side. There are two sets of tv rooms, living rooms, etc. The residents can go to either side. They each have their own rooms with their possessions. There is also medical staff available 24/7. Personally I could not have taken care of her. She has always been cold to me. My grandma did live with us for ten years when I was growing up, so I have seen it work.
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Post by cindyupnorth on Jun 30, 2015 22:55:07 GMT
I think it is all those things. Regional, personal, plus more including culture.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2015 22:59:38 GMT
If I still lived in Japan my BIL would be taking care of the ILs and would live with him forever and ever. That's the way things are done there. I had planned to do the same for my Mom, but she got sicker and sicker and has to go into assisted living for people with memory issues. This is what we had hoped for her, but it has to be done.
MIL relying on Depends and a walker give her independence and dignity. Depends will keep her from having embarrassing accidents and not wearing them is utter BS. People don't use walkers because they are fun. They are a medical device used to keep people as mobile as possible. Can I slap your SIL? She clearly has no concept of what aging people need.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2015 0:04:09 GMT
Regional, personal, cultural, and financial.
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Post by 950nancy on Jul 1, 2015 0:49:59 GMT
Wow. I was all behind SIL caring for her until you said the part about a walker and depends. Lost me there. Can she still walk unassisted and generally maintain bladder control? Otherwise I just don't get it. She can't get up out of a chair by herself or the bed (so I would guess the toilet too). I didn't ask specifically about the Depends other than she wanted to wear them and my SIL does not want her to wear them because she think she won't get better. Honestly, she's 90 and just had a major stroke. I would want to wear them too. My SIL is a bit of a martyr and isn't clearly thinking about how much time it would take to help and entertain her mother. SIL says MIL wants to come live with her, but MIL is telling the other three kids she doesn't want to live with SIL because it is too busy there. Keeping my mouth shut and praying she doesn't want to come here. My husband is her favorite (no secret there). |
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valleyview
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Post by valleyview on Jul 1, 2015 0:56:09 GMT
My experience was that children who were not with parent in a regular basis were ill-equipped to understand the need for more help. I hope that reason prevails, because it sounds like assisted living is your best choice.
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melissa
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Post by melissa on Jul 1, 2015 1:04:57 GMT
That SIL not only has personal feelings on the topic, she is in denial about your MIL's diagnosis and prognosis.
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Post by polz on Jul 1, 2015 1:11:34 GMT
Regional, personal, cultural, and financial. This. My aunt was my Nan's caregiver for five years. it's just not done in my culture to put your grandmother in a home. Even if we were millionaires a family member would have cared for my Nan in her declining years. |
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Post by txdancermom on Jul 1, 2015 1:14:56 GMT
It sounds like your MIL is in a good place. I know I have a friend who wouldn't even consider having a family member in a nursing home or assisted living under any circumstances.
My grandma decided she needed more help and found an assisted living center to move into, and made all the arrangements. I have a feeling that my dad (almost 92) will tell us when he is ready for something like that.
dh and his sister tried to take care of their parents in their home and after 2 weeks both were exhausted and knew at that time that something had to be done. my sil is a nurse and has worked on a geriatric ward so she knew what she was in for, but not 24/7.
the nursing home they found for their parents was a wonderful place and they took excellent care of them. there is no way that dh and his sister could have managed that, it was the best for all involved.
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Post by lindywholoveskids on Jul 1, 2015 1:16:20 GMT
I realize that lots of families take votes, etc on the care options for parents in need.
With my mil and mom, we needed to use a Geriatric Care Manager because it wasn't so clear where they should go.
No one had room for my mom, and she was full in to her dementia / Alzheimer's. She went into an incredible non profit Skilled a Nursing Facility where she passed away 3 yrs later. They were wonderful.
We ended out moving my MIL to the same wonderful place about a yr ago. 24/7 care in her home wasn't working because of a new law passed in CA requiring caregivers to have time off at night ( necessitating a 3 rd caregiver)
My MIL is ok, but in hospice now there where she lives. It's only 10 minutes from our house. My BIL lives about 5 hrs away and sees her every few months.
When the family can't come up with a plan that is a situation that's healthy and safe for the elder, the Care Manager can be of great help.
You can find them in every state under Licensed Geriatric care managers.
We we're also able to afford a wonderful companion to visit my mom. They made cookies in a toaster oven in her room and shared them with the residents! That companion went on to also become a Geriatric Care Manager.
When in doubt you can call the Alzheimer's Association 800# 24/7, which we did - sometimes in the middle of the night. I would ask to speak with a social worker because physical and medical needs were being met , but family dynamics were sometimes in need of help. That worked for us.
Recently when my MIL went into hospice care ( didn't have to move) we had questions about advanced dementia and pain management.shes ok now / stable. And she will be 98 next month!
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Post by lindywholoveskids on Jul 1, 2015 1:21:59 GMT
On the Alzheimer's website you can find the Activities of Daily Living- it's very clear that if the person can't do 3 or more of these , they need assistance. With my Mom and Mil , the meds need sped to be monitored by an RN. And supervised by her dr. She wasn't able to manage them for the past decade or so.
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Post by 950nancy on Jul 1, 2015 3:21:03 GMT
On the Alzheimer's website you can find the Activities of Daily Living- it's very clear that if the person can't do 3 or more of these , they need assistance. With my Mom and Mil , the meds need sped to be monitored by an RN. And supervised by her dr. She wasn't able to manage them for the past decade or so. They used that list to decide to decide which part of the care facility she would live. She needed the side with medical assistance. She said she did not want to go back to her house and was lonely. |
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Post by 950nancy on Jul 1, 2015 3:24:34 GMT
I realize that lots of families take votes, etc on the care options for parents in need. With my mil and mom, we needed to use a Geriatric Care Manager because it wasn't so clear where they should go. No one had room for my mom, and she was full in to her dementia / Alzheimer's. She went into an incredible non profit Skilled a Nursing Facility where she passed away 3 yrs later. They were wonderful. We ended out moving my MIL to the same wonderful place about a yr ago. 24/7 care in her home wasn't working because of a new law passed in CA requiring caregivers to have time off at night ( necessitating a 3 rd caregiver) My MIL is ok, but in hospice now there where she lives. It's only 10 minutes from our house. My BIL lives about 5 hrs away and sees her every few months. When the family can't come up with a plan that is a situation that's healthy and safe for the elder, the Care Manager can be of great help. You can find them in every state under Licensed Geriatric care managers. We we're also able to afford a wonderful companion to visit my mom. They made cookies in a toaster oven in her room and shared them with the residents! That companion went on to also become a Geriatric Care Manager. When in doubt you can call the Alzheimer's Association 800# 24/7, which we did - sometimes in the middle of the night. I would ask to speak with a social worker because physical and medical needs were being met , but family dynamics were sometimes in need of help. That worked for us. Recently when my MIL went into hospice care ( didn't have to move) we had questions about advanced dementia and pain management.shes ok now / stable. And she will be 98 next month! Good information I didn't know anything about. I will write down that info. MIL has two kids in town only about 10 minutes away. They both have 6 adult kids (combined) who live in the city or within two hours. She will have lots of company and since the stroke someone from the family has been with her all day or part of the day. They are hoping she makes friends. She loves to play games and has been invited to play with the other residents. Her sister was in a care facility (less monitoring) and the sister loved it. |
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Post by 950nancy on Jul 1, 2015 3:32:46 GMT
For those of you who have cared for (or know someone who cared for) a parent, who stays home with the parent all day every day? Who helps at night? I just can't imagine taking care of my MIL.
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Post by bc2ca on Jul 1, 2015 3:34:20 GMT
My experience was that children who were not with parent in a regular basis were ill-equipped to understand the need for more help. I hope that reason prevails, because it sounds like assisted living is your best choice. I think it is really easy to underestimate the level of care needed unless you are living with or interacting daily with the person needing care. At 90, your MIL is going to be facing more health challenges not fewer and it sounds like she is in the best place for her to be. I think the feelings about assisted living are more cultural and personal than regional. |
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Post by elaine on Jul 1, 2015 3:44:09 GMT
On the Alzheimer's website you can find the Activities of Daily Living- it's very clear that if the person can't do 3 or more of these , they need assistance. With my Mom and Mil , the meds need sped to be monitored by an RN. And supervised by her dr. She wasn't able to manage them for the past decade or so. They used that list to decide to decide which part of the care facility she would live. She needed the side with medical assistance. She said she did not want to go back to her house and was lonely. If this is what your MIL wants, your SIL should honor her wishes. At 90, it IS NOT about her "getting better," it is about honoring her wishes for how she wants to live out the rest of her life. If that means wearing Depends, using a walker, and living in assisted living/a nursing home, then so be it. Those are HER choices, and those wishes certainly CAN be honored. |
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Post by bc2ca on Jul 1, 2015 4:05:53 GMT
For those of you who have cared for (or know someone who cared for) a parent, who stays home with the parent all day every day? Who helps at night? I just can't imagine taking care of my MIL. This has happened in DH's family. The dad was cared for by mom with the help of their teen daughter. After dad dies, mom is diagnosed with Alzheimer's and daughter spends the next 10 years caring for her night and day. Her brother lived with them and she effectively was his housekeeper and cook as well. She is the loveliest person but never married or had kids because by age 30 she was done with looking after people. Her brother never married because he hasn't been able to find someone willing to look after him the way his mother and sister did. In this case it was completely cultural (Greek) and based on traditional expectations. |
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Post by crazy4scraps on Jul 1, 2015 4:14:59 GMT
For those of you who have cared for (or know someone who cared for) a parent, who stays home with the parent all day every day? Who helps at night? I just can't imagine taking care of my MIL. You're in a tough spot, BTDT myself and it was ugly. My mom lived at home with my youngest brother until the last year of her life which was what she wanted. She had Alzheimer's and could no longer care for herself, and there was only so much my brother could do. I had a newborn at the time and I was doing everything I could do (all financials, took her to all appointments, handled her meds, etc.), and two more brothers pitched in when they could with whatever they could. Even my out of state sister helped out when she visited. When mom started attempting to wander in the middle of the night, was incontinent and needed help with bathing and washing her hair, my other sister (local) did NOT want mom to go to adult daycare even though she wasn't willing to step up and help out more (she didn't do much to begin with). She fought the rest of us tooth and nail on it because she didn't want us to spend mom's money on that (seriously?). We did it anyway, because my brother couldn't stay up watching her 24/7 and was uncomfortable with having to help her bathe, etc. and I didn't blame him. The poor guy needed that respite so he could get some uninterrupted sleep! We sent her to daycare 3x a week for a year until she needed a higher level of daily care. That's when it all really hit the fan because that same sister REALLY didn't want us to spend the thousands per month it would cost for a nursing home, and in-home skilled nursing care cost even more than that. She was vetoed and we chose a very nice place close to the majority of us so we could visit. My sister threw a fit and the entire year my mom was in that home (where my three brothers and their families, me, my DH and our DD and a few of the older grandkids would visit regularly) my sister kept looking for somewhere further away from us to move her to.  She maybe made it over there twice a month if that, and NONE of her three kids (two of whom were adults by then) EVER made it over there even once in the year she lived there! The bottom line is that the people who are in the thick of it are the ones who should be making the decisions, not someone who is far away and doesn't have a clue what is really going on day to day. Regardless of what the patient wants, you need to do what is best for their personal situation to ensure their health, safety and welfare, especially if they are unable to make those kinds of decisions for themselves. Your SIL doesn't have the first clue. |
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Post by 950nancy on Jul 1, 2015 4:53:56 GMT
crazy4scraps I am with you on this. The other daughter is 600+ miles away. My husband has a medical background and is power of attorney. The daughter that lives 10 minutes away just had a cancer scare, moved her home of 30+ years to another city so her husband who just retired could take another job, and has been taking care of her mother throughout her recovery from surgery. Out of town sister has been twice to visit. My husband is going back for the fifth time and feels badly about all of it. Before we were married, my husband used to say his mom would never go into a home and that she would live with each of the kids for three months out of the year. I was pretty sure that was never going to happen since she hasn't ever had a conversation with me for more than 30 seconds in our 32 year history. As she aged, she stayed quite healthy and this stroke has taken the four kids aback. How can she be sick? She was just healthy. For her to have lived 90 years and had one health issue prior to the stroke is amazing. I want to shake them all and tell them how lucky they have been to have had her around and healthy for so long. I lost my mom when she was 58 and my dad at 69, so 90 seems like an amazing gift. Thankfully the money is not a huge issue yet. She gets VA benefits that pay for $1200 of it a month, but it still isn't cheap. Right now the issue is the one sister saying mom is telling her one thing and the three other kids hearing another. Ugh. I hate how badly my husband is feeling over all of it.
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Post by crazy4scraps on Jul 1, 2015 5:05:16 GMT
Right now the issue is the one sister saying mom is telling her one thing and the three other kids hearing another. Ugh. I hate how badly my husband is feeling over all of it. My mom did this too before she got really bad. I have one older brother that moved in with mom and younger brother for a while. He drove them both nuts, but he would press her to tell him she wanted him to stay and eventually she would give in and agree that's what she wanted. But then when he wasn't around, she would tell anybody who would listen the exact opposite and that he was driving her nuts and she wanted him to move back to his house (which was four blocks away)! So in that situation, I would also believe what she's telling the majority of the siblings and vote down the odd man out. |
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anniebygaslight
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Post by anniebygaslight on Jul 1, 2015 5:36:49 GMT
I think it is all those things. Regional, personal, plus more including culture.  |
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Post by 950nancy on Jul 1, 2015 15:32:19 GMT
Right now the issue is the one sister saying mom is telling her one thing and the three other kids hearing another. Ugh. I hate how badly my husband is feeling over all of it. My mom did this too before she got really bad. I have one older brother that moved in with mom and younger brother for a while. He drove them both nuts, but he would press her to tell him she wanted him to stay and eventually she would give in and agree that's what she wanted. But then when he wasn't around, she would tell anybody who would listen the exact opposite and that he was driving her nuts and she wanted him to move back to his house (which was four blocks away)! So in that situation, I would also believe what she's telling the majority of the siblings and vote down the odd man out. So far, that is where it stands. |
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Post by kate on Jul 1, 2015 17:55:31 GMT
My grandma decided she needed more help and found an assisted living center to move into, and made all the arrangements. This was my MIL. I call her the poster child for assisted living! She's in much better health than when she was trying to make it on her own. She's very together mentally, and she gets around using a walker if she has to go far. I keep meaning to ask her if she encountered mean girls when she moved in...
My grandma was terrified of being "put in a home" because her mother was in some state facility (maybe in the 1940's?) that was a horror show. My mom took care of her mom at home through years of health problems and final battle with cancer.
My mom said she herself will go to assisted living when she needs to, and that we should "put her in a home" if she needs it someday, even if she objects at the time!
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Post by crittsmom on Jul 2, 2015 3:34:27 GMT
We moved my dad into assisted living about a year after his wife had passed. My brother and his friend had stayed with him, but my brother was getting tired of it. He lasted about another year there, he wasn't extremely happy about it. Once he made some friends, it got better for him. We would stop by 2-3 times a week, it was only about 15 mins away. He was 87. He started to give up when he turned 88 and passed away a couple months after that.
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She maybe made it over there twice a month if that, and NONE of her three kids (two of whom were adults by then) EVER made it over there even once in the year she lived there!
