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Post by jeremysgirl on Feb 17, 2018 22:59:55 GMT
leftturnonly said: Would that be considered offensive to women, to be told to buy weapons that terrified them? And if so, why is it not considered offensive to men of color to be told the very same thing? This is a really interesting point.
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Post by pjaye on Feb 17, 2018 23:03:37 GMT
I agree with what others have posted - the meme itself is not racist, rather it is pointing out the racism that still exists.
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pilcas
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Post by pilcas on Feb 17, 2018 23:12:21 GMT
Some states have gun laws others don’t. I was amazed when that infamous alt-right parade in Charlotsville took place to discover that it was legal for them to march armed. To me that is terribly intimidating and it had no other purpose than to intimidate or terrorize. I don’t understand why any civilian needs to be armed with an Assault weapon.
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Post by busy on Feb 17, 2018 23:21:59 GMT
Wasn’t there a “social experiment” a while back wher several black men walked diwn the street with guns in an open carry jurisdiction to see the response? IIRC, they were met with multiple concerned calls to law enforcement and were stopped and questioned. A similar group of white men did not get as much attention. Imagine four young armed black men (with legal open carry) walking into a convenience store together late at night. One, misinterpreted move could result in disaster. I mean, if trained law enforcement is going to overreact, how can you expect the minimum wage clerk not to do the same? Yes, many whites are afraid of black men. They might not always cross the street when they see a group of young black men approaching, but I can just about guarantee their hearts beat faster and adrenaline kicks in. I have worked with a lot of college-age black men, and this is their reality. John Crawford - a Black man - was shot and killed by police in Wal-Mart in Ohio because he had a B.B. gun that was sold in the store. He was not brandishing it, he did not threaten anyone. Ohio is an open carry state, yet he was shot on sight. |
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Post by dewryce on Feb 17, 2018 23:26:50 GMT
leftturnonly said: Would that be considered offensive to women, to be told to buy weapons that terrified them? And if so, why is it not considered offensive to men of color to be told the very same thing? This is a really interesting point. I may be wrong, but I don't feel like the purpose of the meme is for POC to go purchase the guns to prove a point. I think the purpose was to get people thinking about and talking what would happen if they actually did. |
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Post by jeremysgirl on Feb 17, 2018 23:36:28 GMT
leftturnonly said: Would that be considered offensive to women, to be told to buy weapons that terrified them? And if so, why is it not considered offensive to men of color to be told the very same thing? This is a really interesting point. I may be wrong, but I don't feel like the purpose of the meme is for POC to go purchase the guns to prove a point. I think the purpose was to get people thinking about and talking what would happen if they actually did. Well I understand that. Never did I think it should be taken literally. Leftturnonly brought up a thought that hadn't even crossed my mind and no one else touched upon. It is an interesting perspective. |
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Post by dewryce on Feb 18, 2018 0:12:06 GMT
I may be wrong, but I don't feel like the purpose of the meme is for POC to go purchase the guns to prove a point. I think the purpose was to get people thinking about and talking what would happen if they actually did. Well I understand that. Never did I think it should be taken literally. Leftturnonly brought up a thought that hadn't even crossed my mind and no one else touched upon. It is an interesting perspective. I'm sorry, I must have misunderstood your question. Since they're not really being told to go purchase the weapons I personally don't see how it is offensive. But will definitely check back for other thoughts and insights. |
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Post by leftturnonly on Feb 18, 2018 0:33:00 GMT
leftturnonly said: Would that be considered offensive to women, to be told to buy weapons that terrified them? And if so, why is it not considered offensive to men of color to be told the very same thing? This is a really interesting point. I may be wrong, but I don't feel like the purpose of the meme is for POC to go purchase the guns to prove a point. I think the purpose was to get people thinking about and talking what would happen if they actually did. Yes, you're right. Sorry. The recent school shooting was on my mind when I responded and that was reflected in my answer. I think that the meme was disturbing because it is true AND because it directly refers to our near history in America. It creates a multitude of feelings that shouldn't be tied up with a bow and labelled offhand without dismissing the reality that peoples' thoughts about this are very complex and based on a wide diversity of experience. I was taught in college that prejudice is a natural result of our own experiences. We pre-judge the danger in a situation as a survival mechanism in large measure based on what we have already learned. In other words, prejudice doesn't happen out of the blue. There is a cause before the effect. Just as it is true that the results of slavery in America are still felt today, so too is it true that violence has affected a great many in varying measures. Those of us who have experienced great and devastating local change that coincides with a change in the racial makeup of the local population will not react the same way to something like this as others who have not. It's just not possible. The lives that have been lost, the businesses, homes & property that have been destroyed are too personal to forget. To dismiss these real experiences is naive at best. It's not just people of color who have scars because of racial division here. We all have suffered because of it. We each initially react to the meme based on our own disturbing experiences. If it had been white men that murdered someone I respected and my family loved, that destroyed the city we had been part of for generations - as is the case for many people of color - I'd have a far different gut reaction than I do to the reality that my experience is based on the decimators being black, not white. <It never ceases to pain me to refer to people as black or white. It's a designation that makes no sense to me. Specifically in this post, it's a poignant reminder that while we want to see things as black or white, the truth is somewhere in the middle both in how we perceive the world around us and in how we regard other people.> |
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Post by leftturnonly on Feb 18, 2018 0:38:25 GMT
Some states have gun laws others don’t. What state doesn't have gun laws? |
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Post by busy on Feb 18, 2018 0:40:53 GMT
Some states have gun laws others don’t. What state doesn't have gun laws? I think the poster means some states have some specific gun-related laws that other states don’t, not that any state lacks gun laws entirely. |
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AnotherPea
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Post by AnotherPea on Feb 18, 2018 0:44:40 GMT
Wasn’t there a “social experiment” a while back wher several black men walked diwn the street with guns in an open carry jurisdiction to see the response? IIRC, they were met with multiple concerned calls to law enforcement and were stopped and questioned. A similar group of white men did not get as much attention. Imagine four young armed black men (with legal open carry) walking into a convenience store together late at night. One, misinterpreted move could result in disaster. I mean, if trained law enforcement is going to overreact, how can you expect the minimum wage clerk not to do the same? Yes, many whites are afraid of black men. They might not always cross the street when they see a group of young black men approaching, but I can just about guarantee their hearts beat faster and adrenaline kicks in. I have worked with a lot of college-age black men, and this is their reality.I agree with this. And we can't just blame the white people for this reaction. I believe it has to do with context and experience. Some, SOME, black men WANT to be viewed this way. Most people are reasonable and kind and the black men that are both, I imagine, do not want to be. But some do. Just last week while I was in the hallway at school we had a group of older black male teens walking very slowly towards, I assume, their classes. They were already five minutes late. These particular young men come from a very rough neighborhood and some of them have already been to jail more than once. They range in age from 17 to 19. As they walk past two girls that were heading to the restroom, three of the boys surrounded the girls and thrust their chests at them, bowing up to intimidate. I called them out on it, they cackle and walk on. I followed the three to their first period where their case manager was waiting for them. We had a small discussion, which they (the three) laughed and one said that "they gotta let people know who be the boss around here." One of the kids had been suspended earlier in the year for intimidating some younger white boys by making threats. Final straw kind of thing. I was at his meeting to return where his mother flat out said that black men need to act intimidating so white people don't walk all over them. I'm betting that if someone did a social experiment where hospital visitors were walking down a hallway where a black doctor versus a white doctor (or just people in lab coats) approached, there wouldn't be an discernible difference in reactions. Even though I support open carry I admit I would take a second glance if I saw any group of men gathered together with assault rifles. And if I saw a group of men walking into a convenience store whooping it up or acting like they were nervous, I'd get worried. I have been around black men that were open carrying and did not get concerned at all. Those men were minding their own business, had their guns holstered, were in their 30s or older and in general looked like they had their crap together. I imagine most people would be far less nervous being around such men than a white guy who had a pistol in his hand, looked unkempt and was acting erratically. |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Feb 18, 2018 0:46:08 GMT
It’s offensive. Very offensive. Please will you expand on this for me? I am really trying to wrap my brain around this and clarify my own feelings. I am just so used to living and working in harmony with minorities that maybe I have gone blind to systemic racism. I find it offensive towards our AF community, that the person posting this took aim at the stigma “if blacks have guns” then (white) congress will start to ban them/enact gun control. I find it offensive that the person posting this is making an ill timed quip at the expense of even more children losing their lives because of murder with a gun. The person who posted that is devoid of sensitivities. |
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Post by leftturnonly on Feb 18, 2018 0:47:50 GMT
What state doesn't have gun laws? I think the poster means some states have some specific gun-related laws that other states don’t, not that any state lacks gun laws entirely. You know, I would like to assume that. I have, however, learned not to assume anything when it comes to what people actually know about our actual gun legislation. |
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Post by dewryce on Feb 18, 2018 0:54:33 GMT
leftturnonly I think I see what you're saying about why you have the initial gut reactions you do. But to me, I think it's important to remember that the problems the community is having is not because the perpetrators of the unrest are black. Much like prejudice doesn't happen out of the blue, these groups didn't start causing violence and destruction out of the blue. There are generations of history with extreme discrimination and poverty, experiences that have had a great influence on how they act/react today. As you so rightly said, cause before the effect. Sorry, having a fibro flare and my words aren't coming to me and I'm not able to clearly get my thoughts across. Hopefully someone else can provide a different (easier to understand  ) perspective.
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Post by dewryce on Feb 18, 2018 1:01:25 GMT
Wasn’t there a “social experiment” a while back wher several black men walked diwn the street with guns in an open carry jurisdiction to see the response? IIRC, they were met with multiple concerned calls to law enforcement and were stopped and questioned. A similar group of white men did not get as much attention. Imagine four young armed black men (with legal open carry) walking into a convenience store together late at night. One, misinterpreted move could result in disaster. I mean, if trained law enforcement is going to overreact, how can you expect the minimum wage clerk not to do the same? Yes, many whites are afraid of black men. They might not always cross the street when they see a group of young black men approaching, but I can just about guarantee their hearts beat faster and adrenaline kicks in. I have worked with a lot of college-age black men, and this is their reality.I agree with this. And we can't just blame the white people for this reaction. I believe it has to do with context and experience. Some, SOME, black men WANT to be viewed this way. Most people are reasonable and kind and the black men that are both, I imagine, do not want to be. But some do. Just last week while I was in the hallway at school we had a group of older black male teens walking very slowly towards, I assume, their classes. They were already five minutes late. These particular young men come from a very rough neighborhood and some of them have already been to jail more than once. They range in age from 17 to 19. As they walk past two girls that were heading to the restroom, three of the boys surrounded the girls and thrust their chests at them, bowing up to intimidate. I called them out on it, they cackle and walk on. I followed the three to their first period where their case manager was waiting for them. We had a small discussion, which they (the three) laughed and one said that "they gotta let people know who be the boss around here." One of the kids had been suspended earlier in the year for intimidating some younger white boys by making threats. Final straw kind of thing. I was at his meeting to return where his mother flat out said that black men need to act intimidating so white people don't walk all over them. I'm betting that if someone did a social experiment where hospital visitors were walking down a hallway where a black doctor versus a white doctor (or just people in lab coats) approached, there wouldn't be an discernible difference in reactions. Even though I support open carry I admit I would take a second glance if I saw any group of men gathered together with assault rifles. And if I saw a group of men walking into a convenience store whooping it up or acting like they were nervous, I'd get worried. I have been around black men that were open carrying and did not get concerned at all. Those men were minding their own business, had their guns holstered, were in their 30s or older and in general looked like they had their crap together. I imagine most people would be far less nervous being around such men than a white guy who had a pistol in his hand, looked unkempt and was acting erratically. Some very militant, extremely macho white men are the same. It's not the color of their skin it's their actions that should be the deciding factor in our reactions I think. In the original experiment listed she didn't say anything about their actions, yet police were still called. Perhaps they were acting suspiciously, I haven't been able to find the experiment she was referencing. Either way, I think we can all admit that it is the color of skin that causes the fear in many cases. |
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AnotherPea
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by AnotherPea on Feb 18, 2018 1:09:47 GMT
I agree with this. And we can't just blame the white people for this reaction. I believe it has to do with context and experience. Some, SOME, black men WANT to be viewed this way. Most people are reasonable and kind and the black men that are both, I imagine, do not want to be. But some do. Just last week while I was in the hallway at school we had a group of older black male teens walking very slowly towards, I assume, their classes. They were already five minutes late. These particular young men come from a very rough neighborhood and some of them have already been to jail more than once. They range in age from 17 to 19. As they walk past two girls that were heading to the restroom, three of the boys surrounded the girls and thrust their chests at them, bowing up to intimidate. I called them out on it, they cackle and walk on. I followed the three to their first period where their case manager was waiting for them. We had a small discussion, which they (the three) laughed and one said that "they gotta let people know who be the boss around here." One of the kids had been suspended earlier in the year for intimidating some younger white boys by making threats. Final straw kind of thing. I was at his meeting to return where his mother flat out said that black men need to act intimidating so white people don't walk all over them. I'm betting that if someone did a social experiment where hospital visitors were walking down a hallway where a black doctor versus a white doctor (or just people in lab coats) approached, there wouldn't be an discernible difference in reactions. Even though I support open carry I admit I would take a second glance if I saw any group of men gathered together with assault rifles. And if I saw a group of men walking into a convenience store whooping it up or acting like they were nervous, I'd get worried. I have been around black men that were open carrying and did not get concerned at all. Those men were minding their own business, had their guns holstered, were in their 30s or older and in general looked like they had their crap together. I imagine most people would be far less nervous being around such men than a white guy who had a pistol in his hand, looked unkempt and was acting erratically. . It's not the color of their skin it's their actions that should be the deciding factor in our reactions I think. In the original experiment listed she didn't say anything about their actions, yet police were still called. Perhaps they were acting suspiciously, I haven't been able to find the experiment she was referencing. Either way, I think we can all admit that it is the color of skin that causes the fear in many cases. I will assume you are correct about that. What I am saying is that prejudice sometimes is founded in experiences that are hard to overcome. If you experience groups of black men trying to intimidate you or if you see it happen often, you are going to get more nervous when you see a group of black men versus white men. You can't blame someone for being cautious when their experiences have taught them to be. And when you have people actively trying to encourage those feelings through continued intimidation, it is going to be even harder to overcome. Just as if you had a group of white men plowing through a black neighborhood, waving rifles, you'd notice that the black residents would be nervous. There's a history there that is impossible to ignore. |
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Post by leftturnonly on Feb 18, 2018 1:20:11 GMT
leftturnonly I think I see what you're saying about why you have the initial gut reactions you do. But to me, I think it's important to remember that the problems the community is having is not because the perpetrators of the unrest are black. Much like prejudice doesn't happen out of the blue, these groups didn't start causing violence and destruction out of the blue. There are generations of history with extreme discrimination and poverty, experiences that have had a great influence on how they act/react today. As you so rightly said, cause before the effect. Sorry, having a fibro flare and my words aren't coming to me and I'm not able to clearly get my thoughts across. Hopefully someone else can provide a different (easier to understand  ) perspective. You're doing just fine. My reaction was one of interest. I think the meme could be discussed in a classroom for several days, exploring things from many different angles. I'm concerned that "white privilege" is casually tossed out without consideration that there are far more complex issues going on here than just that, and therefore, reactions are far more complicated than just that. That means that real issues are being casually dismissed and today, I chose to speak up and point that out. If you want to speak about a group of people's general prejudices, it's probably best not to show prejudice against a general group of people. |
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Post by dewryce on Feb 18, 2018 1:21:28 GMT
AnotherPea I see what you're saying and I think it is the same thing leftturnonly is saying. Another example being a woman who is raped shying away from men. Another understandable reaction, and one she hopefully is able to work on for her own peace of mind if nothing else. For me, the question becomes, how do we overcome this going forward? How do we teach ourselves to base our reactions on current actions not skin color? eta: I think teaching ourselves to recognize why we have this reaction, remember that it's based on the past, and force ourselves to question what's going on in front of us at the moment and react to the now is what's needed. And I think it is really important that we do so. Just don't know how.
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Post by leftturnonly on Feb 18, 2018 1:24:42 GMT
Some very militant, extremely macho white men are the same. It's not the color of their skin it's their actions that should be the deciding factor in our reactions I think. In the original experiment listed she didn't say anything about their actions, yet police were still called. Perhaps they were acting suspiciously, I haven't been able to find the experiment she was referencing. Either way, I think we can all admit that it is the color of skin that causes the fear in many cases. And in other cases where it is fear because of the behavior, it is still considered to be fear because of the color of skin. Truth is a two-way street. Acknowledgement needs to be made that there is far more going on in people's minds than is being given credit. |
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Post by dewryce on Feb 18, 2018 1:27:53 GMT
Some very militant, extremely macho white men are the same. It's not the color of their skin it's their actions that should be the deciding factor in our reactions I think. In the original experiment listed she didn't say anything about their actions, yet police were still called. Perhaps they were acting suspiciously, I haven't been able to find the experiment she was referencing. Either way, I think we can all admit that it is the color of skin that causes the fear in many cases. And in other cases where it is fear because of the behavior, it is still considered to be fear because of the color of skin. Truth is a two-way street. Acknowledgement needs to be made that there is far more going on in people's minds than is being given credit. I don't think I understand what you are saying. |
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Post by leftturnonly on Feb 18, 2018 1:29:37 GMT
AnotherPea I see what you're saying and I think it is the same thing leftturnonly is saying. Another example being a woman who is raped shying away from men. Another understandable reaction, and one she hopefully is able to work on for her own peace of mind if nothing else. For me, the question becomes, how do we overcome this going forward? How do we teach ourselves to base our reactions on current actions not skin color? How about stop referring and sorting people by skin color first and foremost? "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character." - MLK |
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pudgygroundhog
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Post by pudgygroundhog on Feb 18, 2018 1:33:12 GMT
Some states have gun laws others don’t. I was amazed when that infamous alt-right parade in Charlotsville took place to discover that it was legal for them to march armed. To me that is terribly intimidating and it had no other purpose than to intimidate or terrorize. I don’t understand why any civilian needs to be armed with an Assault weapon. Can you imagine if marchers at a Black Lives Matter event all showed up armed the same way? Or a DACA rally? I think it's safe to say the response - from law enforcement to the president - would be radically different. |
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pudgygroundhog
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Post by pudgygroundhog on Feb 18, 2018 1:38:34 GMT
Wasn’t there a “social experiment” a while back wher several black men walked diwn the street with guns in an open carry jurisdiction to see the response? IIRC, they were met with multiple concerned calls to law enforcement and were stopped and questioned. A similar group of white men did not get as much attention. Imagine four young armed black men (with legal open carry) walking into a convenience store together late at night. One, misinterpreted move could result in disaster. I mean, if trained law enforcement is going to overreact, how can you expect the minimum wage clerk not to do the same? Yes, many whites are afraid of black men. They might not always cross the street when they see a group of young black men approaching, but I can just about guarantee their hearts beat faster and adrenaline kicks in. I have worked with a lot of college-age black men, and this is their reality.I agree with this. And we can't just blame the white people for this reaction. I believe it has to do with context and experience. Some, SOME, black men WANT to be viewed this way. Most people are reasonable and kind and the black men that are both, I imagine, do not want to be. But some do. Just last week while I was in the hallway at school we had a group of older black male teens walking very slowly towards, I assume, their classes. They were already five minutes late. These particular young men come from a very rough neighborhood and some of them have already been to jail more than once. They range in age from 17 to 19. As they walk past two girls that were heading to the restroom, three of the boys surrounded the girls and thrust their chests at them, bowing up to intimidate. I called them out on it, they cackle and walk on. I followed the three to their first period where their case manager was waiting for them. We had a small discussion, which they (the three) laughed and one said that "they gotta let people know who be the boss around here." One of the kids had been suspended earlier in the year for intimidating some younger white boys by making threats. Final straw kind of thing. I was at his meeting to return where his mother flat out said that black men need to act intimidating so white people don't walk all over them. I'm betting that if someone did a social experiment where hospital visitors were walking down a hallway where a black doctor versus a white doctor (or just people in lab coats) approached, there wouldn't be an discernible difference in reactions. Even though I support open carry I admit I would take a second glance if I saw any group of men gathered together with assault rifles. And if I saw a group of men walking into a convenience store whooping it up or acting like they were nervous, I'd get worried. I have been around black men that were open carrying and did not get concerned at all. Those men were minding their own business, had their guns holstered, were in their 30s or older and in general looked like they had their crap together. I imagine most people would be far less nervous being around such men than a white guy who had a pistol in his hand, looked unkempt and was acting erratically. I agree that there are often better indicators of what makes our Spidey senses tingle that have nothing to do with race. But for some people, race alone will be enough to make them nervous/afraid/apprehensive. This was some years ago, but a black friend was coming to a book club meeting at a house on a rural-ish street for the first time. She accidentally went to the house next door and knocked on the door. She could tell people were home, but wasn't sure why anybody was answering, so went back to her car for the moment. Next thing she knows, the police are there with guns pointed at her telling her to get out of the car. They at first didn't believe she was going to a book club and eventually let her go without incident. It's hard to tell why they immediately called the cops and why the cops showed up with guns drawn, but I can't help but think race was a factor. |
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twinsmomfla99
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Post by twinsmomfla99 on Feb 18, 2018 1:45:32 GMT
I agree with this. And we can't just blame the white people for this reaction. I believe it has to do with context and experience. Some, SOME, black men WANT to be viewed this way. Most people are reasonable and kind and the black men that are both, I imagine, do not want to be. But some do. Just last week while I was in the hallway at school we had a group of older black male teens walking very slowly towards, I assume, their classes. They were already five minutes late. These particular young men come from a very rough neighborhood and some of them have already been to jail more than once. They range in age from 17 to 19. As they walk past two girls that were heading to the restroom, three of the boys surrounded the girls and thrust their chests at them, bowing up to intimidate. I called them out on it, they cackle and walk on. I followed the three to their first period where their case manager was waiting for them. We had a small discussion, which they (the three) laughed and one said that "they gotta let people know who be the boss around here." One of the kids had been suspended earlier in the year for intimidating some younger white boys by making threats. Final straw kind of thing. I was at his meeting to return where his mother flat out said that black men need to act intimidating so white people don't walk all over them. I'm betting that if someone did a social experiment where hospital visitors were walking down a hallway where a black doctor versus a white doctor (or just people in lab coats) approached, there wouldn't be an discernible difference in reactions. Even though I support open carry I admit I would take a second glance if I saw any group of men gathered together with assault rifles. And if I saw a group of men walking into a convenience store whooping it up or acting like they were nervous, I'd get worried. I have been around black men that were open carrying and did not get concerned at all. Those men were minding their own business, had their guns holstered, were in their 30s or older and in general looked like they had their crap together. I imagine most people would be far less nervous being around such men than a white guy who had a pistol in his hand, looked unkempt and was acting erratically. Some very militant, extremely macho white men are the same. It's not the color of their skin it's their actions that should be the deciding factor in our reactions I think. In the original experiment listed she didn't say anything about their actions, yet police were still called. Perhaps they were acting suspiciously, I haven't been able to find the experiment she was referencing. Either way, I think we can all admit that it is the color of skin that causes the fear in many cases. This isn’t the one I remember, but it does show differing police reactions to a open carry by a black man and a white man. www.google.com/amp/s/www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/white-black-men-legally-openly-11307594.amp |
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Post by dewryce on Feb 18, 2018 1:53:06 GMT
Some very militant, extremely macho white men are the same. It's not the color of their skin it's their actions that should be the deciding factor in our reactions I think. In the original experiment listed she didn't say anything about their actions, yet police were still called. Perhaps they were acting suspiciously, I haven't been able to find the experiment she was referencing. Either way, I think we can all admit that it is the color of skin that causes the fear in many cases. This isn’t the one I remember, but it does show differing police reactions to a open carry by a black man and a white man. www.google.com/amp/s/www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/white-black-men-legally-openly-11307594.ampI don't doubt it was exactly as stated. I just wish they would have included information in the article about whether or not this happened in the same location and if the guns were identical. Give less wiggle room for people who don't want to admit that these things happen based on the color of skin alone. And I agree with the lady that suggested they were taking quite a risk doing this, and based on history, a much greater risk for the black participant. |
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Post by leftturnonly on Feb 18, 2018 1:54:52 GMT
And in other cases where it is fear because of the behavior, it is still considered to be fear because of the color of skin. Truth is a two-way street. Acknowledgement needs to be made that there is far more going on in people's minds than is being given credit. I don't think I understand what you are saying. If you are wary of someone because of their body stance, their abusive language, their intimidating behavior, the color of their skin seems to be the most important thing when others are judging the incident. If I were to cross the street to avoid particular behaviors, it would only be noteworthy to many if the people I avoided were dark-skinned. Then, I would be an open and free target for negative commentary whereas if the people I avoided were light-skinned, far fewer assumptions would be made. What would be going on in my mind would be my safety. What would be said about my behavior would be entirely based on skin color, completely missing the mark. It's very easy to assume things about others that just aren't true about that person individually when you apply a generalized filter first. People who see a white woman crossing the street to avoid harassment may assume they know why, but assumptions are notoriously deceitful. People who decide that people who see a meme and don't respond the same way that they do must be guilty of deficits of character are likewise making assumptions that may be grossly biased. |
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Post by jeremysgirl on Feb 18, 2018 2:16:41 GMT
leftturnonly said: People who decide that people who see a meme and don't respond the same way that they do must be guilty of deficits of character are likewise making assumptions that may be grossly biased. Thank you for saying that like you did. I sat here all day figuring out how to respond to that post on Facebook. I listened to all of you today and I really thought about my own heart. I don't have anything to prove to a random stranger on Facebook, but I didn't want to be cast as racist just because I found the meme uncomfortable. With that said, I believe it was meant to shock. And sometimes we need to be shocked. This has been an interesting discourse and well worth discussing. I appreciate everyone's input.
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Post by jenjie on Feb 18, 2018 2:21:37 GMT
This is probably way off topic but @anotherpea’s story about the incident at School reminded me of something. When we were in NYC this guy got on the train. He was dressed like he wanted to look like a thug. Except there was one thing ruining his street cred - an adorable little girl with her Doc McStuffins backpack. Any time I see a daddy engage with his kids, it warms me right up. (I loved it when dh did, I would watch or listen from the other room - those were the times he was most attractive to me.)
And this guy was engaged.I thought, man you’re dressed like you’re trying to look tough, but you’re a softie with your little one.
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Post by dewryce on Feb 18, 2018 2:22:08 GMT
I don't think I understand what you are saying. If you are wary of someone because of their body stance, their abusive language, their intimidating behavior, the color of their skin seems to be the most important thing when others are judging the incident. If I were to cross the street to avoid particular behaviors, it would only be noteworthy to many if the people I avoided were dark-skinned. Then, I would be an open and free target for negative commentary whereas if the people I avoided were light-skinned, far fewer assumptions would be made. What would be going on in my mind would be my safety. What would be said about my behavior would be entirely based on skin color, completely missing the mark. It's very easy to assume things about others that just aren't true about that person individually when you apply a generalized filter first. People who see a white woman crossing the street to avoid harassment may assume they know why, but assumptions are notoriously deceitful. People who decide that people who see a meme and don't respond the same way that they do must be guilty of deficits of character are likewise making assumptions that may be grossly biased. My take on this is because historically (and even to a lesser degree) now race is the primary factor. Personally, unless their actions and/or words are overtly racist, I try and give people the benefit of the doubt initially. Especially on the Internet where it can be hard to get your point across and words can be easily misconstrued. I take into consideration what I "know" about the person and don't automatically put them in the "racist" bin after one comment. |
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Post by jenjie on Feb 18, 2018 2:23:30 GMT
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) perspective.
