Sarah*H
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,973
Jun 25, 2014 20:07:06 GMT
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Post by Sarah*H on Dec 3, 2015 17:57:01 GMT
No doubt that WILL be an interesting shift because my recollection on the Syrian refugee thread was that many on the left pointed out that people are being radicalized right here and that ISIS doesn't need to rely on an uncertain refugee screening and placement process to get into the United States.
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Post by maryland on Dec 3, 2015 18:00:31 GMT
In many cases, I don't even perceive it as lip service anymore, I see it as shameless pandering to their own base because I'm sure the victims yesterday really cared that my backwater Congressman in western PA tweeted them thoughts and prayers. How many of them follow his twitter feed? Are his initials D.M.?
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Sarah*H
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,973
Jun 25, 2014 20:07:06 GMT
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Post by Sarah*H on Dec 3, 2015 18:08:30 GMT
No, I was talking about Tim Murphy who apparently deleted the tweet that was linked. His only tweet about it now says "Profound sorrow - beyond words."
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Post by bc2ca on Dec 3, 2015 18:08:07 GMT
Until we get to the mental health issue, screaming gun control isn't going to change things. California had the bans in place. Didn't stop them. Same in Chicago, same in Paris. Gun bans aren't going to stop mass violence. It's cause and effect. I'd prefer to focus on the cause, not the effect (means). I think we can work on both mental health issues and gun control. If you look at countries that have much stricter gun controls they do not have the mass violence we have in the US.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Dec 3, 2015 18:33:08 GMT
No doubt that WILL be an interesting shift because my recollection on the Syrian refugee thread was that many on the left pointed out that people are being radicalized right here and that ISIS doesn't need to rely on an uncertain refugee screening and placement process to get into the United States. Actually people on both sides were agreeing with that is a huge area of concern on the Syrian refugee crisis thread.
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Post by gmcwife1 on Dec 3, 2015 18:39:44 GMT
I think the bashing and mocking of politicians for offering their thoughts and prayers with the victims is misguided at best. But here's the latest for you all to tear into: "Our first order of business is to send our thoughts and prayers." Can't wait for you and the blogsphere to mock President Obama. I don't usually listen to his speeches because of his long drawn out pauses, but I did this morning and I really appreciated what he had to say.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 5, 2024 7:51:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2015 18:52:12 GMT
That's no more ignorant than the idiots who are accusing the NRA and the gun industry of orchestrating these events to increase gun sales. Oh wait - that's what you guys are really saying, isn't it? Stfu about the NRA. "Your" side has many many shadowy organizations dumping millions into the hands of politicians to advance their anti-Liberty agendas and actually line their own already deep deep pockets. The NRA is a boogeyman. Open your damn eyes to the reality of this world. Find the real enemies. Take off your liberal apologist blinders before it's too late. The worse thing that ever happened to this country is the NRA the best thing that could ever happen to this country is if the NRA was gone. Harsh sentiment maybe but only a dimwit does not understand the roll the NRA has played in this country earning the disgusting but true title of "Mass Murder Country of the World". Now to go down to your childish remarks. I can say WHATEVER I want about the NRA and there is not a damn thing you can do about it. So there! By the way. You really should see someone about your anger problems. Can't be good for your health. Oh you stung me, Krazy. Ouch. My anger? All you numbskulls are blaming a single organization for all these shootings while ignoring the real reasons behind them. Islam. Society's descent into amorality and political correctness. The rejection of personal responsibility. The rewarding of abhorrent behavior. The celebrating of victim hood. And Islam. And that just scratched the surface. But please Krazy- once again please enlighten me with your long list of laws that the NRA has thwarted that would have absolutely stopped this, or any, of the shootings in the last 7 years of liberal reign. I'll remind you that CA already has the toughest laws in the country. Google "CA legal AR" or go to the CA DOJ website and read all about it. American citizens in CA already have to jump through ungodly hoops in order to exercise their constitutional rights. These cretins did not obey they laws. The CA limits in ARs did not stop them from spraying untold numbers of bullets into that room. You are a complete idiot to keep blaming the NRA, when every "common sense" measure you have sqwaked about in the past has failed to stop anything. You want to know who has more culpability than the NRA? CAIR. You want to go after an organization that bribes politicians and kills people? Start there.
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama
La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Dec 3, 2015 18:53:30 GMT
IMHO, after so many mass shootings without calls for something to change, the "prayers & thoughts" comes across as empty lip service rather than compassion. Well I think it's interesting that we'll see the exact opposite responses when the discussion begins about the shooter being radicalized (which CNN is currently reporting). We'll see the seismic shift of the right shouting about what needs to be done and accusing the left of being of the "so sad, too bad, nothing we can do" Yes, I would imagine the responses would be different given that, on one hand, we are talking about human beings and, on the other, inanimate objects.
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Sarah*H
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,973
Jun 25, 2014 20:07:06 GMT
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Post by Sarah*H on Dec 3, 2015 18:55:28 GMT
At least you aren't pretending anymore.
And I quite agree with you, clearly one of the problems in our society right now is too much civility. Down with that amoral political correctness, down I say!
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Post by Merge on Dec 3, 2015 18:56:20 GMT
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama
La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Dec 3, 2015 19:05:46 GMT
Islam. Society's descent into amorality and political correctness. The rejection of personal responsibility. The rewarding of abhorrent behavior. The celebrating of victim hood. And Islam. And that just scratched the surface. How was Islam responsible for the mass shooting in Georgia yesterday? Or the one in Colorado Springs last week? Minneapolis, Columbus, Houston, Conway, Boston - also last week?
FFS, that doesn't even include the 5 separate mass shootings on the 22nd that injured 35 people.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Dec 3, 2015 19:18:51 GMT
Well I think it's interesting that we'll see the exact opposite responses when the discussion begins about the shooter being radicalized (which CNN is currently reporting). We'll see the seismic shift of the right shouting about what needs to be done and accusing the left of being of the "so sad, too bad, nothing we can do" Yes, I would imagine the responses would be different given that, on one hand, we are talking about human beings and, on the other, inanimate objects. That's just silly. It does nothing to actually find common ground and have a prayer of actually enacting the change people say they want, to not acknowledge the impact on people.
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Nanner
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,962
Jun 25, 2014 23:13:23 GMT
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Post by Nanner on Dec 3, 2015 19:35:09 GMT
Stfu about the NRA. "Your" side has many many shadowy organizations dumping millions into the hands of politicians to advance their anti-Liberty agendas and actually line their own already deep deep pockets. The NRA is a boogeyman. Open your damn eyes to the reality of this world. Find the real enemies. Take off your liberal apologist blinders before it's too late. ok, after all these years, I'm going to say it. You are fucking CRAZY. STFU? Seriously? Are you fucking serious? Thank goodness I don't live in the same country as you, you moron. People keep getting murdered by gun wielding psychos, but you always have an excuse, don't you. The realities of this world? All those mass shootings are the realities of this world? More guns, more guns, more guns!!!! Everytime I read your lunatic posts, I see red. I can't even read them anymore. You really are fucking CRAZY.
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama
La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Dec 3, 2015 19:37:43 GMT
Yes, I would imagine the responses would be different given that, on one hand, we are talking about human beings and, on the other, inanimate objects. That's just silly. It does nothing to actually find common ground and have a prayer of actually enacting the change people say they want, to not acknowledge the impact on people. You'll have to be a bit clearer - which part is silly? The part where some believe that humans should be valued above objects? Or the part where you are trying to compare things that are fundamentally different?
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pudgygroundhog
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,643
Location: The Grand Canyon
Jun 25, 2014 20:18:39 GMT
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Post by pudgygroundhog on Dec 3, 2015 20:27:33 GMT
Until we get to the mental health issue, screaming gun control isn't going to change things. California had the bans in place. Didn't stop them. Same in Chicago, same in Paris. Gun bans aren't going to stop mass violence. It's cause and effect. I'd prefer to focus on the cause, not the effect (means). The ATF has confirmed that the guns were purchased legally, but not details released yet on where the guns were purchased (i.e. out of state) or how they ended up in the hands of the killers. www.cbsnews.com/news/san-bernardino-shooting-atf-says-all-4-guns-bought-legally/I don't know what your personal stance is on guns or mental health and how we provide it, so this is a general comment. I feel that some people often cite mental health to deflect from the issue of guns, but they don't really care about funding or programs for mental health; it's just a convenient talking point.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 5, 2024 7:51:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2015 20:38:17 GMT
Oh you stung me, Krazy. Ouch. My anger? All you numbskulls are blaming a single organization for all these shootings while ignoring the real reasons behind them. Islam. Society's descent into amorality and political correctness. The rejection of personal responsibility. The rewarding of abhorrent behavior. The celebrating of victim hood. And Islam. And that just scratched the surface. But please Krazy- once again please enlighten me with your long list of laws that the NRA has thwarted that would have absolutely stopped this, or any, of the shootings in the last 7 years of liberal reign. I'll remind you that CA already has the toughest laws in the country. Google "CA legal AR" or go to the CA DOJ website and read all about it. American citizens in CA already have to jump through ungodly hoops in order to exercise their constitutional rights. These cretins did not obey they laws. The CA limits in ARs did not stop them from spraying untold numbers of bullets into that room. You are a complete idiot to keep blaming the NRA, when every "common sense" measure you have sqwaked about in the past has failed to stop anything. You want to know who has more culpability than the NRA? CAIR. You want to go after an organization that bribes politicians and kills people? Start there. I'm really getting concerned about you and your rants. But you know what? I think you might have a career in writing FICTIONAL conspiracy thrillers. Might want to give it a try. Might be a good outlet for your frustrations and anger. And you might make some money in the process. Now seriously. Yes I hold the NRA responsible for what is happening with guns in America. And I'll tell you why. Yes CA has some of the strongest gun laws around. In San Francisco they are or going to pass a law that all gun purchases in gun stores be video taped and turned over the police. That law or potential law caused the last gun shop to close in SF. Chicago has some of the toughest gun laws around that don't seem to be working. You want to know why these laws don't work? Simple because they are regional and this country has not become the police state some of you believe it has become by checking every person as they pass from one state/city to another for guns. And because of the piecemeal laws that make it too damn easy for the wrong people to get guns. And who is responsible for this? The NRA. IMO the only way to make the laws work is if they are federal laws that apply to all guns and all gun owners. But that will never happen as long as the NRA has the GOP lawmakers in DC in their pocket. How did we get to the point where GOP candidates have to pass the NRA litmus test to successfully become the candidate of choice GOP?
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Post by anxiousmom on Dec 3, 2015 20:46:33 GMT
The worse thing that ever happened to this country is the NRA the best thing that could ever happen to this country is if the NRA was gone. Harsh sentiment maybe but only a dimwit does not understand the roll the NRA has played in this country earning the disgusting but true title of "Mass Murder Country of the World". Now to go down to your childish remarks. I can say WHATEVER I want about the NRA and there is not a damn thing you can do about it. So there! By the way. You really should see someone about your anger problems. Can't be good for your health. Oh you stung me, Krazy. Ouch. My anger? All you numbskulls are blaming a single organization for all these shootings while ignoring the real reasons behind them. Islam. Society's descent into amorality and political correctness. The rejection of personal responsibility. The rewarding of abhorrent behavior. The celebrating of victim hood. And Islam. And that just scratched the surface. But please Krazy- once again please enlighten me with your long list of laws that the NRA has thwarted that would have absolutely stopped this, or any, of the shootings in the last 7 years of liberal reign. I'll remind you that CA already has the toughest laws in the country. Google "CA legal AR" or go to the CA DOJ website and read all about it. American citizens in CA already have to jump through ungodly hoops in order to exercise their constitutional rights. These cretins did not obey they laws. The CA limits in ARs did not stop them from spraying untold numbers of bullets into that room. You are a complete idiot to keep blaming the NRA, when every "common sense" measure you have sqwaked about in the past has failed to stop anything. You want to know who has more culpability than the NRA? CAIR. You want to go after an organization that bribes politicians and kills people? Start there. You know, I would take this so much more seriously if I didn't think half of it came straight out of Rush Limbaugh's mouth.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 5, 2024 7:51:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2015 20:53:00 GMT
Until we get to the mental health issue, screaming gun control isn't going to change things. California had the bans in place. Didn't stop them. Same in Chicago, same in Paris. Gun bans aren't going to stop mass violence. It's cause and effect. I'd prefer to focus on the cause, not the effect (means). The ATF has confirmed that the guns were purchased legally, but not details released yet on where the guns were purchased (i.e. out of state) or how they ended up in the hands of the killers. www.cbsnews.com/news/san-bernardino-shooting-atf-says-all-4-guns-bought-legally/I don't know what your personal stance is on guns or mental health and how we provide it, so this is a general comment. I feel that some people often cite mental health to deflect from the issue of guns, but they don't really care about funding or programs for mental health; it's just a convenient talking point. The guns were purchased legally by the shooters at a local gun store, Annie's Get Your Gun. www.latimes.com/visuals/graphics/la-me-g-san-bernardino-shooting-20151202-htmlstory.html
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jayfab
Drama Llama
procastinating
Posts: 5,521
Jun 26, 2014 21:55:15 GMT
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Post by jayfab on Dec 3, 2015 20:55:52 GMT
Oh you stung me, Krazy. Ouch. My anger? All you numbskulls are blaming a single organization for all these shootings while ignoring the real reasons behind them. Islam. Society's descent into amorality and political correctness. The rejection of personal responsibility. The rewarding of abhorrent behavior. The celebrating of victim hood. And Islam. And that just scratched the surface. But please Krazy- once again please enlighten me with your long list of laws that the NRA has thwarted that would have absolutely stopped this, or any, of the shootings in the last 7 years of liberal reign. I'll remind you that CA already has the toughest laws in the country. Google "CA legal AR" or go to the CA DOJ website and read all about it. American citizens in CA already have to jump through ungodly hoops in order to exercise their constitutional rights. These cretins did not obey they laws. The CA limits in ARs did not stop them from spraying untold numbers of bullets into that room. You are a complete idiot to keep blaming the NRA, when every "common sense" measure you have sqwaked about in the past has failed to stop anything. You want to know who has more culpability than the NRA? CAIR. You want to go after an organization that bribes politicians and kills people? Start there. You know, I would take this so much more seriously if I didn't think half of it came straight out of Rush Limbaugh's mouth. I'm starting to think she IS Rush Limbaugh.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 5, 2024 7:51:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2015 21:30:10 GMT
You know, I would take this so much more seriously if I didn't think half of it came straight out of Rush Limbaugh's mouth. I'm starting to think she IS Rush Limbaugh. ha ha ha. If only you all got your heads out of the asses of the liberal elites... you don't see the irony of accusing me of being "rush limbaugh" while you do nothing but parrot the talking points of every democrat on earth. Seriously. After all these years, its become quite amusing. But I also no longer have the patience to suffer fools. And fools you all are. I have the ability to use common sense. You, apparently, have lost that ability. I feel for you. Truly. The NRA is no more responsible for the gun violence in this country, than the American Medical Association is responsible for bad doctors. The total lack of critical thinking, fear of offending some victim group, desire to be a useful idiot...I don't know what causes this illness, but I'm sick of trying to bring light to you darkness. Please, Krazy...since you have once again sidestepped my question about which laws the NRA has thwarted that would have stopped this massacre...let me ask you this - Europe has almost universal gun control/gun bans. So how did the NRA cause last months Paris attack? I'll take you answer in long form, short form, as long as you provide facts. You are always completely devoid of facts. Please also explain how the NRA is responsible for the myriad of pipe bomb and incendiary devices that these cretins in SB had concocted...it's obvious that they had grander plans than just shooting people. How did the NRA enable them? Was the pipe bomb building just a hobby that they wouldn't have used, had they not been able to legally buy guns? I'll give you a fact though - you all are, despite your repeated protestations, 100% FOR confiscation and outright banning of guns. You want to completely erase the 2nd amendment. Just freaking admit it and we can move on. And while you are at it, if you are going to insist on "Expanded background checks" as Obama has repeatedly sqwaked about - I"m sure you will be totally fine with expanding those to include a mandatory waiting period for anyone with a middle eastern name or possible ties to Islam, right? Because we have now had at least three mass murders committed by Muslims. By YOUR reasoning, it is only smart to deamand that ALL Americans of middle eastern descent be subjected to extra scrutiny. Right? Hmm?
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Post by Darcy Collins on Dec 3, 2015 21:46:27 GMT
The press conference today said only the handguns were purchased by the couple. The long rifles were purchased legally by someone else. The CNN talking head follow up was speculating that they had been either purchased legally a decade or so earlier (I think he said 2001 but can't say for sure) or out of state as that was how long they'd been illegal in CA. I'll see if I can find further information.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 5, 2024 7:51:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2015 21:52:22 GMT
The press conference today said only the handguns were purchased by the couple. The long rifles were purchased legally by someone else. The CNN talking head follow up was speculating that they had been either purchased legally a decade or so earlier (I think he said 2001 but can't say for sure) or out of state as that was how long they'd been illegal in CA. I'll see if I can find further information. I heard that this morning too, but the information in the LA Times was just published in the last hour or so, and appears to be more up-to-date.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Dec 3, 2015 22:00:40 GMT
The press conference today said only the handguns were purchased by the couple. The long rifles were purchased legally by someone else. The CNN talking head follow up was speculating that they had been either purchased legally a decade or so earlier (I think he said 2001 but can't say for sure) or out of state as that was how long they'd been illegal in CA. I'll see if I can find further information. I heard that this morning too, but the information in the LA Times was just published in the last hour or so, and appears to be more up-to-date. This is a later article from the LA Times (just published half an hour ago) discussing the fact that the couple didn't buy the rifles. I' guessing the earlier article with all the graphics didn't update for the press conference this morning: www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-san-bernardino-suspects-sprayed-the-room-with-bullets-20151203-story.html
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 5, 2024 7:51:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2015 22:04:31 GMT
Huh, interesting. They had just posted that update shortly before I linked it.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Dec 3, 2015 22:08:29 GMT
I hope they give more details. I don't know if they ever clarified the status of the guns from the UCC shooting. They only reported that the guns had been purchased legally, by the shooter and some family members. I think it would be helpful to see the specifics of the where actual fire arms are coming from to have a discussion about what's not working. In the UCC case, they never even stated if any of the guns used versus at the shooters home had been purchased by him versus other family members. Access to legally purchased guns by others appears to be a huge issue, and tightening who is buying the guns won't help one iota if a potential shooter isn't the one buying.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 5, 2024 7:51:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2015 22:14:01 GMT
Until we get to the mental health issue, screaming gun control isn't going to change things. California had the bans in place. Didn't stop them. Same in Chicago, same in Paris. Gun bans aren't going to stop mass violence. It's cause and effect. I'd prefer to focus on the cause, not the effect (means). The ATF has confirmed that the guns were purchased legally, but not details released yet on where the guns were purchased (i.e. out of state) or how they ended up in the hands of the killers. www.cbsnews.com/news/san-bernardino-shooting-atf-says-all-4-guns-bought-legally/I don't know what your personal stance is on guns or mental health and how we provide it, so this is a general comment. I feel that some people often cite mental health to deflect from the issue of guns, but they don't really care about funding or programs for mental health; it's just a convenient talking point. That's all it is....a fucking talking point. Our GOP Governor took pride this year in closing down two of our state's mental health hospitals with threats to close more. Why? because of course, private companies can do the job better.....the problem with that? Admin costs are going to skyrocket because of course when we're talking private companies, the almighty dollar is the bottom line, so if the profit margin isn't there, do you honestly think that cuts in services won't happen?....or do you think that maybe the CEO's of these private corporations will be willing to take cuts to their salaries and benefits? Three patients died as a result of the closing and weeks later, the asshole even vetoed a measure that would have restored services at the one of the mental hospitals and sought a private agency to open a small program at the Clarinda hospital. The measure, which passed both houses of the Legislature, was touted by supporters from both parties as a compromise plan. ALEC certainly has Governor Branstad squarely in their pocketbook and playbook. Asshole.
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Post by anxiousmom on Dec 3, 2015 22:46:28 GMT
ha ha ha. If only you all got your heads out of the asses of the liberal elites... you don't see the irony of accusing me of being "rush limbaugh" while you do nothing but parrot the talking points of every democrat on earth. Seriously. After all these years, its become quite amusing. But I also no longer have the patience to suffer fools. And fools you all are. I have the ability to use common sense. You, apparently, have lost that ability. I feel for you. Truly. The NRA is no more responsible for the gun violence in this country, than the American Medical Association is responsible for bad doctors. The total lack of critical thinking, fear of offending some victim group, desire to be a useful idiot...I don't know what causes this illness, but I'm sick of trying to bring light to you darkness. I find it awfully ironic that someone who parrots a one note song accuses others of a total lack of critical thinking.
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Post by roundtwo on Dec 3, 2015 22:58:35 GMT
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jayfab
Drama Llama
procastinating
Posts: 5,521
Jun 26, 2014 21:55:15 GMT
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Post by jayfab on Dec 3, 2015 23:19:52 GMT
I'm starting to think she IS Rush Limbaugh. ha ha ha. If only you all got your heads out of the asses of the liberal elites... you don't see the irony of accusing me of being "rush limbaugh" while you do nothing but parrot the talking points of every democrat on earth. Seriously. After all these years, its become quite amusing. But I also no longer have the patience to suffer fools. And fools you all are. I have the ability to use common sense. You, apparently, have lost that ability. I feel for you. Truly. The NRA is no more responsible for the gun violence in this country, than the American Medical Association is responsible for bad doctors. The total lack of critical thinking, fear of offending some victim group, desire to be a useful idiot...I don't know what causes this illness, but I'm sick of trying to bring light to you darkness. Please, Krazy...since you have once again sidestepped my question about which laws the NRA has thwarted that would have stopped this massacre...let me ask you this - Europe has almost universal gun control/gun bans. So how did the NRA cause last months Paris attack? I'll take you answer in long form, short form, as long as you provide facts. You are always completely devoid of facts. Please also explain how the NRA is responsible for the myriad of pipe bomb and incendiary devices that these cretins in SB had concocted...it's obvious that they had grander plans than just shooting people. How did the NRA enable them? Was the pipe bomb building just a hobby that they wouldn't have used, had they not been able to legally buy guns? I'll give you a fact though - you all are, despite your repeated protestations, 100% FOR confiscation and outright banning of guns. You want to completely erase the 2nd amendment. Just freaking admit it and we can move on. And while you are at it, if you are going to insist on "Expanded background checks" as Obama has repeatedly sqwaked about - I"m sure you will be totally fine with expanding those to include a mandatory waiting period for anyone with a middle eastern name or possible ties to Islam, right? Because we have now had at least three mass murders committed by Muslims. By YOUR reasoning, it is only smart to deamand that ALL Americans of middle eastern descent be subjected to extra scrutiny. Right? Hmm? Wrong again. Not everyone advocates for confiscation. Yup. I would LOVE expanded background checks and longer mandatory waiting periods for EVERYONE. Let's see 3 out of 355 mass shootings by Muslims this year you say. What the HELL about the other 352? It's obviously smart to demand extra scrutiny for all the white "of any faith" shooters too!!!!! 355 Your bias is showing.
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Dec 3, 2015 23:42:46 GMT
The difference IMHO is what the President says after offering his thoughts and prayers. He is calling for change and the other politicians are coming across as "so sad, too bad, nothing we can do". Just because someone disagrees with the type of change that will help prevent these incidents, doesn't mean they don't care. I don't see how mocking compassion is helpful on any level. Enlighten me (us) darcycollins...what EXACTLY have these particular politicians DONE to change it?
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