Judy26
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Location: NW PA
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Post by Judy26 on Jul 11, 2019 21:52:17 GMT
I’m a retired teacher who works for a program that provides free adult education classes to anyone who needs to improve their math and reading levels for any number of reasons. I usually work from home in an admin./guidance position but I’m filling in over the summer as a teacher for a class that meets at our public library.
Last evening an older gentleman enrolled in the class. As I was completing his orientation it came out that he was just released from prison after serving a twenty year sentence. He was very polite and attentive although his test results were quite low. He said he didn’t attend any classes while incarcerated.
Something got my spidey senses going so after he left I looked him up on our state website. He was sentenced 20 years ago for aggravated assault, attempted kidnapping, and attempted rape charges after assaulting 3 different women he didn’t know in secluded places.
After a sleepless night I contacted my bosses and explained the situation. They contacted their supervisors and made the decision to refuse services to him, which is something we very seldom do.
I’m feeling torn today. I believe everyone deserves a second chance. Education might be the very thing he needs to get on with his life. On the other hand my classroom is not in the main part of the library and my other student’s safety needs to be considered as well. What say the Peas? Did I do the right thing?
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Post by femalebusiness on Jul 11, 2019 21:55:42 GMT
Don't turn your back on him. I don't know his specifics but I'd be very wary. No, I'd probably quit that job.
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johnnysmom
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,682
Jun 25, 2014 21:16:33 GMT
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Post by johnnysmom on Jul 11, 2019 21:55:45 GMT
Did you do the right thing by looking him up? Sure. Will it cause you extra worry and make you regret knowing what you now know? Possibly. But isn't that better than the alternative and not knowing? Now you can make sure you don't disclose personal information (like where you live) and you can make sure you're not alone in a classroom with him. Better safe than sorry.
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Post by peano on Jul 11, 2019 21:59:32 GMT
Always listen to your spidey-senses.
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Post by crimsoncat05 on Jul 11, 2019 22:00:57 GMT
huh- in looking at it from a different angle, he served the time required for the crimes he was convicted for. yet even now that he's supposedly 'done his time' and is trying to get back into society, you decided he's not a decent human being, and have judged him. Again.
that's kind of rotten, in my opinion.
eta: basically, it says that you think he might not have changed or improved over that time at all, and are still judging him on something that happened more than 20 years ago. Something for which he was already judged. By a jury of his peers.
People who have been incarcerated get MORE judging for the rest of their lives-- it's tough enough on them being a felon, without people judging them FOREVER for that. (and please, no one say 'well, they shouldn't have done the crime, then' because life is NOT that black-and-white simple.)
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Post by bc2ca on Jul 11, 2019 22:01:13 GMT
I’m a retired teacher who works for a program that provides free adult education classes to anyone who needs to improve their math and reading levels for any number of reasons. I usually work from home in an admin./guidance position but I’m filling in over the summer as a teacher for a class that meets at our public library. Last evening an older gentleman enrolled in the class. As I was completing his orientation it came out that he was just released from prison after serving a twenty year sentence. He was very polite and attentive although his test results were quite low. He said he didn’t attend any classes while incarcerated. Something got my spidey senses going so after he left I looked him up on our state website. He was sentenced 20 years ago for aggravated assault, attempted kidnapping, and attempted rape charges after assaulting 3 different women he didn’t know in secluded places. Maybe it's because I recently watched When They See Us, but the first thing that jumped out at me is he served a full 20 year sentence. I can't believe he wouldn't have been up for parole at some point. If he was, or maintained he was innocent, he would not have been eligible for parole. Given that you aren't seeing him in a secluded place I would continue to tutor him as part of the program. |
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Post by pierkiss on Jul 11, 2019 22:07:02 GMT
Oh dear. I honestly don’t know if you did the right thing. I’m not even sure what I would do in this situation.
On the one hand, you want to maintain the safety of your classroom and the persons in it. He was charged with terrible things. Things that could easily be repeated in the future. And you do not know what kind of rehabilitation he went through, if any, during his time in jail. Nor are you aware of how effective it was. I admit I would be freaked out in this situation.
On the other hand, he served his time, in full. And he made the step to enroll in this class in order to better himself. Which shows progress, and a willingness to try and rejoin society as a productive member.
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Post by Delta Dawn on Jul 11, 2019 22:07:18 GMT
My personal safety supersedes his privilege to get re-educated and I would have zero fucks to give.
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Post by bc2ca on Jul 11, 2019 22:08:12 GMT
I’m a retired teacher who works for a program that provides free adult education classes to anyone who needs to improve their math and reading levels for any number of reasons. I usually work from home in an admin./guidance position but I’m filling in over the summer as a teacher for a class that meets at our public library. Last evening an older gentleman enrolled in the class. As I was completing his orientation it came out that he was just released from prison after serving a twenty year sentence. He was very polite and attentive although his test results were quite low. He said he didn’t attend any classes while incarcerated. Something got my spidey senses going so after he left I looked him up on our state website. He was sentenced 20 years ago for aggravated assault, attempted kidnapping, and attempted rape charges after assaulting 3 different women he didn’t know in secluded places. After a sleepless night I contacted my bosses and explained the situation. They contacted their supervisors and made the decision to refuse services to him, which is something we very seldom do. I’m feeling torn today. I believe everyone deserves a second chance. Education might be the very thing he needs to get on with his life. On the other hand my classroom is not in the main part of the library and my other student’s safety needs to be considered as well. What say the Peas? Did I do the right thing? I thought something must be missing from the OP. I think you did a shitty thing. The MO of the original crimes were against strangers, not women helping him in a public space. |
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Judy26
Pearl Clutcher
MOTFY Bitchy Nursemaid
Posts: 2,834
Location: NW PA
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Post by Judy26 on Jul 11, 2019 22:08:35 GMT
huh- in looking at it from a different angle, he served the time required for the crimes he was convicted for. yet even now that he's supposedly 'done his time' and is trying to get back into society, you decided he's not a decent human being, and have judged him. Again. that's kind of rotten, in my opinion. I know. I’m feeling quite rotten about this. He does deserve a second chance. He may be completely rehabilitated. But I also need to feel safe in my workplace and I have several women in my class who also need to be safe. He is on Megan’s List for the rest of his life as he was a repeat offender of aggravated sexual crimes which have a very high recidivism rate. |
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Judy26
Pearl Clutcher
MOTFY Bitchy Nursemaid
Posts: 2,834
Location: NW PA
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Post by Judy26 on Jul 11, 2019 22:11:39 GMT
I’m a retired teacher who works for a program that provides free adult education classes to anyone who needs to improve their math and reading levels for any number of reasons. I usually work from home in an admin./guidance position but I’m filling in over the summer as a teacher for a class that meets at our public library. Last evening an older gentleman enrolled in the class. As I was completing his orientation it came out that he was just released from prison after serving a twenty year sentence. He was very polite and attentive although his test results were quite low. He said he didn’t attend any classes while incarcerated. Something got my spidey senses going so after he left I looked him up on our state website. He was sentenced 20 years ago for aggravated assault, attempted kidnapping, and attempted rape charges after assaulting 3 different women he didn’t know in secluded places. After a sleepless night I contacted my bosses and explained the situation. They contacted their supervisors and made the decision to refuse services to him, which is something we very seldom do. I’m feeling torn today. I believe everyone deserves a second chance. Education might be the very thing he needs to get on with his life. On the other hand my classroom is not in the main part of the library and my other student’s safety needs to be considered as well. What say the Peas? Did I do the right thing? I thought something must be missing from the OP. I think you did a shitty thing. The MO of the original crimes were against strangers, not women helping him in a public space. It’s not a public space. The classroom is on the second floor of the library and no one else is on that floor when we are having class. |
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Post by papersilly on Jul 11, 2019 22:12:21 GMT
i think it's good that you know his background but i also believe in second chances. if the system thought he deserved release, then he must have been on good behavior to earn that. if he wants to improve himself through education, then i believe he deserves that chance. safety is paramount but i feel bad that he will be refused a chance to attend classes.
ETA: i would rather my tax dollars go to educating him than housing him in jail for another day. i wan't him to support himself with knowledge, confidence and a job.
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Post by femalebusiness on Jul 11, 2019 22:15:43 GMT
If he had robbed liquor stores or banks or had gotten into a bar fight and accidentally killed someone, I might think he had served his time and been rehabilitated. He attempted to kidnap and assault women that he didn't know. That particular defect in the brain doesn't usually get fixed. Take no chances. Make certain that your purse (driver's license and ID) is under lock and key. Do not talk about anything personal, ever. Have an escort to and from your car and make certain that you are not followed home each and every time you leave class.
I'd quit.
eta. I just read your update. Good that he won't be around. Still watch your back.
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Post by curiouscrafter on Jul 11, 2019 22:24:16 GMT
I’m a retired teacher who works for a program that provides free adult education classes to anyone who needs to improve their math and reading levels for any number of reasons. I usually work from home in an admin./guidance position but I’m filling in over the summer as a teacher for a class that meets at our public library. Last evening an older gentleman enrolled in the class. As I was completing his orientation it came out that he was just released from prison after serving a twenty year sentence. He was very polite and attentive although his test results were quite low. He said he didn’t attend any classes while incarcerated. Something got my spidey senses going so after he left I looked him up on our state website. He was sentenced 20 years ago for aggravated assault, attempted kidnapping, and attempted rape charges after assaulting 3 different women he didn’t know in secluded places. After a sleepless night I contacted my bosses and explained the situation. They contacted their supervisors and made the decision to refuse services to him, which is something we very seldom do. I’m feeling torn today. I believe everyone deserves a second chance. Education might be the very thing he needs to get on with his life. On the other hand my classroom is not in the main part of the library and my other student’s safety needs to be considered as well. What say the Peas? Did I do the right thing? I look at it from both sides. He took the next step of trying to get educated after incarceration. That is huge for him. It's a shame that he will not get the education he needs to now be able to acclimate back into society and hopefully get a job. On the other side - your personal safety is a concern. Could he be put in a class that is always a public setting? So you feel comfortable and he gets some education? |
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Post by crimsoncat05 on Jul 11, 2019 22:24:31 GMT
nope- still shitty, in my opinion. You don't honestly believe there haven't been convicted felons in any other class that was ever taught there?
You said you're filling in, and that your organization gives free education to anyone who wants it. Doesn't your organization have safety guidelines, considering that someone in the position of just getting out of prison might need to avail themselves of your services?
'convicted felon' might just as well be a scarlet A, I guess... or hey, why not let's brand people right on their forehead, so we ALL know their background, just by looking at them... that way we don't even have to stay on the same side of the street as them, if we see them walking down the sidewalk.
(yes, I'm being snarky- but c'mon. our justice system has MORE than enough problems without labeling people for the rest of their lives.)
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Post by freecharlie on Jul 11, 2019 22:26:05 GMT
He didn't have to disclose his past and you would have never known.
How can people reenter society after they serve time if society won't give them a chance?
That said, I would have never been alone with him.
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Country Ham
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,313
Jun 25, 2014 19:32:08 GMT
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Post by Country Ham on Jul 11, 2019 22:26:34 GMT
You meet in a public library and you provide a service that seems to be exactly what he needs. I could understand not tutoring him in his own home, or meeting privately. But a public library?? With other students?
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Post by bc2ca on Jul 11, 2019 22:26:55 GMT
I thought something must be missing from the OP. I think you did a shitty thing. The MO of the original crimes were against strangers, not women helping him in a public space. It’s not a public space. The classroom is on the second floor of the library and no one else is on that floor when we are having class. FFS, it is still a public place not "secluded" as the original crimes suggest. In a classroom with multiple people. He shared his history with you and you did a shitty thing. Own it. |
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Post by crimsoncat05 on Jul 11, 2019 22:31:17 GMT
FFS, it is still a public place not "secluded" as the original crimes suggest. In a classroom with multiple people. He shared his history with you and you did a shitty thing. Own it. ^^^ THAT. I'm guessing there's a phone / security guard in the library, no? |
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Country Ham
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Jun 25, 2014 19:32:08 GMT
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Post by Country Ham on Jul 11, 2019 22:36:04 GMT
THAT. I'm guessing there's a phone / security guard in the library, no? Security guards in a library? I honestly have never seen one anywhere I have been. Phones were located behind the check out counter but really I would venture the OP would have a cell phone. It's rare now a days not too. |
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Post by LavenderLayoutLady on Jul 11, 2019 22:36:59 GMT
You know what, he EARNED being discriminated against.
He chose to commit horrendous crimes.
He served prison time, which earns him the right to be out in public society.
It does not mean that a woman who is afraid of him because his past actions has to teach him.
OP, You did what your gut instincts told you was safest for you. And that is the right thing.
He's a felon, and there are programs specifically for teaching felons after release. He has other options.
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Post by Delta Dawn on Jul 11, 2019 22:39:23 GMT
Have a chat with his victims. They may feel differently.
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Post by canadianscrappergirl on Jul 11, 2019 22:40:12 GMT
Hmm I get you need to feel safe but when you said your spidey senses kicked in after he left and then looked up his crime that didn't sit well with me. I would think my spidey senses if I felt threatened or something wasn't right about him would have kicked in while you were teaching or going thru orientation not after you found out he was in prison. To me spidey sense kicks in when you subconsciously feel threatened or unsafe. Up until he let you know he was in incarcerated I get the impression no uneasy feelings were raised.
I think you need to be and feel safe but I think you jumped the gun on how you approached it.
How is he or any other incarcerated person ever going to better themselves or become a contributing member of society if no one ever gives them a chance.
I think there was a way to help him and for you to be safe if you had given it some thought or discussed it with a supervisor.
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Post by crimsoncat05 on Jul 11, 2019 22:40:30 GMT
nope- not going to get into it. other than to say, wow- discrimination is alive and well. We don't like *some* kinds of it, but other kinds are apparently a-okay. (eta: see the many threads about 'existing while black standing on the sidewalk' or the pool party lady, et. al. )
and with that, I'm out.
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marianne
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Jun 25, 2014 21:08:26 GMT
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Post by marianne on Jul 11, 2019 22:41:28 GMT
I'm a strong believer in trusting my instincts. If your spidey sense was tingling before you knew why he was incarcerated, I'd pay a whole lot of attention. Others can call it judgmental, but for your own sense of safety and well being (and that of the ladies in your class,) I'd be trusting my instincts.
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Deleted
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Jun 1, 2024 9:24:03 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2019 22:42:36 GMT
Such a tough one. On one hand, he just got out for some very serious crimes against women. One the other hand, he is entitled to second chances and being that he's older, he might not have the violent tendencies that he had when he was younger. Is there a way to connect him with a male tutor willing to work with him one-on-one being that his scores were so low?
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Judy26
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Post by Judy26 on Jul 11, 2019 22:43:00 GMT
FFS, it is still a public place not "secluded" as the original crimes suggest. In a classroom with multiple people. He shared his history with you and you did a shitty thing. Own it. ^^^ THAT. I'm guessing there's a phone / security guard in the library, no? This is a very small town. I have my phone with me but there is no security guard. The class is small. Three younger girls are the other students. The library is quite empty by the time we leave. My head says he deserves an education but I have worked with many students with records and never got the weird feeling I got with him which is why I looked up his record and informed my superiors. They had a long meeting with his probation officer who agreed that the class wasn’t a good fit. It wasn’t my decision. But ultimately I put it in motion. I will have to own it. |
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Post by 950nancy on Jul 11, 2019 22:44:18 GMT
I taught a a community college class at night and had a male student who was also in the Army in my class. He was in his young 20's and completely harassed me (verbally) and made me feel very nervous to be around him even in a classroom full of people. I kept telling myself I was strong enough to handle it and put him in his place if needed, but he was deployed by the fifth week and I was ever so thankful.
OP, I don't know what I would have done in your shoes. I am (and always have been) cautious of men who send off my spidey sense. If I could have been guaranteed a safe place to teach him in public view and never alone with an escort to my vehicle, I would have done it no problem. Without that, I don't know. I also worked at a large mall in high school and college and knew of too many people harassed or hurt in the parking lot.
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peabay
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Jun 25, 2014 19:50:41 GMT
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Post by peabay on Jul 11, 2019 22:45:01 GMT
The library actually refused him services? No one has tried to find him another opportunity to educate himself? I would ask my supervisors if someone can help him in some way - perhaps a male librarian can arrange with him to find some tutoring. Something. It just seems like this guy keeps getting punished, after he's already paid his debt.
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Post by canadianscrappergirl on Jul 11, 2019 22:48:13 GMT
^^^ THAT. I'm guessing there's a phone / security guard in the library, no? This is a very small town. I have my phone with me but there is no security guard. The class is small. Three younger girls are the other students. The library is quite empty by the time we leave. My head says he deserves an education but I have worked with many students with records and never got the weird feeling I got with him which is why I looked up his record and informed my superiors. They had a long meeting with his probation officer who agreed that the class wasn’t a good fit. It wasn’t my decision. But ultimately I put it in motion. I will have to own it. Was there not a male teacher on staff who's class he could take? Are you at all worried that he may confront you because you were the catalyst for him being denied education? |
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