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Post by cindyupnorth on Dec 2, 2016 1:48:35 GMT
One of my good friend's son's did something really dumb about 1 month ago. He was driving home, and saw a Trump political sign still sitting in a ditch. He got out in the middle of the night and spray painted it. He apparently got caught by the police. He was cited with 4th degree property damage. I think to the sign. So now he has to appear in court. He knows he did wrong, and just wants to plead guilty and move on. My friend is worried that this will go on his personal background check when he starts to apply for jobs. It's a misdemeanor and it's 4th degree. Does it ever happen with something like this, where the person pleads guilty and the judge just throws it out? or is it a done deal?
UPDATE: So my friend's son got a public defender, and they had him plead ....crap I can't remember the exact name. But they basically admit to doing it, but ask for probation, and it not to go on their record. Which the judge agreed to. So he is on probation for a yr. Paid a small fee, and it won't be on his record or background check. So it all worked out, and hopefully he learned his lesson! |
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Post by mlynn on Dec 2, 2016 1:53:47 GMT
Is he a minor? If so, I believe it only shows up later in life if he doesn't keep his nose clean. It is hard to say what his penalty would be. I would talk to a public defender. Sometime prosecutor's make a deal that if they stay out of trouble for a certain period of time, everything goes away. It might even be worth a consult with a private lawyer.
For perspective, I think a speeding ticket is a misdemeanor.
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Post by cindyupnorth on Dec 2, 2016 2:17:11 GMT
No,not a minor. In college. They don't have money for a lawyer. Like I said, he just wants to be done with it. But Mom is worried about the long term affects. That is a good idea about he deal though. When h goes to court in a few wks, during the court appearance, can he just ask for this?
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Post by Eddie-n-Harley on Dec 2, 2016 2:26:50 GMT
I believe you're asking about expungement or expunction. You'll probably want to encourage her to consult an attorney-- believe in my state you have to be under a certain age (teenager probably is) but the judge also has to order it at sentencing. If not, it's too late to go back and ask for expunction later. I'm not sure on what the requirements are either-- just completing the sentence, or a period of time, or what. For perspective, I think a speeding ticket is a misdemeanor. At least in my state, most speeding tickets and other moving violations are considered civil forfeitures, not crimes. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2016 2:56:15 GMT
Here that would land you in jail!
There are legal clinics for college students, I would advise him to go to one.
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Post by cindyupnorth on Dec 2, 2016 3:28:38 GMT
How would that land him in jail where you live? the Trump part? or the 4th degree? 4 degree is the very lowest they could charge him with. My friend said the police office told him he would most likely get a fine is all. They are just more worried about it on his record, and with back ground checks with future jobs.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2016 3:38:41 GMT
How would that land him in jail where you live? the Trump part? or the 4th degree? 4 degree is the very lowest they could charge him with. My friend said the police office told him he would most likely get a fine is all. They are just more worried about it on his record, and with back ground checks with future jobs. It has something to do with people destroying bush signs way back when. People got very angry and it is now a crime to destroy campaign signs. |
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Post by whipea on Dec 2, 2016 3:38:56 GMT
He really needs to worry about his record. He needs to do what it takes and consult an attorney. I have seen many people not permitted to be licensed in numerous professions due to misdemeanors. In the health fields students have problems being placed in field work even if if the conviction was withheld - no field work, no degree. Also effects employment opportunities, so many applicants employers can be very picky. Again, he needs to consult an attorney.
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Post by sillyrabbit on Dec 2, 2016 4:18:52 GMT
In my state (Kentucky) with misdemeanors you can apply to have them expunged from your record after 5 years. It will show up in a background check until it is expunged. I would tell them to check with his attorney or another court familiar person to see what the rules are in his state.
ETA: I'd say if he pleads guilty it's a done deal. A lawyer can probably work some kind of deal out though if he's never been in trouble before. He needs to consult a lawyer before pleading guilty.
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Post by bc2ca on Dec 2, 2016 4:21:53 GMT
One of my good friend's son's did something really dumb about 1 month ago. He was driving home, and saw a Trump political sign still sitting in a ditch. He got out in the middle of the night and spray painted it. He apparently got caught by the police. He was cited with 4th degree property damage. I think to the sign. So now he has to appear in court. He knows he did wrong, and just wants to plead guilty and move on. My friend is worried that this will go on his personal background check when he starts to apply for jobs. It's a misdemeanor and it's 4th degree. Does it ever happen with something like this, where the person pleads guilty and the judge just throws it out? or is it a done deal? I'm not an attorney, but my understanding is if you plead guilty the judge can't throw it out. With a misdemeanor I would anticipate the guilty plea results in a fine and/or community service hours. In CA the property damage has to be much higher (IIRC $5,000) to elevate the crime to felony charges. We know a bunch of dumb kids that faced charges for egging houses & cars last year. ETA I would definitely talk to a public defender/legal aid about the impact of a guilty plea on his record. |
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Post by epeanymous on Dec 2, 2016 4:31:29 GMT
The police officer is the person who charged him. He should not rely on a police officer for legal advice.
If he has never been in trouble before and it is a minor offense, in many jurisdictions there are pretrial diversion programs that permit you to avoid a criminal conviction. It is also possible that there are various problems with the charge that would permit him to avoid conviction. It is also possible that a misdemeanor could be reduced to a violation, which is more like a traffic ticket and may not need to b reported on employment forms, etc. It is difficult for him to know his options without consulting a lawyer, and just going in and pleading guilty as charged is not necessarily the right move even if he wants to take responsibility -- given that bargaining is rampant in criminal court, it's kind of the equivalent of paying the retail sticker price at Michael's without checking to see if there is a sale or a coupon. Even expungement laws vary from place to place, and the kinds of offenses that can be expunged for first-time convicted persons vary.
I would advise my kid not to plead guilty without consulting with an attorney.
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Post by lurkingsince2001 on Dec 2, 2016 5:39:08 GMT
I get that you say they can't afford an attorney, but they really can't afford to not have an attorney.
If he's a student, his college may have somewhere he can go for advice. There are also Legal Aid numbers some places that might prove useful.
I know it seems silly that something like this, the lowest degree as you put it, could screw things up in the future. But with so much competition for jobs these days, the littlest thing can cut a person out of the running.
Something like this can have far reaching and currently undiscernable effects. He does not need to continue to compound his stupidity by just walking in and pleading guilty without proper advice.
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Post by darkangel090260 on Dec 2, 2016 5:57:11 GMT
he can get a court appointed attorney
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Post by mlynn on Dec 2, 2016 6:27:53 GMT
You might have them google "lawyer referral service". I used it once when a legal/criminal situation almost involved me and I was concerned. The first visit was a relatively nonminal fee, and then if I chose to I could hire him to pursue the matter. When I googled, results came up for the referral service and also for finding legal aide in your area.
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Post by LavenderLayoutLady on Dec 2, 2016 11:18:06 GMT
He really needs to worry about his record. He needs to do what it takes and consult an attorney. I would recommend that he & his family do whatever it takes to hire him an attorney. His future depends on it. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2016 13:00:21 GMT
They have money for a lawyer, they're just using it right now to pay for his schooling. Perhaps school will be delayed a bit while they sort this out.
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Post by cindyupnorth on Dec 2, 2016 18:46:00 GMT
No, I am pretty sure they don't. School is being paid for by loans, and grants. He doesn't want to lose them, so needs to go full time.
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Post by scrappyoutlaw on Dec 2, 2016 19:06:17 GMT
I second the court appointed attorney. I was a public defender in a district court for a stint, but being that we're different states I really can't provide any detailed advice. It varies too much state by state. I do however, want to reiterate what others have said above, do NOT just plead guilty, there are usually so many options for a first time offender!
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Post by originalvanillabean on Dec 2, 2016 19:13:13 GMT
No, I am pretty sure they don't. School is being paid for by loans, and grants. He doesn't want to lose them, so needs to go full time. If they are truly concerned about future impacts of this, it is important to talk to an attorney before going to court, even if it costs money. Plus, there are usually resources for no or low-cost. Good luck to your friend and his son. |
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Post by *leslie* on Dec 2, 2016 20:56:46 GMT
Why is he carrying around spray paint?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2016 20:57:38 GMT
You really need to keep us updated!
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Post by Scrapbrat on Dec 2, 2016 20:57:47 GMT
I don't think this is an issue that the peas can really help with. Criminal laws differ widely from state to state, so what is or isn't a misdemeanor in one state has no bearing on your own state. Similarly, whether or not something goes on a minor's record, or can be expunged, are also matters that are within the purview of your particular state's law. Your best bet would probably be for the young man or his family to try to contact a local legal aid clinic and see if they can get some advice that way.
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Post by annaintx on Dec 2, 2016 21:14:23 GMT
He needs a lawyer.
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Post by hop2 on Dec 2, 2016 21:27:17 GMT
He needs an attorney some how some way -he could loose his grants for college if he pleads guilty. (I said could because it varies according to each agreement )
He could make himself unemployable if he just goes in an pleads guilty. There are so many things an attorney can arrange that will not affect his record for the rest of his life. He made an impulsive rash decision when he damaged the sign and he seems to be making another impulsive rash decision about court.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2016 22:40:16 GMT
I don't think this is an issue that the peas can really help with. Criminal laws differ widely from state to state, so what is or isn't a misdemeanor in one state has no bearing on your own state. Similarly, whether or not something goes on a minor's record, or can be expunged, are also matters that are within the purview of your particular state's law. Your best bet would probably be for the young man or his family to try to contact a local legal aid clinic and see if they can get some advice that way. This. It can vary from city to city depending on the local laws. |
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