schizo319
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,030
Jun 28, 2014 0:26:58 GMT
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Post by schizo319 on Feb 16, 2017 14:07:19 GMT
I read this article last night about classism in America. As someone who grew up on public assistance, a lot of it resonated with me. Especially this line: "Having straddled a class divide and been wrongly stereotyped on both sides of it, throughout my life I've found peace in the places and things that don't evaluate my status: nature, animals, art, books" I thought some of you guys might enjoy the article too.
Poor Teeth
(note: I didn't mark this thread as political, because I don't think it is, but I can see how a discussion about it could TURN political, so I won't be mad if someone wants to mark it that way)
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Post by kitkath on Feb 16, 2017 14:31:30 GMT
Interesting article, thanks.
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perumbula
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,439
Location: Idaho
Jun 26, 2014 18:51:17 GMT
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Post by perumbula on Feb 16, 2017 14:54:16 GMT
that was a fantastic article. I grew up poor but not at the bottom. We had free lunch, but my parents' jobs which paid so little had good healthcare. I was able to get braces at 12. The only member of my family to do so, actually. The others just had to deal because theirs didn't look as bad as mine. Two of my siblings had braces as adults because of previously undiagnosed jaw alignment issues.
My mom held on like a doberman to our class position. We were "poor but we aren't trash," was something she said more than once. Every one of us had to start delivering newspapers at 8. That was our allowance. At 12 the newspaper money not only had to buy little wants it had to buy all our clothing too. When I joined the debate team and went on the trips it was money I earned myself that paid for them. She talked about when we would go to college (paid for on our own dimes with 100% Pell Grants and eligible for poor people scholarships.) She definitely talked about the trailer park two houses down as if the people there were lesser. But I think her holding on to her class position so tightly helped us immensely. All of her children have moved up in the world. Not by much, but most of us are definitely better off.
My husband grew up way worse off than I did. He knows what Government Cheese tastes like. All his clothing was bought second hand. Their children for the most part have moved up as well. Just last year he and his siblings paid off his parents' mortgage so they could have some money freed up for their health care, which is really a problem.
The "scars" of poverty hang on, though. It contributes to money issues and I can say positively that it still affects my self esteem and feelings of belonging. I always feel like I don't quite belong in any group I'm in. There are other things, but growing up poor never really goes away.
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Post by crazy4scraps on Feb 16, 2017 15:05:41 GMT
TFS, that was a good read.
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Post by mikklynn on Feb 16, 2017 15:07:55 GMT
I have often thought, if I were rich, I'd pay for dental care for some people I see working at our mall.
I wish dental care, health care, and mental health care were available to all.
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schizo319
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,030
Jun 28, 2014 0:26:58 GMT
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Post by schizo319 on Feb 16, 2017 15:23:20 GMT
The "scars" of poverty hang on, though. It contributes to money issues and I can say positively that it still affects my self esteem and feelings of belonging. I always feel like I don't quite belong in any group I'm in. There are other things, but growing up poor never really goes away. Really well said. I was fortunate in that my mom went to college during the years we were on assistance and by the time I was a senior in High School, my parents were in a much better position (though we still qualified for me to go to college on a Pell Grant, so we still weren't that far from the poverty line). My husband dealt with it too, his mom was disabled and he felt "looked down upon" by the rest of his family because they were all successfully upper middle class. My extended family on the other hand, mostly never made it out of the bottom rungs (for a lot of reasons, both societal and self-inflicted) and they think we're "uppity" because we don't struggle the same way they do.
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Post by not2peased on Feb 16, 2017 15:23:50 GMT
I have often said that the lack of attention paid to dental health in this country is shameful.
People NEED access to basic dental care
TFS
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pudgygroundhog
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,652
Location: The Grand Canyon
Jun 25, 2014 20:18:39 GMT
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Post by pudgygroundhog on Feb 16, 2017 15:34:47 GMT
The "scars" of poverty hang on, though. It contributes to money issues and I can say positively that it still affects my self esteem and feelings of belonging. I always feel like I don't quite belong in any group I'm in. There are other things, but growing up poor never really goes away. Really well said. I was fortunate in that my mom went to college during the years we were on assistance and by the time I was a senior in High School, my parents were in a much better position (though we still qualified for me to go to college on a Pell Grant, so we still weren't that far from the poverty line). My husband dealt with it too, his mom was disabled and he felt "looked down upon" by the rest of his family because they were all successfully upper middle class. My extended family on the other hand, mostly never made it out of the bottom rungs (for a lot of reasons, both societal and self-inflicted) and they think we're "uppity" because we don't struggle the same way they do. I think that is an interesting aspect of those trying to better their circumstances - sometimes they are faced with criticism from their family/friends who aren't doing the same. It's just one other factor that makes it harder. Interesting article and depressing. It saddens me that in a country so well off we see such disparity.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Aug 18, 2025 19:29:33 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Feb 16, 2017 15:43:24 GMT
I grew up poor as well and after moving out weeks after my eighteenth birthday, I have spent many years trying to hide "the tells" of my poor upbringing. I was not well educated, well traveled, nor well cared for. And like the author, I also had little dental care growing up. I remember going to the dentist ONE time while under my mom's roof. I am so thankful my teeth survived all those years of neglect.
Thanks for sharing this article. Once in a while I need reminded of my young childhood- ill fitting hand-me-down clothes, outhouse potty, Kool Aid & margarine, dirty home-cut hair, no vacations etc..etc..........
I am going to spend the day being thankful.
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Post by ~summer~ on Feb 16, 2017 16:11:32 GMT
Thanks good article
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Anita
Drama Llama

Posts: 5,891
Location: Kansas City -ish
Jun 27, 2014 2:38:58 GMT
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Post by Anita on Feb 16, 2017 16:22:59 GMT
Great article. My mother had dentures before she was 30. I didn't see a dentist for the first time until I was 17 because we didn't have dental insurance. We were definitely poor, and it does stay with you for life.
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freebird
Drama Llama

'cause I'm free as a bird now
Posts: 6,927
Jun 25, 2014 20:06:48 GMT
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Post by freebird on Feb 16, 2017 17:37:27 GMT
This article nearly brought me to tears. She pretty much described my childhood. I went to the dentist only a couple times as a child, once I had to beg I was in so much pain, my mom was angry at me when I finally went. That tooth later became a very expensive crown as an adult - that I still couldn't afford. My brother - who is 50, still has his baby teeth - very strange deal. He's supposed to have dentures since he was 20 but he's just never done it. I know he got it from my mom, her teeth were the same. She got dentures when she was about 28-30. I have crooked teeth that can pass but they do bother me. My 2 much younger sisters have perfect teeth, which is funny because of their ages they had different "parents" (same parents) so they had better nutrition than us older 3 did. They also have gotten along better in life than probably us older 3.
When my youngest was about 6-7 his older brother was fighting with him and kicked out his front teeth accidentally (man I was mad!) He had no front teeth for a couple years so when his teeth finally grew in, they were really REALLY crooked and stuck out. He couldn't even shut his mouth properly. Had it been my own parents, he would still look like that. I knew he'd never get a great job, or a beautiful girl so we all sucked it up (ex, his wife, my husband and I) and scraped up the money for the braces. He has a beautiful smile now. A beautiful girlfriend and a great job. I consider this one of my greatest accomplishments!
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Post by LavenderLayoutLady on Feb 16, 2017 18:00:56 GMT
I consider this one of my greatest accomplishments! You post touch me and this quote resonated with me. I had almost no dental care as a kid. Even after trying to fix my mouth as an adult, it isn't as healthy as it should be. And I still can't afford to do the things that I would like to for myself. You damn well better believe that I make it an extremely high priority for my kids to have good dental health.
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Post by ilikepink on Feb 16, 2017 18:29:44 GMT
Great article - real food for thought. Dental/medical care is just a visible sign of the haves and have-nots. You can be ignorant with great teeth and designer shoes, or educated with basic needs not met.
There but for the grace of God...........
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quiltedbrain
Full Member
 
Posts: 429
Jun 26, 2014 3:34:53 GMT
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Post by quiltedbrain on Feb 16, 2017 18:59:59 GMT
The "scars" of poverty hang on, though. It contributes to money issues and I can say positively that it still affects my self esteem and feelings of belonging. I always feel like I don't quite belong in any group I'm in. There are other things, but growing up poor never really goes away. I'll echo another posters comment that this was really well said. OP, thanks for sharing this article.
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pridemom
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,843
Jul 12, 2014 21:58:10 GMT
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Post by pridemom on Feb 16, 2017 19:02:32 GMT
The "scars" of poverty hang on, though. It contributes to money issues and I can say positively that it still affects my self esteem and feelings of belonging. I always feel like I don't quite belong in any group I'm in. There are other things, but growing up poor never really goes away. Really well said. I was fortunate in that my mom went to college during the years we were on assistance and by the time I was a senior in High School, my parents were in a much better position (though we still qualified for me to go to college on a Pell Grant, so we still weren't that far from the poverty line). My husband dealt with it too, his mom was disabled and he felt "looked down upon" by the rest of his family because they were all successfully upper middle class. My extended family on the other hand, mostly never made it out of the bottom rungs (for a lot of reasons, both societal and self-inflicted) and they think we're "uppity" because we don't struggle the same way they do. Thank you for phrasing this so well. I still feel horribly inadequate regarding my home, car, clothing, etc. I feel like an imposter. We make a fairly good income, but I am constantly afraid of not being able to pay the bills. DH has to be the one to pay the bills because I freeze up when I see the bank balance go down. I am afraid of being poor again. Whoever mentioned government cheese--lol. Nothing melts for grilled cheese sandwiches like government surplus cheese. Good stuff! I am the only one of my maternal siblings to have all of their teeth. We did get dental care under Medicaid but daily care was neglected. One sibling has two teeth and has been that way since his mid 20's. My mom had her teeth all pulled at 30 and had a full set of dentures. I never got the braces I should have to correct a cross bite. I have made sure my kids do, though.
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mallie
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,253
Jul 3, 2014 18:13:13 GMT
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Post by mallie on Feb 16, 2017 19:23:44 GMT
My parents firmly believed in the truth of the tag line of this post. Although we were poor, somehow they found money and a wonderful ortho and ldentist willing to be paid in installments. One of my sisters does have osme dental problems.s th o ugh that they they were unable to find the money to correct.
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Post by lbp on Feb 16, 2017 21:06:45 GMT
Though we were what I would call lower middle class, and had no dental insurance, my mother made sure she saved enough money to get us to the dentist once a year for cleanings and cavities filled. My sister and I were very fortunate that our teeth grew in straight because there wouldn't have been money for braces.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Aug 18, 2025 19:29:33 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Feb 16, 2017 21:45:43 GMT
This article nearly brought me to tears. She pretty much described my childhood. I went to the dentist only a couple times as a child, once I had to beg I was in so much pain, my mom was angry at me when I finally went. That tooth later became a very expensive crown as an adult - that I still couldn't afford. My brother - who is 50, still has his baby teeth - very strange deal. He's supposed to have dentures since he was 20 but he's just never done it. I know he got it from my mom, her teeth were the same. She got dentures when she was about 28-30. I have crooked teeth that can pass but they do bother me. My 2 much younger sisters have perfect teeth, which is funny because of their ages they had different "parents" (same parents) so they had better nutrition than us older 3 did. They also have gotten along better in life than probably us older 3. When my youngest was about 6-7 his older brother was fighting with him and kicked out his front teeth accidentally (man I was mad!) He had no front teeth for a couple years so when his teeth finally grew in, they were really REALLY crooked and stuck out. He couldn't even shut his mouth properly. Had it been my own parents, he would still look like that. I knew he'd never get a great job, or a beautiful girl so we all sucked it up (ex, his wife, my husband and I) and scraped up the money for the braces. He has a beautiful smile now. A beautiful girlfriend and a great job. I consider this one of my greatest accomplishments! I am so glad you were able to fix his teeth. It IS an accomplishment!!! I often catch myself looking at my daughter's fixed teeth (ortho and whitening) and am so happy her smile will never hold her back in life.
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Post by papersilly on Feb 16, 2017 22:22:17 GMT
what an interesting article and so true.
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Post by mom on Feb 16, 2017 23:03:33 GMT
I read this to my husband. He grew up on welfare and has really had to work hard at overpowering the scars that come with that. When we had been married for awhile - maybe 8 years? - he had worked his way up the food chain at work and was the top guy. I asked him what his biggest accomplishment was. His answer? HIs biggest accomplishment was when he could afford to fix his teeth. It truly changed how he saw himself but also how others saw him.
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Post by librarylady on Feb 16, 2017 23:39:00 GMT
Very interesting read. We were very poor also. As I child I never had a dental check up, but did go to the dentist when a bad tooth ached so much I could not stand it. After that, I had several fillings done. My mother had bad teeth and got dentures when she was in her 40s, and went to the dental college to get the work done.
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Post by librarylady on Feb 16, 2017 23:40:16 GMT
When I was in France in the 1990s, our tour guide said he could always recognize Americans by the great teeth we had. He said the Americans who visited never had bad teeth or missing teeth.
I thought that was an interesting observation.
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Post by anxiousmom on Feb 17, 2017 0:19:42 GMT
We grew up poor. I wasn't really aware of it for a long time, mostly because no one treated us as poor. But I got free breakfasts and lunches at school, new clothes came from the TG&Y and hair cuts were sitting in the dining room with my mom hacking away with the sewing scissors. There was the time that I stepped on a rusty nail and it was so awful that I had to use crutches-but we couldn't afford them and I ended up with what we then called the 'polio crutches' (this was of course years ago when polio was still kind of thing-they were the aluminum kind that had the arm braces and hand holds.) I knew that other people lived differently than we did-we didn't have air conditioning, we didn't have a tv, our house was only about 950 square feet...but we ate well (my mom volunteered at the food co-op every weekend in exchange for fresh vegetables) and my mom had a group of friends that we always hung out with-big pot luck dinners and lots of music.
And where I really lucked out? When I was about 9 my mom went back to school for dental hygiene. Thanks to her job, we always had great dental care. Free cleanings every six months, cavities covered...and when it came time for braces, the orthodontist gave steep, steep discounts because he was friends with the dentist she worked for. So I escaped the consequences of poor dental health thanks to my mom's employer who allowed her and us kids access to free dental care.
We talk sometimes about how poor we were, but usually while laughing. I had SUCH a happy childhood. My aunt lived with us for a couple of years, my mom's friends were amazing people who brought interesting experiences into my world. We spent more weekends than not camping...at the beach, in the woods, by the rivers. We went to music festivals, we went to free outdoor concerts, we had parties where people brought their instruments and music was a HUGE part of my childhood. We were the barefoot children of the 70's...chewing on sugar cane right off the plant, sucking on oranges right off the trees, with sunburned noses playing among the blankets in front of stages listening to whoever was playing at the time. We were poor, and at times so poor that buying a coca-cola was stretching the budget, but I honestly wouldn't trade my experience for anything in the world.
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zella
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,884
Jul 7, 2014 19:36:30 GMT
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Post by zella on Feb 17, 2017 0:32:16 GMT
Man, does this resonate with me.
I grew up in the UK. We were poor when I was born, and middle class by the time I was in school. I don't think I went to the dentist until I was about 9, and I needed 8 fillings. This wasn't due to poor dental hygiene, but to genetics and non-fluoridated water. Both of my parents had a lot of tooth problems, but I had to be different. I was born with a type of ectodermal dysplasia, which causes problems with nails, teeth and hair. My baby teeth were okay, but they didn't all fall out, and I didn't lose my first tooth until I was 7. I never had wisdom teeth. I was also missing about 6 or 8 adult teeth, including all of the lateral incisors. Consequently my canines, which are usually the pointiest teeth, were right beside my front four teeth (same top and bottom). The disorder also causes oddly shaped teeth, so my incisors, particularly the upper ones, were vampire-like. My front bottom teeth are very small and thin and there are gaps in between them.
When I was 18, my parents paid for me to have four crowns and a three-tooth bridge on my upper teeth. Crowns are meant to last for about 10 years. I'm now 54 and still have them. I've never had enough money to get them replaced, or to have my lower teeth fixed. My teeth also break and crack easily, which has led to multiple root canals and extractions. I have two large gaps on the left side of my mouth. I can't afford to get it fixed.
I hate my teeth. I have cried many, many tears over them. And yes, it IS an indicator of class and wealth, and the fact that I have a degree and live a middle-class lifestyle makes it harder, as I have the teeth of a poor person. My younger daughter has inherited many of my tooth problems, unfortunately. It wouldn't be quite so hard if we didn't live in the land of people with straight, white teeth.
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PLurker
Prolific Pea
 
Posts: 9,890
Location: Behind the Cheddar Curtain
Jun 28, 2014 3:48:49 GMT
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Post by PLurker on Feb 17, 2017 0:34:58 GMT
We grew up with little money, too. I fell off a bike and knocked my two front teeth crooked. They did not get fixed until adulthood. Thank goodness they weren't too bad. That being said it has always stuck in my mind when people disrespect people with dental problems, "why don't they just get that fixed"- like it's so easy.
And not to get political but the one thing that the Hardee's guy that was up for Labor Secretary was quoted as saying that really turned me off on him was about this very subject. Something demeaning that all his employees at Hardees "better have their teeth" or similar. Grrrrrrrrrrr.
Good teeth as a luxury is so sad.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Aug 18, 2025 19:29:33 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2017 1:30:00 GMT
The shame is even with insurance dental care is outrageous and sometimes you can be at the mercy of a scam dentist.
My daughter has GERD. And we stared her dental care at 8 months to keep her teeth. At 5 the dentist wanted to put crowns on her back molars. $1200 a piece after insurance!!! X4. These crowns would be replaced as needed. Until she was 16 or so when permanent crowns would be down. If I made payments, the total cost would be around $20-30 grand! With no guarantees, If a crown broke we had to pay for it. We went to another dentist. He is an artist he scrapped and drilled off bad pieces and filled/shaped resin into those areas. You can not tell where the work was done.
The first dentist called me a horrible mother for getting a second opinion.
It should be noted that you also can have the best dental care , but genetics can play a big part in how your teeth hold up.
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Post by Merge on Feb 17, 2017 2:57:27 GMT
We weren't poor, but definitely lower middle class in terms of income when I was a kid. But teeth were a big deal to my dad - because he felt, as the article says, that bad teeth would forever mark us as lower class. He found the cheapest one-man dentist shop in town - a crotchety old guy who had trained as a dentist in the Navy and did all his own work (no hygienist, just him in the office). And that's where we went, every six months like clockwork. I know my dad used to go over and help him with small fix-it projects in the office to pay off some of our bill.
I know now he was an awful dentist. Everything was much more painful than it needed to be, and all his equipment seemed to have come from the 1950s with him. I had no idea until I was an adult that dental work didn't have to be awful, or that some dentists had hygienists to do the cleanings and nice, modern, updated offices. But my teeth are nice.
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Post by AussieMeg on Feb 17, 2017 3:06:57 GMT
When I was in France in the 1990s, our tour guide said he could always recognize Americans by the great teeth we had. He said the Americans who visited never had bad teeth or missing teeth. I thought that was an interesting observation. Well that makes a lot of sense - Americans who couldn't afford to go to the dentist also couldn't afford to go to France!
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Post by k8smom on Feb 17, 2017 4:13:53 GMT
Growing up, I was #3 of 6 kids. My dad was a teacher and my mom a stay at home mom. Even though we had medical and dental insurance, we were never taken because of the potential for out of pocket expenses. I had two teeth that essentially rotted to the gums and it wasn't until my parents divorced and my dad remarried that my horrified new stepmom carted me off to the dentist PRONTO.
I was in the 8th grade when I had that first dental appointment, and there was nothing they could do to save the teeth. The dentist pulled the fragments left embedded in my gums and stormed out to the waiting room to let my stepmom have it. He told her he was reporting them to child welfare services and my stepmom, who was all of 27 herself, explained that she had just married my dad and that she had no previous knowledge of the situation.
Nothing was ever done to fill the gaps left by the two pulled teeth, so as an adult with my own insurance I had two bridges to fill the gaps, wore braces in my 30s and am a tad obsessed with oral hygiene. Go figure!
That said, teeth is the first thing that I notice when I meet someone!
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