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Post by miominmio on Mar 14, 2016 7:37:34 GMT
.....except.....it turns out she didn't. We found lots! of legal documents on it, so it won't be difficult to prove that it wasn't, and hopefully she will get a new one without too much hassle, but it makes you wonder how often stores get away with this....
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Post by ExpatBackHome on Mar 14, 2016 7:41:19 GMT
Wow! That's crazy. Seems like they would've done a better job of wiping it clean.
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Post by gar on Mar 14, 2016 8:28:00 GMT
It'll be interesting to hear their explanation for that! She might want to contact the company/person it belonged to before and see what they think!!
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mlana
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,525 
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Post by mlana on Mar 14, 2016 9:32:18 GMT
We buy a lot of computers for customers and you'd be surprised how often this can happen. DH won't take anything out of the store that isn't factory sealed because he's had this happen to him so many times.
Most stores will take it back with no problems, but no apology either. They just shrug and say it happens. It's also possible the person who returned it did a good job of closing the packaging and the store didn't realize it had been opened.
Marcy
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Post by miominmio on Mar 14, 2016 9:34:55 GMT
We buy a lot of computers for customers and you'd be surprised how often this can happen. DH won't take anything out of the store that isn't factory sealed because he's had this happen to him so many times. Most stores will take it back with no problems, but no apology either. They just shrug and say it happens. It's also possible the person who returned it did a good job of closing the packaging and the store didn't realize it had been opened. Marcy Oh, they knew! It turns out that the previous owner returned it because of problems with the hard drive, and he has the documentation to prove it. |
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Post by miominmio on Mar 14, 2016 9:39:03 GMT
It'll be interesting to hear their explanation for that! She might want to contact the company/person it belonged to before and see what they think!! I did it for her, the whole thing freaked her out. It belonged to a lawyer, and there are several thousand documents on it. He was extremely upset, which is understandable. We have names and privileged information about several hundreds of his clients. |
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gsquaredmom
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Post by gsquaredmom on Mar 14, 2016 9:39:47 GMT
We buy a lot of computers for customers and you'd be surprised how often this can happen. DH won't take anything out of the store that isn't factory sealed because he's had this happen to him so many times. Most stores will take it back with no problems, but no apology either. They just shrug and say it happens. It's also possible the person who returned it did a good job of closing the packaging and the store didn't realize it had been opened. Marcy Oh, they knew! It turns out that the previous owner returned it because of problems with the hard drive, and he has the documentation to prove it. Confused. Who is he? Your mom bought it. Who has the documentation? Do you know the previous owner? |
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Post by gar on Mar 14, 2016 9:40:11 GMT
It'll be interesting to hear their explanation for that! She might want to contact the company/person it belonged to before and see what they think!! I did it for her, the whole thing freaked her out. It belonged to a lawyer, and there are several thousand documents on it. He was extremely upset, which is understandable. We have names and privileged information about several hundreds of his clients. Wow!! |
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gsquaredmom
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Jun 26, 2014 17:43:22 GMT
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Post by gsquaredmom on Mar 14, 2016 9:40:51 GMT
It'll be interesting to hear their explanation for that! She might want to contact the company/person it belonged to before and see what they think!! I did it for her, the whole thing freaked her out. It belonged to a lawyer, and there are several thousand documents on it. He was extremely upset, which is understandable. We have names and privileged information about several hundreds of his clients. Why did he not wipe the drive before returning it? Sounds like he messed up. |
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mlana
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,525
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Post by mlana on Mar 14, 2016 9:42:22 GMT
We buy a lot of computers for customers and you'd be surprised how often this can happen. DH won't take anything out of the store that isn't factory sealed because he's had this happen to him so many times. Most stores will take it back with no problems, but no apology either. They just shrug and say it happens. It's also possible the person who returned it did a good job of closing the packaging and the store didn't realize it had been opened. Marcy Oh, they knew! It turns out that the previous owner returned it because of problems with the hard drive, and he has the documentation to prove it. If it was returned with data on it, they have no business giving you a hard time about returning it. Did you contact the previous owner? Did he realize it had his data on it when he returned it? Do you suppose the store sold it knowing there was data on it? I'm sorry your mom didn't get what she paid for. We love delivering a new machine to clients; there's just something so fun about having a brand new computer..so many possibilities, I guess. Marcy |
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Post by miominmio on Mar 14, 2016 9:45:43 GMT
Oh, they knew! It turns out that the previous owner returned it because of problems with the hard drive, and he has the documentation to prove it. Confused. Who is he? Your mom bought it. Who has the documentation? Do you know the previous owner? We found several thousand documents on it. He's a lawyer, and has used the computer for work. |
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Post by miominmio on Mar 14, 2016 9:48:43 GMT
Oh, they knew! It turns out that the previous owner returned it because of problems with the hard drive, and he has the documentation to prove it. If it was returned with data on it, they have no business giving you a hard time about returning it. Did you contact the previous owner? Did he realize it had his data on it when he returned it? Do you suppose the store sold it knowing there was data on it? I'm sorry your mom didn't get what she paid for. We love delivering a new machine to clients; there's just something so fun about having a brand new computer..so many possibilities, I guess. Marcy He returned it without wiping it (because he didn't know how to do it), but the store promised to do so. They were aware that he is a lawyer, and that the hard drive containd privileged information. |
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gsquaredmom
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Post by gsquaredmom on Mar 14, 2016 10:06:17 GMT
If it was returned with data on it, they have no business giving you a hard time about returning it. Did you contact the previous owner? Did he realize it had his data on it when he returned it? Do you suppose the store sold it knowing there was data on it? I'm sorry your mom didn't get what she paid for. We love delivering a new machine to clients; there's just something so fun about having a brand new computer..so many possibilities, I guess. Marcy He returned it without wiping it (because he didn't know how to do it), but the store promised to do so. They were aware that he is a lawyer, and that the hard drive containd privileged information. I hope he got it in writing. Verbal contracts are hard to enforce. As a lawyer with sensitive documents, one would think he would exercise better care to ensure client data was eliminated, perhaps asking or paying someone more knowledgable to wipe it prior to returning. Thank goodness it was an honest person who bought it! I think this is on him more than on the store. He should have taken better care to ensure it was wiped. Even if the store were to wipe it, how could he know the wiper would not download all those documents for nefarious purposes? Not a good move to return it with client data. |
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Deleted
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Aug 18, 2025 21:35:52 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2016 10:11:57 GMT
If it was returned with data on it, they have no business giving you a hard time about returning it. Did you contact the previous owner? Did he realize it had his data on it when he returned it? Do you suppose the store sold it knowing there was data on it? I'm sorry your mom didn't get what she paid for. We love delivering a new machine to clients; there's just something so fun about having a brand new computer..so many possibilities, I guess. Marcy He returned it without wiping it (because he didn't know how to do it), but the store promised to do so. They were aware that he is a lawyer, and that the hard drive containd privileged information. Wow !! So not only have they been negligent in wiping it they've obviously not sorted the faulty hard drive that was reported before they sold it off, as new to someone else otherwise they would have realized that it had info on it. Big big trouble on the way to them I would think. |
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Post by miominmio on Mar 14, 2016 10:14:15 GMT
He returned it without wiping it (because he didn't know how to do it), but the store promised to do so. They were aware that he is a lawyer, and that the hard drive containd privileged information. I hope he got it in writing. Verbal contracts are hard to enforce. As a lawyer with sensitive documents, one would think he would exercise better care to ensure client data was eliminated, perhaps asking or paying someone more knowledgable to wipe it prior to returning. Thank goodness it was an honest person who bought it! I think this is on him more than on the store. He should have taken better care to ensure it was wiped. Even if the store were to wipe it, how could he know the wiper would not download all those documents for nefarious purposes? Not a good move to return it with client data. Oh, I agree, he definitely should have been more careful, however, the store have strict protocols in place regarding this (or so they claim). There has been several cases lately where stores have sold phones and computers as new, but where the new owners have found pictures belonging to the previous owners. The stores have all said that they are not only supposed to routinely wipe anything that is returned, but that they, under Norwegian law, have to disclose that it is a pre-owned item. |
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gsquaredmom
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Post by gsquaredmom on Mar 14, 2016 10:14:56 GMT
He returned it without wiping it (because he didn't know how to do it), but the store promised to do so. They were aware that he is a lawyer, and that the hard drive containd privileged information. Wow !! So not only have they been negligent in wiping it they've obviously not sorted the faulty hard drive that was reported before they sold it off, as new to someone else otherwise they would have realized that it had info on it. Big big trouble on the way to them I would think. I think leaving sensitive client data on that drive was irresponsible. If I were returning a computer, I would have found a way to wipe it prior. No way would I want to depend on a store to do it. |
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Post by miominmio on Mar 14, 2016 10:15:03 GMT
He returned it without wiping it (because he didn't know how to do it), but the store promised to do so. They were aware that he is a lawyer, and that the hard drive containd privileged information. Wow !! So not only have they been negligent in wiping it they've obviously not sorted the faulty hard drive that was reported before they sold it off, as new to someone else otherwise they would have realized that it had info on it. Big big trouble on the way to them I would think. Oh, you can count on the "big trouble" part |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2016 10:16:41 GMT
Wow !! So not only have they been negligent in wiping it they've obviously not sorted the faulty hard drive that was reported before they sold it off, as new to someone else otherwise they would have realized that it had info on it. Big big trouble on the way to them I would think. Oh, you can count on the "big trouble" part Bigger still I would imagine when it already involves a lawyer !! Served them right IMO. |
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gsquaredmom
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Post by gsquaredmom on Mar 14, 2016 10:17:19 GMT
Even more egregious on his part if it is already publicly known that the stores are not wiping returns.
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wellway
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Jun 25, 2014 20:50:09 GMT
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Post by wellway on Mar 14, 2016 10:19:59 GMT
So the store promised to wipe the hard drive (granted the lawyer might to rethink his disposal policy), didn't wipe the drive (wonder if they charged him) and then sold it as new to your Mum. The store deserves what is coming to them.
If I was your Mum I would ask for my money back and buy somewhere else. I won't trust them at all.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2016 10:20:50 GMT
Wow !! So not only have they been negligent in wiping it they've obviously not sorted the faulty hard drive that was reported before they sold it off, as new to someone else otherwise they would have realized that it had info on it. Big big trouble on the way to them I would think. I think leaving sensitive client data on that drive was irresponsible. If I were returning a computer, I would have found a way to wipe it prior. No way would I want to depend on a store to do it. I happen to agree with you from a personal point of view BUT if they ( the store) assure you that they will carry this out within the law of Data protection ( which we have here and I imagine they probably have a similar law in Norway) then I would expect them to do so. I also wouldn't expect them and it's also against the law, to sell a product as "new" when it has already been in use. They have to even mark product as " Ex display" over here if they've only been on display in the store. |
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gsquaredmom
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Post by gsquaredmom on Mar 14, 2016 10:21:55 GMT
Oh, you can count on the "big trouble" part Bigger still I would imagine when it already involves a lawyer !! Served them right IMO. If he is smart he will keep this low key to protect his own reputation. If I had a lawyer do that, I would think him irresponsible and not very bright. |
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Post by ChicagoKTS on Mar 14, 2016 10:24:40 GMT
The attorney is the one who should be in trouble as he has a duty to keep his client's information confidential. It's no excuse that he didn't know how to wipe the drive. You find out how to do it or find someone who can do it while you observe it being done and confirm the info has been wiped. Those documents should not leave his possession.
Sure the store employees messed-up but they do not have a duty to keep info on a returned computer confidential.
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gsquaredmom
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Post by gsquaredmom on Mar 14, 2016 10:25:34 GMT
I think leaving sensitive client data on that drive was irresponsible. If I were returning a computer, I would have found a way to wipe it prior. No way would I want to depend on a store to do it. I happen to agree with you from a personal point of view BUT if they ( the store) assure you that they will carry this out within the law of Data protection ( which we have here and I imagine they probably have a similar law in Norway) then I would expect them to do so. I also wouldn't expect them and it's also against the law, to sell a product as "new" when it has already been in use. They have to even mark product as " Ex display" over here if they've only been on display in the store. Lots of things required by law don't happen. Lawyers depend on that for work. I don't know about the returned/new part so can't comment. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2016 10:29:47 GMT
Bigger still I would imagine when it already involves a lawyer !! Served them right IMO. If he is smart he will keep this low key to protect his own reputation. If I had a lawyer do that, I would think him irresponsible and not very bright. I think the store has far more to lose than the lawyer has if they are selling goods as new when in fact they've been used. As far as the lawyer is concerned would you also expect him to wipe his hard drive every time his IT system needs a repair? No of course you wouldn't because you are entrusting it to someone that will comply with the safeguards that are in place for them to carry out that repair......Data Protection laws in this case. |
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gsquaredmom
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Post by gsquaredmom on Mar 14, 2016 10:34:11 GMT
If he is smart he will keep this low key to protect his own reputation. If I had a lawyer do that, I would think him irresponsible and not very bright. I think the store has far more to lose than the lawyer has if they are selling goods as new when in fact they've been used. As far as the lawyer is concerned would you also expect him to wipe his hard drive every time his IT system needs a repair? No of course you wouldn't because you are entrusting it to someone that will comply with the safeguards that are in place for them to carry out that repair......Data Protection laws in this case. Not the same as a repair in which he chooses the technician and does not relinquish ownership to a stranger in a storefront. A lawyer who has a duty to protect client data has a greater responsibility than the typical returner. Naive for him to assume the law will be followed for his confidential data. And an issue separate from the used sold as new factor. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2016 10:57:31 GMT
I think the store has far more to lose than the lawyer has if they are selling goods as new when in fact they've been used. As far as the lawyer is concerned would you also expect him to wipe his hard drive every time his IT system needs a repair? No of course you wouldn't because you are entrusting it to someone that will comply with the safeguards that are in place for them to carry out that repair......Data Protection laws in this case. Not the same as a repair in which he chooses the technician and does not relinquish ownership to a stranger in a storefront. A lawyer who has a duty to protect client data has a greater responsibility than the typical returner. Naive for him to assume the law will be followed for his confidential data. And an issue separate from the used sold as new factor. Where in the OP does it say he's relinquished ownership to a stranger in the store? Ok so as an example.......Lawyer has bought a computer from this store.....he has trouble with the hard drive and it's still under guarantee....computer goes in for repair/investigation for the faulty hard drive.....store eventually tells him they can't sort the hard drive out and they will replace the computer.....he informs them he has sensitive info on that hard drive and it needs to be wiped, can they recommend someone to wipe it as he doesn't have the knowledge....store assures him they can deal with this on his behalf and safely. Lawyer gives them the go ahead to do this having been re-assured that it will be wiped . Lawyer receives a replacement computer for the faulty one under the guarantee and fully expects the other to be wiped clean and returned to the manufacturer as there is a fault on it. Whether it was a directly employed IT tech or the tech staff at a store is irrelevant. It was reasonable to assume having being assured that it would be done that it would be carried out and not passed on as new to another customer. A store that has a repair dept has the same responsibility as any other IT repair person as far as the safety of a customers data is concerned. |
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gsquaredmom
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Post by gsquaredmom on Mar 14, 2016 11:10:01 GMT
He owned it. He returned it. He relinquished ownership to a stranger at a return counter in a store. I would not assume a verbal conversation with a sales associate in a store is the same as signing a repair contract with the tech department who is (at least in the US), insured and bonded. However, even with that repair contract for a wipe of sensitive information, as a lawyer responsible for that data, I would want to witness the wiping and get it in writing that it was done. Bottom line is that as a potential or actual client, I would think the lawyer was at the very least naive in assuming it would be taken care of and I would not want him as my lawyer. I would want someone significantly brighter/more savvy.
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Mar 14, 2016 11:21:46 GMT
I think dottyscrapper nailed it!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2016 12:13:39 GMT
He owned it. He returned it. He relinquished ownership to a stranger at a return counter in a store. I would not assume a verbal conversation with a sales associate in a store is the same as signing a repair contract with the tech department who is (at least in the US), insured and bonded. However, even with that repair contract for a wipe of sensitive information, as a lawyer responsible for that data, I would want to witness the wiping and get it in writing that it was done. Bottom line is that as a potential or actual client, I would think the lawyer was at the very least naive in assuming it would be taken care of and I would not want him as my lawyer. I would want someone significantly brighter/more savvy. Where did the OP say that ( bolded)? We don't know the circumstances that it was returned under. So anything else is speculative and you are comparing this to the US stores. I don't know about Norway but very many stores here have tech repair dept and are covered by the same laws as any other tech persons individually or not. Witnessing the wiping of a hard drive is no use to anyone if they don't know the process of how it's done, They're no more informed than before it was done. How would you know that it had all been wiped....by switching it on and no data shows up? That is no guarantee that the hard drive is totally clean. |
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