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Post by lovetodigi on Aug 1, 2014 16:52:09 GMT
The two healthcare workers in te isolation pod - not worried. The guy who became severely ill on a plane to Nigeria whilst en route to Minnesota - this is a very real hazard. What about the people that were on the plane with him? According to what I have read, at the point that you become ill, you are contagious.
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MizIndependent
Drama Llama
Quit your bullpoop.
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Jun 25, 2014 19:43:16 GMT
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Post by MizIndependent on Aug 1, 2014 17:08:38 GMT
So what should we do? Lock our own citizens out of their country? Not let anyone who has been in an affected area in the US ever? I just don't know what people expect the country to do. I'm not at all concerned about the two Americans being flown home under quarantine or about them being treated in a facility that is 100% geared to deal with situations like this and worse. I am very concerned about all of the other factors - i.e. border breakdown, etc. The truth is, there isn't much we can do about it except protect ourselves, have emergency supplies on hand, blahblahblah. People need to use their heads, not panic, prepare and be aware. That's all we really can do in any situation like this, right? Half the fight here is not burying your head in sand about how serious an issue like this really is. The two healthcare workers in te isolation pod - not worried. The guy who became severely ill on a plane to Nigeria whilst en route to Minnesota - this is a very real hazard. What about the people that were on the plane with him? According to what I have read, at the point that you become ill, you are contagious. Nope, a person can be contagious anywhere from 2 to 21 days after exposure and be completely asymptomatic. That is why this is such a dangerous situation. All of those people on that plane have been exposed...how many were actually affected? We just don't know yet.
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Deleted
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Oct 7, 2024 4:17:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2014 17:11:38 GMT
So what should we do? Lock our own citizens out of their country? Not let anyone who has been in an affected area in the US ever? I just don't know what people expect the country to do. I'm not at all concerned about the two Americans being flown home under quarantine or about them being treated in a facility that is 100% geared to deal with situations like this and worse. I am very concerned about all of the other factors - i.e. border breakdown, etc. The truth is, there isn't much we can do about it except protect ourselves, have emergency supplies on hand, blahblahblah. People need to use their heads, not panic, prepare and be aware. That's all we really can do in any situation like this, right? Half the fight here is not burying your head in sand about how serious an issue like this really is. No burying my head in the sand here. I'm always prepared due to living in hurricane country. I just don't see anything to be concerned about at this time, even with the border issues (that have always been there). Some people are acting like it us the end of the world online though. It is quite amusing to be honest.
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raindancer
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Jun 26, 2014 20:10:29 GMT
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Post by raindancer on Aug 1, 2014 17:15:24 GMT
So what should we do? Lock our own citizens out of their country? Not let anyone who has been in an affected area in the US ever? I just don't know what people expect the country to do. I'm not at all concerned about the two Americans being flown home under quarantine or about them being treated in a facility that is 100% geared to deal with situations like this and worse. I am very concerned about all of the other factors - i.e. border breakdown, etc. The truth is, there isn't much we can do about it except protect ourselves, have emergency supplies on hand, blahblahblah. People need to use their heads, not panic, prepare and be aware. That's all we really can do in any situation like this, right? Half the fight here is not burying your head in sand about how serious an issue like this really is. What about the people that were on the plane with him? According to what I have read, at the point that you become ill, you are contagious. Nope, a person can be contagious anywhere from 2 to 21 days after exposure and be completely asymptomatic. That is why this is such a dangerous situation. All of those people on that plane have been exposed...how many were actually affected? We just don't know yet. Incubation period is 2-21 days, that is no the same as being contagious. Ebola is also spread via direct contact with bodily fluids, is not airborne and is not contagious until you are symptomatic.
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Post by Chips on Aug 1, 2014 17:15:28 GMT
The US is airlifting two American citizens infected with the Ebola virus back to the US for treatment and it really has me thinking. It really does worry me thinking that someone has to make the decision that more lives will be lost just by moving these people back to the US.
While the US is probably one of the best places to find a cure for the ebola virus I feel like moving these two back to the US is like opening Pandora's box. Too scary and zombie apocalypse like for me.
link From what little I have seen of the care facilities at the center of the outbreak they seem pretty basic. Ebola has been around since about the 1970's and I wonder why the first world countries have not come together to set up a higher tech medical facility in the region. While the region is remote and full of conflict, Ebola (a disease with no known cure) has been an issue of concern for a while. I believe 100% that all the people with the disease should be treated and that the WHO needs to step up measures to contain and treat/cure those affected with it.
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raindancer
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Post by raindancer on Aug 1, 2014 17:27:53 GMT
The US is airlifting two American citizens infected with the Ebola virus back to the US for treatment and it really has me thinking. It really does worry me thinking that someone has to make the decision that more lives will be lost just by moving these people back to the US.
While the US is probably one of the best places to find a cure for the ebola virus I feel like moving these two back to the US is like opening Pandora's box. Too scary and zombie apocalypse like for me.
link From what little I have seen of the care facilities at the center of the outbreak they seem pretty basic. Ebola has been around since about the 1970's and I wonder why the first world countries have not come together to set up a higher tech medical facility in the region. While the region is remote and full of conflict, Ebola (a disease with no known cure) has been an issue of concern for a while. I believe 100% that all the people with the disease should be treated and that the WHO needs to step up measures to contain and treat/cure those affected with it. The lack of health care facilities and access across the globe is pretty astounding. It seems so simple, but the reality is it is an exceptionally complex problem that cannot only be solved with cash flow. One issue is getting qualified care providers to live there. The other is educating those who do live there in medicine. Cost of course. Corrupt governments and rebels. And one other thing that people don't realize is a barrier is cultural differences and language barriers. It is not something we can just bust in there with our western ideas and say "Do it this way and everything will be better". For two reasons. One, it's not true. Our ways are not always better. Two, really, our ways are not always better. Also we tend to start in the middle of a problem and then we miss the cues as to why our "good idea" isn't working. Quality community assessments have to be done, and you have to realize that a model that is effective in one place may not be effective in another. Even within the US we see this. One program that is helping kids in San Diego's population will not work at all in Atlanta due to culture, values, assets, deficits, and a million other reasons. Without considering each community as a unique space you may wind up hurting more than helping. Or at best just wasting a ton of time and money.
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MizIndependent
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Quit your bullpoop.
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Jun 25, 2014 19:43:16 GMT
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Post by MizIndependent on Aug 1, 2014 17:29:46 GMT
I'm not at all concerned about the two Americans being flown home under quarantine or about them being treated in a facility that is 100% geared to deal with situations like this and worse. I am very concerned about all of the other factors - i.e. border breakdown, etc. The truth is, there isn't much we can do about it except protect ourselves, have emergency supplies on hand, blahblahblah. People need to use their heads, not panic, prepare and be aware. That's all we really can do in any situation like this, right? Half the fight here is not burying your head in sand about how serious an issue like this really is. Nope, a person can be contagious anywhere from 2 to 21 days after exposure and be completely asymptomatic. That is why this is such a dangerous situation. All of those people on that plane have been exposed...how many were actually affected? We just don't know yet. Incubation period is 2-21 days, that is no the same as being contagious. Ebola is also spread via direct contact with bodily fluids, is not airborne and is not contagious until you are symptomatic. According to WHO: "People are infectious as long as their blood and secretions contain the virus. Ebola virus was isolated from semen 61 days after onset of illness in a man who was infected in a laboratory." I concede you may be right: "is not airborne and is not contagious until you are symptomatic."
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raindancer
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Post by raindancer on Aug 1, 2014 17:42:41 GMT
Incubation period is 2-21 days, that is no the same as being contagious. Ebola is also spread via direct contact with bodily fluids, is not airborne and is not contagious until you are symptomatic. According to WHO: "People are infectious as long as their blood and secretions contain the virus. Ebola virus was isolated from semen 61 days after onset of illness in a man who was infected in a laboratory." I concede you may be right: "is not airborne and is not contagious until you are symptomatic." There is a difference between infectious and contagious. This is similar in nature to AIDS if you want to think about it that way. It isn't something you just get by being on an airplane with someone. It's dangerous to come in direct contact with the bodily fluids of someone with this illness. Unless the guy on the airplane was joining the mile high club with everyone on board, it's just not that risky. It is not outside of the realm of possibility that someone on that plane unfortunately did have this happen and has been exposed, but its really just not *that* dangerous. We have far worse things out there that would be devastating on a global scale if they break out into human populations. This just isn't really one of them. The real issue in Africa right now is that there is not enough proper medical care or access and there is not enough being done to isolate people who have come in contact with the disease and I'm not overly familiar with this region, but I suspect that they are not living in a great area of infrastructure, poor roads, poor sanitation, lack of running water, lack of doctors/health care workers. And then you have the latency period that makes it difficult to manage in an area like that where the reality of isolation/quarantine is just not at all practical.
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Post by moveablefeast on Aug 1, 2014 17:53:38 GMT
The gentleman who was en route from Liberia to Minnesota became symptomatic in-flight. He became symptomatic between Liberia and Nigeria, but could just as easily have become symptomatic halfway across the Atlantic. The virus is present in vomit and stool, so a person cleaning up after him, using a facility that was not properly sanitized after him, or treating him in a healthcare setting could easily be exposed. I don't think downplaying that makes sense - it is not sexually transmitted only, it is transmitted through bodily fluids.
I don't feel at all hysterical about Ebola. I'm not worried about it. I see it as a much lower threat to my well-being than the food I will eat at the county fair with my kid this afternoon. I am especially not worried about the two known victims of Ebola who are being cared for under severe quarantine.
But - the reality still is that it is only a flight away. Global travel is so simple. The risk exists. I am really, really grateful for the doctors and nurses and epidemiologists and others who are working so hard to combat this thing.
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Post by txdancermom on Aug 1, 2014 17:54:55 GMT
This is less worrisome than someone getting off a plane that may have been in the area and got infected and doesn't know it, and them wandering around for a day or two, possibly infecting others. The hospital that they are going to is set up for this, is separate from the main hospital and they are trained to deal with this.
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Post by lucyg on Aug 1, 2014 17:57:51 GMT
Here's the thing. If Ebola has mutated enough to become the next big pandemic that takes out millions of people worldwide ... bringing infected Americans home under the supervision of the CDC is not what's going to spread it to the U.S. It will come regardless, spirited in by thousands of asymptomatic Africans and others returning from Africa, Asia, and around the world. Absolutely independent of whether we bring our people home to give them much-needed medical care. Not.Worth.Worrying.About. At least, not till it actually happens. Then you have my permission to panic.
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Post by lovetodigi on Aug 1, 2014 17:59:04 GMT
According to WHO: "People are infectious as long as their blood and secretions contain the virus. Ebola virus was isolated from semen 61 days after onset of illness in a man who was infected in a laboratory." I concede you may be right: "is not airborne and is not contagious until you are symptomatic." There is a difference between infectious and contagious. This is similar in nature to AIDS if you want to think about it that way. It isn't something you just get by being on an airplane with someone. It's dangerous to come in direct contact with the bodily fluids of someone with this illness. Unless the guy on the airplane was joining the mile high club with everyone on board, it's just not that risky. It is not outside of the realm of possibility that someone on that plane unfortunately did have this happen and has been exposed, but its really just not *that* dangerous. Suppose that person went to the bathroom on the plane, was a little messy and did not wash their hands when leaving. Body fluid would then be on the door handle and any seats that they touched on the way back to their seat. Then the next person to follow them into the bathroom would be touching that same handle when leaving the bathroom. Even if that person washed their hands, the door knob to get out would still be dirty and would germs would be on that persons hands and whatever they touched, food, drink, etc.
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raindancer
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Post by raindancer on Aug 1, 2014 17:59:12 GMT
The gentleman who was en route from Liberia to Minnesota became symptomatic in-flight. He became symptomatic between Liberia and Nigeria, but could just as easily have become symptomatic halfway across the Atlantic. The virus is present in vomit and stool, so a person cleaning up after him, using a facility that was not properly sanitized after him, or treating him in a healthcare setting could easily be exposed. I don't think downplaying that makes sense - it is not sexually transmitted only, it is transmitted through bodily fluids. I don't feel at all hysterical about Ebola. I'm not worried about it. I see it as a much lower threat to my well-being than the food I will eat at the county fair with my kid this afternoon. I am especially not worried about the two known victims of Ebola who are being cared for under severe quarantine. But - the reality still is that it is only a flight away. Global travel is so simple. The risk exists. I am really, really grateful for the doctors and nurses and epidemiologists and others who are working so hard to combat this thing. And I said : It is not outside of the realm of possibility that someone on that plane unfortunately did have this happen and has been exposed, but its really just not *that* dangerous.
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Post by lily on Aug 1, 2014 18:08:56 GMT
THIS ^^^
On a lighter note...someone told me today that the people are flying to Atlanta...and then commented that that is where the Walking Dead show originates....
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Post by librarylady on Aug 1, 2014 19:46:58 GMT
The male dr. is from FW, so we are getting an overdose of the story. I am very sad for this happening to anyone, but especially to medical folk trying to help.
However, I am angered/appalled/horrified that anyone is knowingly bringing the virus to this continent!! I am not receiving any comfort from the visions of the plastic isolation chamber. The dr. who is now ill was wearing the hazmat suit etc. and still contracted the illness. I think it is a bad decision.
Additionally, if both patients are in grave condition--why the heck are they healthy enough to be transported such a long distance.
If it were my loved one, yes, I'd want them closer--but, I am against bringing that virus to our continent and creating a problem on this side of the planet.
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Post by librarylady on Aug 1, 2014 19:49:28 GMT
I'm not worried. It's not an airborne virus, and I'm 1000% the necessary precautions have been taken. I don't think medical people REALLY know. Every thing I have read says it moves through body fluids. If that is true, why do they make the medical people treating sick folks wear hazmat suits? I think medical people don't really know how it is transmitted.
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Post by lovetodigi on Aug 1, 2014 20:01:57 GMT
I'm not worried. It's not an airborne virus, and I'm 1000% the necessary precautions have been taken. I don't think medical people REALLY know. Every thing I have read says it moves through body fluids. If that is true, why do they make the medical people treating sick folks wear hazmat suits? I think medical people don't really know how it is transmitted. I think it is because bodily fluids can be transmitted by coughing, sneezing, someone talking and spit coming out of their mouths, in addition to other fluids like blood, urine, etc. I read something about that a bit ago and if I can find it again, I will come back and link it. Here is the Link-USA Today
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Post by freecharlie on Aug 1, 2014 20:13:32 GMT
They were saying that the massive outbreak in Africa is largely due to the people not breaking custom and taking care of their family members after the person becomes ill. Then the person that is taking care becomes ill, the one taking care of that one... If any of them step outside and spread it to the next family over, the cycle starts with that family.
I'm not worried (too much) about these two victims, but rather the person coming in that we don't know that they have it yet. We are pulling the Peace Corp out, correct? ARe there isolation areas for them? Do we put them in quarantine for a while?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2014 20:24:41 GMT
I don't think downplaying that makes sense - it is not sexually transmitted only, it is transmitted through bodily fluids. Is sweat considered a bodily fluid? Skin oils? Suppose that person went to the bathroom on the plane, was a little messy and did not wash their hands when leaving. Body fluid would then be on the door handle and any seats that they touched on the way back to their seat. Then the next person to follow them into the bathroom would be touching that same handle when leaving the bathroom. Even if that person washed their hands, the door knob to get out would still be dirty and would germs would be on that persons hands and whatever they touched, food, drink, etc. This is what crosses my mind.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2014 20:31:11 GMT
Well, in this case, these infected people would pretty much have to vomit or crap all over large populations in the US, who would in turn vomit and crap on more people.
I think, given the circumstances, I could avoid getting vomited and crapped on.
I can't live my life in fear. The same way we're talking about transmitting disease through door handles is the same way we could pass the swine flu, bird flu, and other scary diseases we've heard of.
I agree that would be scary, if we were comparing apples to apples. But chances are, he didn't contract it while working with the patients. He contracted it during those times when he had to take off the suit to eat, sleep, walk around away from the hospital. Conditions in third world countries just don't compare to here. Dr. Brantly and Nancy Writebol most undoubtedly picked it up from a dirty, infected street or other bodily fluid swap away from the hazmet suits.
I'd bet my house bringing these two Americans home will not start an outbreak here in the US.
Julie
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scrappinghappy
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Post by scrappinghappy on Aug 1, 2014 20:36:56 GMT
I'm an African and I can tell you this Ebola outbreak is a HUGE deal in Africa at least and is in the news daily.
As FreeCharlie says, the spread amongst non-healthcare people is in fact mostly due to family members caring for each other but even MORE so, the traditions that are practiced between death and burial. EG washing the body, embalming which involves removing body fluids, non-cremation etc. Also long incubation periods make it difficult for the uneducated and disbelieving average tribal person to understand that they got sick from someone else making is even harder to get them to follow procedures for reducing contamination. Education is a key factor in arresting the spread but it's been really hard to get it across to people who still have strong tribal beliefs.
It is scary to me that first world trained healthcare workers, wearing Hazmat suits and practicing everything we know to prevent contamination, still got sick. Makes me thing the contagious period may not be fully understood. To answer the question about how they are ill with this deathly disease but still able to travel...the disease doesn't become symptomatic right away. During stage 1 you are still able to do almost anything. You may have a fever, some diarrhea, headache, weekness, fatigue and maybe a sore throat. One might think you just have flu or a stomach bug - right? But as far as I know that's it. Stage two is when the bleeding starts. Usually lasts a couple of days but can be much longer and patients die from extreme blood loss and shock, renal and/or kidney failure. From what I've heard, Dr Brantly was still OK as of this morning - typing on his computer in quaratine and talking to his wife and kids and pretty much asymptomatic. He also gave the single dose of an experimental drug to his infected co-worker, Nancy Writebol. Again from what I've heard, she has diarrhea but is also able to travel.
If you were them, wouldn't you want to come home and get the best possible treatment? Good for them for doing the job they do, how many of us would have done the same? Now is not the time to abandon them.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2014 21:27:02 GMT
I'd bet my house bringing these two Americans home will not start an outbreak here in the US. Julie I agree. It's the guy that got sick on the plane from Nigeria to Minnesota and all the people he came in contact with that people wonder about. And not just on the plane. At the airport. And any others like him.
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Post by lovetodigi on Aug 1, 2014 21:59:32 GMT
I'd bet my house bringing these two Americans home will not start an outbreak here in the US. Julie I agree. It's the guy that got sick on the plane from Nigeria to Minnesota and all the people he came in contact with that people wonder about. And not just on the plane. At the airport. And any others like him. I just watched the local news (Atlanta) It sounds like the hospital has a lot of precautions in place. There are only 4 people that will be working with these patients. What I did not originally think about is that the plane that is going to pick them up is a plane from Phoenix in Cartersville. That involves more people, possibly being exposed, the pilot, co-pilot and medical workers. Then there will be more people that will be responsible for transporting them to the hospital once they land. Will these workers be proactive and safe in cleaning that plane and ambulance? Will the workers be trained enough and take the same precautions that the highly trained workers at Emory will be taking? I agree, if it were someone in my family that was over there and sick, I would want them home and I think they need to be brought home. I just worry that this strain of Ebola, might somehow, through all of the different contacts, make an entrance here. Then there are all of the people that are traveling that may have been exposed, like Gia pointed out. It would be wonderful if CDC could come up with a cure to help everyone around the world that is being affected by this nasty disease.
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scrappinghappy
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Post by scrappinghappy on Aug 1, 2014 23:46:21 GMT
It would be wonderful if CDC could come up with a cure to help everyone around the world that is being affected by this nasty disease. NIH is rolling out testing on an Ebola vaccine but not until September.
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