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Post by lovestocreate on Jul 11, 2016 10:25:15 GMT
According to ABC news, cops shot in the line of duty is up 44% this year from last year. So yes, I would think so. Actually, there have been fewer this year than last year. Overall officers killed in the line of duty are down, though the year is just over half over, however, officers killed by gunfire is up 63%. Gmcwife1's point stands. |
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tduby1
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Post by tduby1 on Jul 11, 2016 10:26:36 GMT
You know, I keep hearing this... Put yourself in her shoes. You just witnessed your boyfriend getting killed, your child is in the back seat screaming... At some point she had the presence of mind to start recording BUT I find it really hard to believe she also, in her panic, her fear, her grief, her confusion, had the presence of mind to think, "hey, I better concoct a story to make him look innocent and record it and for bonus points whip the country Into a frenzy". No way. I'd buy it he'd been arrested for stealing a candy bar or something and she was hoping to keep his mama from spanking his behind... But not after witnessing him being shot, smack dab in a tense situation, while he died in front of her eyes, her child screaming in the back, officers yelling at her. it would take a true psychopath to think that quick. Did you see the video of her smoking weed? I don't see *that girl being able to pull that off. Creating a wildass assertion as a reason to dismiss the fact that we don't know what actually happened before the recording started, doesn't really work. The fact remains, we still don't know what actually happened before the recording. Disclaimer: Acknowledging this fact does not mean that I believe the victim deserved it. Which part do you think is a "wildass" assertion? Going through my post point by point? Her boyfriend getting killed? Fact. Her child screaming in the backseat? Fact. She started recording at some point? Fact. That there was panic, grief, fear and confusion involved on her behalf? Well I guess I don't *know that* for a fact but I think it is a safe assumption and can be heard on the tape so I'd hardly call that a "wildass assertion". That she had the presence of mind to concoct a story to somehow make her bf look innocent in the immediate aftermath, so immediate the officer himself can still be heard panicking? Because that is the only thing left that i posted and to me that IS a wildass assertion but it wasn't mine. *That is the only *created part of the story as the rest is fact and I didn't create it. |
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Post by Peace Sign on Jul 11, 2016 10:54:14 GMT
Actually, there have been fewer this year than last year. Overall officers killed in the line of duty are down, though the year is just over half over, however, officers killed by gunfire is up 63%. Gmcwife1's point stands. Can you explain the difference between the two? Not being snarky-seriously want to know. |
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Post by lovestocreate on Jul 11, 2016 11:00:18 GMT
Overall officers killed in the line of duty are down, though the year is just over half over, however, officers killed by gunfire is up 63%. Gmcwife1's point stands. Can you explain the difference between the two? Not being snarky-seriously want to know. Officer deaths are tracked by manner of death such as by vehicle, stabbing, gunshot, etc. While the total of deaths in the line of duty is down so far this year, deaths by gunfire specifically is up 63%. |
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Post by Peace Sign on Jul 11, 2016 11:15:02 GMT
Thank you.
That's not the information I'm getting. I'll be looking into that later today.
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Post by missmiss on Jul 11, 2016 14:53:13 GMT
2012 Line of Duty Officer Deaths Line of Duty Deaths: 139 9/11 related illness: 10 Accidental: 1 Aircraft accident: 3 Assault: 1 Automobile accident: 23 Drowned: 1 Duty related illness: 3 Fall: 2 Gunfire: 48 Gunfire (Accidental): 2 Heart attack: 10 Heat exhaustion: 1 Motorcycle accident: 5 Stabbed: 5 Struck by vehicle: 6 Training accident: 2 Vehicle pursuit: 5 Vehicular assault: 11 2013 Line of Duty Deaths: 123 9/11 related illness: 14 Aircraft accident: 1 Automobile accident: 26 Boating accident: 1 Bomb: 1 Drowned: 2 Duty related illness: 3 Electrocuted: 1 Fall: 4 Fire: 1 Gunfire: 31 Gunfire (Accidental): 2 Heart attack: 10 Motorcycle accident: 5 Stabbed: 2 Struck by vehicle: 8 Training accident: 2 Vehicle pursuit: 4 Vehicular assault: 5 2014 Line of Duty Deaths: 145 9/11 related illness: 16 Assault: 3 Automobile accident: 27 Drowned: 2 Duty related illness: 3 Fire: 1 Gunfire: 47 Gunfire (Accidental): 2 Heart attack: 20 Motorcycle accident: 4 Struck by vehicle: 5 Vehicle pursuit: 5 Vehicular assault: 10 2015 Line of Duty Deaths: 130 9/11 related illness: 8 Accidental: 2 Aircraft accident: 1 Assault: 3 Automobile accident: 27 Bomb: 6 Drowned: 1 Duty related illness: 2 Fall: 1 Gunfire: 39 Gunfire (Accidental): 2 Heart attack: 17 Motorcycle accident: 3 Struck by vehicle: 4 Vehicle pursuit: 5 Vehicular assault: 8 Weather/Natural disaster: 1 2016 So far this year looks to be from July 8th Line of Duty Deaths: 59 9/11 related illness: 1 Aircraft accident: 1 Animal related: 1 Automobile accident: 9 Gunfire: 26 Gunfire (Accidental): 1 Heart attack: 4 Motorcycle accident: 3 Struck by vehicle: 2 Vehicle pursuit: 2 Vehicular assault: 9 When talking about up 63% the number of police officers killed by gun fire has bounced around. Yes as of now it looks to be headed I would say close to 60. Which is more than last year by quite a bit. I am in no way discounting the deaths of any police officer. These are the numbers. When talking about it going up 63% you first need a starting number and should know the numbers in the years before to see a trend. Here is the website. www.odmp.org/search/year?year=2016What I find interesting is the k9 deaths as well. What I can't believe is how many police officers left their k9 in the car and they died. |
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happymomma
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Post by happymomma on Jul 11, 2016 15:26:37 GMT
You just witnessed your boyfriend getting killed, your child is in the back seat screaming... At some point she had the presence of mind to start recording BUT I find it really hard to believe she also, in her panic, her fear, her grief, her confusion, had the presence of mind to think, "hey, I better concoct a story to make him look innocent and record it and for bonus points whip the country Into a frenzy". No way. I'd buy it he'd been arrested for stealing a candy bar or something and she was hoping to keep his mama from spanking his behind... But not after witnessing him being shot, smack dab in a tense situation, while he died in front of her eyes, her child screaming in the back, officers yelling at her. it would take a true psychopath to think that quick. Did you see the video of her smoking weed? I don't see *that girl being able to pull that off. I agree with this 100%. That would require quick thinking that I just don't believe she would be capable of at that time. Also, listening to that police officer? He sounds like someone who shot first and thought he could ask questions later. In the state he was in, don't you think he would have denied what she was saying if it had not been true? Instead, he just keeps yelling "fuck." Just to be accurate: The officer does yell "Fuck." But he also clearly says "I told him not to reach for it!" So...who knows what transpired? It will be interesting to hear BOTH sides of the story, eventually, after investigation. Could the officer just have been having a bad day and decided to shoot this guy for no reason? Sure and if that is the case, he needs life in prison or whatever the punishment is for murder where the crime happened. I don't think there is any way ANY of us can make an informed judgement as to what happened YET. I truly hope justice prevails in whichever direction it should. Now to the SEPARATE topic of that female smoking weed (if it's weed, it appears to be) with a child in the car...I certainly hope that is handled by authorities because that is just way way way wrong. That poor child, to witness that shooting first and then this...I feel for that child. |
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Post by Peace Sign on Jul 11, 2016 15:54:18 GMT
I've read your posts. I don't think they come off as objective as you think they are. They are objective. Something went fatally wrong in what began as a pullover for a bad tail light. The police officer may have been racially biased, or he may not have been. I have no idea. LEO have a particularly high pullover rate for people of color in that area. That's allowed to influence what we post on this thread, but pointing out the obvious lingering smell of marijuana is not? Ridiculous. *IF*, and that is an enormous if that is probably of very little actually significance here, but IF the smell had something to do with the officer's reaction in any way, that is something concrete that LEO can train their officers to recognize so that they may increase their alertness without overreacting. Bad tail lights are going to get you pulled over no matter what color you are. But *IF* cops are disproportionately pulling people of color over for no apparent reason, then that is also something concrete that can be addressed. Those ideas are a whole lot more objective than deciding that a poster on a message board just doesn't get it and so their posts should be taken out of context and mentioned again and again as wrong. Actually, we won't all get pulled over for a busted taillight. I wish I could find what I was reading just this morning! The DOJ asked for a few towns to voluntarily release their reports for a study on who they stop and what color they are. They found that the whiter the community, the more blacks were stopped. So, blacks are getting pulled over way more Frequently. I think it was on yahoo dot com. It had a headline about philando -he was pulled over 52 times. It's important to note that way back before Rodney king, blacks have been pissed about the extra attention they receive from law enforcement. Driving while black. It's tantamount to harassment. And...municipalities are making the hole blacks find themselves in (sometimes) bigger with heavy fines. Philandro himself receiving over $6000 in fines. That's bullshit. And before you say (General you) to obey the law just know that not having your seatbelt on, though it's the law, will get more blacks pulled over in whiter neighborhoods than whites. Period. THAT is the crux of the reason that some people are fed up, that they speak up when being pulled over (Sandra bland) and don't just sit quietly and take it. That is no reason to be shot dead. If an officer can't take some raised voices, even insults, whatever, they shouldn't be working in a cruiser. I quoted you, left turn, but this isn't really directed at you. Sorry. |
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Post by leftturnonly on Jul 11, 2016 17:02:20 GMT
I quoted you, left turn, but this isn't really directed at you. Sorry.  The traffic stops are important. I'm leaving the death out of this for the rest of this post on purpose. I've been pulled over for a tail light that was out. I know it does happen, but that's a specific instance that deserves to be noticed and that's not really the point here. People of color are pulled over by police more often than people with whiter skin. If a bad tail light is a made up excuse and there actually is no bad light, then that's on the cops. If people of color drive around disproportionately with bad lights, that's on them. Don't forget, Timothy McVeigh was caught because he didn't have a tag on his car. Trooper who arrested Timothy McVeigh shares story. Sometimes the drivers are at fault. In this particular case, Castille had been pulled over 52 times in the last 4 years. Why was he driving with a bad tail light this time? Didn't he have any expectation that he would be pulled over for it? Had any of those other stops been for the same light? I have no idea, do you? If he had a continuing issue that cops pull people over for, that does change the narrative here. If this disproportionality is on the cops, that's something that can be focused on. If some of the disproportionality is on the drivers, meaning certain drivers continue to drive when their cars have particular issues that will get them pulled over, then at least some of this responsibility rests on them. That's also something that can be focused on within whatever community may be seeing this as a problem. * Remember, this post is not about Castille's death. It is not an attempt at justification. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2016 19:32:06 GMT
Creating a wildass assertion as a reason to dismiss the fact that we don't know what actually happened before the recording started, doesn't really work. The fact remains, we still don't know what actually happened before the recording. Disclaimer: Acknowledging this fact does not mean that I believe the victim deserved it. Going through my post point by point? Her boyfriend getting killed? Fact. Her child screaming in the backseat? Fact. She started recording at some point? Fact. That there was panic, grief, fear and confusion involved on her behalf? Well I guess I don't *know that* for a fact but I think it is a safe assumption and can be heard on the tape so I'd hardly call that a "wildass assertion". That she had the presence of mind to concoct a story to somehow make her bf look innocent in the immediate aftermath, so immediate the officer himself can still be heard panicking? Because that is the only thing left that i posted and to me that IS a wildass assertion but it wasn't mine.
*That is the only *created part of the story as the rest is fact and I didn't create it.Your post is the only place I see that, so if it didn't originate with you, where did it originate? |
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Post by annabella on Jul 11, 2016 21:09:38 GMT
I just read two news articles that Philando Castile was stopped because him and his girlfriend looked like suspects who just committed a robbery. The busted tail light story came from her. It said that he didn't have a concealed weapons permit and the gun was in plain sight on top of his lap supposedly seen in the video. Her facebook page shows them doing weed together in front of her kid and her with the merchandise stolen. And his facebook page shows him to be a gang member. The police officer who shot him is latino. These were sketchy sites, wish I had saved them, but I'm going to wait now and see what comes out of this. His girlfriend got her weave fixed and is already doing the news circuit with her attorney.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2016 0:27:53 GMT
I'm so sad right now thinking about the fact that iamkristinl16 and Peace Sign need to give their children "special talks" on how to avoid being shot by a police officer. What the hell is the world coming to? How many white moms on here have to give their white teenagers talks about what to do to avoid being shot by police? SaveSaveI did, almost 10 years ago, to my white teenage son, who was doing drugs and hanging around a bad crowd. I feared for his life daily. I feared he'd OD (most of his friends from that time period are now dead), and I feared that he'd either run from police or smart-talk them and get in trouble (shot? put in jail?). Any time your child is into criminal behavior, a parent is very worried that this could very well be the end result. I know that my ex and I both told my son to always respect the police, listen to them and do exactly what they say. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2016 0:36:43 GMT
How many white moms on here have to give their white teenagers talks about what to do to avoid being shot by police? SaveSaveI have never had that talk with my three grown white children. I have personally been stopped by police and have had zero issues neither retrieving my registration from my glovebox, nor digging in my huge ass purse for my wallet/license. No cop has ever batted an eye. I also have never had to keep my hands on my steering wheel. The same can be said for my white husband. Everyone should be treated like that regardless of the color of their skin. SaveSavemomstime: I'll tell you that I was pulled over by a deputy about a year ago. It was very dark out and I was on my way home in rush hour traffic. I sensed that someone was closely following me, making me feel uncomfortable. I changed lanes, and he was again behind me. I didn't see that it was a police car until his lights flashed and I pulled over. I was PISSED that he chose to pull me over when there were a few examples of people driving quite negligently, but his statement to me was that, "I was just watching you." I felt like he was LOOKING for something on me. Since many, many people here don't change their license to reflect their address changes, or they aren't current with their car insurance or registration, or they have warrants out on them or a suspended license. With every question, I had my legal answer and he seemed to be more pissed off. I felt more and more uncomfortable and worried. I was going to ask if I could call my husband since I was so close to home, but I didn't. I got my notice to appear and I was so freakin' pissed! This cop hounded me, followed me, scared me and then had nothing but me speeding (to get away from him!). But, was I scared to even reach for my ID in the glove compartment?? You bet your ass!! Every single thing I did, I asked him first. I was very careful. I felt very much chosen to be ticketed. It's a horrible feeling. (I fought the ticket and won since he didn't appear. Now I'm much more aware of who's near me.) |
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Just T
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Post by Just T on Jul 12, 2016 0:40:37 GMT
I have most definitely told my son how to behave if he gets pulled over. I am a middle aged white woman, and I have encountered one situation where a cop was a total a$$ to me, even though I was being about as cooperative as a person can be and was almost in tears. My son, who is 21, tends to be a bit mouthy and cocky at times, and I have most definitely talked to him about what to do and how to act if he gets pulled over. I've also told my girls, who are 20 and 18 the same things.
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Post by shescrafty on Jul 12, 2016 0:41:46 GMT
How many white moms on here have to give their white teenagers talks about what to do to avoid being shot by police? SaveSaveI did, almost 10 years ago, to my white teenage son, who was doing drugs and hanging around a bad crowd. I feared for his life daily. I feared he'd OD (most of his friends from that time period are now dead), and I feared that he'd either run from police or smart-talk them and get in trouble (shot? put in jail?). Any time your child is into criminal behavior, a parent is very worried that this could very well be the end result. I know that my ex and I both told my son to always respect the police, listen to them and do exactly what they say. All of my friends who have children of color talk to them about behavior if pulled over or talked to by a cop. NOT because their son is into criminal behavior as yours was (and I hope things are better for him and you family now), but because they are scared of what may happen to their son if any of their behavior is perceived as threatening or wrong in any way. Saw a FB post the other day by a friend who is black and who has an adult son with autism. She is VERY scared for him because he does not always respond in typical ways. He gets agitated and can go from walking along to reacting very poorly and screaming or running away at times. So even though he is not involved in criminal activity, she is scared because he is a large black male who does not act in a typical and predictable fashion. |
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peasquared
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Post by peasquared on Jul 12, 2016 0:48:33 GMT
In regards to Philandro Castile, the only FACTS we know are 1) the police pulled them over. 2) the police shot and killed Philandro Castile. I don't understand how so many people here can jump to conclusions based on the video taken AFTER the shooting. I've not one time blamed either man for his own death. But I am not able to jump to blame the police based on the video I saw, the same video all of you have seen because to me, the only factual thing that video shows is that he was shot and died. 3) The officer stood at the window with his gun drawn while making no attempt to aid the dying Philandro. 4) Handcuffed the girlfriend, locked her up and separated her from her daughter. In regards to the officer's attorney, he can say anything he wants right now. He is not in a court of law yet. He's trying to shed his client in a good light. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2016 1:01:32 GMT
I did, almost 10 years ago, to my white teenage son, who was doing drugs and hanging around a bad crowd. I feared for his life daily. I feared he'd OD (most of his friends from that time period are now dead), and I feared that he'd either run from police or smart-talk them and get in trouble (shot? put in jail?). Any time your child is into criminal behavior, a parent is very worried that this could very well be the end result. I know that my ex and I both told my son to always respect the police, listen to them and do exactly what they say. All of my friends who have children of color talk to them about behavior if pulled over or talked to by a cop. NOT because their son is into criminal behavior as yours was (and I hope things are better for him and you family now), but because they are scared of what may happen to their son if any of their behavior is perceived as threatening or wrong in any way. Saw a FB post the other day by a friend who is black and who has an adult son with autism. She is VERY scared for him because he does not always respond in typical ways. He gets agitated and can go from walking along to reacting very poorly and screaming or running away at times. So even though he is not involved in criminal activity, she is scared because he is a large black male who does not act in a typical and predictable fashion. shescrafty: Thank you, yes, he's doing very well, thank God! He moved from NY to live with me and my husband in FL and start a new, clean life. My husband (not his father) has been the BEST thing for him--he's tough, he's loving and he's the one person who gets through to my son. He helped my son get on a good path, join a program, get help and turn his life around. I thank God every day for that. When I'm in need of anything, my son is right here, helping out. Thank you for asking. I've mentioned his story on a few threads on here....... As a sidenote: One of my sisters has a bi-racial son. When she was dating his father, she told me of how even though we're in such a progressive world, some people still seemed to have an issue with her interracial relationship. I couldn't believe it. Then when her son was about 5, his dad told him how he had to be extra careful and respectful, even more than white people. Sad, but true. That was just about the time that he took note of everyone's color, ("She's white," "He's tan," "He's black..."). |
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happymomma
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Post by happymomma on Jul 12, 2016 1:09:46 GMT
You bet your a** I have had that talk with my son, who is white and 27 years old. Just the other day, in fact. I do worry. He lives in a small Montana town and drives a big, older truck as his work truck. It isn't in the best of shape, looks-wise.
Black men are not the only ones that can encounter a bad cop, or be beat up or shot.
I've also advised him that if he ever gets called in for interrogation for anything, to exercise his right to an attorney before he talks, even if he hasn't done a thing wrong. I guess I have watched way too many Dateline, etc. episodes where any little thing can get twisted around or any inaccurate of vague statements can end you up in prison for life.
It's just good common sense to protect yourself no matter what your age, color or gender.
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LeaP
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Post by LeaP on Jul 12, 2016 1:11:07 GMT
And I ask this honestly, does anyone think that police officers are more "skittish" due to the gun culture in this country? They have to assume that everyone is packin'? I think this. I have no idea if it is actually the case. My friend is dating a police officer. The very first time he came for dinner, he said something to the effect of good people like us owning guns. He got a good laugh when I told him we could hardly remember to put away butter, let alone responsibly curate ammunition and guns. His serious stories gives me the feeling that he has had a number of close calls that have made him cautious over the years. Knowing how many guns are out there, would make me nervous if I were an officer. SaveSaveSaveSaveSaveSaveSaveSave |
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Post by Peace Sign on Jul 13, 2016 10:27:14 GMT
So, those who want to gain some insight, can watch CNN tonight at 10:00 for a town hall with police, black and white people.
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jayfab
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Post by jayfab on Jul 13, 2016 11:43:03 GMT
So, those who want to gain some insight, can watch CNN tonight at 10:00 for a town hall with police, black and white people. Thanks, I'll be sure to watch. |
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Post by erinshavonne34 on Jul 30, 2016 3:38:47 GMT
I have to admit this has been weighing heavily on my mind today. The two men from Louisiana and Minnesota, the Dallas Police Department, the little girl in the backseat of the car and what Olan has been saying on this thread. Olan, this is only my perspective but perhaps others share it as well. A lot of times my lack of commenting is because I can't even wrap my head around what I feel or think. Even after processing the information more likely than not I am going to end up somewhere in the middle. For example, Trayvon Martin. To this day I can't even fully commit to a "side" because of the conflicting stories. Does that mean I think Zimmerman is a stand up guy who had only pure intentions that night? Definitely not. Do I think Trayvon was a "thug" or looking for trouble that night. Definitely not. How can I try to comment on a message board when I don't even know myself what I am thinking. So I keep my mouth shut and read other peoples opinions hoping that maybe something will make it more clear to me. A lot of the reason I can't wrap my head around tragedies like this is because I live in South Dakota. We just don't have situations like this here. Not to mention I live in a town of less than 900 people. We don't have a police station. We have two cops and when the one isn't on duty his police car is parked in his driveway. So we don't exactly see police brutality. FTR on these two latest shootings I think the videos are pretty damning and as of right now I don't see any reason why the officers thought these two men needed to be shot and killed. Sure I will wait for more information to be released to see if my opinion is going to change. However, at this moment I don't see what they could possibly say that will change my mind. Especially in the Castile shooting. He was wearing a seatbelt for crying out loud! Not to mention a 4 year old child in the backseat and my heart does break for that little girl. Her comforting her mom is something that makes me cry. Normally I wouldn't even post this because I always worry that I am not going to word my thoughts correctly. For every 1 post I have there are at least 5 others posts that I have typed on various topics but always end up deleting. However, I did want you to know Olan that I "hear" what you are saying. I understand what you are trying to convey. I am seeing the bigger picture in this discussion. Like you I want to see something change. Let help you commit to a side....Clearly Zimmerman is violent he's been arrest over a dozen times since his trail. Been in several photo with known racist and you still question his motives? Wow. |
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Post by erinshavonne34 on Jul 30, 2016 5:04:23 GMT
Which part do you think is a "wildass" assertion? Going through my post point by point? Her boyfriend getting killed? Fact. Her child screaming in the backseat? Fact. She started recording at some point? Fact. That there was panic, grief, fear and confusion involved on her behalf? Well I guess I don't *know that* for a fact but I think it is a safe assumption and can be heard on the tape so I'd hardly call that a "wildass assertion". That she had the presence of mind to concoct a story to somehow make her bf look innocent in the immediate aftermath, so immediate the officer himself can still be heard panicking? Because that is the only thing left that i posted and to me that IS a wildass assertion but it wasn't mine.
*That is the only *created part of the story as the rest is fact and I didn't create it. Your post is the only place I see that, so if it didn't originate with you, where did it originate? I get your point....but white America should just admit they don't understand....And they don't want to try |
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Olan
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Post by Olan on May 2, 2017 12:26:15 GMT
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Olan
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Post by Olan on May 2, 2017 22:03:03 GMT
His brother flagged down a passing police car when he realized his brother had been shot, in order to get medical help for his brother, and it still took "10-15 minutes" for medical help to arrive? This is just as important to be looked at as the original shooting. I can't imagine how long it must have felt for his brother. Incredibly sad situation that's become pretty common place now. |
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Post by elaine on May 2, 2017 22:04:58 GMT
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Post by bc2ca on May 2, 2017 22:13:48 GMT
Thank goodness for body cameras. It sounds like the officer's initial report contradicts what is on the camera.  |
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ginacivey
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Post by ginacivey on May 2, 2017 22:22:28 GMT
"10-15 minutes" for medical help to arrive? the whole thing stinks - shooting while a vehicle drives away - with a rifle not making much sense but 10-15 minutes for help in a metro area - i wonder what THAT story is gina |
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tduby1
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Post by tduby1 on May 2, 2017 22:30:52 GMT
Thank goodness for body cameras. It sounds like the officer's initial report contradicts what is on the camera. And I suspect he assumed the chief would back him up. Thankfully he did what was right instead. |
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Olan
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Post by Olan on May 2, 2017 22:41:17 GMT
Thank goodness for body cameras. It sounds like the officer's initial report contradicts what is on the camera. The police chief released that lie and later said he misspoke in an effort to release the information quickly. Following the murder the older brother was handcuffed and held overnight. It also seems the police didn't bother to notify the Edward's parents of their child's death or arrest because another report says the father was arrested at a police station inquiring about his sons. |
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