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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2014 19:05:52 GMT
Oh, that's really hard.
On one hand, if your rule is no boys and he wants to be accepted as a boy, that seems pretty straightforward. On the other hand, Larry probably needs to feel like his life is as normal as it can be and like his friends aren't changing or changing the way they behave because of his change of identity.
Honestly, I'd probably try to schedule non-sleepover outings and stuff and try to avoid the whole issue entirely.
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Post by sisterbdsq on Aug 27, 2014 19:41:27 GMT
um just want to say wow, I was asking for input. Yours was sooo sweetly put. thank you for that. said child did not just develop gender identity issues overnight said child was sleeping at our house at the time so I doubt the parent would have issues if they didnt then. If it comes up that my dd wants to ask him to sleep over, then no shit, I will be calling the parent. I didn't quote you and say anything negative to you. I was quoting a statement that someone else posted and commenting on the social graces, or lack thereof, of the situation. I starting commenting on the conversation as it progressed. I don't think anyone here is stupid and thinks this child had overnight decided to be a boy. The time to have brought up your "no shit" information was when I first posted about talking to the parents, not way down the thread. If you want to be a snot and have a hissy, that's on you.
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Post by flanz on Aug 27, 2014 19:53:12 GMT
how awesome that his parents accepted him and let him change. that's really great and i hope it's a sign that they are supporting him fully! what a tricky situation tho- i agree with parts of all the previous posts, on the "yes" and "no" sides. i think the instinct would be, if you were fully treating him like a boy, then he can't stay over. of course he doesn't have to lose your daughter as a friend, but he just has to go home at bedtime and can come back in the morning. if you two have a good relationship, maybe you could say you're happy he's finding out more about who he really is, and you support him 100%, but because you do you have to hold him to the same rules as other boys. I found myself "liking" both yea and nay posts on the sleepover issue. It is a tough call. BlueTulip has summed up my feelings well.
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Post by kmk1112 on Aug 27, 2014 20:08:33 GMT
How about a compromise, where he can sleep over, but not in her room. That honors the friendship from before, but he sleeps in the guest room, or DD sleeps on the couch and he gets her bed.
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Post by CarolinaGirl71 on Aug 27, 2014 20:16:00 GMT
how awesome that his parents accepted him and let him change. that's really great and i hope it's a sign that they are supporting him fully! what a tricky situation tho- i agree with parts of all the previous posts, on the "yes" and "no" sides. i think the instinct would be, if you were fully treating him like a boy, then he can't stay over. of course he doesn't have to lose your daughter as a friend, but he just has to go home at bedtime and can come back in the morning. if you two have a good relationship, maybe you could say you're happy he's finding out more about who he really is, and you support him 100%, but because you do you have to hold him to the same rules as other boys. I agree. To be a boy means to be treated as a boy would be treated.
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Post by jackie on Aug 27, 2014 20:23:42 GMT
This sexuality stuff gets really tricky these days. I get the rule, and overall I think it's a good one or at least a good guideline, but sexual experimentation and various sexual orientations sure muddy the waters! My ds came out to me as gay and he did it when he wanted to have a sleepover at his best friend's house (who is a girl). I told him "no boy/girl sleepovers". Really I knew at that point he was gay and I thought this would nudge him into coming out to me. It did and yes, I let him sleepover. He was 14 then and is 18 now. All of his teen sleepovers have been with girls. He asked to sleep over at a boy's house about a year ago, assuring me he wasn't gay. I was skeptical but said yes, then found out he was at the very least bisexual. We had a talk about that one--I at least need him to be honest with me. My dd hangs with an artsy, freaky sort of a crowd (and I mean freaky with NO negative connotations). There are definitely friends who are bi or gay. And truth be told, there are straight girls who are curious and experiment. I don't know why I'm rambling, but the truth is, you can't really get away from sexual experimentation with kids, especially on sleepovers. Having a "no boy" rule or allowing this transgender child to be an exception to the rule--neither will guarantee this stuff won't happen. Oh, and while I have no advice, just want to say that I love that this child's parents are accepting him as he is and that you and your dd and all of their friends are too. It warms my heart!
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Deleted
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Oct 11, 2024 0:32:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2014 20:27:35 GMT
My only experience is second hand, but when a high school friend of mine's transgendered child started living as a boy, it was really important that it changed his existing friendships as little as possible. Despite the consensus here of "if he identifies as a boy, he should be treated like a boy and not be allowed to stay over," changing their relationship by now forbidding sleepovers will probably be perceived as "punishing" him. At this time of great change for him, that's not what I'd want to do. I can see moving in that direction in the future, but this is new and I would not force the issue right now. He needs all the support he can get.
I do agree, though, that talking to his parents is the best course of action.
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Post by kandie on Aug 27, 2014 20:36:22 GMT
it seemed like when you were typing YOU, you were referring to me( as the oringal author of this thread), thus I took offense to what you posted as I viewed it as snarky.
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LeaP
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Jun 26, 2014 23:17:22 GMT
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Post by LeaP on Aug 27, 2014 20:38:19 GMT
Wow, this is one of those difficult questions!
I would ask his parents and then proceed accordingly. I can see both sides of saying yes and no to sleepovers, the answer is more nuanced. Please let us know what you decide.
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Post by sisterbdsq on Aug 27, 2014 20:39:44 GMT
it seemed like when you were typing YOU, you were referring to me( as the oringal author of this thread), thus I took offense to what you posted as I viewed it as snarky. My apologies for the CAPS then. I did not mean you (OP) just a collective, general you as in people/parents/humans. But I will cop to calling you a snot and I APOLOGIZE (in caps!).
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Post by disneypal on Aug 27, 2014 20:45:36 GMT
Wow - that is tough. I think if my policy is that no boys are allowed to sleep over, then Larry cannot sleep over since Larry now identifies himself as a boy.
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Post by penny on Aug 28, 2014 2:37:00 GMT
This is an interesting question... Part of me sees no problem because they've already had sleepovers, but part of me thinks that if Larry feels/wants/is (I'm sorry, I'm not sure the best words to use), to be recognized as a male, then the most respectful thing is to treat him like you would any other male...
I also think, although you didn't ask, that age plays a bigger part in sleepovers than gender... When I was growing up my best friends were two brothers and we'd have sleepovers all the time... It only changed at age ten when my parents knew physical and psychological changes would be starting to happen... They just said that little kids can have sleepover the same way they can take naps together, but now that you're older there are different rules...
I think that whatever you decide, make sure to tell Larry your decision and why you made it... The real reason and not something that could sound like an excuse to him... If you go the no sleepover route, just say that the house rule is no boys can sleep over (simple as that), just like boys and girls can't change clothes in the same room or whatever else might be different...
Kids are smart, and he sounds amazingly self aware... He'll be able to sense if you're accepting and will understand that some rules might change...
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Grom Pea
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Jun 27, 2014 0:21:07 GMT
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Post by Grom Pea on Aug 28, 2014 3:33:17 GMT
This is a tough one but I think I'd let Larry stay and probably any friend stay on a case by case basis. Here is why. I was at a bonfire and a friend of a friend was laughing with his sister about the "no opposite sex friends in the same room. He was gay and his parents insisted that none of his female friends were allowed to sleep in his room only males and he was implying that he got the good deal since his parents basically set up a scenario where he was alone with his boyfriend, yet his sister could not stay in the same room as her boyfriend, basically by having inflexible rules house parents guaranteed the exact opposite of what they wanted to happen. I think you know your daughter best and you should know if she is a good judge of character or if you need to step in and help and with the info you've given it sounds like you don't need to kick Larry out at this age.
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Post by 950nancy on Aug 28, 2014 3:44:59 GMT
I agree, this is a hard one. I would rather err to the side of caution and not allow sleepovers anymore. They can still hang out and do special things together, but why does one NEED to have the sleepover. Perhaps talking to the mom will give you some better insight into the situation.
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Post by polz on Aug 28, 2014 3:49:02 GMT
No sleepovers if Larry is now a boy. I have the same rule. And yet, DD has a 14 year old friend who is gay and I have no problem with her sleeping over.
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trollie
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Post by trollie on Aug 28, 2014 3:53:20 GMT
I would be ok with it too....
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Post by lindywholoveskids on Aug 28, 2014 3:58:09 GMT
Time to be flexible Good idea to talk it out with the kids and maybe the parents
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Post by AussieMeg on Aug 28, 2014 4:11:30 GMT
My only experience is second hand, but when a high school friend of mine's transgendered child started living as a boy, it was really important that it changed his existing friendships as little as possible. Despite the consensus here of "if he identifies as a boy, he should be treated like a boy and not be allowed to stay over," changing their relationship by now forbidding sleepovers will probably be perceived as "punishing" him. At this time of great change for him, that's not what I'd want to do. I can see moving in that direction in the future, but this is new and I would not force the issue right now. He needs all the support he can get. I do agree, though, that talking to his parents is the best course of action. Wow OP, that is a tough one! I have read all the posts and I agree with people on both sides of the argument. Busypea's response above is the one that really stuck out to me and I this this is what I would base my answer on if it were my child.
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Post by smokey2471 on Aug 28, 2014 4:18:45 GMT
I would let Larry sleep over as long as DD inderstood that Larry is sleeping over as an exception and that other boys are still a no go.
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MrsPea #2861
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Jul 9, 2014 3:19:52 GMT
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Post by MrsPea #2861 on Aug 28, 2014 5:47:06 GMT
I think you stick to your rule. Larry identifies as a boy. Larry doesn't sleep over. Frankly, I think he'll be happy you are respecting his wishes. He can still come over and hang out. But to me if he identifies and has crossed that line, I would respect it and regardless of his genitalia, treat him as a boy. Yep^^^
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ComplicatedLady
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Jul 26, 2014 21:02:07 GMT
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Post by ComplicatedLady on Aug 28, 2014 6:03:57 GMT
Despite the consensus here of "if he identifies as a boy, he should be treated like a boy and not be allowed to stay over," changing their relationship by now forbidding sleepovers will probably be perceived as "punishing" him. At this time of great change for him, that's not what I'd want to do. I can see moving in that direction in the future, but this is new and I would not force the issue right now. He needs all the support he can get. I do agree, though, that talking to his parents is the best course of action. I agree with this. There has to be so much going on in this 13 yo's head right now. I wouldn't want to put my child in a position to potentially alienate or 'punish' Larry. I would talk talk to my dd first and see what her thoughts are. Depending on what she said or wanted to do, I would talk to Larry's parents. Basically, i would want to be there for my dd and her friend during this transition. Nothing in life is black and white and this is just another example of that gray area.
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Post by leftturnonly on Aug 28, 2014 6:36:10 GMT
This is a young adolescent, a brand new teenager, with a brand new public sexual identity.
Life is going to be very, very hard for "Larry" this year.
Yes, he wants to be considered as a male, but right now, "he" has all the memories and emotions (still) of Lisa. If Larry is undergoing treatment to keep him from developing further as a woman, than those emotions will begin to change, but I'm sure that's a process and not something that magically changes with a namechange.
I don't see how the black & white rules apply to this grey time in his life.
Maybe it's too soon to decide how you'll react. Maybe this is one of those cross the bridge when you get to it situations.
Who knows? Larry may still act, think, and talk exactly like Lisa for a good long time and you may be completely comfortable with having him overnight for a while yet.
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Post by Heart on Aug 28, 2014 11:54:51 GMT
I have had to make this decision. My DD is genderqueer and has many trans or otherwise non binary friends on various parts of the rainbow spectrum. After a lot of hard discussion and soul searching, I have adjusted my preconceived ideas about sex, gender and sexual orientation. I know I may have to adjust again. Currently, my rule is no potential partners or love interests can stay over.
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paigepea
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Jun 26, 2014 4:28:55 GMT
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Post by paigepea on Aug 28, 2014 12:44:36 GMT
I agree with the poster who said make decisions about sleepovers on a case by case basis.
I'm surprised at how many are talking about so many sleepovers. My dd has a sleepover once very other month, or less. How close are Larry and your dd - because it doesn't sound like they're super close or that you know the parents all that well. In that case, I'd probably let the kids dictate how their relationship will be. I understand the posters who say Larry has had enough change in his life and needs his good friends and similar situations at the moment, but I don't believe that is realistic. He must expect that some things will change, and he must have accepted that.
I also can't believe that whether or not sleepovers with your dd continue is high on his parents' priority list.
I would do what I'm comfortable with. If it were me, I only let kids whom I know very well, from families where I know the parents well, and whom I trust, sleep over. If I knew this boy very well, trusted him and trusted him with my dd, and if I had a good and open relationship with the parents, I'd probably let him sleep over.
I don't know what I think about the boy / girl sleep over issue. I feel that, when my dd grows, there will most likely be some boys I'd trust more then girls. At the same time, I'm more inclined to limit sleepovers as opposed to having black/white rules about sleepovers, and just assess each situation as it comes.
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Country Ham
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Jun 25, 2014 19:32:08 GMT
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Post by Country Ham on Aug 28, 2014 13:34:00 GMT
If she wants to pretend to be a boy then treat her like a boy. Same rules. If you treat her the same way then it's like you don't accept her change and you consider her the same as she always was a female friend.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2014 13:43:22 GMT
13 year old DD has a friend Lisa (names changed). They are both in 8th grade. Lisa has always been tomboyish. Lisa has slept over at our house several times last year. Sweet kid and great family!!! Lisa and my DD hang out with the same group of friends and have similar interests. Lisa came back to school as Larry. I had a long discussion with my DD, she totally accepts Larry and has no problem refering to Lisa as Larry or as a boy. Now here is the issue. Boys are not allowed to sleep over at our house. Larry (Lisa) has slept over here as Lisa. How do I address this now if DD wants him to sleep over. It is still the same child. she has the genitalia of a female but she is identifying as a boy. thoughts?? you wanna live as a boy, you forgo the perks of being a girl, such as sleeping over with my daughter. You made your choice. I respect your choice but you changed, so new rules apply.
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PaperAngel
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Jun 27, 2014 23:04:06 GMT
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Post by PaperAngel on Aug 28, 2014 13:44:37 GMT
For simplicity, fairness, & respect, I suggest adopting the rule of no more sleepovers regardless the gender identity/expression or sexual orientation of the friend! Best wishes...
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