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Post by melanell on Feb 8, 2017 13:55:25 GMT
I think he certainly can read. He has the ability to read in general. For me the question is "How well?".
But the ability to focus on long works or large blocks of print, to read easily, or to comprehend more difficult papers, articles, contracts, etc., is an entirely different matter.
His never-ending Twitter use indicates that he can at least focus on, read, & comprehend small bites at a time. But that is far, far from the amount of literacy I would expect from the POTUS. And I could certainly believe that he may have some sort of reading or learning disability or some sort of attention deficit disorder.
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Post by elaine on Feb 8, 2017 14:01:26 GMT
I think he certainly can read. He has the ability to read in general. But the ability to focus on long works or large blocks of print, to read easily, or to comprehend more difficult papers, articles, contracts, etc., is an entirely different matter. His never-ending Twitter use indicates that he can at least focus on, read, & comprehend small bites at a time. But that is far, far from the amount of literacy I would expect from the POTUS. And I could certainly believe that he may have some sort of reading or learning disability or some sort of attention deficit disorder. This made me think of one of my favorite movies - A Fish Called Wanda:
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Post by anonrefugee on Feb 8, 2017 14:29:29 GMT
The most pertinent part of that video was the last 30 seconds - a lack of intellectual curiosity and compensation for inability to read. He could have a reader (human or tech), competent advisors, etc.
Due to his age it's entirely possible he has an undiagnosed learning difference like dyslexia. It would also explain a lot of his behavior, the bully dealing with a personal shame.
As the mother of people with dyslexia (and for the record high comprehension and intellect) watching that video was disturbing for reasons that might not concern others, I feel sadness. I'm thankful my kids live in a time where there's recognition of the disorder, and in an area with excellent resources for training. What could be a lifelong challenger becomes only a hiccup for many with proper training.
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pudgygroundhog
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Post by pudgygroundhog on Feb 8, 2017 14:38:24 GMT
I just don't think we can make hard and fast conclusions about his reading comprehension from this exchange. It's not enough information. Oh I agree with that, you couldn't draw any conclusions from this about his actual reading ability. However I do think some of the points made in this are interesting, especially about his attitude and how he is seen to treat the written word, documents etc. I've read from a few different sources and seen interviews where he has been asked about reading and books and he's basically said his favourite book is the bible and then his own book. When asked about his heroes he says his dad and then babbles on about himself. So I do think there's enough evidence to show that he isn't a reader, and there have also been numerous sources that have come out with the short attention span thing and how he prefers TV over books and needs to be kept on task. I highly doubt he can't actually read, but I do think there is evidence there that he isn't a very good reader and that he tries hard to cover this up. When he talks, like the most recent speech about terrorists he sounds like he's doing story time at a grade school. That Black History month speech was a complete clusterf**ck of nonsense as well. I think that's a concern when it comes to being President as no doubt there are a lot of documents, contracts, files etc etc that are compulsory reading for him, and if he's not reading them, well... If he thinks it's OK to get a 200 page report on something and to flip through and think he's "got the gist of it" then that's going to be an issue when it comes to his understanding of political situations and how he deals with them. I'm sure he can read (even if at a fourth grade level he can certainly get by), but he clearly is not a reader. And the speeches baffle me. Where are his speech writers? I guess he thinks he doesn't need them? Or maybe he can't read what they wrote.
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pudgygroundhog
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Post by pudgygroundhog on Feb 8, 2017 14:39:40 GMT
Makes some sense. His spoken English is said to be equivalent to that of a 10 year old, and the way he signs his signature reminded me of a child who had practiced and practiced and was showing us how clever he was. The only thing missing was that he didn't have his tongue sticking out of the corner of his mouth. That's an insult to my nine year old. (who is undoubtedly more well read than he is)
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pudgygroundhog
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Post by pudgygroundhog on Feb 8, 2017 14:42:23 GMT
I don't know that there is enough evidence to support him being illiterate. What DID bother me was his obvious attempt to truthfully answer in the deposition by purposely evading what was on the document. This points directly to his character and illustrates what a cheat he is. That is far more disturbing to me than his oratory skills. There is a reason why so many New Yorkers did not trust him. The guy was in real estate development in NYC. He has been in bed with far shadier criminals than Putin for decades, his moral boundaries -- if he had any originally --were compromised long ago. Plus the many stories of him cheating people, including small business especially are legion. Don the Con is in the White House. What is of far more concern to me and makes me wonder even more about his judgment and acumen is the NYT article in which he is reported to have been angry at staff who he blames for not explaining the EOs he has been signing. It is your fucking responsibility to read what you are signing. Business 101, for starters. Whythe hell would you sign contracts without reading and full comprehension of the contents and consequences? Lazy, illiterate, stupid? Dangerous. His idiocy and fascism are going to be tragic for this country. ITA! I think in his business dealings he had trusted lawyers/advisers that did his bidding and tell him about the contracts, etc. But now he's got Bannon. Which is terrifying.
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pudgygroundhog
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Post by pudgygroundhog on Feb 8, 2017 14:44:52 GMT
I think he certainly can read. He has the ability to read in general. For me the question is "How well?". But the ability to focus on long works or large blocks of print, to read easily, or to comprehend more difficult papers, articles, contracts, etc., is an entirely different matter. His never-ending Twitter use indicates that he can at least focus on, read, & comprehend small bites at a time. But that is far, far from the amount of literacy I would expect from the POTUS. And I could certainly believe that he may have some sort of reading or learning disability or some sort of attention deficit disorder. Maybe he just needs to read books in Twitter format. Can you imagine how long it would take to read War and Peace? lol.
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sueg
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Post by sueg on Feb 8, 2017 14:45:37 GMT
The most pertinent part of that video was the last 30 seconds - a lack of intellectual curiosity and compensation for inability to read. That bit struck me too. I come from a family where everyone reads for both enjoyment and learning, and many subjects were discussed over the dinner table. We did the same with our children when they were growing up, and it is still amazing to have a good conversation with both of them. I still find myself searching out books, or more recently podcasts, about places we visit and historical events that occurred there. That anybody doesn't care to learn more about the world around them is just foreign to me, and especially when that person has so much influence on what might happen in that world.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Feb 8, 2017 14:46:04 GMT
Trump illiterate? So your theory is someone else is writing his tweets? There's been more than a few times when he's used a teleprompter - which is probably a better example of ability to read than a deposition. I'll file this under yet another example of liberals being susceptible to fake news.
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sueg
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Post by sueg on Feb 8, 2017 14:49:12 GMT
Trump illiterate? So your theory is someone else is writing his tweets? There's been more than a few times when he's used a teleprompter - which is probably a better example of ability to read than a deposition. I'll file this under yet another example of liberals being susceptible to fake news. He has said on several occasions that he dictates his tweets. It is even shown in the linked video. He also boasts - again, shown in the video - that he doesn't follow what's on the teleprompter all the time. There is also a difference between being able to say the words you see, and comprehending what you are reading.
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Post by compwalla on Feb 8, 2017 14:50:12 GMT
The picture of the Oval Office bookshelves before and after Lord Dampnut is very depressing. A president who only trusts TV news to inform his policy decisions? How the fuck can anyone hear that and think, "Yes, this is the level of intellect we want in a president." JFC this guy is a disaster.
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Post by pjaye on Feb 8, 2017 14:51:45 GMT
There's been more than a few times when he's used a teleprompter yes - badly. I'll file this under yet another example of liberals being susceptible to fake news. And I'll file this under...another person who doesn't have enough of an attention span to sit and watch a 12 minute video...because by your comments it's obvious you didn't watch it, and that's what this thread is about. Why even bother commenting if you don't watch the video in the OP?
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Just T
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Post by Just T on Feb 8, 2017 14:53:17 GMT
Especially when he despises the media and says all they do is lie. Baffling.
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Dalai Mama
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Post by Dalai Mama on Feb 8, 2017 15:00:09 GMT
I'm going to reiterate that there are many of us out there that have issues with reading that have nothing to do with our intelligence.
As someone else said, his lack of intellectual curiosity is much more concerning.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Feb 8, 2017 15:03:59 GMT
There's been more than a few times when he's used a teleprompter yes - badly. I'll file this under yet another example of liberals being susceptible to fake news. And I'll file this under...another person who doesn't have enough of an attention span to sit and watch a 12 minute video...because by your comments it's obvious you didn't watch it, and that's what this thread is about. Why even bother commenting if you don't watch the video in the OP? I watched the video up until the big "reveal" of the deposition - it was stupid. Am I impressed with Trump's intellectualism - no. Do I even find him intellectually curious - no. But I have actually been deposed. And the idea that his deposition is some red flag that he can't read is ridiculous. And reading these comments about him being illiterate and mentally retarded - clearly a whole lot of people on this thread don't realize what those words mean.
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Sarah*H
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Post by Sarah*H on Feb 8, 2017 15:11:24 GMT
He's on record saying that he dictates his tweets. I don't know if that's all of them (who is there to type for him at 3 am?) but even if he does it himself, the ability to type 140 characters is hardly indicative of his reading level.
I just read an article which said that he wants all briefings on one piece of paper, bullet pointed, no more than 9 bullet points. Could be just another false leak but it's in line with what we already know about his attention to detail.
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Post by librarylady on Feb 8, 2017 15:13:00 GMT
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Post by compwalla on Feb 8, 2017 15:15:21 GMT
And the idea that his deposition is some red flag that he can't read is ridiculous. The pattern of behavior (only wanted short bullets, no more than one page, the admission he doesn't read books or newspapers, his tap dancing around being asked to read a longer passage from a lease) is very typical of an adult who has learned to cope with limited reading skills. "I don't have my glasses" is a typical comment along with using other excuses for why a functionally illiterate adult would avoid reading in front of someone else. I have in the past volunteered with an organization that trained the volunteers to recognize when a client may be unable to read and trained us how to help the client with their needs without causing embarrassment and with a referral to a literacy coach if the client seemed receptive. If I had a nickel for how many times I heard, "I don't have my glasses with me," I would have a nice pile of nickels. It's not just the one time he deflected reading a lease during a deposition but the accumulated evidence that he struggles with reading comprehension. Pair this possibility with being intellectually incurious and I personally find it extremely troubling. Also - he's supposed to be a real estate mogul and he's never reviewed many leases? What the actual fuck?
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Post by friendly on Feb 8, 2017 15:17:07 GMT
I just don't know what to say. If it's true, we (the US) are in so much trouble.
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Post by friendly on Feb 8, 2017 15:20:36 GMT
yes - badly. And I'll file this under...another person who doesn't have enough of an attention span to sit and watch a 12 minute video...because by your comments it's obvious you didn't watch it, and that's what this thread is about. Why even bother commenting if you don't watch the video in the OP? I watched the video up until the big "reveal" of the deposition - it was stupid. Am I impressed with Trump's intellectualism - no. Do I even find him intellectually curious - no. But I have actually been deposed. And the idea that his deposition is some red flag that he can't read is ridiculous. And reading these comments about him being illiterate and mentally retarded - clearly a whole lot of people on this thread don't realize what those words mean. You're admitting that you didn't watch the entire video. Perhaps you should before you start insulting the posters on this thread.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Feb 8, 2017 15:21:57 GMT
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Post by librarylady on Feb 8, 2017 15:22:19 GMT
I noticed that when he was reading something about MLK, Jr. Apparently the Jr. was on line 2 and he read Martin Luther King (long pause) Jr. blah, blah blah
To me, that day, it was apparent he never realized that Jr. went with the words Martin Luther King.
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Post by librarylady on Feb 8, 2017 15:28:02 GMT
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scorpeao
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Post by scorpeao on Feb 8, 2017 15:35:36 GMT
Makes some sense. His spoken English is said to be equivalent to that of a 10 year old, and the way he signs his signature reminded me of a child who had practiced and practiced and was showing us how clever he was. The only thing missing was that he didn't have his tongue sticking out of the corner of his mouth. And add to that how often he makes comments about how smart he is. Almost like he is trying to convince himself, as well as the public. I've said it before...those who profess to be so smart are usually total frauds. My step-dad is genius level smart...brilliant really. I've never heard him, or his colleagues, say anything about being smart. Furthermore, I work in the science field around some pretty damn smart people, and again, I don't hear them talking about how smart they are.
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Rhondito
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Post by Rhondito on Feb 8, 2017 15:36:59 GMT
If this is true, or in part true, it could explain why he wants a member of his family as an advisor, and why Ivanka has moved to DC. She and her husband can conveniently help cover up any reading obstacles he may have.
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pudgygroundhog
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Post by pudgygroundhog on Feb 8, 2017 15:43:17 GMT
And add to that how often he makes comments about how smart he is. Almost like he is trying to convince himself, as well as the public. I've said it before...those who profess to be so smart are usually total frauds. My step-dad is genius level smart...brilliant really. I've never heard him, or his colleagues, say anything about being smart. Furthermore, I work in the science field around some pretty damn smart people, and again, I don't hear them talking about how smart they are. Absolutely! Things you don't hear smart people say: "I'm so smart!". A good friend of mine (also one of the smartest people I know) has a sign in her office that says "If you're the smartest person in the room, you are in the wrong room". (and I think you could also finish that with "if you're the smartest person in the room, you might not be as smart as you think").
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Kath
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Post by Kath on Feb 8, 2017 15:49:12 GMT
I watched the video and felt touched, saddened, and inspired all at the same time. I mean, if Donald Trump can't read past a 4th or 5th grade level and yet he can still become president of the United States, what the @#$ is my problem?
Facing a big challenge today in my professional life and I will take this with me. If he can do it, well, then so can I.
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Post by bc2ca on Feb 8, 2017 16:02:33 GMT
And add to that how often he makes comments about how smart he is. Almost like he is trying to convince himself, as well as the public. I've said it before...those who profess to be so smart are usually total frauds. My step-dad is genius level smart...brilliant really. I've never heard him, or his colleagues, say anything about being smart. Furthermore, I work in the science field around some pretty damn smart people, and again, I don't hear them talking about how smart they are. Seriously, who do you (general you) know in real life that goes around telling everyone how smart they are once past second grade? I think he is a step or two above truly being functionally illiterate, but he does have a seriously limited vocabulary and no evidence of intellectual curiosity. His argument to uphold the Muslim Ban EO is that it is beautifully written, not anything specific regarding any merit or sound legal/consitutional basis. As the mother of an adult child with a processing disorder that seriously impacted her learning to read, I really agree with what you wrote here anonrefugee:
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Post by melanell on Feb 8, 2017 16:07:43 GMT
Trump illiterate? So your theory is someone else is writing his tweets? There's been more than a few times when he's used a teleprompter - which is probably a better example of ability to read than a deposition. I'll file this under yet another example of liberals being susceptible to fake news. I'm curious if you watched the video. Because one section showed a tweet from Trump where he came right out and said that his time is too valuable to type out his own tweets so he dictates them to someone else to type for him. I don't think that in any way means the man can't read. But it certainly does mean that man most certainly does have someone else writing out his words into tweets--at least some of the time. Save
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Post by melanell on Feb 8, 2017 16:14:13 GMT
He's on record saying that he dictates his tweets. I don't know if that's all of them (who is there to type for him at 3 am?) but even if he does it himself, the ability to type 140 characters is hardly indicative of his reading level. I know, but I wasn't talking about his ability to write tweets. I was referring to the fact that he himself said that he scrolls through Twitter and then dictates the answers. He can clearly focus on a tweet, read a tweet, and understand a tweet. And as I also said that the ability to use Twitter certainly isn't enough, but it the one thing I can use as proof that he does have some reading ability. I'm not quite sure what you took my post to mean. I can't tell if you think I'm giving him too much credit or not enough. Save
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