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Post by 950nancy on Sept 2, 2017 20:41:30 GMT
I believe our kids and our country would be much better off if sports were eliminated from schools. At least minimized. I've been told so many times that if I didn't pass a kid along he would end up dropping out of high school. Nope, didn't happen. I've been told that "encouraging " kids to stay on teams (aka forgiving late assignments, giving extra chance before writing referrals) would keep them out of trouble. Nope, those kids got arrested in the parking lot dealing drugs before the game! I sometimes catch crap from kids and even their parents for scheduling labs or tests on game day Fridays. Don't I know those boys need to be resting up for a big night? We had a kid who was caught cheating on an AP test in class. He was assigned in school suspension. The day had to be arranged around the team's schedule because he was such s good player @@. And then on his assigned day some coach from a college came to visit the school and he was trotted out for a photo op. In our area, some of the kids attend school so they can play sports. School should always be the first priority, but if you've had kids in sports, you know the value of a great coach who is inspirational. The teammates can be just as important. Yes, some kids will always get into trouble, but for the vast majority, sports keep kids busy and motivated. No way would I think schools would be better off without sports. (I personally can't stand them, but I do see the benefit.)
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AnotherPea
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,968
Jan 4, 2015 1:47:52 GMT
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Post by AnotherPea on Sept 2, 2017 21:29:16 GMT
I believe our kids and our country would be much better off if sports were eliminated from schools. At least minimized. I've been told so many times that if I didn't pass a kid along he would end up dropping out of high school. Nope, didn't happen. I've been told that "encouraging " kids to stay on teams (aka forgiving late assignments, giving extra chance before writing referrals) would keep them out of trouble. Nope, those kids got arrested in the parking lot dealing drugs before the game! I sometimes catch crap from kids and even their parents for scheduling labs or tests on game day Fridays. Don't I know those boys need to be resting up for a big night? We had a kid who was caught cheating on an AP test in class. He was assigned in school suspension. The day had to be arranged around the team's schedule because he was such s good player @@. And then on his assigned day some coach from a college came to visit the school and he was trotted out for a photo op. In our area, some of the kids attend school so they can play sports. School should always be the first priority, but if you've had kids in sports, you know the value of a great coach who is inspirational. The teammates can be just as important. Yes, some kids will always get into trouble, but for the vast majority, sports keep kids busy and motivated. No way would I think schools would be better off without sports. (I personally can't stand them, but I do see the benefit.) I've had two children that participated in three different sports each through the schools. They had great coaches. But my opinion still stands.
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Post by jamielynn on Sept 2, 2017 21:35:09 GMT
I didn't read all the responses but would the class day be longer? If so I imagine sport practices would be later too - so would the kids nip the extra sleep off that way?
If they didn't go the same amount of hours I wonder if they would have more school days to meet requirements and thus eat cost savings?
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Post by 950nancy on Sept 2, 2017 22:24:49 GMT
In our area, some of the kids attend school so they can play sports. School should always be the first priority, but if you've had kids in sports, you know the value of a great coach who is inspirational. The teammates can be just as important. Yes, some kids will always get into trouble, but for the vast majority, sports keep kids busy and motivated. No way would I think schools would be better off without sports. (I personally can't stand them, but I do see the benefit.) I've had two children that participated in three different sports each through the schools. They had great coaches. But my opinion still stands. My kids lived for sports. I saw it as a great partnership with schools.
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Post by ktdoesntscrap on Sept 2, 2017 22:28:31 GMT
Around her most high school start and 8.30 and they seem to have no problem with sports. Practice is from 3.45 to 6.30, same for band, chorus, and theatre.
My daughter does a theatre program after school and hasn't got home until 8 pm for years. She is just a Freshman so all through middle school. It worked. She just had to be organized and on top of things. Games and shows do mean later nights. I know they had to move our HS football game from Friday to Thursday due to weather. The game was a couple of hours away. So they gave the players and cheerleaders an excused absence for the first period on Friday. It can be done it just requires creative thinking. Bolding mine. That's great if you have enough gym/practice space for all practices to be simultaneously, but not all schools have that luxury. We have a middle school gym and a high school gym (the schools are connected). During basketball season (I'm sure other sports are the same) they somehow have to schedule 6 teams (middle school boys & girls, JV boys & girls, and Varsity boys & girls), every day, in those 2 gyms. Now the seasons don't fully overlap, but parts do. There is some serious juggling going on, I can't imagine what it'd be like if school got out an hour later. I guess I don't see what is different. If you move the start time back by an hour the end time is an hour later. So the juggling issue doesn't really change. I can see that it might require lights for outdoor sports.. but you have the same space no matter what time school starts. THe kids are staying up late anyway. If you read the research it explains that starting the day later does not mean kids go to bed later.. it just means they get more sleep.
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Post by 950nancy on Sept 2, 2017 22:34:36 GMT
Bolding mine. That's great if you have enough gym/practice space for all practices to be simultaneously, but not all schools have that luxury. We have a middle school gym and a high school gym (the schools are connected). During basketball season (I'm sure other sports are the same) they somehow have to schedule 6 teams (middle school boys & girls, JV boys & girls, and Varsity boys & girls), every day, in those 2 gyms. Now the seasons don't fully overlap, but parts do. There is some serious juggling going on, I can't imagine what it'd be like if school got out an hour later. I guess I don't see what is different. If you move the start time back by an hour the end time is an hour later. So the juggling issue doesn't really change. I can see that it might require lights for outdoor sports.. but you have the same space no matter what time school starts. THe kids are staying up late anyway. If you read the research it explains that starting the day later does not mean kids go to bed later.. it just means they get more sleep. When you have three (or four) football teams that need the same space, practices can go very late as is. Even with lights (in the less funded districts) the districts cannot afford to put them in or even turn them on for practices. I definitely think what works for one area will not automatically work for another area because of logistics. While you don't see the issue, other districts that have wanted to try moving the time forward have not been able to make it happen because it is different. And in my experience, if kids are playing football or soccer, they are extremely tired and they don't stay up later. Mine usually crashed right after their homework was finished.
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Post by 950nancy on Sept 2, 2017 22:37:35 GMT
I didn't read all the responses but would the class day be longer? If so I imagine sport practices would be later too - so would the kids nip the extra sleep off that way? If they didn't go the same amount of hours I wonder if they would have more school days to meet requirements and thus eat cost savings? Yes, some states go by hours and don't have as many days. They also add in extra hours for emergencies, but overall have a shorter calendar year than lots of other kids.
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cycworker
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,376
Jun 26, 2014 0:42:38 GMT
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Post by cycworker on Sept 3, 2017 0:36:19 GMT
Our schools start around 8:35 or so.
The research I've read says not to start before 9:00 a.m., which I think would be best. We used to go 9-3
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Post by Night Owl on Sept 3, 2017 0:48:18 GMT
My daughter goes to school 1 hour earlier now that she is in middle school this year and we both are really feeling the difference.
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Post by katiejane on Sept 3, 2017 7:47:08 GMT
There has been lots of international studies on the changes to the age brains. There was a schools in the UK that moved from the the 8.30 start to at 9.30 start and it had good results. The senior schools here are 8.20 - 3.00, which additional clubs sports or academic activities until 5pm.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Sept 3, 2017 14:06:18 GMT
I'm a teacher of middle grades. The school I'm at is a K-8. We start at 7:45 and the K-3 gets out at 1:45 with the 4-8 getting out at 2:20. Our high school starts at 8:05 and gets out at 3:05. I asked my kids about their feelings on starting later. They were all about it because it meant that their parents would let them stay up later and play on their phones and video games. They will not get any extra sleep. They'll still be tired when school starts. It's not going to be beneficial to MOST kids. AND sports will go until 10 or 11 on a school night. Jobs would be harder to get since they wouldn't be able to start work until 4 or later. Now, for me? I'd LOVE a later start. I'm a morning person but I have to get up at 5:30 to get lunches made, showered, breakfast, etc... before I leave at 6:45. If we started at 8:30, I wouldn't have to leave until 7:30. Not that I'd sleep in since my internal alarm clock goes off at 5:45 at the absolute latest. I could get stuff done at home before having to leave. You know, important stuff like email, Facebook, chatting with my friends. LOL Because of their natural sleep and wake cycles, teens often can't get to sleep until later in the evening. So, yes, they may be up watching TV or playing games, but they most likely are doing that already. My 12 and 14 year olds often say that they lay awake for quite awhile at night and can't get to sleep. So, yes, kids do get more sleep with a later start time.
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Post by Linda on Sept 3, 2017 16:22:52 GMT
I'm in a rural district where the bus routes are long and spread out and the bus drivers do two routes (elementary/6th & Middle/High).
6th grade is 733-210 (bus riders are shuttled to/from their zoned elementary schools to ride their buses)
K-5 is 745-215 - our bus is picking up a bit later this year at 620 - in the past it was as early as 605
7-8 is 840-325
9-12 is 828-320 - our bus picks up at 705
I'm up at 545, DD17 gets up at 6 and dd10 gets up at 630.
DD17 usually comes home, does homework, has dinner, does homework, and goes to bed. No video games, no TV, no non-assigned reading and she's almost always behind on homework (that's in part due to her courseload - she has 1 honours class, 6 AP classes, and an online course)
DD10 comes home, does homework, plays for a bit, has dinner, reads, and goes to bed. No TV or video games here except on weekends
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Post by 950nancy on Sept 3, 2017 17:19:33 GMT
I'm a teacher of middle grades. The school I'm at is a K-8. We start at 7:45 and the K-3 gets out at 1:45 with the 4-8 getting out at 2:20. Our high school starts at 8:05 and gets out at 3:05. I asked my kids about their feelings on starting later. They were all about it because it meant that their parents would let them stay up later and play on their phones and video games. They will not get any extra sleep. They'll still be tired when school starts. It's not going to be beneficial to MOST kids. AND sports will go until 10 or 11 on a school night. Jobs would be harder to get since they wouldn't be able to start work until 4 or later. Now, for me? I'd LOVE a later start. I'm a morning person but I have to get up at 5:30 to get lunches made, showered, breakfast, etc... before I leave at 6:45. If we started at 8:30, I wouldn't have to leave until 7:30. Not that I'd sleep in since my internal alarm clock goes off at 5:45 at the absolute latest. I could get stuff done at home before having to leave. You know, important stuff like email, Facebook, chatting with my friends. LOL Because of their natural sleep and wake cycles, teens often can't get to sleep until later in the evening. So, yes, they may be up watching TV or playing games, but they most likely are doing that already. My 12 and 14 year olds often say that they lay awake for quite awhile at night and can't get to sleep. So, yes, kids do get more sleep with a later start time. I also think kids that are used to being on phones and computers have a harder time shutting off. I was a great sleeper at that age. I didn't have a hard time sleeping until I had babies.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Jun 2, 2024 9:51:07 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2017 17:45:16 GMT
Even if they moved the start time, most kids would still arrive at the same time here due to their parents' work schedules. Our (private) schools don't have busses and public transportation is unreliable and infeasible for families attending multiple schools.
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Post by anonrefugee on Sept 3, 2017 17:55:19 GMT
I'm a teacher of middle grades. The school I'm at is a K-8. We start at 7:45 and the K-3 gets out at 1:45 with the 4-8 getting out at 2:20. Our high school starts at 8:05 and gets out at 3:05. I asked my kids about their feelings on starting later. They were all about it because it meant that their parents would let them stay up later and play on their phones and video games. They will not get any extra sleep. They'll still be tired when school starts. It's not going to be beneficial to MOST kids. AND sports will go until 10 or 11 on a school night. Jobs would be harder to get since they wouldn't be able to start work until 4 or later. Now, for me? I'd LOVE a later start. I'm a morning person but I have to get up at 5:30 to get lunches made, showered, breakfast, etc... before I leave at 6:45. If we started at 8:30, I wouldn't have to leave until 7:30. Not that I'd sleep in since my internal alarm clock goes off at 5:45 at the absolute latest. I could get stuff done at home before having to leave. You know, important stuff like email, Facebook, chatting with my friends. LOL Our school district has staggered start times with elementary at 7-something, middle at 8-something and high school at 9:15. It's been this way since before my now-college son entered kindergarten. There was a huge cost saving by using the buses for multiple shifts, and they used teen health and sleep studies to justify it. But I'm not sure it's led to more real sleep, just like you said seaexplore. My sons' practices are before school, as are others and band during marching season. So they're at school before 6:30 most days, and class goes until after 4. If there's an evening activity, like a game, kids are easily out until 11. And homework can lead to late nights too. It seems like a reasonable concept when you read articles and studies. But living the reality is much different!
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