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Post by sunnyd on Oct 6, 2014 17:52:02 GMT
Dd is in her 2nd year of uni, majoring in Physiology & Developmental Biology, which according to her academic adviser, is the most difficult major at the university. She struggled her first semester (by struggled, I mean she got her first ever B) and has a current GPA of 3.74. She was on the deans list last semester. I think that's amazing considering how challenging her classes have been. Her academic adviser tells her she's doing great & to keep doing what she's doing. Her university is very competitive & it's been her goal to go there since day 1. Her goal was to be a dentist since she was about 4 years old. She's never said anything different when someone asked her what she wanted to do/be, until now. She puts a ton of pressure on herself, always has, only child, over-achiever, perfectionist, blah blah blah. She now hates school, hates her major & especially chemistry, which is a very heavy focus for her major. She's literally ILL about her chemistry 106 & 107 & molecular biology classes this semester. She got a 90% on her first chemistry test, average class score was 75%. What's to stress over, right? And she's dreading next semester of organic chemistry, etc. Her major requires at least one chemistry class every semester for all 4 years. And she is adamant, 100% sure that she no longer wants to be a dentist. She is contemplating transferring to an easier university that offers dental hygiene since her current university doesn't offer a degree in that field. She really has no idea what to do with her life & is freaking out. I'm trying to reassure her that she doesn't have to know that yet. She's never NOT had a plan & she doesn't like working her butt off without a plan. I think she needs to explore other career options like possibly medical research (although she's a people person & know nothing about that career at all) or physician's assistant or something completely different that she hasn't ever considered, like business. I'm 40 something & never really figured out a career path, just went where it led me, which worked out fine in the end. So, I feel unqualified to counsel her. Have you been to a career counselor? Any suggestions to finding one? Any suggestions for someone trying to figure out their career path/univeristy major in life? Any thoughts on dental hygiene as a career? Any suggestions for careers for her to explore? She's going to meet with the uni's career counseling dept. this week but I want to let her know about any & all resources that might help her. TIA!  |
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Deleted
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Aug 18, 2025 21:22:07 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2014 17:59:21 GMT
Does she have to do that degree to become a dentist? She shouldn't give up her dream because of courses she doesn't like.
I took Honours Molecular Biology & Biochemistry in university and the organic chemistry nearly killed me. There were several students in my cohort who were planning on becoming dentists. However, we only had to take organic chemistry up until 2nd year. I actually failed my last orgo class the first time I took it, tried it again and realized I hated it, took a break from school to have a family, and went back and did a degree in Biochemistry and Biomedical Sciences instead -- the only difference between the degrees was that I didn't have to take that second year orgo course. Everything else I had already taken or was the same!!
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Post by mikewozowski on Oct 6, 2014 18:00:18 GMT
it is not necessary to major in a difficult major to go to dental school. you can major in PE or basket weaving as long as you have the dental school prereqs.
she is being kind of silly for freaking out over getting a 90 on a test.
it is also kind of silly to ditch your lifelong goal of being a dentist over a couple "bad" (a B is not actually bad, though) grades.
i would suggest switching to an easier major so that she can keep her GPA intact. no need to ditch the school or the dream.
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Post by sunnyd on Oct 6, 2014 18:17:00 GMT
Thanks, Ashley & Mikew! I'm sorry my OP was so long. She says she's actually sure she now doesn't want to be a dentist. She's wanting to figure out what she does want to be since she's never thought about anything else until now. How successful are career counselors at helping one do that? What other ways of exploration are available to figure out your career at the age of 19? She hates not knowing what she wants to do/be & feels really strongly that she needs to know so she's not "spinning her wheels" at college. Although I don't think her education is wasted time at all. She's thinking about everything now from IT to dental hygiene & is feeling lost. Thanks again! |
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Post by Darcy Collins on Oct 6, 2014 18:19:13 GMT
It's too early for career counseling to be honest. She may be freaking out because it's the first time she's really struggled. It's normal, it happens to many of us at university. She also may be figuring out what she does and doesn't love. My college roommate's parents freaked out because her lifelong dream was to become a doctor. They thought she gave up the dream because of organic chemistry (which did kick her behind). But in reality, she was exposed to many, many things that she'd never imagined when she was 6. She ended up with a Chemical Engineering degree and went to graduate school in Environmental Studies. She found her true passion. It doesn't sound like your daughter has yet discovered something that excites her - but is more on the freaking out side, but be open to that possibility. If she has discovered a true hatred for Chemistry that will impact her ability to complete her major, I strongly agree with the above posters that she should look and see which majors include more of what she loves and less Chemistry. Dropping out of a strong 4 year university to complete an Associates Degree for Dental Hygiene is an extreme response and not appropriate for one's first B.
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Post by kelbel827 on Oct 6, 2014 18:19:43 GMT
My son thought he wanted to go dental school until he took chemistry. His major is computer science and he was talking only dental school pre reqs. He shadowed several dentists and they all suggested something not pre med. they said it sets you apart from the 95% of pre med majors. It's very competitive and they like diversity.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2014 18:24:45 GMT
I was in the exact same place in university.
I spent my entire life wanting to be a doctor -- a surgeon, specifically. Once in university and when my mom had cancer, I became very disillusioned with the whole medical system; my mom's doctor told her he couldn't do anything for her and he could keep her comfortable for about 6 months (she saw a different doctor and she is alive 13 years later), and my fellow students who all wanted to become doctors were grade-grubbing whiners who just talked about how much money they wanted to make.
Figuring out your life when you are 19 or so is not an easy task!! I feel for her.
I've never been to a career counsellor, so I don't have any advice to offer.
If I was in her place again, I'd give up the organic chemistry; if she hates it this much now, she isn't going to want a career in it anyway. I'd talk to my professors; ask them questions about what they are teaching, get involved. Find what sparked a love of learning and follow that.
Is there a co-op programme she could try??
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Post by CarolinaGirl71 on Oct 6, 2014 18:47:55 GMT
Thanks, Ashley & Mikew! I'm sorry my OP was so long. She says she's actually sure she now doesn't want to be a dentist. She's wanting to figure out what she does want to be since she's never thought about anything else until now. How successful are career counselors at helping one do that? What other ways of exploration are available to figure out your career at the age of 19? She hates not knowing what she wants to do/be & feels really strongly that she needs to know so she's not "spinning her wheels" at college. Although I don't think her education is wasted time at all. She's thinking about everything now from IT to dental hygiene & is feeling lost. Thanks again! If she is sure she doesn't want to be a dentist, I think she needs to look outside of dental hygiene. With her grades, she should be able to get into graduate programs in physical, occupational or speech therapy. Has she considered those? |
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Post by elaine on Oct 6, 2014 19:10:31 GMT
Her university has a counseling center. Most university counseling centers hire Counseling Psychologists. A large portion of graduate training for counseling psychologists is career counseling. If she wants to pursue career counseling, she can get all that she needs for free (it is paid for through registration fees) at the university counseling center. They will have professionals there who specialize in it and have the most current assessment tools. Helping college students pick and change majors and careers is a large portion of what psychologists do with this population - it is the biggest crisis/decision point for this age. There is plenty of help available for her to utilize if she is at a good university.  |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2014 19:19:35 GMT
My dd that is a sophomore with a chemistry major is home on Fall break. She is also the General Chemistry TA this semester. Anyway, I read your message to her, and she said that if your daughter does not like General Chemistry, then she will really dislike Organic Chemistry. My dd loves Chemistry and is now not liking Chemistry because of Organic. Is it the material or the teacher she doesn't like? If it's the material, it will just get worse. I also totally agree with kelbel827. My other dd (also a sophomore in college) want to be a physician. She is majoring in Computer Science and Biology with a minor in Chemistry. Her academic counselor told her the Computer Science degree is GREAT for people wanting to get into med school. She loves that with Biology too so it's a great fit for her. Does your daughter's school have academic counselors available? BTW, your dd still has a great grade in Chemistry. |
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raindancer
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Post by raindancer on Oct 6, 2014 19:28:10 GMT
I think she should just stick with the undergrad classes that are intended to weed out people and relax about the chem grade. Our class was so bad it was curved so that a 78% was an A. Ridiculous. A 90 is a great score and she will learn a lot being there for any number of science tracks. One hard class is no reason to give up a lifelong dream. Tell her to attend office hours and tutoring as often as possible, it's almost always helpful. I didn't take O-chem, but I know several people who hated gen chem and loved o-chem and vice versa so she might be surprised. No point in dreading it already. That's weeks away. |
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Post by epeanymous on Oct 6, 2014 19:30:55 GMT
Just FYI, one of the reasons that women are less represented in math and science is because when men get their college B grades in those areas, they keep going, while women decide that they must not be able to hack it and switch. That might be helpful information to pass on to your daughter, not because she has a responsibility to take science classes for all women, but to let her know that what she is feeling is common for women and doesn't mean she is not good at those subjects or shouldn't pursue her dreams.
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scrapaddie
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Post by scrapaddie on Oct 6, 2014 19:33:22 GMT
Her university should have career counselors. My dd saw them at ohio state and they were quite thorough
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Post by Darcy Collins on Oct 6, 2014 19:36:26 GMT
Just FYI, one of the reasons that women are less represented in math and science is because when men get their college B grades in those areas, they keep going, while women decide that they must not be able to hack it and switch. That might be helpful information to pass on to your daughter, not because she has a responsibility to take science classes for all women, but to let her know that what she is feeling is common for women and doesn't mean she is not good at those subjects or shouldn't pursue her dreams. I wish I could triple like this! It's so true. Many of the women who would be very successful in these careers are also the ones who are so very hard on themselves. Now I actually never wanted to be a doctor, but I always loved this oldi but goodie for perspective: What do you call the student who graduates from medical school at the very bottom of their class? Doctor. It's not about being perfect. It's not about knowing all the answers. It's about persevering, and reminding yourself that what you don't know, you can learn! |
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Post by Clair on Oct 6, 2014 19:37:08 GMT
One of my kids is just like your dd as far as grades, perfectionist, etc.
It took him a bit to realize that at the school he choose everyone was exceptional. '. Everyone there is a top student. Throw in the truly genius kids etc - it is a big adjustment.
The first B he received shook him up.
He's now in his senior year with a 3.82 which is exceptional for his major at his school.
Also - many of the difficult majors have weeder classes to see if the kids can really cut it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2014 19:59:11 GMT
Just FYI, one of the reasons that women are less represented in math and science is because when men get their college B grades in those areas, they keep going, while women decide that they must not be able to hack it and switch. That might be helpful information to pass on to your daughter, not because she has a responsibility to take science classes for all women, but to let her know that what she is feeling is common for women and doesn't mean she is not good at those subjects or shouldn't pursue her dreams. THIS can't be repeated often or loud enough. A "B" is not a bad grade. But a personal requirement for absolute perfectionism will derail a life from one of affluence to barely scratching by if all things must be perfect. A dental hygienist still has their hands in people mouths and still deals with tooth/mouth issues. Over the course of her life does she really want to be paid less than the dentist over a B in a chemistry class years earlier? Now, if she has decided teeth and people ick her out that is a whole different discussion. And maybe she needs to consider if a Physiology & Dev Bio degree is the right one for her and go with a more general Biology degree or some other science. But B's happen. Even a C won't end the world or her dreams unless she lets it. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2014 20:26:07 GMT
Just FYI, one of the reasons that women are less represented in math and science is because when men get their college B grades in those areas, they keep going, while women decide that they must not be able to hack it and switch. That might be helpful information to pass on to your daughter, not because she has a responsibility to take science classes for all women, but to let her know that what she is feeling is common for women and doesn't mean she is not good at those subjects or shouldn't pursue her dreams. Now, if she has decided teeth and people ick her out that is a whole different discussion. And maybe she needs to consider if a Physiology & Dev Bio degree is the right one for her and go with a more general Biology degree or some other science. But B's happen. Even a C won't end the world or her dreams unless she lets it. Yes! Love that. So very true and something to really think about. |
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Post by casswithsass on Oct 6, 2014 20:35:43 GMT
My youngest son is a dentist. He majored in zoology, and after his graduation, he claimed the only thing he was qualified to do was scoop poop in a zoo somewhere LOL. Seriously, I don't think is GPA was super stellar. He got accepted at a good college, and is a super dentist now. His graduating class was half women at least, and the undergrad majors were all over the place.
Before he was even accepted at dental school. he went on a humanitarian dental trip and that sealed the deal.. He still goes on trips every year to all kinds of places.
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Post by mikewozowski on Oct 6, 2014 20:41:21 GMT
there should be a career counselor at her university. how good they are will depend. most likely, they will have her take an interest inventory to see how her interests align with those in different professions. idk how effective that is, but it is a start.
my own kid kind of went through this type of situation (with not knowing what she wanted to do, not with the insane grade perfectionism.) she started college wanting to be something like a physicians assistant. she ended up majoring in chemical engineering (the hardest major at her university). she kept up her grades and completed all the prereqs to go to medical school or PA school or any number of other schools (but not nursing, because their prereqs are pretty different.) she considered dental school. she considered medical school. she considered becoming an anesthesia assistant.
when she was pretty settled on anesthesia, then she couldn't decide whether to be an AA or an MD. finally, she settled on becoming an AA. had all the prereqs and the grades...THeN, during her senior year she decided she was tired of school and didn't want to go anymore. ok ... good idea she got a useful degree. much better to graduate with a chemical engineering degree than a degree in basket weaving. so, now she has graduated and is out on her own working at goldman-sachs in FINANCE!
long story ... but i guess my point is ... it's a process. and things can change. but i think doing from a goal of dental school to a life as a dental hygienest (idk how to spell that one) is not really a logical step if she is getting by with a 3.8 in her current work.
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twinsmomfla99
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Post by twinsmomfla99 on Oct 6, 2014 20:41:26 GMT
Has she been to see her advisor? I work in advising, and we have been flooded with students who are suddenly questioning their lifelong career goals now that they are in college. We refer them to our career services office where they can take interest inventories and aptitude tests that can suggest careers they may not hav considered before. We also offer a one hour mid semester class called "choosing majors and careers" in which they learn how to research potential careers and develop alternative or parallel plans that will accept many of the same courses for graduation. I would also recommend that she see a counselor for stress management. It might seem silly to some, but those first Bs can be devastating to students who are used to getting As.
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Judy26
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Post by Judy26 on Oct 7, 2014 1:09:09 GMT
If she would like to do some career searching/ interest inventories on her own to see what is out there I recommend onet online.org. It is a very thorough online resource for career exploration tools. I use it frequently with both my HS gifted students and my GED students.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2014 14:55:15 GMT
You DD doesn't need a career counselor - she needs a mentor! She needs a mentor who is a woman, who has been through the academic trials and tribulations your DD is currently going through, and can be a neutral third party to keep her going when the chips are down.
Is there a dentist she can reach out to who can give her a bit of moral support?
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Post by Darcy Collins on Oct 7, 2014 16:40:47 GMT
You DD doesn't need a career counselor - she needs a mentor! She needs a mentor who is a woman, who has been through the academic trials and tribulations your DD is currently going through, and can be a neutral third party to keep her going when the chips are down. Is there a dentist she can reach out to who can give her a bit of moral support? This is a good idea - I'd even ask what type of mentoring she has with upper classmen. I definitely think having a few very close friends who were upper classwomen helped put the transition in perspective. |
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Post by pierkiss on Oct 7, 2014 16:50:39 GMT
You don't have to major in that to become a dentist, or a medical doctor. She can just as easily major in bio and go on to graduate training. I took molecular and cellular bio in college while I was a bio major (I wanted to be a pediatrician). That class kicked my ass all over the place. It was the hardest class I took throughout my time in college. I took it at the same time as chemistry, and sucked at that too. I decided that a career in medicine was not in my future, and started exploring other classes. I landed in psychology, and was/am very happy there. I loved biology though, and had taken so many science classes that I chose to minor in it. When I switched it to being my minor I didn't have to take the harder classes, and life became more enjoyable. . My favorite bio class was Microbiology of Infectious Diseases. Has she taken that one yet? It's a lot of fun. |
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